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ForsbergTheGreat last won the day on November 12 2016

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About ForsbergTheGreat

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  1. 4 pages ago, Last year was the year that ESPN predicted the 65 point season. We've clearly been on that topic, you acknowledged this "Yeah but they were basing those claims on a 'normal' amount of injuries. We did not have a 'normal' amount of injuries.......And people were still assuming Benning would hang on to Burr/Hansen last year because he 'won't move vets / isn't rebuilding" Last year was a walk in the park in terms of missing valuable players. I'll say it again, give Canucks a healthy roster and we still weren't a 15-20 placed team last year. 95% of our roster did not perform to what we hoped/expected them to, that is we sucked. That is why even today with a better roster on paper, we are still pegged to be a bottom feeder.
  2. You might want to get the correct season, the first quote was the 2015-16 season, not last shooter said, but you had a good day though.....
  3. Based on what? Predictions come from conclusions being drawn together. Canucks getting injured is nothing new @TheGuardian_ has already went through injuries to prove it was nothing out of the norm. I already showed you this team sucked from our 9 game losing streak in November and onward, not because we traded Burrows and Hansen. You can make excuses but that's all they are, excuses. We all made fun of those prediction, why? because we all had are homer glasses on and expected more from the roster. (most, at least, I assumed we were moving burrows and Hansen, I even thought we might try moving Miller) I just though Sven would have a better impact, Jake would show up and break 20 goals, rodin would notch 15, Eriksson would help rejuvenate the twins, and Hutton was going to take a leap forward. None of that happened, excuses aren't the full reason to blame why we finished bottom 5 last year. We (as canucks fans) over valued what we had, being a middle of the pack team was a pipe dream, even if we stayed healthy we weren't doing that. Everything needed to go right for that to happen, we'd have needed a miracle run and all those expectation we had hope for, didn't turn out. Bo was the only real bright spot last year. This year, people have giving up on that hope, People don't expect Eriksson to score 25+, people don't expect sedins to be 60 point players, people don't expect Marky to be a top 10 goalie and that's why no one complains about predictions this year . People are starting to see this team for what it really is, we have taken on the homer glasses, full of previous years excuses. We're not afraid to admit that this team, just isn't that good.
  4. Sorry but no. Where did people say that in there predictions? They tend to take everything into consideration and come to a conclusion on the team. There conclusion was a heck of a lot closer than most of us were thinking. All you are doing now is making excuses rather than admitting they were right. I can admit it, i was one of the people saying it was a joke. I was wrong. I can see that now, No people were making fun of the predictions calling them leafs media, spewing hate. Two years in a row canucks have been a bottom 5 team in the league. Fool me once, fool me twice. I don't know what you were smoking but you might want to check some facts on that. There was a total of 5 weeks (the first 3 weeks of the season and 2 weeks in January) that canucks were ranked better than 20th. The other 21 weeks of the year we were in the bottom 10 of the league. AKA we weren't a 15-20 placed team. So keep on dreaming. You can say "people were still assuming Benning would hang on to Burr/Hansen" as an excuse to why we finished below your 15-20 range but Burr and Hansen were moved Feb 27 & 28th Feb 26, 2017 canucks were tied for the 28th worst record (3rd last). I guess that debunks that claim.
  5. But we weren't. I like to say what if Daniel didn't get concussed in 2012, what if Bert didn't get suspended in 2004. We can say "what if's" all we want, but reality shows we were only 69 point team. Injuries to a team that travels as much as we do, with the players that have played hard minutes has become the expectation, so we can't really use that as an excuse anymore. This year we're only 4 games in and Eriksson and Edler are both out. I made that excuse for canucks in 2015/16 season, "Sutter was hurt, Edler was hurt, Hamhuis was hurt. we are a better team than 31 win season" Only for us to be followed up with a 30 win season the following year. At some point you just have to say it. We suck. The problem is, being fans we fill the idea with hope. We assume youth are going to continue to progress, sedins will bounce back if we finally find them a complimentary winner, the additions we make will automatically have chemistry, and injuries wont be as bad as the year before. We made fun of all the media that told us we weren't good, pretending like every outlets was out to get the canucks. At the end of the day for the last two years, they were right and we were wrong, maybe they did have some truth to what they were writing.
  6. It's funny how that opinion has change the last few years. Even speaking about myself. Two years ago, we were coming off a bounce back year, we saw Jake and McCann make the team, along with Bo and Hutton and the rebuild was on the way. The idea was "Detroit model full steam ahead" should be a smooth transition, with canucks only having to take a slight dip in standings (but likely making playoffs). And then.....Injuries happened, players didn't develop as fast as we hoped, and sedins slowed down considerably, Vbrata floated, we finished bottom 5. Last year it was, "do not worry about last year, it was mostly injuries that caused our dip, we should see another bounce back, Bo, Sven, Traymkin and Jake will be developing into impact players, we added a top 4 shut down D in guddy, We might not be considered a contending team, but we will be right there in the wild card spot.....Stupid ESPN predicting us to finish at 65 points" And then....more injuries, even slower sedins, Jake and Tryamkin forgot to work out over the summer, Finally this year it's, yes we suck, what does everyone expect happens during a rebuild....I think we've all finally excepted that we aren't that good. Yes we still will have injuries, and yes the Sedins have slowed down faster than expected but like you said, putting lipstick on the pig isn't fooling anyone.
  7. That's true, but honestly Bo is the one guy (not a rookie) we can expect to be on this roster in 2 years. My dad coached me the first few years of hockey, and he was harder on me than all the other players, likely because he knew what i was capable of and wanted me push to get there. I think Green is doing the same with Bo. I agree.
  8. It really depends on the person and their personality. I don't think we could ever consider Wellwood or Kessel a positive for player development I actually don't mind Bo being called out. Green is holding him to a higher standard because he is the guy that we will build around and we need him to keep pushing himself. Calling out the sedins at this point in their careers isn't going to do anything. They are one year away from retirement, nothing is going to all of the sudden change in their games. That doesn't mean we should reward them but I am ok with Bo being held to a different standard.
  9. Exactly, same mistake the flames and leafs made Leafs missed the post season between 2006-2014, they kept trying to speed up the rebuild and compete only delaying the enviable. It wasn't until April 11, 2014 when Shanahan got hired and put his rebuild plan into place. Flames missed the post season 2009-2013, Flames held on to diminishing assets trying to compete and give them another shot, Feaster started the rebuild in 2013 when he traded Iggy, Bouwmeester and attempted to move Kipper. He was fired the following year and Trevling was hired in April 28, 2014. The Vancouver Canucks formally introduced him as their general manager in a press conference on May 23, 2014
  10. It's a draft, no matter how good a GM is, they can't predict what other teams are going to do. JB was shocked that lind was still around in the second round. You might have a better arguement if the trades were made draft day, but more late round trades are months, year's prior to the draft. A team doesn't know what position they will finish in let alone the draft position a player will be at. For example, JB traded a 5th round pick, in the 2017 draft, for Larsen on 24 February 2016, In Jan of 2016 he traded Jensen and a 6th round pick for Etem. That's a year and 4-5 months prior to the draft, unless JB is a fortune teller he has zero idea what the 5th round was going to look like in 2017. The proof is that a year and 4-5 months later he felt the need to give up an asset to reacquire those picks. In order to draft Palmu and Gunnarsson it came at the expense of a 4th round pick.
  11. On one hand the debate is, "you don't need to suck/tank to find elite talent, you can find gems throughout the draft to build a cup contending roster. (aka Ducks- Getzlaf/Perry, Bruins- Lucic, Bergeron, Marchand, Det - Zetterberg, Datzyuk, franson...)" But then the same people flip the script and state that later round draft picks are unimportant because they have low odds Yes, drafting a gem, like Johnny hockey, Benn, and Pavelski is low, but that's why upping your odds by obtaining more picks is a good thing. The goal is to find elite talent and lots of it. That way you're not banking on one you two players possibly reaching above their potential to save your franchise. In terms of getting young assets, You can draft them,higher the draft pick the more likely you are to hit on the player. You can try to trade for them, the more proven a player is the higher the price is to obtain. You can sign free agents, UFA's, NCAA, and European free agents, but they are hard to acquire since you are competing against 30 other teams. History shows that one of these methods is the most successful in building a cup contending roster, Yes it's through the draft. In a rebuilding phase it doesn't mean we have to solely focus on that method and ignore the other methods, but it is the method that should take priority, (aka drafting assets shouldn't come at the expense of trading for players).
  12. No worries I'm with ya on that. I'm not including McCann as a first I'm using his value of what he's worth day. You were the one that said we've gained more value overall so i'm breaking it down to show you we haven't I'll break it down even better, Trades that involved us sending away a pick IN / OUT Baertschi / 2nd round pick Vey / 2nd round pick Gudbranson, 5th round pick / McCann, 2nd round pick, 4th round pick Dorsett / 3rd round pick Pedan / 3rd round pick Etem / Jensen, 6th round pick Prust / Kassian, 5th round pick Larsen / 5th round pick Pouliot / Pedan, 4th round pick Sutter, 3rd round pick / Clendening, Bonino, 2nd round pick Let’s assume Jensen, Kassian, Clendening all got waived, claimed and we didn’t retain an asset for them. What we have to show for it Baertschi, Gudbranson, Dorsett, Sutter, Pouliot What we moved (i crossed off the picks that we equaled each other out) 4x 2nd round picks, 1x 3rd round pick, 2x 4th round picks, 1x 5th round pick, 6th round pick, Bonino, McCann So if I were to break these values down by =, <, or > Baertschi = McCann Sutter = Bonino + 5th round pick Pouliot = 3rd round pick + 6th round pick Dorsett = 2x 4th round picks That leaves us with 4x 2nd rounds picks for Gudbranson. Fair trade? No. So we are not up value we are down value. And that's me being generous on some valuations.
  13. Yep run and hide. He's something for you to choke on. Between 2014. 2015, 2016, draft picks in the top 120 Winnipeg - 13 Toronto - 16 Vancouver -9 Gosh I wonder why they have deeper prospect pools. Connect the dots and the light bulb might turn on, "but but we have guddy and Sven to show for it"....
  14. Granlund, dahlen, goldobin didn’t cost us a pick so I’m not sure why you included them. If if you include sutter and guddy you have to include bonino, clendening and McCann as picks weren’t the only pieces moved. Lets break down the trades so it ends the debate. really what we’re looking at is gudbranson + Sutter + baertschi + dorsett + pouliot for 4x2nd + 3rd + 2x4th + 5th + 6th + McCann + bonino + clendening id take McCann over baertschi, but we can call it a draw. Sutter and bonino are a close draw (maybe add the 6th), clendening and pouloit are extremely close too. Slight edge to pouliot as he’s a year younger (add a 5th). Would you trade gudbranson and dorsett for 4x 2nd round picks + a 3rd round pick + 2x 4th?