[Roozter]

you know I can respect that some people like the Orca, but, i have found that the fans that have been supporting the team through all the rough times (ie: the messier years, or even earlier in the 80,s) don't like the orca. The bandwagoners are the ones that like it. I'm not saying that as an insult. Bandwagoneers are fans too.

[Baggins]

m2kmike, on Aug 5 2007, 02:43 PM, said:

ummm.... Gino Gino Gino Gino....
Chris Simon
Jordan TooToo
Jonathon Cheechoo

Shall I go on?????????

Ok, how about rephrasing:
What does a native tribe defeated by the Illinois state militia have to do with hockey?

[drdeath]

Baggins, on Aug 5 2007, 03:20 PM, said:

Ok, how about rephrasing:
What does a native tribe defeated by the Illinois state militia have to do with hockey?

More than likely the United Center is built on their land.

[Roozter]

Baggins, on Aug 6 2007, 02:20 AM, said:

Ok, how about rephrasing:
What does a native tribe defeated by the Illinois state militia have to do with hockey?

It doesn't matter, they use the name because they were brave warriors which is quite often used in sport, either way this is not the argument. The orca doesn't represent Vancouver. It is quite clear that a team nickname doesn't have to represent the sport. The logo should represent the nickname of the team. This is not about the name Canucks, its about a stupid logo, that has nothing to do with a canuck. Now you are arguing that the orca represents Vancouver. Well that doesn't matter it doesn't represent a CANUCK, but also, even though the fact that it doesn't represent a canuck should be enough, the Orca DOES NOT represent vancouver. You can talk all you want about whales and hockey or natives & hockey, that is not the arguement. try understanding that. Read over it a few times if you must

[*vInTaGe*]

Wow, this thread is slowing down.









[stops/]

[Baggins]

Roozter, on Aug 5 2007, 01:54 PM, said:

I'm getting sick of people who have no idea why the orca is even on our jersey. Fine you like it, but don't argue that it has something to do with the canucks or hockey or anything. Just stop.

I've said this before but I'll say it again just for you. If you truly want a logo that represents 'Canucks' it would have to be a frenchman or Hawaiian wearing a fur coat and beaver cap.The original term refered to the French and Hawaiian's working the fur trade in the Pacific NW.

You seem to be the one that has no idea why the Haida style Orca is on the jersey.

[Roozter]

And by the way they are not INDIANS, indians are from INDIA. They are Natives.

[Baggins]

Roozter, on Aug 5 2007, 03:27 PM, said:

It doesn't matter, they use the name because they were brave warriors which is quite often used in sport, either way this is not the argument. The orca doesn't represent Vancouver. It is quite clear that a team nickname doesn't have to represent the sport. The logo should represent the nickname of the team. This is not about the name Canucks, its about a stupid logo, that has nothing to do with a canuck. Now you are arguing that the orca represents Vancouver. Well that doesn't matter it doesn't represent a CANUCK, but also, even though the fact that it doesn't represent a canuck should be enough, the Orca DOES NOT represent vancouver. You can talk all you want about whales and hockey or natives & hockey, that is not the arguement. try understanding that. Read over it a few times if you must

So you'd like a large Hawaiian in a fur coat and beaver cap holding a hockey stick. I get it.

[Roozter]

Baggins, on Aug 6 2007, 02:28 AM, said:

I've said this before but I'll say it again just for you. If you truly want a logo that represents 'Canucks' it would have to be a frenchman or Hawaiian wearing a fur coat and beaver cap.The original term refered to the French and Hawaiian's working the fur trade in the Pacific NW.

You seem to be the one that has no idea why the Haida style Orca is on the jersey.

Well, by that statement your telling me that you're an ignorant american. A canuck is a Canadian hero. Also, a canuck is strong and canadian, which may I add could kick an americans A** any day of the week. The best Canuck logo would be a Canadian beat the crap out of some Yankee redneck. Now that would represent a canuck

[TheGhostOfRazor]

You guys are arguing about the Orca and whether or not it represents anything 'Canuck', etc etc....

Here's the answer:

1. A Canuck is a Canadian.

2. Prior to the Orca, the Canucks have had 2 logos that have 'kind of represented Canadians: Stick/Skate (hockey) and a skate (hockey).

3. When new ownership came in, they created a company that would oversea the hockey team, GM Place, concessions, parking, concerts, trade shows, etc etc. It only makes sense to treat each "arm" of the business as seperate entities, all under an umbrella company. They needed a name. Of course it only made good business sense to come up with a name that the people of B.C. could identify and embrace: "Orca Bay & Entertainment".
Yes, we are Canucks, yes we are Canadians. The killer whale is immediately identifiable with British Columbia though, and if you were to put a patch of a killer whale on your backpack and go travelling across Canada, pretty sure everyone would think you were from B.C.

4. Naturally, with new ownership, they wanted to create a new image for the hockey team. "What would trepresent a Canuck, a Canadian?" they think..."What image is strong, powerful, and indentifiable to British Columbians?"..."Something that is unique to B.C."....ahhh....the KILLER WHALE.

Anyways, while I don't personally think the logo itself is very good, it's is only pessimism that cannot see past the business of it all and realize that our hockey team dons the image of a graceful, strong, powerful, and incredibly beautiful killer whale. People travel across the world to pay good money just to see these orcas in the ocean, and we have these wonders in our backyard.

John McCaw is gone, and his legacy (or lack-thereof), in my mind, is NOT going to tarnish the proud image of a killer whale.

[Baggins]

Roozter, on Aug 5 2007, 03:11 PM, said:

It doesn't represent Vancouver at all, that's just what Orca brqainwashed you to think. There are Orcas all over the Pacific Ocean they are not exclusive to Vancouver at all. That would be like saying that we should have rain drops on our jerseys because it rains in Vancouver, well guess what it rains everywhere else too. That excuse that Orcas represent Vancouver is not acceptable, its not even a good arguement. Also, a very convincing percentage of Canuck Fans do not think it represents our city or our team at all, so how could you possibly think it should represent our team? Because Orca bay told you it represents our city? And even if the orca was exclusive to our city, which it is not, by that logic, then Toronto should have the CN tower on their JHersey or some bonehead who thinks the Leafs should be the only team in the NHL on their jersey. Give up that the Orca represents our city, if you like it, then fine. You want it on the crest cause you like it... but don't give us that lame garbage that it represents the city.

And Trashers are exclusive to Georgia? Coyotes to Arizona? Sharks and Ducks to California? Shall I go on?

Vancouver and BC in general is world renowned for it's native art. People come here from around the world to go whale watching. Yes, orcas. These are aspects of the logo because they do represent our city. Those elements are formed into a 'C' to represent Canucks. Orca Bay didn't have to tell me anything, these aspects were perfectly obvious to me. Possibly because I work in the tourism industry, or maybe because I'm just a little smarter than some. You simply refuse to accept these facts because you've decided to dislike the logo.

[canuck07]

Roozter in all out fairness, what would you propose the team use as a logo other than a "Tough Canadian kicking the #$% out of some redneck American"? If you have a good idea please post it, I am curious to see what you suggest. (No, I am not trying to be a prick)

By way Roozter...I've been a fan since I was a little guy despite all the leaf lovers out here. In other words, according to yourself (because I like the Orca logo the best) I have been a "bandwagoner" for almost 2 decades now.

[Baggins]

Roozter, on Aug 5 2007, 03:31 PM, said:

Well, by that statement your telling me that you're an ignorant american. A canuck is a Canadian hero. Also, a canuck is strong and canadian, which may I add could kick an americans A** any day of the week. The best Canuck logo would be a Canadian beat the crap out of some Yankee redneck. Now that would represent a canuck

Born in Burnaby and never lived outside of BC. Nice try though. The Canuck you're refering to is a fictional political cartoon character created in Ontario. Me, I'd prefer something that actually has to do with BC. I'll ignore your puffed up internet chest.

[<3]

Roozter, on Aug 5 2007, 03:11 PM, said:

It doesn't represent Vancouver at all, that's just what Orca brqainwashed you to think. There are Orcas all over the Pacific Ocean they are not exclusive to Vancouver at all. That would be like saying that we should have rain drops on our jerseys because it rains in Vancouver, well guess what it rains everywhere else too. That excuse that Orcas represent Vancouver is not acceptable, its not even a good arguement. Also, a very convincing percentage of Canuck Fans do not think it represents our city or our team at all, so how could you possibly think it should represent our team? Because Orca bay told you it represents our city? And even if the orca was exclusive to our city, which it is not, by that logic, then Toronto should have the CN tower on their JHersey or some bonehead who thinks the Leafs should be the only team in the NHL on their jersey. Give up that the Orca represents our city, if you like it, then fine. You want it on the crest cause you like it... but don't give us that lame garbage that it represents the city.

Why can't you see past the whole "Orca Bay" crap and just take a look at the logo? Like I said before, yes, the company's name is Orca Bay, but that does not mean that the logo solely represents Orca Bay and not the hockey team. I haven't been brainwashed. Even before the Orca logo killer whales have been associated with BC. And like you said, Orcas are all over the Pacific Ocean and are not exclusive to Vancouver. But once again, are Leafs exclusive to Toronto? Sharks to San Jose? Penguins in Pittsburgh? No. Sure those logos match the names, but how do you put a CANUCK on the jersey? You can’t. So instead we have a logo that represents Vancouver and Canada as a whole.

If you read my posts you would know that I have stated multiple times that I am NOT the biggest fan of the Orca logo, I don't want to have it as our logo next year, and I have also said that I would much rather have the Vintage fulltime. However, this does not mean the Orca is a bad logo. I think that the Orca is a great logo and it does an amazing job of representing the team. So you can stop thinking that I'm defending the logo just because I want it to stay.

Roozter, on Aug 5 2007, 03:16 PM, said:

you know I can respect that some people like the Orca, but, i have found that the fans that have been supporting the team through all the rough times (ie: the messier years, or even earlier in the 80,s) don't like the orca. The bandwagoners are the ones that like it. I'm not saying that as an insult. Bandwagoneers are fans too.

Speaking of ignorant...

First of all, you don't know me. Second, you don't know how long I have been supporting the team. And third, I am NOT a bandwagoner.

"The bandwagoners are the ones that like it."
That is the most ignorant, rude comment I have heard. And it is also completely untrue.

This post has been edited by <3: 05 August 2007 - 04:01 PM

[TheGhostOfRazor]

Roozter, on Aug 5 2007, 03:27 PM, said:

It doesn't matter, they use the name because they were brave warriors which is quite often used in sport, either way this is not the argument. The orca doesn't represent Vancouver. It is quite clear that a team nickname doesn't have to represent the sport. The logo should represent the nickname of the team. This is not about the name Canucks, its about a stupid logo, that has nothing to do with a canuck. Now you are arguing that the orca represents Vancouver. Well that doesn't matter it doesn't represent a CANUCK, but also, even though the fact that it doesn't represent a canuck should be enough, the Orca DOES NOT represent vancouver. You can talk all you want about whales and hockey or natives & hockey, that is not the arguement. try understanding that. Read over it a few times if you must

Here's a little grade 1 quiz for you:

Q: In Canada, what province or territory does the Orca most represent, both in the fact it is a commonly found whale there, and in its history through art?

Also, you say it doesn't represent a 'Canuck'. Perhaps it doesn't represent you as a 'Canuck', but I have traveled a lot in my 32 years, and when people in other countries ask me what it's like in Vancouver, I tell them about the people, the mountains that inhabit grizzly bears, the Pacific Ocean that inhabits killer whales, etc etc.

The killer whale absolutely has a role in representing British Columbians.

[Baggins]

canuck07, on Aug 5 2007, 03:48 PM, said:

Roozter in all out fairness, what would you propose the team use as a logo other than a "Tough Canadian kicking the #$% out of some redneck American"? If you have a good idea please post it, I am curious to see what you suggest. (No, I am not trying to be a prick)

By way Roozter...I've been a fan since I was a little guy despite all the leaf lovers out here. In other words, according to yourself (because I like the Orca logo the best) I have been a "bandwagoner" for almost 2 decades now.

I really start follow NHL hockey when Orr was a rookie. I've followed the Canucks since they joined the NHL. Kind of blows his bandwagon fan notion out of the orca infested water.

[Roozter]

canuck07, on Aug 6 2007, 02:48 AM, said:

Roozter in all out fairness, what would you propose the team use as a logo other than a "Tough Canadian kicking the #$% out of some redneck American"? If you have a good idea please post it, I am curious to see what you suggest. (No, I am not trying to be a prick)

By way Roozter...I've been a fan since I was a little guy despite all the leaf lovers out here. In other words, according to yourself (because I like the Orca logo the best) I have been a "bandwagoner" for almost 2 decades now.

I said most people who like the orca are bandwagon jumpers. Also, if you have a whale on your backpack people will probably think you work for an aquarium. We have a good logo, which a good majority of canuck fans like, and on the flipside most Canuck fans hate the orca. The shortsided view that the orca represents vancouver should not have anything to do with an arguement that a corporate logo should be on the jersey. As Native art goes, that isn't an arguement either. They as in whoever thinks its a great idea to use it for every single logo or sign in Vancouver has gone way too overboard with it. I didn't like the yellow spaghetti plate logo, or the colours that went with it, but the stick n' rink is good, I like the WW2 logo. The ownership, in my opinion totally turned its back on the fans by #1 not taking any feedback from the fans on the new uniforms, not including them and #2 sticking with a logo which most fans don't like to the tune of aprox 75% to 80%.

[Roozter]

look canuck07, you might like the orca, maybe your just glad its not plate of spaghetti with McDonald' colours. Whatever,. The fact remains that a very large majority of fans don't like the orca. If I'm an owner that cares about the fans, I'd be real stupid person not to get the hint.

[osmun]

You're saying orcas don't represent BC?

I don't live in BC. I've always associated Orcas with BC. Before I was a nucks fance (pre 98) we we're taught this in school. Orca = BC because its the only damn place they are in Canada. The Native art style is even more representative of the region, due to the native art (IE the totem poles) that vancouver is famous for.

Are you really that dense to say that before the Orca became the Canucks logo, no one thought it was represented BC ?

Thats like saying the beaver didn't represent Canada until it became a corporate roots logo.

This post has been edited by osmun: 05 August 2007 - 04:11 PM

[<3]

Roozter, on Aug 5 2007, 04:07 PM, said:

The ownership, in my opinion totally turned its back on the fans by #1 not taking any feedback from the fans on the new uniforms, not including them and #2 sticking with a logo which most fans don't like to the tune of aprox 75% to 80%.

1) You haven't seen the new jerseys so you can't make a fair judgment yet.
2) 75% - 80% don't support the Orca? Let's take a quick poll here. canuck07, Baggins, TheGhostOfRazor and I are defending the logo (4). You are not (1). 4/5 = 80% are FOR the Orca, not against.

Edit: Add osmun to the mix. That's 5/6 = Approx 83%. So no, 80% are not AGAINST the Orca, they're FOR the Orca.

This post has been edited by <3: 05 August 2007 - 04:15 PM