***The UFC/MMA THREAD***

[Down by the River]

1 minute ago, SabreFan1 said:

Yeah.  That was nuts.  Now the book is out on how to beat Cyborg.  Exactly the same way to beat Rousey.  You just need to have more punching power to put Cyborg down than you do Rousey.

 

I'll bet Holly Holm wants a rematch with Cyborg now.  It was close the first time, but if she puts on more muscle, she has the striking skills to take her out if she can get off her punches as fast as Nunes did.

I'm not sure if this is true, because I think the Nunes fight was Cyborg at her worst. No game plan, just looking for a brawl. She had backed away from that approach her last 4-5 fights and wasn't just trying to force the KO ASAP. I think the embarrassment of getting dummied in under a minute by someone she had been trash talking for years will be enough to stop her from making the same mistake again.

 

I guess technically you're right in that one way to beat Cyborg is to make her beat herself, but I don't think fighters should want to count on this for the foreseeable future. 

[SabreFan1]

Just now, Down by the River said:

I'm not sure if this is true, because I think the Nunes fight was Cyborg at her worst. No game plan, just looking for a brawl. She had backed away from that approach her last 4-5 fights and wasn't just trying to force the KO ASAP. I think the embarrassment of getting dummied in under a minute by someone she had been trash talking for years will be enough to stop her from making the same mistake again.

 

I guess technically you're right in that one way to beat Cyborg is to make her beat herself, but I don't think fighters should want to count on this for the foreseeable future. 

One thing that I remember fighters saying is that you're never the same after the first time you get knocked out.  Like when Holm beat Rousey, I think the invincible tag is off of Cyborg, and fighters will be more willing to strike hard and fast on her now instead of just straight up boxing her.

 

If that KO diminished Cyborg's confidence or chin at all, then she's going to lose more fights to pure punchers.  If it doesn't affect her, then she'll likely get her rematch with Nunes eventually even though Dana White didn't seem so keen on an immediate rematch in post fight interviews.

[Down by the River]

TJ makes weight. Think he takes Cejudo. 

[bishopshodan]

6 hours ago, Down by the River said:

TJ makes weight. Think he takes Cejudo. 

Me too.

 

I'm not watching this one. I know, they will really miss me 

 

I don't like the look of the whole Hardy domestic thingy, I'm in the camp that thinks it's in poor taste putting him on a card with Ostovich. I know she has come out saying it's not an issue but what is she supposed to say? She's 4-4, I wouldn't say peep to my employer either if my record looked like that and I was fighting in the biggest org. 

Now, saying that. I am not totally up to speed with Greg's situation and I understand giving people second chances in life. What made me come to my decision was Dana once again railing at Ariel, calling him douchy etc... Dana is such a baby Trump, I think he may be a very close second to the Orange One's lying rate, he is constantly trying to control the narrative and I am tired of seeing media members under attack ( obviously not just with the ufc) for just bringing up what some of the public is interested in.

 

I'm always at a conflict with my support for the UFC and it's mostly Dana turning it into a sports entertainment-esq company. They are just after the moola, I get that. I've always had respect for Joe R and I know he calls the UFC out a lot. I just would love for him to be an even louder voice and maybe even jump ship to a group that might start respecting standings and push toward being more of a legit sport...

 

Hey and they're even revealing their new Legacy belt, don't care. 

[Down by the River]

3 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

Me too.

 

I'm not watching this one. I know, they will really miss me 

 

I don't like the look of the whole Hardy domestic thingy, I'm in the camp that thinks it's in poor taste putting him on a card with Ostovich. I know she has come out saying it's not an issue but what is she supposed to say? She's 4-4, I wouldn't say peep to my employer either if my record looked like that and I was fighting in the biggest org. 

Now, saying that. I am not totally up to speed with Greg's situation and I understand giving people second chances in life. What made me come to my decision was Dana once again railing at Ariel, calling him douchy etc... Dana is such a baby Trump, I think he may be a very close second to the Orange One's lying rate, he is constantly trying to control the narrative and I am tired of seeing media members under attack ( obviously not just with the ufc) for just bringing up what some of the public is interested in.

 

I'm always at a conflict with my support for the UFC and it's mostly Dana turning it into a sports entertainment-esq company. They are just after the moola, I get that. I've always had respect for Joe R and I know he calls the UFC out a lot. I just would love for him to be an even louder voice and maybe even jump ship to a group that might start respecting standings and push toward being more of a legit sport...

 

Hey and they're even revealing their new Legacy belt, don't care. 

I think so many people never believed that the UFC would succeed, so they were always happy to let a 2-bit gangster like Dana run a 2-bit organization like the UFC. They expected him to run it into the ground. That never happened, and now you have a moron with such a big ego, identity crisis, etc. running something that could actually become so much more with a bit of vision. 

 

Dana's vision was always "make the UFC big". He accomplished that, but then never had the intelligence to think bigger. 

[bishopshodan]

1 minute ago, Down by the River said:

I think so many people never believed that the UFC would succeed, so they were always happy to let a 2-bit gangster like Dana run a 2-bit organization like the UFC. They expected him to run it into the ground. That never happened, and now you have a moron with such a big ego, identity crisis, etc. running something that could actually become so much more with a bit of vision. 

 

Dana's vision was always "make the UFC big". He accomplished that, but then never had the intelligence to think bigger. 

Yep,

He has made it a success. No doubt.

 

It's just another dude that has done so much in life, has made so much money, has so much power... I mean , hats off to him.  Yet, he just reeks of insecurity.  Once you start yelling and being emotional, I tune out.

. 

 

[RRypien37]

On 1/9/2019 at 3:30 PM, SabreFan1 said:

Yeah.  That was nuts.  Now the book is out on how to beat Cyborg.  Exactly the same way to beat Rousey.  You just need to have more punching power to put Cyborg down than you do Rousey.

 

I'll bet Holly Holm wants a rematch with Cyborg now.  It was close the first time, but if she puts on more muscle, she has the striking skills to take her out if she can get off her punches as fast as Nunes did.

Holm vs Cyborg was in no way close. She got picked apart for the entire 5 rounds. It looked more like a sparring session. It had the illusion of being competitive because it was the first time Cyborg didn't completely walk through an opponent in 1 round. 

 

Against Nunes, Cyborg lost that fight more than Amanda won. As a poster mentioned, no game plan, both put their heads down and started swinging. Whoever would've connected with their flury was winning. 

 

That being said it goes to show how good Shevchenko is. Took Nunes to decision twice and arguably won at least once. If the Bullet was just bigger I could see her decisively taking out both Nunes and Cyborg. 

[SabreFan1]

1 minute ago, RRypien37 said:

Holm vs Cyborg was in no way close. She got picked apart for the entire 5 rounds. It looked more like a sparring session. It had the illusion of being competitive because it was the first time Cyborg didn't completely walk through an opponent in 1 round.

I don't remember enough of the fight any more to break it down into a concise argument.  Also, I'm a Holm fanboy so I'll rewatch the fight if I can still find a torrent of it.  I'll be able to analyze it better now that I won't be cheering if I can keep from staring at her butt.  If I can find it, I'll respond again.

 

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Against Nunes, Cyborg lost that fight more than Amanda won. As a poster mentioned, no game plan, both put their heads down and started swinging. Whoever would've connected with their flury was winning. 

I disagree.  Nunes was the faster,more precise puncher.  Cyborg would definitely lose a rematch.

 

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That being said it goes to show how good Shevchenko is. Took Nunes to decision twice and arguably won at least once. If the Bullet was just bigger I could see her decisively taking out both Nunes and Cyborg. 

Shevchenko is definitely the most skillful fighter of the three.  I'm curious to see how well her sister will do in the UFC.

[MikeBossy]

12 hours ago, SabreFan1 said:

I don't remember enough of the fight any more to break it down into a concise argument.  Also, I'm a Holm fanboy so I'll rewatch the fight if I can still find a torrent of it.  I'll be able to analyze it better now that I won't be cheering if I can keep from staring at her butt.  If I can find it, I'll respond again.

 

I disagree.  Nunes was the faster,more precise puncher.  Cyborg would definitely lose a rematch.

 

Shevchenko is definitely the most skillful fighter of the three.  I'm curious to see how well her sister will do in the UFC.

I agree 100% - look at it this way - she has walked through 2 of the most dominant women in the sport in Rousey and Cyborg and she knocked them out. However one could argue that she beat both in the downward slide of their respective careers. Might be why vs Shevchenko it was much closer? I thin a rematch with Cyborg ends the same way - as you said she is faster, more accurate and I'd even say a much harder puncher!

[Down by the River]

14 hours ago, SabreFan1 said:

I don't remember enough of the fight any more to break it down into a concise argument.  Also, I'm a Holm fanboy so I'll rewatch the fight if I can still find a torrent of it.  I'll be able to analyze it better now that I won't be cheering if I can keep from staring at her butt.  If I can find it, I'll respond again.

 

I disagree.  Nunes was the faster,more precise puncher.  Cyborg would definitely lose a rematch.

 

Shevchenko is definitely the most skillful fighter of the three.  I'm curious to see how well her sister will do in the UFC.

I completely agree, but also think that part of the reason this is true is because Cyborg acted like she was in a bar fight and was just swinging wildly. 

 

When you look at TJ/Garbrandt 2, Gargrandt has much better hand speed, IMO. However, in the exchange that led to the TKO, TJ kept getting to Cody first. It wasn't because TJ was faster, it was because he was taking a shorter path from A to B. 

 

I'm not trying to say that Nunes would lose in a rematch, I just think that the first fight isn't a good indication of the skillset of Cyborg. 

[Isam]

War fedor. Lets see if you can turn back the clock one more time.

[SabreFan1]

1 hour ago, Down by the River said:

I completely agree, but also think that part of the reason this is true is because Cyborg acted like she was in a bar fight and was just swinging wildly. 

 

When you look at TJ/Garbrandt 2, Gargrandt has much better hand speed, IMO. However, in the exchange that led to the TKO, TJ kept getting to Cody first. It wasn't because TJ was faster, it was because he was taking a shorter path from A to B. 

 

I'm not trying to say that Nunes would lose in a rematch, I just think that the first fight isn't a good indication of the skillset of Cyborg. 

There will likely be a rematch within the next year or so.  Since there's no way that Cyborg will be dumb enough to try and trade 2 for 1 punches again, we'll see how long it will take for Nunes to wear her down enough to start teeing up on her again.  That is if Cyborg works on her head movement between now and then.  If she doesn't, it'll be another 1st round KO.

[bishopshodan]

2 minutes ago, SabreFan1 said:

There will likely be a rematch within the next year or so.  Since there's no way that Cyborg will be dumb enough to try and trade 2 for 1 punches again, we'll see how long it will take for Nunes to wear her down enough to start teeing up on her again.  That is if Cyborg works on her head movement between now and then.  If she doesn't, it'll be another 1st round KO.

I hate that Nunes stated Cyborg can wait two years for the rematch. That's Weak. 

Chris has done too much in her career to write her off in the rematch. She has good boxing, she just has to use it. Then the fight will be closer. 

 

IMO Holly has the best hands for the ladies at that weight but she is soo boxer-ish. she doesn't sit down into her strikes. She is up on her toes like Fred Flintstone, reminds me of when BJ re-tuned his striking. 

[SabreFan1]

5 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

I hate that Nunes stated Cyborg can wait two years for the rematch. That's Weak. 

Chris has done too much in her career to write her off in the rematch. She has good boxing, she just has to use it. Then the fight will be closer.

Nunes said that because she's pushing for more money.  After the fight Dana played down a rematch for the same reason, but in the UFC's favour.  He was singing a different tune this week though.

 

Cyborg is the only one with little to no leverage this time so she'll just have to wait out negotiations between Dana and Nunes.

 

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IMO Holly has the best hands for the ladies at that weight but she is soo boxer-ish. she doesn't sit down into her strikes. She is up on her toes like Fred Flintstone, reminds me of when BJ re-tuned his striking. 

Boxers are taught to fight from the balls of their feet.  That's why Holmes has that stance.  Don't forget that before MMA, she was a highly decorated multiple title holding world champion boxer.  Since her game is developed mainly on her striking, there's no reason for her to become more flat-footed.  She transitions well enough when she needs to fight off take-downs.

[bishopshodan]

8 minutes ago, SabreFan1 said:

Boxers are taught to fight from the balls of their feet.  That's why Holmes has that stance.  Don't forget that before MMA, she was a highly decorated multiple title holding world champion boxer.  Since her game is developed mainly on her striking, there's no reason for her to become more flat-footed.  She transitions well enough when she needs to fight off take-downs.

Yes I do know about Holly's back ground,, I guess that's what i was leading to.I 'd like to see her sit down in her stance a bit more and try to generate more power for them slick hands. But i don't mean flat footed. I've trained a lot of boxing but I competed till i was 35 in Karate, which is my true love. We move and have distance trying to land counters with  power. It's hard to generate power with your legs so close together. I like Holly a lot, just her stance seems a little tip toe-ish imo. 

.

 

[SabreFan1]

4 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

Yes I do know about Holly's back ground,, I guess that's what i was leading to.I 'd like to see her sit down in her stance a bit more and try to generate more power for them slick hands. But i don't mean flat footed. I've trained a lot of boxing but I competed till i was 35 in Karate, which is my true love. We move and have distance trying to land counters with  power. It's hard to generate power with your legs so close together. I like Holly a lot, just her stance seems a little tip toe-ish imo.

Her odd mechanics are her trade-off for a little extra speed and agility.  Fighting people like Nunes and Cyborg, that's her only advantage.  If she gave that up for a touch more power, they'd both hand her her lunch in the first or second round.

[bishopshodan]

Just now, SabreFan1 said:

Her odd mechanics are her trade-off for a little extra speed and agility.  Fighting people like Nunes and Cyborg, that's her only advantage.  If she gave that up for a touch more power, they'd both hand her her lunch in the first or second round.

Sure, or she might sleep them with a touch more power is my point. She's so fast and accurate....but it's too far along in her career to really change. I'm just supposing .She is one of the best in the world, I just like her so much that I want to armchair tweak her attributes. 

 

[SabreFan1]

Is TSN broadcasting tonight's card for you Canadian heathens?

[bishopshodan]

Just now, SabreFan1 said:

Is TSN broadcasting tonight's card for you Canadian heathens?

ALLmy friends are heathens....

 

 

 

 

 

take it slow...

 

 

 

 

sorry

[SabreFan1]

Just now, bishopshodan said:

Sure, or she might sleep them with a touch more power is my point. She's so fast and accurate....but it's too far along in her career to really change. I'm just supposing .She is one of the best in the world, I just like her so much that I want to armchair tweak her attributes.

I see where our disconnect is now.  You have faith in her power game whereas I don't think she has the kind of power needed to do that.  I'd like to see her work harder on her kicks.  She has deadly kicks.