Raoul Duke Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 I dunno, Santana's absolutely dominating. I like Peavy or even Brandon Webb at the top. Bedard looks like he's gonna be something else too. And forgot about Hamels. What about this Jeff Francis kid?? He any good??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Bob Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Will the Bule Jays ever make the post season again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gretzky's Mullet Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share Posted February 1, 2008 I dunno, Santana's absolutely dominating. I like Peavy or even Brandon Webb at the top. Bedard looks like he's gonna be something else too. And forgot about Hamels. What about this Jeff Francis kid?? He any good??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeba77 Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Will the Bule Jays ever make the post season again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Alchemist Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 If Fernando Martinez is the Mets' best prospect, then Humber, Gomez, Guerra and Mulvey are probably 2-5. I don't think the Twins got such a bad deal since they could never have afforded what Santana wanted anyways. I don't think he's the best pitcher in baseball either, though he's certainly top 5. I'd rather have Peavy, Beckett and Bedard personally. Maybe Halladay, Verlander and Hamels too, though the last two would partly be because of their young age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gretzky's Mullet Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share Posted February 1, 2008 Humber and Mulvey are back end rotation guys at best, Gomez lacks plate discipline and Guerra projects as a number 3 guy, maybe a number 2 if everything goes right for him. Hughes alone (if thats really what the Yanks were offering) almost beats that package. You really don't think Santana is the best pitcher in baseball? In his 4 full seasons as a starter, he has got 2 Cy Youngs (should be 3). Even his worst year, which was last year is better than any year Verlander has had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raoul Duke Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Zambrano can eat my bag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucic17 Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Jays will be okay IF they GET RID of Ricchardi. I HATE that guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raoul Duke Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Jays will be okay IF they GET RID of Ricchardi. I HATE that guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Alchemist Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Keep in mind you're talking about young players. Humber went 3rd (or 4th, can't remember off hand) overall three years ago no? Admittedly, Hughes has passed him in terms of development, but I don't really think the Mets or Twins should write him off just yet. Gomez strikes out a lot, sure, but he's also only 22 years old. I was under the impression that the deal got held up because the Yankees refused to part with Hughes, but I might be wrong about that. I said I'd probably take Verlander right now because he's younger and cheaper, and Hamels because of his huge potential and youth. I guess I just see both of those guys as being on the upswing with the potential to pass Santana, but I suppose neither has done it yet. I'd also handicap Santana a little bit because he's been less good in the playoffs, which is why I'd give a bit of an edge to Josh Beckett (who really could have won the Cy Young and World Series MVPs last year, though Sabathia and Lowell weren't undeserving). I concede that Santana probably could've gotten it over Colon in 2005. I believe that Jake Peavy is the best pitcher in baseball, at judging from last year. He was pretty much the best in every category (except I think Bedard actually had the best SO/IP ratio), and he was far less susceptible to the long ball. Only two guys in the entire league gave up more jacks than Santana. I know that isn't a sabermetric stat, but it still holds some weight for me. I suppose if money, age, attitude, playoff history, potential, etc were no object, my list (and I've thought about this more this time than the previous post) would be: 1. Peavy 2. Beckett 3. Santana 4. Bedard 5. Webb/Young/Sabathia/Hamels Couldn't pick between those guys for number 5. You know who isn't on my list though? Carlos Zambrano. Not meant as an insult to the Cubs, I just think that guy, like Santana, has a bit of an inflated impression of his own value, and the attitude hurts both in my eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raoul Duke Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 You just crossed a line, I can never forgive you for that statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NucksFanTilIDie Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Woo hoo go M's! Anyone else secretely hope, for a while before he re-signed with the Yankees, that the Mariners would get A-rod back? Maybe i'm just unable to let go of the days he was here, similar to wanting Bertuzzi back with the canucks. Oh well, hope we get Bedard. We need some pitching, and plus he's Canadian makes the M's even more likeable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeba77 Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Woo hoo go M's! Anyone else secretely hope, for a while before he re-signed with the Yankees, that the Mariners would get A-rod back? Maybe i'm just unable to let go of the days he was here, similar to wanting Bertuzzi back with the canucks. Oh well, hope we get Bedard. We need some pitching, and plus he's Canadian makes the M's even more likeable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raoul Duke Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 well if the M's get bedard then they'll have to canadian lefties Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gretzky's Mullet Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share Posted February 1, 2008 I'd agree that with you in taking Verlander and Hamels over Santana, because they're younger, cheaper and have a lot of potential, I just don't think that they have quite got to his level yet but they'll get there and maybe surpass him in a short while. I can definitely see a case being made for Peavy being the best pitcher in baseball, him and Santana would be my top 2 for sure. The problem with Zambrano is all mental, he has the stuff to be a top 3 pitcher in baseball, he just needs to learn how to concentrate and keep his cool. He gets excited, overthrows, and leaves the ball up in the zone. Check out his stats in his last few Opening Day starts, they're not pretty. As for his attitude, he definitely makes some boneheaded statements(referring to himself in 3rd person, predicting 120 wins etc.) but I just can't get myself to dislike the guy. Maybe its the homer in me, but I like seeing him make crazy statements and jump up and down on the mound. Anytime I've seen him say a selfish or immature thing, hes always apologized shortly after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yeti003 Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 gotta say go jays go that being said im out here on the east coast and local media has actually started talking ball but they are saying that halladay if he doesnt actually regain his form may be possible trade bait this year anyone else think its too early to give up on him side question do you think we could get anyone worth a salt to run the team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gretzky's Mullet Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share Posted February 1, 2008 gotta say go jays go that being said im out here on the east coast and local media has actually started talking ball but they are saying that halladay if he doesnt actually regain his form may be possible trade bait this year anyone else think its too early to give up on him side question do you think we could get anyone worth a salt to run the team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yeti003 Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 Halladay might be coming off of a down year, but he's still the best pitcher the Jays have at any level. I don't personally see him being traded. I just wish the Jays could get a full and consistent season out of A.J. Burnett. I truly believe he has the better stuff when he's got command: he throws harder than Halladay, has an ungodly curve, and mixes off speed pitches well. He just doesn't have the mental fortitude of Halladay, or the consistency of command. I got to see Mcgowan pitch live last year once too, and I think he's ready to be the no. 3 guy, with Marcum the early candidate for 4th. It'll be interesting to see who nails down the fifth spot, as I think Chacin has kind of lost his grip on a spot in the rotation. Actually, I just found this on the topic on the Jays' website: http://toronto.bluejays.mlb.com/news/artic...sp&c_id=tor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yeti003 Posted February 1, 2008 Share Posted February 1, 2008 what do you guys think of LITSCH? I think he can be great if we dont burn him out to early ala woods Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gretzky's Mullet Posted February 1, 2008 Author Share Posted February 1, 2008 what do you guys think of LITSCH? I think he can be great if we dont burn him out to early ala woods Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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