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#1441 Salmonberries

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 07:51 PM

Wow, what a compelling argument. You get a well deserved slow clap.

I know it's hard to argue with someone who watches all the games and uses logic, but a video? You can do better.

Lol, give it two seconds will ya. That was my attempt at humor.
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#1442 Canvoucer Vanuck

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 07:52 PM

Actually you can ask DeNiro (IIRC) about it... I don't think he was ever impressed with Arniel.
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#1443 Salmonberries

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 08:06 PM

Wow, what a compelling argument. You get a well deserved slow clap.

I know it's hard to argue with someone who watches all the games and uses logic, but a video? You can do better.

Okay so you watch all them games. I already new that about you. But where are the logical fallacies in my posts. I want to see them.

If you please?
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#1444 Salmonberries

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 08:14 PM

Meanwhile, why don't we all enjoy another video???!!!



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#1445 DJ Kreuzberg

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 08:16 PM

Sorry, gave it an hour!

My hunch is informed by the idea that the lockout completely turned the competitive balance of power on it's ear and made the Wolves a less competitive team than they would have been in a normal AHL season. it just isn't the same league with all of those young NHLers around; you want to pin the consequences of this on the shoulders of Scott Arniel. Where was all this anti-Arniel sentiment during the four year tenure in Winnipeg with the Moose anyway. Are you seriously trying to tell me thay he has forgotten how to coach/develop young players in two short years?


I can't know what is and isn't in Arniels mind. What I can tell you is what I see on the ice and the decisions hes made.

PK has been a major issue since the beginning of the season whereas it was a great advantage under MacT. Last season, we were regularly in the top 5 PK teams all year long. This season, we were in the bottom 5 for literally months. Personnel decisions here affected the team greatly and it's effectiveness. Arniel decided to use Ebbett on the first unit despite a blind person seeing that he was a major liability there. He neglected to use last years regular PKers in Schroeder, Sweatt, and Miller; players who attributed to the excellence last season. He Even had Friesen on the PK instead of these guys. It's baffling.

Sauve looks confused as to what role he is in and what he is supposed to be doing. The Canucks want him to play a simple game such as he was last season, to the point that I thought he might be able to contribute in a 7-8 dman role for the Canucks. He has taken several steps back because he has gotten so far away from a simple game. He is now a high risk player on the ice with little reward with his poor pinches and poor decision making with the puck.

Kassian and Schroeder were ultimately the offensive cogs in the "tougher" AHL part of the season since Haydar and Ebbett could not handle the increased talent level. It was plain to see that the most effective players offensively were Kass and JS, but he refused to put them on the first PP. He refused to put them out there in the final minutes when trying to tie a game. They were given paltry PP minutes when they should have been a prime tool on the PP. MacT in 6 games had Jensen on the first PP because he recognized the talent and goal scorer he had in him.

Has Arniel forgotten how to coach? No, but are his decisions questionable? Highly and I think they are a contributing factor to the struggles of the Wolves this season.
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#1446 DJ Kreuzberg

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 08:34 PM

Okay so you watch all them games. I already new that about you. But where are the logical fallacies in my posts. I want to see them.

If you please?


1.Once again, how can the same organization whose management team remains unchanged develop players well one year to a team that has an ulterior motive to play their vets and stagnate our prospects? This is simply illogical.

You identified two prime indictments of the Wolves supposed incompetence. Polasek and Rodin.

2. You state you understand that other teams benefitted from top players moving down to the NHL. This happened to us as well. Polasek was pushed out of a spot because of the introduction of Tanev and Canuck guns for hire in Joslin and Mullen. Where is the blame to place on the Wolves? It's the Canucks moves that pushed him out of a spot. Whom would you rather have warming the bench, Miskovic or Polasek? Polasek got moved down for playing time, simple as that. Now he's back since there is room.

3. You have attributed the blame of Rodins play on the Wolves treatment of our young players, suggesting he has been given the short end of the stick. No, he has Ben given plenty of opportunity on the PP and in the top 6. He and only himself has failed to take the opportunity by the horns and capitalize. He is an inconsistent player who IMO has been playing himself out of a contract.

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#1447 Salmonberries

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 09:01 PM

1.Once again, how can the same organization whose management team remains unchanged develop players well one year to a team that has an ulterior motive to play their vets and stagnate our prospects? This is simply illogical.

You identified two prime indictments of the Wolves supposed incompetence. Polasek and Rodin.

2. You state you understand that other teams benefitted from top players moving down to the NHL. This happened to us as well. Polasek was pushed out of a spot because of the introduction of Tanev and Canuck guns for hire in Joslin and Mullen. Where is the blame to place on the Wolves? It's the Canucks moves that pushed him out of a spot. Whom would you rather have warming the bench, Miskovic or Polasek? Polasek got moved down for playing time, simple as that. Now he's back since there is room.

3. You have attributed the blame of Rodins play on the Wolves treatment of our young players, suggesting he has been given the short end of the stick. No, he has Ben given plenty of opportunity on the PP and in the top 6. He and only himself has failed to take the opportunity by the horns and capitalize. He is an inconsistent player who IMO has been playing himself out of a contract.

1)You make the unfounded assumption here that I agree that last year was a stellar year in player development for the Canucks. More like adequate imo. This years club is simply not as competitive in the lockout AHL, which needs to factored into any comparisons with last years team.

2)A team that truly controlled the destiny of it's AHL prospects, like, say, Calgary, would have Polasek playing in it's top six. not Hunt or Matheson. It would be Polasek And Sauve And Andersson not either/or Also, not every team benefited to the same extent from the lockout. The whole competitive balance of the AHL was tilted on it's ear with the Wolves being one of the teams that arguably benefited the least from young NHL talent. It's hard for me to condemn the performance of Arniel, three years removed from coach of the year honors in this landscape.

3) You may be right on this one. I personally thought he should have waited until this year to come over from Europe ala Jacob Silfverberg. The Canucks may have blown this one by rushing a project player.
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#1448 Salmonberries

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 09:11 PM

1.Once again, how can the same organization whose management team remains unchanged develop players well one year to a team that has an ulterior motive to play their vets and stagnate our prospects? This is simply illogical.

You identified two prime indictments of the Wolves supposed incompetence. Polasek and Rodin.

2. You state you understand that other teams benefitted from top players moving down to the NHL. This happened to us as well. Polasek was pushed out of a spot because of the introduction of Tanev and Canuck guns for hire in Joslin and Mullen. Where is the blame to place on the Wolves? It's the Canucks moves that pushed him out of a spot. Whom would you rather have warming the bench, Miskovic or Polasek? Polasek got moved down for playing time, simple as that. Now he's back since there is room.

3. You have attributed the blame of Rodins play on the Wolves treatment of our young players, suggesting he has been given the short end of the stick. No, he has Ben given plenty of opportunity on the PP and in the top 6. He and only himself has failed to take the opportunity by the horns and capitalize. He is an inconsistent player who IMO has been playing himself out of a contract.

Interesting. Thanks for sharing your insight here DJ. I'll now consider that coaching may just be a significant factor in all this.

I'm still inclined to wish for a change in affiliates next year though. The Atlanta fans and beat writer were so scathing in their assessment of the Wolves org toward the end that it's just hard not to think that there must be something to it. Granted, the Canucks do have a paucity of good talent to work with at the minor pro level.
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#1449 DJ Kreuzberg

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 11:09 PM

1)You make the unfounded assumption here that I agree that last year was a stellar year in player development for the Canucks. More like adequate imo. This years club is simply not as competitive in the lockout AHL, which needs to factored into any comparisons with last years team.

2)A team that truly controlled the destiny of it's AHL prospects, like, say, Calgary, would have Polasek playing in it's top six. not Hunt or Matheson. It would be Polasek And Sauve And Andersson not either/or Also, not every team benefited to the same extent from the lockout. The whole competitive balance of the AHL was tilted on it's ear with the Wolves being one of the teams that arguably benefited the least from young NHL talent. It's hard for me to condemn the performance of Arniel, three years removed from coach of the year honors in this landscape.

3) You may be right on this one. I personally thought he should have waited until this year to come over from Europe ala Jacob Silfverberg. The Canucks may have blown this one by rushing a project player.

1. Last season had adequate development? Now that's funny. Connauton looked like a guy who could play defense and run a PP and was an AHL Allstar. Tanev got prime time to work on all facets of his game, PK&PP, looked steady in all of those areas. This season he looked shaky for several games and for Tanev's standards. Sauve took a big step forward last season to the point where i thought he might be a Canuck in the near future and as I mentioned, several steps backwards this season. Now I don't even think he is worth a contract. Schroeder took huge steps defensively and in his all around game, began to shoot more and MacT would stay long after practice to help Schroeder on his game and face offs in particular. Rodin had an inconsistent first half last season, but really picked up his consistency in the 2nd half, was looking dangerous offensively. Now I find it hard for me to notice him in a game.

If last season is adequate development, let me know when its well above average. Id like to witness that.

On paper, this seasons AHL roster was significantly better than last season, with the additions of Sterling, Ebbett, Gordon (all 3 ahl allstars). I don't believe that the lockout AHL made the significant difference that you are indicating. Sure, its a factor but not to the extent you imply. You brought up OKC, we played them twice! We play Peoria, Milwaukee, GR, and Rockford the most. These are teams that were not that "significantly" impacted; we had 3 NHLers (ZK, JS, CT), GR had 3 (Tatar, smith, Lashoff), Peoria had 2 (Schwartz and cole), Rockford had the most with 5 (Kruger, saad, shaw, leddy, and bollig), and Milwaukee had 3 (Ellis, Bourque and Blum). Just how much at a disadvantage were we? Going into the season, even accounting for the lockout, we were supposed to be a very good team with vet presence, good role players and a deep as hell blue line with top pairing AHL dmen in Joslin, Mullen, Tanev and Connauton. I cannot concede that this was a team unable to contend with an increased level of competition.

2. A team like abbotsford? The one that sent its 2nd round pick mitch wahl, who was outplayed, to the ECHL as well? No they would never do that because according to your theory, they should gift spots to their prospects.

Hunt has become the teams best dman since the lockout. He deserves to be in the lineup and is deserving of his Allstar game nod.

Why are you holding on to fans and one writer's opinions of a defunct and dysfunctional NHL organization, instead of looking at the relationship that is built and continuing to be built with its current NHL org? IMO, it's two completely different situations and we have to recognize that.
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#1450 Salmonberries

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 11:56 PM

In fairness, I'd like to wait until Ebbett is back with the Wolves and it's genuine AHL competition we`re looking at for a reasonable stretch of games instead of hybrid lockout roster comp before we put the hit out on Arniel. The guy gets nothing but crap around here and I get kinda sick of it after a while. Multiple factors are contributing to the Wolves shaky season, injuries, increased lockout level of competition, and yes coaching changes. Also, the Canucks will cast the only vote that counts on the Wolves merits as a development franchise for their prospects when they renew or move on to a new AHL affiliation next year. I`m all for a change myself!
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#1451 jigsaw99

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 03:22 AM

Sorry, gave it an hour!



I can't know what is and isn't in Arniels mind. What I can tell you is what I see on the ice and the decisions hes made.

PK has been a major issue since the beginning of the season whereas it was a great advantage under MacT. Last season, we were regularly in the top 5 PK teams all year long. This season, we were in the bottom 5 for literally months. Personnel decisions here affected the team greatly and it's effectiveness. Arniel decided to use Ebbett on the first unit despite a blind person seeing that he was a major liability there. He neglected to use last years regular PKers in Schroeder, Sweatt, and Miller; players who attributed to the excellence last season. He Even had Friesen on the PK instead of these guys. It's baffling.

Sauve looks confused as to what role he is in and what he is supposed to be doing. The Canucks want him to play a simple game such as he was last season, to the point that I thought he might be able to contribute in a 7-8 dman role for the Canucks. He has taken several steps back because he has gotten so far away from a simple game. He is now a high risk player on the ice with little reward with his poor pinches and poor decision making with the puck.

Kassian and Schroeder were ultimately the offensive cogs in the "tougher" AHL part of the season since Haydar and Ebbett could not handle the increased talent level. It was plain to see that the most effective players offensively were Kass and JS, but he refused to put them on the first PP. He refused to put them out there in the final minutes when trying to tie a game. They were given paltry PP minutes when they should have been a prime tool on the PP. MacT in 6 games had Jensen on the first PP because he recognized the talent and goal scorer he had in him.

Has Arniel forgotten how to coach? No, but are his decisions questionable? Highly and I think they are a contributing factor to the struggles of the Wolves this season.



Arniel needs to go!

Edited by jigsaw99, 10 February 2013 - 03:24 AM.

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#1452 Salmonberries

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 05:10 AM

Everybody seems to think Arniel has been a complete disaster down there. I'm kind of surprised but hey, maybe it's gonna be one and done for him after this season.
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#1453 Bananas

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Posted 16 February 2013 - 01:47 PM

If I'm not mistaken, isn't this an Anton Rodin thread?

How's he been doing?
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#1454 BureisBest

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 03:42 PM

I don't think the criticism for drafting Rodin is warranted.

First of all, the draft is one giant game of poker. You bluff other teams, you go all-in on certain players, and you trust your own judgement in who you decide to bet on. At the end of the day, you're still waiting for that river card to show up. For most teams, it doesn't, and for a lucky few, it does.

We have one of the best Swedish scouts in the business in Thomas Gradin, and if he saw something special in Anton Rodin that could translate to the NHL, who can blame the Canucks in drafting the kid? If we didn't, another team was going to in short order.

He's had injuries hamper his play on the ice and training off the ice, which was crucial to his development in strengthening and adjusting to the North American game. Our minor league program has also been in shambles since he arrived to the Wolves, and he hasn't been put in the best opportunity to develop, succeed, and build confidence on the ice.

Now that we have full autonomy over our minor league team, why wouldn't we re-sign Rodin and put him a position to succeed on the ice? Get him on the powerplay and playing with skilled players. It's not going to be expensive to bring him back, and to give up on a 22 year old skilled winger this early in his career when our organization is lacking prospect depth, does not make a whole lot of sense.

Remember what happened when we gave up on Michael Grabner at 22 years old?
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#1455 zoner.

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 03:53 PM

Remember what happened when we gave up on Michael Grabner at 22 years old?

Michael Grabner was also a top-15 pick that had shown he could play in the North America by putting up 30 goal seasons in the WHL. Rodin hasn't shown he can contribute on a consistent basis on this side of the pond. Bad comparison.

Edited by zoner., 28 April 2013 - 04:02 PM.

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#1456 BureisBest

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 04:28 PM

Michael Grabner was also a top-15 pick that had shown he could play in the North America by putting up 30 goal seasons in the WHL. Rodin hasn't shown he can contribute on a consistent basis on this side of the pond. Bad comparison.


Fair enough on the Grabner comparison. Although Rodin has been hampered by injuries and is a speedy and skilled winger. The rest of my argument stands though. Low risk/high reward giving Rodin another shot in our fully controlled minor system.
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#1457 zoner.

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 04:31 PM

Fair enough on the Grabner comparison. Although Rodin has been hampered by injuries and is a speedy and skilled winger. The rest of my argument stands though. Low risk/high reward giving Rodin another shot in our fully controlled minor system.

Management seemed high on the kid and he has definitely had injury problems, so I don't see the risk in giving him a 1-2 year deal to see if he can put it together. That said, he's falling down the depth chart rapidly and it's only going to continue if more wingers are added in the 2013 Draft.

Edited by zoner., 28 April 2013 - 04:31 PM.

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#1458 stonecoldstevebernier

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 04:33 PM

I think his injuries may have been his undoing... having such ailments at a critical time in his career could have stunted his development. Maybe he improves next year, but who knows if management is even willing to offer him another contract. I hope they are, as he's only 22 and there's a reason he was drafted in the 2nd round, and played for Sweden at the WJCs. I'd like to see him tendered a one-year deal if possible. Now that we have control of our own AHL team, we can better monitor Rodin's play and management will have more say in how much ice time Rodin gets.

Whatever the case, I think its safe to say that Rodin probably only has one more shot - if that - to make an impact. I can't see him being renewed again if he turns out another season like this one, and its really unfortunate with the way his luck's gone.
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#1459 Phamda

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 11:34 PM

I think it would be a mistake to give up on Rodin given how his injuries prevented and never being put in a situation to succeed on the ice for him to excel for any length of time given how young he still is. There is absolutely no harm is re-signing him to a 2 year two-way deal to let him know management still has faith in him Or because we now own our affiliate we can sign him to an AHL only deal for him to prove he still has a future in the NHL. The problem with the latter is if he lights it up any team could sign him if they wanted.
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#1460 Canvoucer Vanuck

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Posted 01 May 2013 - 02:22 AM

His shoulder injuries coupled with his concussions have affected him badly to the point where he avoids contact pretty much all the time. He has to fix that up or he'll never make it. Hopefully he can put on a lot more bulk and strengthen up. I could see them giving one more year to see if he progresses.
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#1461 BlackOut

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 03:54 PM

His shoulder injuries coupled with his concussions have affected him badly to the point where he avoids contact pretty much all the time. He has to fix that up or he'll never make it. Hopefully he can put on a lot more bulk and strengthen up. I could see them giving one more year to see if he progresses.


I agree
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#1462 BureisBest

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 01:59 PM

Looks like Rodin is done. http://canucksarmy.c...igns-with-bryns
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#1463 playboi19

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 02:06 PM

detroit got Tatar! GOD DAMNIT!


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#1464 Coconuts

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 04:35 PM

That's too bad.. injuries were his undoing. It's a shame thing couldn't have gone differently.
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#1465 stonecoldstevebernier

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 05:31 PM

Looks like Rodin is done. http://canucksarmy.c...igns-with-bryns


What a shame. But not a total surprise given his lack of results in North America and the injuries he sustained here. Our prospect pool has definitely started to sag even further with the departures of Connauton and Rodin (not that they were contenders for roster spots, but it looks worse on the organization when you take a look at their drafting record now).
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#1466 SEAN HARNETT

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 02:00 AM

Another showing of the Canucks scouting ineptitude. And to think they almost took this guy in the first round!
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#1467 Lancaster

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 11:09 AM

Another showing of the Canucks scouting ineptitude. And to think they almost took this guy in the first round!


You mean the same scout who found Alex Edler, Eddie Lack and was instrumental in getting the Twins?
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#1468 Fred65

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 01:03 PM

Who knows maybe some home cooking might help. He obviously has some skill, and maybe a little more time at home....well we can hope, Vcr retains his rights
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#1469 VegasCanuck

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Posted 29 May 2013 - 03:50 PM

You never know, he's still a Canuck prospect. If he turns his game around back in Sweden (probably better than continuing in AHL for now) they still retain his rights unless they don't tender qualifying.

They could still resign him and bring him back down the road!
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#1470 DeNiro

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 06:34 PM

Rodin with a goal in his second game for Brynas today.

I know alot of people have probably given up on this guy, but I don't think the Canucks have. He isn't even 23 yet remember. Alot of Swedish players are late bloomers, so there's still hope for this guy IMO.

He just needs to mature more physically, and get his confidence back.

Also of note, Bill Sweatt scored in his first game for Brynas and is playing on the same line as Rodin. I don't think that is a coincidence. I'm betting the Canucks orchestrated that.
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