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Kevin Bieksa you are really...


Zigmund.Palffy

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Totally agree buddy, i cant belive how many people all over this guy! I guess some people just need to point the finger at somebody. Like you said he hasnt been our best defencemen but hes really doing what hes being asked to do. The coaching staff isnt asking for him to play 25mins be our best defencemen. I hear a lot about the slashing penalty he took last night. Get over it, if the stick never broke it wouldnt have been an issue, i havent heard one person say anything about henriks cough up in the neutral zone that led to a goal??? we may be 1-1-1 but im happy with what i see. I dont see any real weaknesses once burr is back to balance out the lines a bit better. i think after these guys anyone who knows hockey sould be pretty optimistic about the season!

Well Said!

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And this post is in support of Boo Boo?

"He cost us a goal on that play, and took a penalty to put us down 2 men thereby resulting in another goal, but hey! he did make 5 good piches which didn't result in any goals."

I gave you the benefit of the doubt here and re-watched the play. Not even close to "sauntering". In fact he busted his butt and prevented Selanne from going in on a clear cut breakaway.

He then left his position to cover the trailer because Hank was late in doing so. (I admit this may have been a tactical error, but hardly a lack of effort) It should also be noted that Samuelsson shares the blame for this because he decided to check the player that Bieksa was already covering, leaving the trailer wide open.

To blame Bieksa for this goal is to ignore glaring mistakes by both Hank and Sammy.

EDIT: In watching this replay, I see that Visnovsky was guilty of playing the puck with his hand while it was in the crease. I realize that this isn't the same as closing his hand on the puck, but I've it seen called for less....

This should save me the trouble

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I'd also like to add that Bieksa is the ONLY defenseman on the team that is +1 through 3 games, despite not scoring any points. Everyone else is 0, and Edler is -1. Sedins are the ONLY forwards that are -1, despite having 4 and 5 points each.

Hmmm... maybe it's the SEDINS who aren't playing defensively???? But noooo... they can't do any wrong... let's just blame Bieksa instead.

Jack McIlhargey was around plus 38 one year teamed the entire time with Mark Howe. So what's your point?

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Great tonight :), That Penalty you took in OT was Questionable, but no hate, you gotta give the new guys credit

Hamhuis, Ballard, Malhotra wow you gotta take them out to Roxys for bailing you out .

WTF? I thought beiksa was actually quite good. You guys rag on him because of the slash. If that slash doesnt happen no one rags on him. He is this years SOB.

WTF do we always need a scapegoat. Man I miss taylor pyatt he actually WAS bad.

The commentators complimented B quite a few times.

Stop drinking the Hatoraide and start watching subjectivly....

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WTF? I thought beiksa was actually quite good. You guys rag on him because of the slash. If that slash doesnt happen no one rags on him. He is this years SOB.

WTF do we always need a scapegoat. Man I miss taylor pyatt he actually WAS bad.

The commentators complimented B quite a few times.

Stop drinking the Hatoraide and start watching subjectivly....

+1

It seems like the Bieksa haters will see any flaw and blow it out of proportion. Its not that there are Bieksa haters and Bieksa lovers. Its just people who hate Bieksa because his name is Bieksa, and people who aren't subjective or biased towards the guy :shock:

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Ah....but didn't you?

Your honour I present State's evidence, marked #001

I find it interesting that, Before the season started, people were refuting my point based on bieksas +- stat, when it wasnt a good stat for them to use to show he was a good player... Now after a huge amount of games (3) He is a +1, and all of a sudden, wooooo... He cant be bad..hes plus one!!

Yes I know, you never used the plus minus stat.Never mentioned you did...

As can be seen when I quoted someone else :P

Am i not 'people' good sir?! If you prick me, do I not bleed?

I assert that I am people....i'm damn fine people. And I did refute your point regarding statistics. And now, I stand before you, here today to say that I have not statistically argued on this day......nay, I have neither 'woooooo'ed' Yet i have been excluded from the good people...my good implicitly and inherently name sullied and dragged through the cyber-mud.

I seek reparations! Justice! and an aknowledgement that I too, am of the people.....but, I am also not to be lumped into the riff raff that scoundrelously call themselves 'people' too....for I am not of their ilk, and they, sir, are no kinsman of mine!

You , sir, and your argument, sir, have been weighed, measured and found wanting!

I demand redress!

I rest my case.

:)

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It is a real shame that this board does not have any posts older than October of 2008, because it would sure be interesting to see peoples' evaluation of Bieksa's play three or four years ago.

I wasn't on these boards then, but I distinctly remember my own and others' initial reactions to Bieksa's play when he was first wafted up from the farm.

Many hate Dan Russell, but when I used to listen to him, he pegged current play accurately. He called Bieksa "casual".

A friend said he seemed eager but clueless.

And I immediately thought -- here's a guy with confidence who thinks he'll be the next Orr, Bourque, or Park. Too bad he doesn;t know how to play on his own side of the red line.

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Ah....but didn't you?

Your honour I present State's evidence, marked #001

Am i not 'people' good sir?! If you prick me, do I not bleed?

I assert that I am people....i'm damn fine people. And I did refute your point regarding statistics. And now, I stand before you, here today to say that I have not statistically argued on this day......nay, I have neither 'woooooo'ed' Yet i have been excluded from the good people...my good implicitly and inherently name sullied and dragged through the cyber-mud.

I seek reparations! Justice! and an aknowledgement that I too, am of the people.....but, I am also not to be lumped into the riff raff that scoundrelously call themselves 'people' too....for I am not of their ilk, and they, sir, are no kinsman of mine!

You , sir, and your argument, sir, have been weighed, measured and found wanting!

I demand redress!

I rest my case.

:)

Redress???

O come on!

How was that? :P

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+1

It seems like the Bieksa haters will see any flaw and blow it out of proportion. Its not that there are Bieksa haters and Bieksa lovers. Its just people who hate Bieksa because his name is Bieksa, and people who aren't subjective or biased towards the guy :shock:

That's not true at all, there are both Bieksa lovers and Bieksa haters and they both have blinders on for him. There are a lot of haters in this thread that will knit pick everything he does. But there are also a lot of lovers in this thread that brushes off his mistakes, no matter how big they are.

Bieksa has made mistakes all 3 games, but he has made some really good plays all 3 games. The lovers will not say he has made mistakes or they brush off his mistakes saying "So and so made this mistake so why not rag on him" Or "Sure he made that mistake but he also did this and this and this". While the haters will just point out his mistakes, lots of them are little mistakes that change absolutely nothing and aren't a big deal.

So yes, there is Bieksa haters and lovers.

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There are definitely people who can't seem to see what's wrong with the way this guy plays defense. His gap control is just awful, he can't defend the crease to save his life, and he often seems completely unaware - of where his teammates are, where the opposing players are, where the puck is, or worst of all, whether it's a good idea to take an offensive chance at any particular point in the game (like, when we're up by a goal). He telegraphs everything he does worse than anybody else on the team. These aspects of his game are definitely below NHL caliber. He also is not a good shooter at all - his shooting percentage is consistently among the worst on the team, as is his ratio of missed shots to shots on goal. He needs his teammates to make everything easy for him. He is not really good at making a breakout pass, though he can make a tape to tape pass, he will often put the puck to where he thinks somebody will be, instead of putting it on somebody's stick, and he never seems to want to just make the easy first pass. No vision or awareness at all. He often needs his partner to throw a pick for him when he goes back to collect the puck, as Tatoes mentioned, all of this having a draining effect on the whole team. A chain is only as strong as its weakest link.

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Totally agree buddy, i cant belive how many people all over this guy! I guess some people just need to point the finger at somebody. Like you said he hasnt been our best defencemen but hes really doing what hes being asked to do. The coaching staff isnt asking for him to play 25mins be our best defencemen. I hear a lot about the slashing penalty he took last night. Get over it, if the stick never broke it wouldnt have been an issue, i havent heard one person say anything about henriks cough up in the neutral zone that led to a goal??? we may be 1-1-1 but im happy with what i see. I dont see any real weaknesses once burr is back to balance out the lines a bit better. i think after these guys anyone who knows hockey sould be pretty optimistic about the season!

Right on, and staying on the topic of Bieksa...

The intangibles are what he is on this team to bring. For the past couple years, the accurate consensus was that the Nux lacked consistent physical presence and the traits that edgy players with above average skill sets bring. At forward we had Frick and Frack (Kes and Burr's duo's old nickname) and then guys like Samuelson, Hordichuk and Rypien (Don't even try and say Glass or Bernier count) These guys were the physical, passionate players, but in reality only Kes Burr and Samuelson had the potential to be game changers. Hell they were the only guys liable for their actions enough to deserve being on the ice when there was the need for a "game changer".

As a quick example, look at the Cup winners from last year. They had:

Buttfuglyalien

Versteeg

Ladd

Kopecky

Bolland

Brouwer

On defence we had Edler, O'Brien, and sometimes Salo/Bieksa. Salo's getting older, and Bieksa was barely there and when he was, he was trying to play catch up conditioning and intensity wise.

Gillis addressed this last necessary ingredient for a solid contending team. He went out and bought Grit, Determiniation, Intensity and Aggression (not O'Brien's unbridled kind either). He got Malhotra, Torres, and let Desbiens and Bolduc have a spot, making for:

Burrows

Kesler

Malhotra

Torres

Desbiens

Bolduc

On Defence he brought in Hamhuis the Hammer and Ballard the Battering ram. That wasn't enough. He realized the potential Bieksa has, and thought "Hey if this kid who was once projected to be a superstar could play a whole season without an injury that would shoot even Hussein Bolt's confidence, he may just produce as well as expected. PLUS he's everything I've been looking around to spend on. He's a keeper".

And so far Bieksa is proving him right. He's hit, he's been offensive, and he's been defensibly sound. That slash was a borderline call, one that could (and does) happen to every player and it is just put into ever numbnut's focus because the spotlight is currently so bright on him

Lose your ignorance. Watch the game. Be objective. Judge and value based on Hockey and performances, not Drama and media's opinion.

/rant

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Bieksa's great! no costly penalty's this year yet! (Sarcasm)

I'm going to assume you're talking about last night's penalty...

You wouldn't be saying that if you'd played competitive hockey before. Those composite sticks are flimsy. I guarantee if it was a good ol wood stick it wouldn't have broken. Bieksa has looked solid this year.. and he's hardly the reason they haven't been able to put things together. Secondary scoring has been brutal. Hell, only the Sedins have showed up the last few games. Every other forward has been snake bitten this year.

Also, his penalty against LA was terribly weak. If Hamhuis can get the stick slashed out of his hands then Bieksa should be allowed to lightly brush a guy as he's bustin his ass to the point.

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Right on, and staying on the topic of Bieksa...

The intangibles are what he is on this team to bring. For the past couple years, the accurate consensus was that the Nux lacked consistent physical presence and the traits that edgy players with above average skill sets bring. At forward we had Frick and Frack (Kes and Burr's duo's old nickname) and then guys like Samuelson, Hordichuk and Rypien (Don't even try and say Glass or Bernier count) These guys were the physical, passionate players, but in reality only Kes Burr and Samuelson had the potential to be game changers. Hell they were the only guys liable for their actions enough to deserve being on the ice when there was the need for a "game changer".

As a quick example, look at the Cup winners from last year. They had:

Buttfuglyalien

Versteeg

Ladd

Kopecky

Bolland

Brouwer

On defence we had Edler, O'Brien, and sometimes Salo/Bieksa. Salo's getting older, and Bieksa was barely there and when he was, he was trying to play catch up conditioning and intensity wise.

Gillis addressed this last necessary ingredient for a solid contending team. He went out and bought Grit, Determiniation, Intensity and Aggression (not O'Brien's unbridled kind either). He got Malhotra, Torres, and let Desbiens and Bolduc have a spot, making for:

Burrows

Kesler

Malhotra

Torres

Desbiens

Bolduc

On Defence he brought in Hamhuis the Hammer and Ballard the Battering ram. That wasn't enough. He realized the potential Bieksa has, and thought "Hey if this kid who was once projected to be a superstar could play a whole season without an injury that would shoot even Hussein Bolt's confidence, he may just produce as well as expected. PLUS he's everything I've been looking around to spend on. He's a keeper".

And so far Bieksa is proving him right. He's hit, he's been offensive, and he's been defensibly sound. That slash was a borderline call, one that could (and does) happen to every player and it is just put into ever numbnut's focus because the spotlight is currently so bright on him

Lose your ignorance. Watch the game. Be objective. Judge and value based on Hockey and performances, not Drama and media's opinion.

/rant

ok I can give you physical and offense but NOT DEFENSIVELY SOUND

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He made some pretty little (smart and safe) dangles our from behind our net a couple times in these early games. He's also eating the puck into the boards and absorbing hits in the face of inevitable hits and preventing coughing up the puck. There have been plenty of quick intelligent passes and COUNTLESS examples of commitment to get back, to get himself involved, and to be the change he wants to be (hustling back on plays, giving options in trailers and back passes)...

I could be wrong though. Could you give me some examples or reasoning as to why his play has not been defensively sound?

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I'm going to assume you're talking about last night's penalty...

You wouldn't be saying that if you'd played competitive hockey before. Those composite sticks are flimsy. I guarantee if it was a good ol wood stick it wouldn't have broken. Bieksa has looked solid this year.. and he's hardly the reason they haven't been able to put things together. Secondary scoring has been brutal. Hell, only the Sedins have showed up the last few games. Every other forward has been snake bitten this year.

Also, his penalty against LA was terribly weak. If Hamhuis can get the stick slashed out of his hands then Bieksa should be allowed to lightly brush a guy as he's bustin his ass to the point.

Hopefully Bieksa keeps that in mind next time he intends to stick check someone.laugh.gif

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:picard:

you take the best player available that meets your cap needs. It's that simple. So who in the nucks system will do a better job then Bieksa to replace him at this point ?

I'm hoping you figure it out this time so I can discountinue the hand-over-hand assistance I have to keep giving you.

Are you that stupid? No one is saying that we could match quality for quality. However, that doesn't mean that you can't take the same right philosophy for your team but just at a smaller scale. The philosophy of having no defensive weaknesses while maintaining as much scoring as possible is foolproof. That is how the Hawks, Wings, Ducks, and Pens did it, they don't have a Kevin Bieksa on their team because the extra offense, what little he has from his nut huggers, is simply not worth the weaknesses added.

The same works for team Canada by leaving out Green, this is just at a larger scale than our Bieksa issue.

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When has Kevin Bieksa EVER been projected to be a superstar???

He can't even pressure the puck carrier without overcommitting. I'm sorry, but NHL defensemen need to be able to be able to have a middle ground between collapsing and giving up the blueline, or going "all in." And that is a big problem with Kevin's game is he goes "all in" way, way too often. He gets a lot of takeaways that way. He also takes himself out of position a lot that way.

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