لني Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Good point. But, how many giveaways (11) resulted in a goal for the other team VS how many takeaways (9) resulted in a goal for the nucks? I think I could take a pretty good stab at the answer LOL Gee maybe you should be looking at how many GvA resulted in a goal and how many TkA prevented a goal. Considering as a D most will occur in the D zone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slegr Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 I'm wondering if Bieksa will fight at any point this season. It's soooo depressing when one of your team's top fighters refuses to fight. I'm not saying he should go out looking for scraps, but he has been given plenty of opportunity in heated situations to remind us that he is a fantastic fighter. I can't even remember the last time he dropped the gloves. He's starting to play better, but I'd like to see him stick up for his teammates by fighting for them whenever he gets the chance. That element of his game is looong over due. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugemanskost Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Bieksa is a very good pound-for-pound fighter. He has been for his entire career. When the time comes where a fight will help the team, KB will step up and answer the bell. There still has not been a Canuck's game this year where a fight has made a difference in the outcome. If a fight will help the Canucks, Bieksa, Glass or, God forbid, Rypien, will engage. Bieksa is far more useful on the ice (in 20+ minutes per game and a huge PK role) than he is in the box. Possible injuries are another reason Bieksa shouldn't fight. We have already proven, 13 matches into the year, that our defence is either injury-prone or unlucky. Losing / trading / waiving KB at this, or any other stage of this season, would be silly and counter-productive to the team. Depth is everything in the playoffs, as has been shown the last 15 years. The Canucks haven't had it and they have failed to progress past round 2. Bieksa provides that depth at the back. Next year could be a different story, but, if I were GM, I would be looking to extend Bieksa (at a lesser cap hit than his current 3.75) now so our depth remains. Salo and Ehrhoff may not be back. All of a sudden, we not too deep. Flamers... flame away! Haters... hate away! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Lol...come on pal. There's no comparison to Juice by Alberts or Ballard or ANY defenceman on this team, who the man is, when it come to handing out the knuckle sandwiches. Those other two, yes provide "toughness" as far as physicality...but when it come to the handing out the beats....ain't no one got nothing on Boom Boom Bieksa. There's no argument here and no equivalency in comparison to him. /discussion. So you agree with the post I was contradicting and also believe that no other dman on our team brings toughness? That is what that other guy said........totally false, imo. Bieksa------0 fights this season. Even if Alberts and Bieksa landed on punch or scored one takedown, they have both laid the beats more than Bieksa has this season. Say what you want about Alberts and Ballards fighting ability. At least they are willing to stand up and give it a go. Where has Boom Boom been this season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANUCKLELION Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Alberts isn't a good fighter and Ballard never fights anybody that can throw em. Bieksa is a very good pound for pound fighter. As far as toughness goes they're not in the same league. http://www.hockeyfig...om/fights/88442 Kesler says "thanks Juice" Alberts doesn't win many fights but he is a giant of a man so when he hits, he hits hard, especially compared to 'little man's syndrome' Bieksa. The fact is Alberts hits more often and harder, he also fights more often than BXa. Most of Alberts' fights are the result of an opposing player standing up or seeking revenge on behalf of one of their teammates after a big hit by Alberts. Bieksa rarely fights any more, and lately, only fights other lightweights like Richards. Alberts is a much more physically intimidating player, probably the most intimidating Dman on the team. Bieksa though, has the toughest sneer in the league .lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpshooter Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 I'm wondering if Bieksa will fight at any point this season. It's soooo depressing when one of your team's top fighters refuses to fight. I'm not saying he should go out looking for scraps, but he has been given plenty of opportunity in heated situations to remind us that he is a fantastic fighter. I can't even remember the last time he dropped the gloves. He's starting to play better, but I'd like to see him stick up for his teammates by fighting for them whenever he gets the chance. That element of his game is looong over due. Bieksa's job isn't to remind us that he's a fantastic fighter. His job is to be an effective defenceman. Why would you be depressed if he doesn't fight? That's the wierdest thing i've heard all day. He's not an enforcer or an energy guy or any of the things that the other pugilists of the league are on their respective teams for. And i haven't seen anything on the ice while he was on it that would warrant him to take a fighting major where he should have taken offence on behalf of his teammates. You seem like the person who doesn't fight, but forms a cirlce around two guys that can fight and yells "Fight, Fight, Fight". You have a short memory if you can't remember his fights last season. And there's no refusal to fight....there's just no need so far to. Once there is, be assured that he will. Till then...pop in your 'Rock 'Em Sock 'Em' VHS tape and enjoy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpshooter Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 So you agree with the post I was contradicting and also believe that no other dman on our team brings toughness? That is what that other guy said........totally false, imo. Bieksa------0 fights this season. Even if Alberts and Bieksa landed on punch or scored one takedown, they have both laid the beats more than Bieksa has this season. Say what you want about Alberts and Ballards fighting ability. At least they are willing to stand up and give it a go. Where has Boom Boom been this season? Show me a time where Boom Boom needed to drop the gloves and didn't? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Actually, in the argument of who is the toughest dman on the team, I would vote for Salo. playing in a game after taking one off the jewels screams toughness....... If you guys say Bieksa is the best fighter on our D, you are right. If you say he is the toughest dman, you would have to qualify that statement with more than just the fact he is a good fighter. Being a good fighter doesnt mean you are automatically tough. Anyone willing to fight on the ice is tough, win or lose imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugemanskost Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 So you agree with the post I was contradicting and also believe that no other dman on our team brings toughness? That is what that other guy said........totally false, imo. Bieksa------0 fights this season. Even if Alberts and Bieksa landed on punch or scored one takedown, they have both laid the beats more than Bieksa has this season. Say what you want about Alberts and Ballards fighting ability. At least they are willing to stand up and give it a go. Where has Boom Boom been this season? Show me any time this year when any Canuck has needed to fight to affect the game. It simply hasn't happened, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Show me a time where Boom Boom needed to drop the gloves and didn't? As a leader on this team (after all, you guys all have a giant boner over him wearing the A), he should be in there first EVERY time. He is the only fighter wearing an A. As an example, Ballard got rocked (resulting in a concussion) and no one, least of all Bieksa, stood up and sent a message to try to deter the other teams in this league. Show me another team other than Detroit who would not have responded to that happening? There arent any that I can think of. At the very least take a number and dish it back to them later in the game. I havent even seen Bieksa push anybody in a scrum this season. Maybe he thinks he is too good or too valuable to fight anymore, who knows. He hasnt been scoring goals or generating points, he isnt fighting at all, he hasnt stood up the way he used to, and he displays pretty much zero emotion in his game. What exactly is his value again? How many games will it take without any of the passionate physical play before people admit that he is not the same tough player that he used to be in the early years? And for everyone saying there have not been any opportunities for him to fight or that it hasnt been necessary yet, do you even remember the old Bieksa? Would he have given a crap about that? No, because he did it based on emotion, not calculation, and it made him a better player and team guy back then. THAT is what made his fights inspiring to the team. They were random and they were for a reason. You may see him picking his spots and waiting for the stars to align before fighting as him maturing, but I see it as him being neutered. We can agree to disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpshooter Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Actually, in the argument of who is the toughest dman on the team, I would vote for Salo. playing in a game after taking one off the jewels screams toughness....... If you guys say Bieksa is the best fighter on our D, you are right. If you say he is the toughest dman, you would have to qualify that statement with more than just the fact he is a good fighter. Being a good fighter doesnt mean you are automatically tough. Anyone willing to fight on the ice is tough, win or lose imo. Puss's don't win fights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Show me any time this year when any Canuck has needed to fight to affect the game. It simply hasn't happened, IMO. You have seen no instances this season where the team is playing passionless hockey, getting dominated, and unable to come up with a response? You know, a time where momentum could be shifted by a dominating fight? Strange, I have seen it several times, even in some games they have won. I have also seen a few really big hits that should have been deterred right away. Like when Ballard got rocked by Richardson. Legal or not, someone should have answered the bell there. As the so called leader of the D, it should have been Bieksa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Puss's don't win fights. Maybe not, but some of the toughest guys I have ever run across have not been the best fighters in the world either. That slices both ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slegr Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 I've watched every televised Canucks game this season, including those in pre-season, and I've seen plenty of opportunities where Bieksa could have defended his teammates by dropping the gloves. One of the most obvious examples I'm reminded of is when our godsend prospect Cody Hodgson was cruelly plastered into the boards on a late hit, with Bieksa metres away, in one of the final preseason games. No response came from Bieksa. Bieksa used to be a guy who stood up for his teammates. He used to play with an edge. It's what earned him a multi-million dollar contract. Now he plays safe and ordinary. He's mustered second assists, and he's gone through motions. He's playing like he wants out of Canucksville, and isn't willing to risk damaging his knuckles for a team that he's already put in his rearview mirror. It's somewhat strange to say, but until I see him drop the gloves at the defense of one of his teammates, I'll remain unconvinced that his spirit is sporting a Canucks jersey. The Bieksa of old left no doubt in fans' minds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugemanskost Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 You have seen no instances this season where the team is playing passionless hockey, getting dominated, and unable to come up with a response? You know, a time where momentum could be shifted by a dominating fight? Strange, I have seen it several times, even in some games they have won. I have also seen a few really big hits that should have been deterred right away. Like when Ballard got rocked by Richardson. Legal or not, someone should have answered the bell there. As the so called leader of the D, it should have been Bieksa. Was the wonderful Rick Rypien in the lineup that night? Tanner Glass? Who was Ballard's partner? Why didn't Ballard stick up for himself? It doesn't have to be the "leader of the D" who fights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANUCKLELION Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Puss's don't win fights. I guess that's why Bieksa hasn't won one for at least a year eh? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Was the wonderful Rick Rypien in the lineup that night? Tanner Glass? Who was Ballard's partner? Why didn't Ballard stick up for himself? It doesn't have to be the "leader of the D" who fights. Aha, but Alberts was his partner and all you guys are saying Alberts is a useless fighter. If Bieksa is the ONLY fighter on our D, then it is his job. You guys cant have it both ways. Ballard probably didnt stick up for himself because he had his bell rung and could barely get off the ice let alone fight. use your head on that one..... Rick Rypien was injured that game. A better question is, why not Bieksa? Why is he too good to stick up for Ballard there? Why should it be up to Glass or Alberts? Excuses, excuses, excuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpshooter Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 As a leader on this team (after all, you guys all have a giant boner over him wearing the A), he should be in there first EVERY time. He is the only fighter wearing an A. As an example, Ballard got rocked (resulting in a concussion) and no one, least of all Bieksa, stood up and sent a message to try to deter the other teams in this league. Show me another team other than Detroit who would not have responded to that happening? There arent any that I can think of. At the very least take a number and dish it back to them later in the game. I havent even seen Bieksa push anybody in a scrum this season. Maybe he thinks he is too good or too valuable to fight anymore, who knows. He hasnt been scoring goals or generating points, he isnt fighting at all, he hasnt stood up the way he used to, and he displays pretty much zero emotion in his game. What exactly is his value again? How many games will it take without any of the passionate physical play before people admit that he is not the same tough player that he used to be in the early years? And for everyone saying there have not been any opportunities for him to fight or that it hasnt been necessary yet, do you even remember the old Bieksa? Would he have given a crap about that? No, because he did it based on emotion, not calculation, and it made him a better player and team guy back then. THAT is what made his fights inspiring to the team. They were random and they were for a reason. You may see him picking his spots and waiting for the stars to align before fighting as him maturing, but I see it as him being neutered. We can agree to disagree. :sadno:Bieksa wasn't pn the ice with Ballard....hmmm...now let's see, who was? Oh that's right...it was Rome. When the chance was there, Rome didn't answer the bell. When was the last time that Bieksa didn't go after a guy on the ice that took a run at our guys while he was on the ice? That's right, there hasn't been an occasion, and therefore no occasion of reason for Juice to drop the gloves. Zero emotion? That's laughable. You're a funny guy. You amuse me....well, hyperbolic guy for sure....lol....zero emotion. And the leader of the team isn't going to go head hunting after the fact. Plus you'd b**** and complain that he took a penalty after the play or the next shift and his job is to play defense and not go after guys. Man...you're really getting into Hank&Dan territory now. Just the fact that you're questioning his toughness and using scrum pushing matches as an observation towards that point just shows me that you're grapsing for an argument here. You don't have a leg to stand on when it comes to Bieksa's toughness, grit and reputation in the lockerroom as a guy that stands up for his mates, and around the league as a guy who'll drop them, if he sees the need. You got nothing. 0 fights in 13 games? lol....well, if that's your credible and empirical evidence, you keep holding on tight to that one. The rest of us will just watch you with a sad look on our faces, to see the once sensible and sane person we know, reduced to "He haznt fawt in turteen gamez, Oh noes!" "He'z No tuff!" Sad, my brother....just sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugemanskost Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 I've watched every televised Canucks game this season, including those in pre-season, and I've seen plenty of opportunities where Bieksa could have defended his teammates by dropping the gloves. One of the most obvious examples I'm reminded of is when our godsend prospect Cody Hodgson was cruelly plastered into the boards on a late hit, with Bieksa metres away, in one of the final preseason games. No response came from Bieksa. Bieksa used to be a guy who stood up for his teammates. He used to play with an edge. It's what earned him a multi-million dollar contract. Now he plays safe and ordinary. He's mustered second assists, and he's gone through motions. He's playing like he wants out of Canucksville, and isn't willing to risk damaging his knuckles for a team that he's already put in his rearview mirror. It's somewhat strange to say, but until I see him drop the gloves at the defense of one of his teammates, I'll remain unconvinced that his spirit is sporting a Canucks jersey. The Bieksa of old left no doubt in fans' minds. Happy 600th post, Slegr! Bieksa is having a good year so far. When his pugilism is needed, he will be there. There's more to Boom Boom than just fighting. He is far more valuable to the team on the ice than in the box. Let the Rypiens of the world fight and let the hockey players play hockey. Hodgson being "cruelly plastered" into the boards during a pre-season game and no one "standing up for him" may have more to say about Hodson than Bieksa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpshooter Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 I guess that's why Bieksa hasn't won one for at least a year eh? lol lol lol lol lol lol lol You love your lol's at the end of every stupid comment don't you? lol lol lol lol lol lol lol Ugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.