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Poll: Connauton or Granani (198 member(s) have cast votes)

Which defenceman has more upside,or do You think will be a more valuable Defenceman in the future ?

  1. 22 yr old Connauton (167 votes [84.34%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 84.34%

  2. 25 yr old Gragnani (31 votes [15.66%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 15.66%

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#1141 Niloc009

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 04:37 PM

Why are you only showing 1 - 5 on what you have called "Top 10 Canucks Prospects"?

as for your list, I realize that most rankings are done by a prospects current value which It seems like you have. I find myself prone to ranking prospects by what sort of career I could see them having. With that in mind, I think we have 2 defensemen, McNally and Corrado, who still need time to develop but look as if they could have some very promising careers. I think due to K-con's sub par defensive set and JS's lack of size, that their success in the NHL will be somewhat limited. That being said, McNally and Corrado might not even develop into NHL defensemen...........but I like to think they will and that they will be really good :towel:


Delivering the Sauce: Top-10 Canucks Prospects (Part I)
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#1142 The Nuckist

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 04:45 PM

Delivering the Sauce: Top-10 Canucks Prospects (Part I)


My bad, didn't see that.
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#1143 Ossi Vaananen

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 05:05 PM

McNally will gain pimp status if he learns to hit. He's defensively responsible and great on the powerplay but not the least bit physical despite being 6'2. I honestly can't wait to see this kid at a Canucks camp, but he wants an undergrad from Harvard... see you in 2015.

Corrado is closer, finalist for the OHL defenseman of the year. Both of these guys aren't even on the top 5, yet Canucks rankings for prospects is 29/30 for Hockeys Future. Something is seriously wrong with their ranking system.

Any shot of Grenier being in the 6-10 range?
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#1144 Dale Weise's Dad

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 05:06 PM

It's hard to jump for joy when two of our "top 5" prospects (list is debatable) are goalies. We really lack blue chip defensive/offensive prospects other than Jensen. Although Jensen is most likely going to be a career 2nd line winger unless his development goes better than expected. Hopefully we can refill the cupboard this draft with pieces such as Raymond, Ballard, Luongo.


Good, young goalies have lots of value, though. There's always a team looking for a goalie, let alone young ones with a well of potential. We're seeing it right now with Schneider turning Luongo into trade bait.
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#1145 HockeyHobo73

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Posted 08 May 2012 - 09:37 PM

The top 5 prospects you have all wrong... They should be in this order:

5) Mats Froshaug
4) Prab Rai
3) Sawyer Hannay
2) Kellen Tochkin
1) Pathrik Westerholm
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#1146 avelanch

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Posted 08 May 2012 - 09:40 PM

lulz

Edited by avelanch, 08 May 2012 - 09:40 PM.

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#1147 DeNiro

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 12:44 AM

The top 5 prospects you have all wrong... They should be in this order:

5) Mats Froshaug
4) Prab Rai
3) Sawyer Hannay
2) Kellen Tochkin
1) Pathrik Westerholm


I wouldn't mock Froshaug so soon. It sounds like he may be developing very well.
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#1148 Millerdraft

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 07:35 PM

I wouldn't mock Froshaug so soon. It sounds like he may be developing very well.


Any idea why Mats isn't playing for Norway at the World Championship? Was he simply not good enough to make the team?
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Kassian.... Taylor Pyatt 3.0

Lies. He's more of a Steve Bernier. Hopefully his talent level goes up so he can become like a Taylor Pyatt.


#1149 DeNiro

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 08:57 PM

Any idea why Mats isn't playing for Norway at the World Championship? Was he simply not good enough to make the team?


His team went to their league final so my guess is he wasn't available in time to be selected. They were the second place team in the league and lost to the first place team in game 7.

He's definitely good enough. He was 7th in points in Norway's top league, and fourth in goals. And he's the only player in the top 10 point producers under the age of 25, at 23. Most of them are around 30 years old. Plus his greatest strength is being a shutdown two way player type too.

He did represent Norway in the 2008 world championships as a 19 year old, but it was not a very successful campaign since he put up 0 points in 7 games and was a -3. Although this was 4 years ago and was well before he developed his offensive game. He was likely used as a shutdown third line centre, going up against much tougher opponents.
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#1150 Millerdraft

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 09:45 AM

His team went to their league final so my guess is he wasn't available in time to be selected. They were the second place team in the league and lost to the first place team in game 7.

He's definitely good enough. He was 7th in points in Norway's top league, and fourth in goals. And he's the only player in the top 10 point producers under the age of 25, at 23. Most of them are around 30 years old. Plus his greatest strength is being a shutdown two way player type too.

He did represent Norway in the 2008 world championships as a 19 year old, but it was not a very successful campaign since he put up 0 points in 7 games and was a -3. Although this was 4 years ago and was well before he developed his offensive game. He was likely used as a shutdown third line centre, going up against much tougher opponents.


Yeah, I remember seeing him play in the Worlds back then and I was really quite impressed with his play even though he had no production to show for it which is why I was surprised to see he wasn't on the team this time around but perhaps being in the finals affected his availability, like you said.
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Kassian.... Taylor Pyatt 3.0

Lies. He's more of a Steve Bernier. Hopefully his talent level goes up so he can become like a Taylor Pyatt.


#1151 Edler's Mind Tricks

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 10:43 AM

Here is the second part of the list by Angus; along with some insight into his decision making.
http://canucksarmy.c...ospects-part-ii

Delivering the Sauce: Top-10 Canucks Prospects (Part II)

angus_j
May 09 2012 11:28AM

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In the first part of this series, I listed my top five prospects in the organization. The depth in goal is stronger than it has been at any point in franchise history (my number one and number five prospects are both goaltenders – Eddie Lack, and Joe Cannata, respectively), and there are some intriguing names at both defense and forward. How does the Canucks prospect group stack up heading in to the offseason? In the final installment of this two-part series, I’ll reveal the second half of my list.
To clarify, my cut-off for prospects is 25 NHL games of experience for skaters (no Zack Kassian or Chris Tanev), and 25 games of NHL experience for goaltenders. I took many factors into consideration – risk and reward, the estimated time of arrival, potential fit on the 2012-13 roster, and more.
The Honorable Mentions…

Joseph Labate LW/C – The rangy winger should get more responsibility this season at Wisconson.
Yann Sauve D – Hasn’t taken huge steps forward and certainly doesn't appear to have the offensive upside he was once projected to possess. Good size and speed, should settle in as a solid, low-event depth guy (and potential Vigneault favorite).
Adam Polasek D – Intriguing combination of size and skill. Needs more AHL seasoning.
Jeremy Price D – has taken great strides at Colgate – has NHL upside.
10. Bill Sweatt
  • Position: LW
  • 2011-12: Chicago (AHL)
  • Upside: Solid checking winger
  • ETA: Will get a look in 2012-13, likely needs one more year in the AHL.
Chicago used their 2nd round draft pick in 2007 on Sweatt, with the hope that his hockey sense and hands would catch up with his skating (unfortunately, neither happened). Five years after being drafted, Sweatt has only played two mostly unremarkable games at the NHL level. He had a solid four-year career at Colorado College, and has scored 36 goals over the past two AHL seasons. He won’t be a top six forward at the NHL level, but with his speed and tenacity, he could become a very good energy winger. Picking a prospect that will max out as a 15-to-20-goal third line winger for a top 10 list may seem stupid, but Sweatt is a lock to at least play in the NHL. Upside and potential is great, but he should fill an important role with this club for a long time. For a comparable, think of how effective Todd Marchant used to be for Edmonton.
9. Alex Friesen
  • Position: C
  • 2011-12: Niagara (OHL)
  • Upside: Physical, undersized checking centre.
  • ETA: 2013-14
Friesen’s spectacular offensive campaign (26 goals and 71 points in 62 games with Niagara) must be tempered a bit – he was a 20-year-old playing against mostly younger players, and the Ice Dogs iced a formidable roster. That being said, his contributions extended beyond the score sheet. Friesen is regarded as one of the best faceoff men in the OHL, and his defensive acumen and tenacity make him one of the best defensive forwards, too. His only real knock is his size (he's very generously listed at 5’10” and 190 pounds), and it will be interesting to see if he can successfully translate his physical forechecking style to the professional game. Like Sweatt, there are prospects left off of this list that may have more upside, but Friesen plays a pro-type of game already (consistent, hard on the puck, quick in his decision making). He is closer to the NHL than you may think.
8. Anton Rodin
  • Position: LW
  • 2011-12: Chicago (AHL)
  • Upside: Top-Six Playmaker
  • ETA: Should see a few games this season and next, full time by 2014-15.
On the surface, Rodin’s 2011-12 season in Chicago was a disappointing one – 10 goals and 27 points in 62 games. However, it was his first season in North America, and he looked much more comfortable with and without the puck as the season wore on (trending up, if you will). His skill set is obvious. With the puck on his stick, Rodin can beat defenders with his hands and his speed. He has great vision and a heavy wrist shot. The Canucks will be patient with him, but he will need to up his goal production considerably before warranting a call up to the big club. He still struggles with the size and strength of AHL defensemen, and has had some injury issues in the past (although he appears to be past the big one – shoulder tendonitis). Scoring has let the Canucks down in crucial situations in each of the past two seasons, and Rodin could be a part of the long term solution.
7. Patrick McNally
  • Position: D
  • 2011-12: Harvard (NCAA)
  • Upside: Second Pairing D-man. PP Quarterback.
  • ETA: 2015-16
The slick-skating defenseman was a big part of one of the best power play units in the entire NCAA. McNally’s best attribute is his hockey sense – something common among all great NHL power play quarterbacks. He will likely spend another few years in college (many speculate that since he attended Harvard he may want to get his degree first, but a professional contract offer has a funny way of changing things). Vancouver doesn’t have an elite defensive prospect, but they have several very good ones. The 20-year-old defenseman was a finalist for rookie of the year in the ECAC (the conference Harvard plays in). He had 28 points in 34 games – pretty impressive production. The rest of his game is pretty solid, as well. I profiled him back in January – worth the read if you want more information on him.
6. Frank Corrado
  • Position: D
  • 2011-12: Sudbury (OHL)
  • Upside: Top-Four Defenseman
  • ETA: 2014-15
I’m not sure if Corrado still goes by ‘Frankie,’ but I figured it was time for him to become Frank (I have trouble calling any person I don’t know personally ‘Frankie’). His third full season in the OHL saw him earn a nomination for the Defenseman of the Year Award (won, unsurprisingly, by Niagara’s Dougie Hamilton. Or is it Doug?). Corrado isn’t an offensive superstar, but he plays a steady two-way game. He has scored only eight goals in 186 OHL career games – a power play quarterback, he is not. The biggest improvement he made from 2010-11 to 2011-12 was in the defensive zone. His plus-minus (not a perfect measuring stick, mind you) increased from minus- 10 to plus-26.
In the annual poll among OHL Eastern Conference coaches, Corrado was in the running for most improved player (third), best penalty killer (third) and best defensive defenseman (third).
To check out my top-five Canucks prospects, click here.

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#1152 jonnycanuck46

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 11:26 AM

I really like what Gillis has done the last couple of years in the draft. He hasn't gone mainstream for that "stud", but instead he's scouted the bottom feeders to find diamonds in the rough, and I think he has. We might be surprised five years from now to see some of these guys leading our team, while the Patrick Whites of the world enjoy watching from their home theatre system.
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#1153 realnucksfan2010

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 11:58 AM

I like your post good job, here are few more that could be put on your list to:
Nick Jensen, Kev Connauton, Chris Tanev, Eddie Lack, J.F. Grenier, Joe Canata, I am sure there are more. But yes the nucks are a very deep club, i am very excited for the next five years to see how some of these young guys are going to fit in.
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#1154 avelanch

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:04 PM

I like your post good job, here are few more that could be put on your list to:
Nick Jensen, Kev Connauton, Chris Tanev, Eddie Lack, J.F. Grenier, Joe Canata, I am sure there are more. But yes the nucks are a very deep club, i am very excited for the next five years to see how some of these young guys are going to fit in.

you must have missed part 1 (places 1-5), and he explained why tanev isn't listed (over 25 nhl games)

and who's J.F. Grenier?

Edited by avelanch, 10 May 2012 - 12:07 PM.

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#1155 Spyderr

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:11 PM

how anyone can say they are happy with gillis drafting is amazing. He has been here 4 years. Chris tanev who was signed out of college i believe is the only player in 4 years to make this team since gillis has been here and he just cracked it. Drafting has been horrible
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#1156 avelanch

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:14 PM

how anyone can say they are happy with gillis drafting is amazing. He has been here 4 years. Chris tanev who was signed out of college i believe is the only player in 4 years to make this team since gillis has been here and he just cracked it. Drafting has been horrible

hodgson?
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#1157 realnucksfan2010

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:25 PM

Avelanch I must have missed part1, maybe so sorry bout that, just trying to add to the conversation in a positive manner, as far as Grenier goes maybe try looking at the "in the system" it is under the heading "ROSTER"
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#1158 realnucksfan2010

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:28 PM

Sorry ALEXANDER GRENIER, you knew who i meant i am sure!
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#1159 realnucksfan2010

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:30 PM

As well I have read the OP, and I think that Tenev is a great prospect, even if you don't consider him one, stop being so nasty, no need for it!
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#1160 DeNiro

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 12:49 PM

how anyone can say they are happy with gillis drafting is amazing. He has been here 4 years. Chris tanev who was signed out of college i believe is the only player in 4 years to make this team since gillis has been here and he just cracked it. Drafting has been horrible


The average age of a player to enter the NHL is 21. The average age of player to enter the NHL on a contending team is 22-23.

If Schroeder or Jensen, and Connauton or Sauve, can't come in and play some games this season, then we can question his drafting. But as of now, our team has been too good for young players to come in and steal top 6 spots.

Now with the likely departure of Raymond and Rome, there's a top 6 spot open and a 7th spot D-man position open. So the opportunity is there, but we'll have to wait and see what Schroeder and Jensen can do.

If Schroeder can make the team, that will be 3 years after he was drafted, which is pretty standard. If Jensen can surprise and make the team, that's only a year after being drafted, which with a pick at the 29 spot would be unbelievable. But we gotta wait until the start of next season to make that call.
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#1161 BoKnows53

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 01:59 PM

There have been so many top prospects like Zach hamill and Zach boychuk, who look like guarantees to play in the NHL. But it's been years since they were drafted and they still are in the AHL. If one of our prospects can help us in any way each year I'll be happy with our drafting.
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#1162 bluesman60

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 03:14 PM

how anyone can say they are happy with gillis drafting is amazing. He has been here 4 years. Chris tanev who was signed out of college i believe is the only player in 4 years to make this team since gillis has been here and he just cracked it. Drafting has been horrible


When you finish high in the standings, you have to draft late which means that you don't get a player ready to steal an NHL spot right away...they need development. If you rush them, they have nowhere to play on the roster and their Daddy and the agents poison them by urging them to move to a weak club so that they can get icetime and be a star (see CH).
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#1163 Edler's Mind Tricks

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 04:13 PM

Avelanch I must have missed part1, maybe so sorry bout that, just trying to add to the conversation in a positive manner, as far as Grenier goes maybe try looking at the "in the system" it is under the heading "ROSTER"

This is not a positive post, and he was simply telling you why they were not listed...

As well I have read the OP, and I think that Tenev is a great prospect, even if you don't consider him one, stop being so nasty, no need for it!

I think that we are all unanimous in the fact that Tanev is a stellar prospect. He was simply saying why he wasn't included on the list. Not nasty at all, really.


I really appreciate Angus's writing and I think he is pretty spot on.. Grenier may have deserved an honorable mention but that is just my opinion.
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#1164 Canuck Surfer

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 04:21 PM

Yeah beautiful post, thanx heaps!

Wish Sauve was higher on the list, he is the most physically capable to play in the NHL of any of our prospects. I wonder, would love Deniro or Dasein's opinion on this; should be looking drafting more to physical attributes after the 2knd round?

It seems to me there is an asterisk attached to almost all our prospects. Hodgson too slow, Schroeder too small, Connauton weak defensively, McNally too young, but each had a compelling talent. Players like Lucic slip a little below the radar on talent at a draft, then dominate physically... Players like Malhotra have come back to be serviceable players based on size & athleticism, Burrows and Hansen made it in the first place aginst expectation. When the Oiler's made the finals they were full of big, fast young players nobody had heard of. The point, they were drafting athletic ability and crating lines that could both beat you up in the corners & beat you to the puck. Are we missing opportunity by not prioritizing athletic ability?

edit, and funny thing > is that not exactly a corner turned with Kassian? Will it reflect more in our drafting???

Edited by Canuck Surfer, 10 May 2012 - 05:18 PM.

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#1165 TmanVan

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 04:58 PM

I think the biggest suprises with our drafting under MG will be the later round picks.

I can see Alex Friesen in the role of a young Matt Cooke, Joe Cannata as a late rounder putting up college numbers the same as or better than Cory Schneiders could turn out to be one heck of steal, Frankie Corrado getting a vote as top ohl defenseman, and third best defensive defenseman are good signs for a late pick, and Patrick Mcnallys offensive numbers as a rookie blueliner are amazing for college hockey, for all the people drooling over justin schultz give this kid 3 more years.

I can see all of them making the team Kevin Bieksa style, after about 4 years in the AHL.

The only questions I have with MG's drafting are his first round selections. Kyle Palmieri, Marcus Johansson, Tim Erixon, even Jordan Caron are looking pretty good right now compared to Schroeder. Emerson Etem, Charlie Coyle, or Justin Faulk sure would have made the future look nice instead of trading for Ballard. And everybody seems to have a man crush on Niklas Jensen but you can't argue with Brandon Saad's or Ty Ratties numbers... but hey, Gm's dont pick with hindsight so what do I know right?
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#1166 Pears

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 05:04 PM

I really think Corrado will be a steal for us in a few years down the road.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

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#1167 avelanch

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 06:10 PM

Sorry ALEXANDER GRENIER, you knew who i meant i am sure!

i'm sure I did.
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#1168 DeNiro

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 08:02 PM

Yeah beautiful post, thanx heaps!

Wish Sauve was higher on the list, he is the most physically capable to play in the NHL of any of our prospects. I wonder, would love Deniro or Dasein's opinion on this; should be looking drafting more to physical attributes after the 2knd round?

It seems to me there is an asterisk attached to almost all our prospects. Hodgson too slow, Schroeder too small, Connauton weak defensively, McNally too young, but each had a compelling talent. Players like Lucic slip a little below the radar on talent at a draft, then dominate physically... Players like Malhotra have come back to be serviceable players based on size & athleticism, Burrows and Hansen made it in the first place aginst expectation. When the Oiler's made the finals they were full of big, fast young players nobody had heard of. The point, they were drafting athletic ability and crating lines that could both beat you up in the corners & beat you to the puck. Are we missing opportunity by not prioritizing athletic ability?

edit, and funny thing > is that not exactly a corner turned with Kassian? Will it reflect more in our drafting???


Always take the best player available at the position that you are weakest at IMO. Drafting based on a players physical attributes is bound to make us miss out on some good players.

Big players usually have deficiencies in their games too, like skating ability or work ethic. Because big players that dont have many deficiencies in their games typically go top 10 because theyre the mosted coveted type of player.

I think the number one thing that Gillis looks for when he drafts is hockey smarts. Basically what kind of hockey vision a player has and how well he anticipates the game.

I think his philosophy is that all other aspects of the game can be improved through training. If a player is too slow, get them to work on their foot speed. If theyre not strong, make them hit the gym. And if they can#t stick handle, get them to work with a skills coach.

Hockey IQ on the other hand is something that comes more naturally, and players that have it at the highest level typically can adapt and excel much easier. I think thats one of the common themes with players that Gillis targets. Thats why you see him draft alot of college players, because the belief is that the ability and desire to learn in one area such as school should translate over to the game of hockey.
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#1169 Rey

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 03:19 AM

Inconsistent list. The top 1-5 prospects indicated that the rankings were based on NHL readiness. The 6-10 and so fourth, are now based on potential. Should have one or the other. Now it's a mess.

Edited by Rey, 11 May 2012 - 03:25 AM.

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#1170 Pistachios

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 03:22 AM

I really think Corrado will be a steal for us in a few years down the road.


I agree. He was the most impressive for me at the last prospects camp. If he keeps it simple and keeps improving, he could be a solid D man
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