Canucks1207 Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 I agree with some of your points bro but there is no need for name calling. Were just having a conversation here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legstrong Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 This is a Canadian city and hockey is Canada's game. Sure a player is under the microscope here, but signing a contract (especially after a few seasons of playing for the Canucks in Luongo's case) means that the player understands the situation and embraces it. I've said it before and I'll say it again, the player who uses the scrutiny as motivation to succeed is a champion, the player who uses it as an excuse is not. And for the record, if you don't want to attract trolls, leave the troll bait (ie hyperbolic statements) out of your rants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnsey Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 then why no big Signings since Messier? fans are passionate?? I'm a season ticket holder for the last 3 years and Rogers Arena is one of the MOST quietest buildings and arenas ive ever been to! even during the playoffs! its ridiculous how loud and positive an arena like Nashville or Chicago is compared to Rogers arena. So wheres this passion you speak of? We throw our players under the bus the moment they arent reaching our expectations, thats not passsion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastCanucks Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Players DO want to play here. It's an awesome city with a passionate(sometimes a little too crazy) fan base. Most importantly the organization has the desire to win and will do everything in it's power to do so. They treat players well and I think the rest of the league knows that. Look no further than the players poll done by CBC last year: http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/allstar/poll/arenas-and-teams/what-team-would-you-most-like-to-play-on/ We were tied for second when asked which team would you most like to play for which is pretty impressive considering we have never won a cup. And Vancouver always finishes at the top or near the top when these polls come out every year. I think it gives a pretty good indication that players do want to play here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legstrong Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 If you're a pending Unrestricted Free Agent lets say the likes of; Doan, Semin, Webber, Parise etc etc...what do you see? A fan base known for rioting, a fanbase that constantly treat their own players like crap and puts an immense amount of pressure, a building soooo quiet, a travel schedule incomparable to any and a scrutiny from fanbase and media that can abolish a career. So people can talk all they want about nice dressing rooms and sleep doctors and a province full of "fans" but that is not how the rest of league perceives the Canucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ṣpiderman Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Sundin would like to say hi to the original poster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raad_luongo Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 If you're a pending Unrestricted Free Agent lets say the likes of; Doan, Semin, Webber, Parise etc etc...what do you see? A fan base known for rioting, a fanbase that constantly treat their own players like crap and puts an immense amount of pressure, a building soooo quiet, a travel schedule incomparable to any and a scrutiny from fanbase and media that can abolish a career. So people can talk all they want about nice dressing rooms and sleep doctors and a province full of "fans" but that is not how the rest of league perceives the Canucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph. Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 If you're a pending Unrestricted Free Agent lets say the likes of; Doan, Semin, Webber, Parise etc etc...what do you see? A fan base known for rioting, a fanbase that constantly treat their own players like crap and puts an immense amount of pressure, a building soooo quiet, a travel schedule incomparable to any and a scrutiny from fanbase and media that can abolish a career. So people can talk all they want about nice dressing rooms and sleep doctors and a province full of "fans" but that is not how the rest of league perceives the Canucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlweezer Posted October 20, 2011 Author Share Posted October 20, 2011 No, this is about how YOU perceive how the rest of the league feels about the Canucks. Living in other Canadian cities and seeing how their fans treat their teams would be an eye-opener for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bodee Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Firstly I think the argument is flawed. Surely any big name player coming to a team like Vancouver is not going to assume he will bomb, so why should he worry about fan reaction. The only problem Vancouver seems to have is it's geographical position and yes that might influence some USA born players. With regard to the fans I agree with the above posters, the fan base is massive world wide and is set to get even bigger in my view if they maintain their momentum. Regarding the noise in the arena, there is a certain irony here because the only other similar accusation I have heard is constantly made at Manchester United. People in England put this down to their success filling their stadium with, shall we say "more well off fans" from around England who want to be associated with success. The implication is they are too reserved to make too much noise compared to the working classes. Of course the season ticket prices may also lead to the stadium attracting that type of fan. Compare this with loud stadiums in working class places like Liverpool, Newcastle and Glasgow. I don't live in Canada so I don't know if there is any correlation. A psychologist I suppose could advance this theory one step further and argue that this is also the reason why the fans react so badly to lack of success. They feel they need a successful team to go with their successful lifestyle. THE TEAM OWES IT TO THEM in their mind. One criticism that I feel can't be levelled at this great hockey club is that their management and organisation is arguably not one of, if not the most advanced thinking and professional set ups in the league. I also applaud their fantastic links to the community and to the province. Finally I would ask the OP where the evidence of players turning down a chance to come to Vancouver is. If he has evidence then have these players given reasons and if so what were they? (other than it's geographical position which is probably the only one I would accept with any validity) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlweezer Posted October 20, 2011 Author Share Posted October 20, 2011 So why would they think any other clubs are better? Every player has their own different places they want to be, would be if they needed to, and don't want to be. Does Doan want to leave the organization he's been with his whole career? Nope. Does Semin want to leave the competitive team in Washington, playing with fellow Russian teammates and friends Backstrom and Ovechkin? Doubt it. Does Weber want to play somewhere else? Probably, but he was an RFA, so he doesn't count anyway. Parise? The Devils seemed to have to do everything they could to get him to stay; even made him Captain. And they still only re-signed him for one year. Despite what you see, you don't see every city the way a player sees each city, and neither you nor I can say for sure. But I think I've hit the nail pretty close to the head. There's many more factors than the city and the team itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ṣpiderman Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 I don't think the original poster understands how hard it is for almost every team to sign stars unless they have the cap to do so. I'm sure every team could use a Brad Richards, but do you see every team going for him? Just because we didn't get a star doesn't mean we tried to get him. Maybe we're not just interested in the player or we don't want to waste that much cap signing a star player just for the sake of signing one. People always ask why don't we get certain players. It's not that easy, there's a lot of factors that go into it. You can't just trade players like you do in fantasy simulation games. There is no reason for us last season to get a guy like Richards. We are already strong down the middle. This doesn't mean Richards didn't want to sign with us. We simply wouldn't have offered him anything. Most players prefer to sign with their original teams because players don't like moving around and like stability. There really aren't a lot of "big stars" these days with UFAs because most are already resigned back with their original teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlweezer Posted October 20, 2011 Author Share Posted October 20, 2011 Firstly I think the argument is flawed. Surely any big name player coming to a team like Vancouver is not going to assume he will bomb, so why should he worry about fan reaction. The only problem Vancouver seems to have is it's geographical position and yes that might influence some USA born players. With regard to the fans I agree with the above posters, the fan base is massive world wide and is set to get even bigger in my view if they maintain their momentum. Regarding the noise in the arena, there is a certain irony here because the only other similar accusation I have heard is constantly made at Manchester United. People in England put this down to their success filling their stadium with, shall we say "more well off fans" from around England who want to be associated with success. The implication is they are too reserved to make too much noise compared to the working classes. Of course the season ticket prices may also lead to the stadium attracting that type of fan. Compare this with loud stadiums in working class places like Liverpool, Newcastle and Glasgow. I don't live in Canada so I don't know if there is any correlation. A pschologist I suppose could advance this theory one step further and argue that this is also the reason why the fans react so badly to lack of success. They feel they need a successful team to go with their successful lifestyle. THE TEAM OWES IT TO THEM in their mind. One criticism that I feel can't be levelled at this great hockey club is that their management and organisation is arguably not one of, if not the most advanced thinking and professional set ups in the league. I also applaud their fantastic links to the community and to the province. Finally I would ask the OP where the evidence of players turning down a chance to come to Vancouver is. If he has evidence then have these players given reasons and if so what were they? (other than it's geographical position which is probably the only one I would accept with any validity) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlweezer Posted October 20, 2011 Author Share Posted October 20, 2011 I don't think the original poster understands how hard it is for almost every team to sign stars unless they have the cap to do so. I'm sure every team could use a Brad Richards, but do you see every team going for him? Just because we didn't get a star doesn't mean we tried to get him. Maybe we're not just interested in the player or we don't want to waste that much cap signing a star player just for the sake of signing one. People always ask why don't we get certain players. It's not that easy, there's a lot of factors that go into it. You can't just trade players like you do in fantasy simulation games. There is no reason for us last season to get a guy like Richards. We are already strong down the middle. This doesn't mean Richards didn't want to sign with us. We simply wouldn't have offered him anything. Most players prefer to sign with their original teams because players don't like moving around and like stability. There really aren't a lot of "big stars" these days with UFAs because most are already resigned back with their original teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph. Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 youve made good points but have yet to answer my questions. 1. Why would anyone want to sign here after seeing the fan scrutiny, treatment of star players, and most importantly no history of Vancouver being a championship team.... and please dont say we have nice dressing rooms and good management. 2. If Vancouver is such a desirable place to play then why have we not signed any high profiled player since messier...and I dont really count an almost 40 yr old sundin who paid 10 million for half a season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ṣpiderman Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 I'm not just referring to this off-season..Im talking about the last decade, perhaps longer.... and im trying to step out of the box and to look at Vancouver from an outside point of view and as myself...is it desirable for a UFA to come here and play under these conditions...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlweezer Posted October 20, 2011 Author Share Posted October 20, 2011 We treat them like crap? We still cheered for them after game 7! You play well you get treated well. You play like crap for an extended period of time your gonna hear it. Its not like we booed luongo after 1 or 2 games. Its 3 years of letdowns. You wanna make the big bucks then your gonna have to deal with it. You dont like it then go play in pheonix. Every single canadian market is like this you do know that right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dragon Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Why is it necessary to type so much??? Anyway I didn't read everything Can't blame the fans frustration tho...Canucks sell prob the most expensive tickets in all sport I feel bad for those who paid to watch game 7 last year But honestly we need a speedy power forward Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlweezer Posted October 20, 2011 Author Share Posted October 20, 2011 1. Because we have a very good, competitive team now and players want to win. For the record, I never said "because we have nice dressing rooms." I didn't say "good management" either; I said "logical and understanding." Big difference. "Good" is very vague. 2. Because we haven't had to and don't have the cap space for one. I already did answer this, in fact. To ice such a competitive team, we spend to the cap. If we were to sign a $7 million/year player, we would have to lose a very significant peace of the team that's gotten as within one win of the cup. Even in the past few years, we've addressed what we do need (fourth line center, higher profile defensemen, goaltending). Would we love to have another 80 point a season winger to play beside Kesler? Of course! But we don't need one. Pittsburgh and Detroit didn't need Hossa to win the cup (obviously, as they both lost with him). Chicago did because it gave them Toews, Kane, Hossa, and Sharp. We have the Sedins, Kesler, and Burrows. We don't need to add an extra Hossa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legstrong Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 hows that just my perception?? Canuck fans treat their players like crap? I'm not proud of it but to say this is just My perception is a little naive... Remeber the "sedin sisters"....bieksa was traded before the season even started last year...Naslund isnt Captain material...etc etc I can go on! The whole league sees this! they watched us humilate ourselves by jeering Luongo on National Television on Tuesday....this is not just my perception... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.