Bertuzzi Babe Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 2 of those were sarcasm, is the "point" that you have no sense of humour? I believe so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-DLC- Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Honestly, I don't feel bad for the girls at all. No where did it say that he forced these girls into doing this, nor did he threaten them. These normal, capable, aware girls knew what they were doing and what the consequences could be and still decided to partake in sexual activities with this guy for better marks. Girls get crushes on teachers all the time. On a recent episode of TMZ some band called One Direction flew to LAX and these 15, 16, 17 year old girls were screaming "have sex with me!" infront of the cameras. These girls are dumb and stupid and get no sympathy from me. They were willing to have sex with this guy while the option of turning away and going home/reporting to an authority was there the whole time. If I'm a 16 year old boy and i'm attracted to my teacher and she says hey meet me here after 2pm for a little fun if you know what i mean and I'll give you an A on your next test, and I go there at 2pm and have a little fun, I would not expect people to feel bad for me. You only need to read your own response to see why this thinking is wrong. "Girls". You've referred to them as "girls" throughout and, rightfully so. As "girls" they are young, impressionable and these decisions will stick with them for a lifetime. A teacher is in a position of authority and shouldn't take advantage of girls. As girls, it's wrong for an adult to solicit them for sex. Sure, you may argue that, at that age, they should know better. But, at 16, some don't have the tools in place to decide in situations like this - especially if there's peer pressure involved and others are suggesting something's ok. As adults, we're in place to steer them in the right direction, not take advantage of that situation. Young girls do many silly things but it doesn't mean that adults should encourage or suggest they do so. And, as a 16 year old, your teacher would be wrong to hone in on your attraction. The teacher-student relationship is one of mentoring and guidance and there is nothing you can say to make this "right". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-DLC- Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 OK, hadn't read all the responses. Here's something to consider, NPF. What if one of these 16 year old girls who "consented" already has a terrible home life? What if she is already being abused, by someone close to her and is programmed not to say no? There could be complex, underlying issues and beyond more than "the girl agreed". What if her need for acceptance is such that the prospect of getting better grades for a father who beats her if she doesn't has her agree to this? There are many kids already experiencing things at home that may mean their decision making skills aren't up to par and their self esteem is already non existent. So a teacher shouldn't even be presenting something so inappropriate. When girls behave this way, they need direction (not encouragement). Here's the bottom line: it shouldnt' be an option. The teacher, as a figure of authority, may already have a hold on the girl who "chooses" yes because she may feel she has no other choice. She's been taught to agree to these propositions. It can be more complex to some than a "yes/no" deal. So we don't put inappropriate options on the table for kids who, out of desperation, may choose them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Ambien Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 ^ it's already logical to point out that teacher is in a position of authority, in fact, acting as a guardian, and no guardian in a school setting should be allowed that type of relationship, regardless of whether or not the teenager is consenting or on her knees begging. The more one delves into the psychology of a teenager, maturity level, and home upbringing the more it goes in the opposite direction, as in, students should be allowed that discretion. Teenagers wilfully having sex in their very early teens, most of them well before they graduate high school -- can you really give that much credence to bad home upbringing since it's so overwhelmingly popular? The more people paint teenagers as these innocent non-sexual beings, and start looking for people to hang when they do things teenagers do, the further away from "education" this goes, the more it puts parents and schools in a position not to react intelligently to reality. First step is acknowledging what smacks people in the face. Second is burying such fervent idealism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spitfire_Spiky Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 The guy is just plain brutal... put him away for a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heretic Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Very sad....very sad indeed...let me guess....he will get 2 years max and meanwhile his victims are scarred for life... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buggernut Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Side note: It would be interesting to see what the age is of all those who added a + to this post. And I'm betting they're not fathers of a daughter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Ambien Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 I wonder if it reflects an "I'd do it too" line of thinking. I'm not saying this about NPF in particular, but the ones that anonymously show him support for that post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NucksPatsFan Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 OK, hadn't read all the responses. Here's something to consider, NPF. What if one of these 16 year old girls who "consented" already has a terrible home life? What if she is already being abused, by someone close to her and is programmed not to say no? There could be complex, underlying issues and beyond more than "the girl agreed". What if her need for acceptance is such that the prospect of getting better grades for a father who beats her if she doesn't has her agree to this? There are many kids already experiencing things at home that may mean their decision making skills aren't up to par and their self esteem is already non existent. So a teacher shouldn't even be presenting something so inappropriate. When girls behave this way, they need direction (not encouragement). Here's the bottom line: it shouldnt' be an option. The teacher, as a figure of authority, may already have a hold on the girl who "chooses" yes because she may feel she has no other choice. She's been taught to agree to these propositions. It can be more complex to some than a "yes/no" deal. So we don't put inappropriate options on the table for kids who, out of desperation, may choose them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buggernut Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Yep even though I'm happily married and have kids, giving him a + on an internet forum is a sure sign I'd get me some high school pooty tang if I were a teacher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Ambien Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Wasn't the suspect in this case? Just saying it makes no difference. NPF has said for the record that the guy's a pig and should get what's coming to him, and the girls aren't free of blame either, but the way he stated his point made it look like he was making excuses for the guy. I thought some people may just be inclined to "understand the temptation" and have sympathy for the guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jester@wraiths.ca Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 It's entirely true that since NOBODY here knows the exact mental state, emotional state, or thought processes of the girls and teacher involved, most arguments about this event are simply individual's opinions. The girls should have known better, but may have had other circumstances (abused, peer pressure, reduced mental capacity, etc) The teacher should have known better, but may have some mental disorder. Ignoring both of those potential circumstances, it still comes down to the fact that the girls chose to participate. They agreed to do it. The teacher was entirely wrong to ask them to do it, but they did not have to do it. While people (male and female) in their teens make plenty of stupid decisions, they do still understand the concept of right and wrong. The teacher is absolutely in the wrong for abusing power and situation, but the girls made the decision to allow him to do so. In the end, it's just another example of why I say, society is corrupt at every level and anyone who thinks it isn't, is hiding from the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzi Babe Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Well at very least being the adult and acting guardian he bears responsibility for his actions far more than a teenager. However, playing devils advocate, what if he is mentally ill? I see people rightfully concerned mightily with how a teenager that themselves willingly would go out and consent to this sort of thing, and their parents/how they are parented, but where's the concern for the possible mental ailments this teacher could be suffering from? What about societal influences? Teenager influences? School-based influences? Mental illness is attributed to a certain population who look at child pornography, even some previous teachers who slept with students. What's interesting to me is that on this subject people are so fast to jump on their victim-based soapbox and attack different opinions as if their conclusion is the only possible one. Hence why I + the hell out of posts Bertuzzi Babe was critical of, and watched him/her flounder around in mediocrity completely missing the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gino Odjick Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 It's not like this guy was offering sex to ESL or special needs girls for better grades. These were what the education system considers normal girls in a "normal" classroom. YOU don't have any idea of what happened either. How do you know that these girls didn't have a huge crush on this guy and fantasies about him and when the opportunity to play them out presented itself they took them? You don't, so why don't you also stop acting like these girls were forced into it and had no other option and are huge victims. Oh and by the way, my sister has been, and my future, if any, daughters will be raised to be smarter than these girls. They'll actually have some self respect and dignity. If you knew anything about me or my family you'd know my sister has been raised in a way that if any teacher suggested this to her my dad would be getting a phone call from her as she walked to the principle's office to alert them. You don't like my example? Fine, here's another one as a girl. I'm a 16 year old girl who has a crush on my teacher. One day after school, without pointing a weapon at me or threatening to fail me or anything, he suggests some sexual favors in exchange for better grades. Now, while I COULD just turn around and leave and tell someone, or maybe not tell anyone cause I was too embarassed or shocked, I decide to be like yeah sure let's go have sex. I don't see how I'm the victim here. Care to explain how a girl all on her own makes this decision and has a way out of it before making this decision is a victim? Unless further reports come out of this case such as he threatened them in a physical or mental way if they didn't do as he said, these girls are as stupid as those on shows like 16 & Pregnant and Teen Mom. Oh and to touch upon your comment about how I'd feel if this happened to my daughter? I'd wanna kill the teacher who did this but I'd be as equally angry with my daughter about how she could be such a stupid moron; just like the dads of the girls on the aforementioned shows who can't believe how stupid their daughters could be to get knocked up. You're one of those people who even if these girls approached the teacher themselves and were like I wanna have sex with you, you'd still consider the girls victims. The real victims of this story are this pig's wife and kids. Having to live and grow up in a small town where everyone will know that their ex husband/dad had sex with high school girls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzi Babe Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Yes, they have choice. But you're missing the bigger picture. They're still victims of a system that's educating and developing their minds. For 8 hours a day, they're out of their parents hands and teachers/peers have a huge impact on psychological development. You clearly haven't bothered to research or explore the complex social issues that surround and affect teens' mental and physical health. Do you even remotely remember being a teenager? For all I know, you could be a teenager. In case you didn't know (because it seems like you don't), the teenage body is very reflective of the teenage mind. It's a time of development; Discovering identity, sexual preference, and forming opinion. At this age, these girls are very vulnerable. They may have parents who don't pay attention to them or they might come from abusive homes. Their parents may be addicted to drugs. This has a huge impact on teenage sexual identity. Exploitation was used by the teacher. He quite literally used his power to give them higher grades in exchange for sexual favors. It was an exchange of goods and services, much like that of a pimp who provides his prostitute with drugs. Now, you might also be ignorant enough to assume that all prostitutes have a choice. This is probably because you are uneducated about the sex slave industry. If you know anything about that industry then you would know that young girls are taken from their families at a vulnerable age, forced to develop a drug habit, and become dependent to the drug. Addiction no longer becomes a choice, but a way of life. Why am I telling you all of this? Because your ignorant comments heavily suggest a lack of understanding and comprehension of complex issues. These girls deserve an education and mentors they can trust. But instead they got a corrupt teacher who took advantage of their developing minds. Educate yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NucksPatsFan Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Yes, they have choice. But you're missing the bigger picture. They're still victims of a system that's educating and developing their minds. For 8 hours a day, they're out of their parents hands and teachers/peers have a huge impact on psychological development. You clearly haven't bothered to research or explore the complex social issues that surround and affect teens' mental and physical health. Do you even remotely remember being a teenager? For all I know, you could be a teenager. In case you didn't know (because it seems like you don't), the teenage body is very reflective of the teenage mind. It's a time of development; Discovering identity, sexual preference, and forming opinion. At this age, these girls are very vulnerable. They may have parents who don't pay attention to them or they might come from abusive homes. Their parents may be addicted to drugs. This has a huge impact on teenage sexual identity. Exploitation was used by the teacher. He quite literally used his power to give them higher grades in exchange for sexual favors. It was an exchange of goods and services, much like that of a pimp who provides his prostitute with drugs. Now, you might also be ignorant enough to assume that all prostitutes have a choice. This is probably because you are uneducated about the sex slave industry. If you know anything about that industry then you would know that young girls are taken from their families at a vulnerable age, forced to develop a drug habit, and become dependent to the drug. Addiction no longer becomes a choice, but a way of life. Why am I telling you all of this? Because your ignorant comments heavily suggest a lack of understanding and comprehension of complex issues. These girls deserve an education and mentors they can trust. But instead they got a corrupt teacher who took advantage of their developing minds. Educate yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gino Odjick Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Bravo, well said!!! (Careful though, someone will want to kick your 'victim-based soapbox' out from under your feet! ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzi Babe Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 Please, provide proof that states that these girls parents abused them, or are drug addicts or whatever else you decided to list off. Until you can, that's just your opinion. You make these girls sound like they're complete morons who have no morals or sense of direction and this teacher magically brainwashed them. I've never even seen or encountered any 16 year old girls who have absolutely zero self control and can be manipulated oh so easily by some teacher they may or may not like. What planet do you live on? Cause here on Earth, by the time a girl is 16 she knows what's wrong and right and can make decisions on her own. So again, please, can you show me where it says that these girls for sure have some sort of mental deficiency or that their parents abused them or that their parents don't give them attention? No, you can't. For all we know these girls are from a loving family who live in a nice house, have a pet dog and eat dinner together every night; yet the girl just likes sex and is a slut. But thanks for the laugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gino Odjick Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 1.) "Please, provide proof that states that these girls parents abused them, or are drug addicts or whatever else you decided to list off." Until you can, that's just your opinion. You make these girls sound like they're complete morons who have no morals or sense of direction and this teacher magically brainwashed them. I've never even seen or encountered any 16 year old girls who have absolutely zero self control and can be manipulated oh so easily by some teacher they may or may not like. What planet do you live on? Cause here on Earth, by the time a girl is 16 she knows what's wrong and right and can make decisions on her own. So again, please, can you show me where it says that these girls for sure have some sort of mental deficiency or that their parents abused them or that their parents don't give them attention? No, you can't. For all we know these girls are from a loving family who live in a nice house, have a pet dog and eat dinner together every night; yet the girl just likes sex and is a slut. But thanks for the laugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzi Babe Posted April 2, 2012 Share Posted April 2, 2012 How can you be so ignorant? Read my post again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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