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#31 skyfall

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 02:44 PM

This whole business about "adapting" is really just a buzzword used by people who don't really understand what goes on in the dressing room of a professional hockey team.

It's not like coaches pull out the whiteboard between periods and start drawing x's and o's, saying things like "Okay guys, they're using the left wing lock on us, so we're going to switch to the flying chicken wing breakout, except for Manny's line who will use the one legged turkey trot!"

For the most part, coaches will say things like "Make sure you put pressure on their D and hit Kane every chance you get!" or "C'mon guys! We have to outwork them! Win some puck battles!" and the ever popular "Lets win this period!"

The real preparation is done in the film room and on the practice rink. One the puck drops for real, it's up to the players to execute.

I won't say that AV never makes mistakes. He does, as all coaches do. (Even those Gods Bylsma and Babacock) However, it would have taken a hybrid of Scotty Bowman, Toe Blake and Al Arbour to coach his way around the injuries to Hammer, Ehrhoff, Kesler, Juice and Hank...


I'm just curious.. how come it seems like the way some teams play that there are X and O type of changes from the coaches? In other sports like basketball I see the whiteboard and plays drawn up all the time. Coming off of timeouts sometimes players can get totally shut down after shooting the lights out which is likely due to a tactical adjustment. Also in 24/7 I saw Bylsma look at video during intermissions... that seems like an X and O type of thing to do. Also another thing I hear a lot is that coaches don't talk to their players but it seems like a lot of new school coaches or those that have changed like Hitchcock talk to players more. I'm just curious. I don't always buy that all coaches do/don't do certain things. I guess it's the same way with Gillis and GM's... some GM's have sleep programs, some don't. I have to admit I haven't been in a professional dressing room but I'm also guessing that each coach is different and there's different styles. Sometimes I feel AV can be 80% good but if he has potential to be 90% good then he should, whether or not other coaches do the same.

#32 dura_mater

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 02:58 PM

AV is a great coach, but not the best. Mike Babcock and Dan Bylsma to name a few


:lol: Always hard to win with Malkin, Crosby, Fleury and Letang on your team.

Apollo is not a real person but a post-bot built by the Aquilini's to create hype.


You mean the ntcs that all got waived or the ntcs that led us to back to back president trophies and a Stanley Cup?


#33 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 03:17 PM

I'm just curious.. how come it seems like the way some teams play that there are X and O type of changes from the coaches? In other sports like basketball I see the whiteboard and plays drawn up all the time. Coming off of timeouts sometimes players can get totally shut down after shooting the lights out which is likely due to a tactical adjustment. Also in 24/7 I saw Bylsma look at video during intermissions... that seems like an X and O type of thing to do.  Also another thing I hear a lot is that coaches don't talk to their players but it seems like a lot of new school coaches or those that have changed like Hitchcock talk to players more.  I'm just curious.  I don't always buy that all coaches do/don't do certain things.  I guess it's the same way with Gillis and GM's... some GM's have sleep programs, some don't.  I have to admit I haven't been in a professional dressing room but I'm also guessing that each coach is different and there's different styles. Sometimes I feel AV can be 80% good but if he has potential to be 90% good then he should, whether or not other coaches do the same.


There's a difference between "drawing up a play" and "making in-game style adjustments". I have seen the Canucks pull out the whiteboard to draw up a play as well, but it's usually a last minute scenario with the goalie pulled, or a PP setup. I don't believe that was the "adjustments" that were being referred to.

As to why momentum sometimes shifts after a timeout, I'd say it's just that, slowing down a team's momentum, not some stroke of genius shift in the team's style of play that the coach managed to impart on the team within a one minute time period. I also don't think these "total shutdowns" are anywhere near as common as many of the CDC armchair coaching crew seem to think.

Most of the time, the team that was dominating was doing so because they were the better team (at least on that particular night) and continue to do so. BTW: I have been in several of those timeout situations myself. The message from the coach is always the same: "Settle down". "Get your head in the game." "Work harder." etc, etc....

You saw Bylsma look at video during an intermission? Interesting. Did you also hear him or Torts do any of the "adjustments" that I referred to in my earlier post, or did you hear them saying a lot of the same types of things that I said most coaches say?

When you say you guess there are different "styles" of coach, I'd say you're correct. However, that doesn't mean that some coaches make adjustments and some don't. Mainly, it means that some are fiery, in your face coaches like Torts and some are laid back like Bylsma and AV. Hitch used to be a yeller and screamer, but it seems that with age he's realized that it wears thin quickly with players.

I haven't been in a pro dressing room either, but I have been in a Junior dressing room and I can tell you that I'm not guessing. I'm speaking from experience.

Edited by RUPERTKBD, 02 April 2012 - 03:19 PM.

Orland Kurtenbach and Dennis Kearns had just been torched 8-1 by the Habs, but they still took time to come out to meet us, some fellow BC boys who were playing hockey in Montreal. THAT"S what being a Canuck is!

#34 Sugar baby watermelon

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 03:34 PM

I'm sorry OP, I did not read the posting you did, all I saw was kudos to AV and thats all i needed to see.

Kudos to AV for getting us to another season, off as it may be, we are still in the elite. Keep it going into the playoffs Coach!!

#35 Canuck Surfer

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 05:07 PM

I mostly agree with this; noting that I have high lighted your last paragraph. (very good response, well done!)

We can play our system, and gain control of the puck and we are fine. But that could break down on D. The Canucks main issue at the moment is a bit of vulnerability for some of our D to match up against waves of big forward lines; such as in St Louis. Our 3rd pair constantly has guys who either cant beat these big guys to the puck to clear it (Alberts) or are too small if they get hemmed in (Tanev).

Our first line (if Burrows, Danny, Hank) is also vulnerable to size. But, this is a post about's AV's manipulation of the lines. He appears to be experimenting, and testing which combinations of Lapierre, Bitz, Kassian has been able to step in and counter act that issue; and Burrows moves seemlessly from line to line. I would like to see Booth up with the Twins, even Kesler if Reinprecht is effective enough as center. We should have enough depth, where we did not last year, to allow AV to pull this off.

Can we do it on D?

Connauton should be up for a game or 3 before the dance for the same reason. He does not address size (although he is our toughest D behind Bieksa) but does get to the puck and move it very well. Remember, he was an AHL all star this year, not Tanev or Gragnani.

Easy to blame the coach if and/or when we lose.

But I don't agree with this. I'd rather make the other teams try to play our game. If our players aren't executing, or the other teams are just playing better than us, it doesn't always work. But when a team gets away from playing their style and start chasing another teams style, it's a recipe for a quick exit if you're up against a good team. Little adjustments on the fly are one thing, but a shift in playing style is quite another. I'm glad the Canucks play their style and try to force the other team to match us. Does it always work? No. But it's got a much better track record than chasing the other teams style.

Detroit won Cups by playing their puck moving style no matter what the other team tried to bring, and being able to respond to the other teams counters while still playing within their system.

Anaheim won their Cup with brute force and solid goaltending. They didn't run and gun against the Sens in the Final, that would have played into Ottawa's hands. They made the Sens play out of their area of expertise and it was over quickly.

New Jersey won Cups by suffocating the other teams offence. They didn't open up into wide open, offensive style hockey when up against a high octane team. They shut them down and made the other teams try to match the Devils at what the Devils did best. Some might think it was dull, but Brodeur still has his name carved on Lord Stanley 3 times.

This year, the Canucks seem to have the tools to win in any kind of game. Whether they do or not depends on a number of things. Effort is one, health is another. But a big one is composure, and part of composure is trusting in the system and playing your game. Not chasing someone elses.


Edited by Canuck Surfer, 02 April 2012 - 05:09 PM.


#36 -Vintage Canuck-

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 05:13 PM

I don't always agree with AV, but he ends up proving me wrong most of the time. He knows his team.


He probably knows Rome pretty well. ;)

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#37 toyotafan

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 05:16 PM

Nice to see a positive AV thread for a change

#38 thehamburglar

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 06:11 PM

He makes third liners work harder and score more than many other coaches. He's a good coach and I'm glad this team has him.
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#39 Sedinstwin

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 07:01 PM

The moves that AV has done in the past...are moves that I can't see any other coach doing. He has completely jumbled his line up, putting his fourth liner to his first, splitting the Sedins, putting Higg on the third.. these are moves some coaches don't have the guts to do.. and all of them have worked.. he continues to surprise me with his actions but what surprises me more is how successful they are. He really is an amazing coach. But also have to give credit to MG for putting this team together... we have so many options of players and so much depth its crazy, I don't think people realise this because of all the injuries we have... with Ebbet, Pini, Bitz, Bally out for most of the season and now Bieksa and Danny out for a little bit (hopefully). And also with some of the players in our farm team which could also be in the NHL line up.. this team has plenty of depth. If we were in the same situation as last season in game 7 but had this many options.... I don't think it would have ended the same way. MG and AV have learned from last year and so has our core group. They know what it takes now!

#40 sdnucksfan

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 12:13 AM

Through choice and necessity AV has been rationing out ice time in a very effective manner for the Canuck roster to be playoff ready. The 3rd and 4th line have had their minutes upped and the line shakeups have brought forth some interesting combos.

The last six games have really shown how deep the talent is on this club. While I still have concern about the d-core's ability against CUP contending offences the Canucks can overcome this by forwards coming back and their ability to play in the opposing zone. The combos AV is experimenting with has to give fans real optimism.


finally someone who realizes what AV has been doing and gives him some credit.
so sick of the WTF is AV thinking and "we lost the trade" and "mg is an idiot" threads.

i really think the organization learned a great deal last year and has implemented those lessons in this season, especially the last month or two. i love what AV has done, despite the team and some individual players struggling. the individuals who were struggling are integrated in the team and are really picking up their game, and the team is now on a 6 game win streak.

so many people on CDC fail to see the big picture, see one loss, and crap all over what AV or MG are doing. the shake ups and game play style change has made us a much better and stronger team, and much more of a cup contender.

hope our injured guys get back in the line up for the playoffs volpatti and pinizzotto and ballard would be a great addition to have come april 11.

#41 Boudrias

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 08:07 AM

I mostly agree with this; noting that I have high lighted your last paragraph. (very good response, well done!)

We can play our system, and gain control of the puck and we are fine. But that could break down on D. The Canucks main issue at the moment is a bit of vulnerability for some of our D to match up against waves of big forward lines; such as in St Louis. Our 3rd pair constantly has guys who either cant beat these big guys to the puck to clear it (Alberts) or are too small if they get hemmed in (Tanev).

Our first line (if Burrows, Danny, Hank) is also vulnerable to size. But, this is a post about's AV's manipulation of the lines. He appears to be experimenting, and testing which combinations of Lapierre, Bitz, Kassian has been able to step in and counter act that issue; and Burrows moves seemlessly from line to line. I would like to see Booth up with the Twins, even Kesler if Reinprecht is effective enough as center. We should have enough depth, where we did not last year, to allow AV to pull this off.

Can we do it on D?

Connauton should be up for a game or 3 before the dance for the same reason. He does not address size (although he is our toughest D behind Bieksa) but does get to the puck and move it very well. Remember, he was an AHL all star this year, not Tanev or Gragnani.

A critical comment you made was about the makeup of the 1st line. Putting Lapierre with Hank and Burrows gives some idea of the potential of Hank Sedin working with two physical wingers. Lapierre is big enough and physical enough to be a deterent against liberties with Hank. Both wingers have 'soft' hands and can go to the front of the net. How many shifts did we see the other night when Hank sat in the corner or half boards and either dropped to the dman for a point shot or simply fired a shot towards the net. A goal from each winger, not to shabby. You have to think that coaching has been kicking around the idea of putting Dan on the second with Kesler and Booth. Such a move lessens the physical intimidation threat to the Twins and again puts a Sedin with two shooters. Worth a look.

#42 Tearloch7

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Posted 03 April 2012 - 08:59 AM

AV doesn't have the power of god bucko


Bucko? .. and I assume you mean "God"? .. now sure who is asking AV to be "God" or a "God" .. just need him to help the team alter tactics to meet changes in our opponents approach to the game .. simple, really .. :rolleyes:

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