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It's Time To Deal With The 2Nd Line Enigma.


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#1 Bodee

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 09:49 AM

The second line is not producing and I have a theory as to why that is.

It was thought at the time that because Booth and Kesler had played together in their formative years that there would be a chemistry. Actually I don't know why so much store was put into this factor (maybe it wasn't a factor at all of course as far as AV was concerned) because a) we don't know there was any chemistry back then and B) Kesler's game has changed a lot since coming to the Canucks.

I also imagine the same could be said for David Booth.

The problem as I see it is Booth has not learned to play with his line mates on this team and he seems unwilling to change his style.
We need the second line to be high producers and you won't achieve that if the puck is not circulated. Most of the best lines I have watched know the value of passing and passing early.

For example, watch the last night's Boston game.

I would prefer to see Booth bumped up to first with the Sedins or down to third with Hansen and Pahlsson..............or even 4th if that's what it takes until he gets some team mojo going.

Sedins - Booth
Higgins - Kesler - Burrows/Raymond
Lapierre/Raymond - Pahlsson - Hansen
Ebbett - Manny - Lapierre/Bitz/Kassian/Reinprecht

It may be too late now to try something like this but no one can convince me, the second line will produce with Booth partnering Kesler. If all else fails Booth MUST be told to pass earlier and to get his head up.

Discuss.

Edit Include Burrows/ Raymond/ ........Raymond/Lapierre combinations. Thanks for pointing out my drunken omission. :picard:

Edited by Bodee, 06 April 2012 - 10:13 AM.

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#2 wendythirteenthrashers

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 09:54 AM

UH WHERE IS BURROWS?

#3 wendythirteenthrashers

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 09:55 AM

i agree tho that kes/booth need separation.....send booth to the 4th

#4 The Brahma Bull

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 09:56 AM

Kes will go beast mode by himself. Booth just needs to go tothe net for e rebounds. Kesler will be on fire in the playoffs. Can't wait.


#5 Line Juggler

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 09:59 AM

My question is whether we should split the Sedins during the playoffs. If yes then the only line that doesn't change is the 3rd. Although switching Booth with Higgens may become a necessity if Booth continues to faulter.
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#6 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 09:59 AM

Hmmm... This talk didn't exist when they were both scoring at a decent rate.


TOML
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#7 wendythirteenthrashers

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:01 AM

booth /kes/raymond = 3 puck hogs.....

#8 Mookie Wilson

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:01 AM

Hmmm... This talk didn't exist when they were both scoring at a decent rate.


TOML


Agreed. Kesler and Booth showed chemistry together earlier in the season. The AMEX line had a nice run before Booth's latest injury.

#9 timberz21

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:03 AM

Change Booth and Higgins

Edited by timberz21, 06 April 2012 - 10:04 AM.


#10 Tambellini's Wrist Shot

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:05 AM

There's one glaring omission in that line-up.........

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It is pretty funny how the grass is always greener, until it is in your backyard..


#11 ba;;isticsports

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:05 AM

I remember saying at the beginning of the Year that Kesler should have been moved to the wing (where He started his career)
Putting Coho in the Middle to distribute the puck to the speedy and shoot happy Booth and Kesler

All great centres are set up men and passers first
They are the Drive -( Coach V mentioned earlier for Kes to use his wingers)


When Booth drives to the Net with the puck,why isnt someone following Him for the rebound ?

Maybe they feel that if they are not getting the Passes, that they have to do it themselves to get the chance to score?
Im not sure how You fix it this late, but I do know they have to move the puck around more

regarding PP, I remember Kes standing in front creating havoc for the Goalie, I no longer see that (maybe saving His body for the rigors of the Playofffs)?
Wondered why they didnt try putting Kass to do that job (Like Bertuzzi did here in his day??

Edited by ba;;isticsports, 06 April 2012 - 10:29 AM.


#12 Bodee

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:06 AM

UH WHERE IS BURROWS?


Your right Burrows/Raymond to third and Lappy to 4th before Bitz.........Afternoon wine drinking is a bitch :emot-parrot:

Also I was never convinced there was teamwork even when Booth had his scoring patch and said so at the time.
I put him with the Sedins because I feel they would change/enhance his game..........You have to pass occasionally (at least) when you play with the Sedins

Edited by Bodee, 06 April 2012 - 10:10 AM.

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#13 nuck nit

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:15 AM

Kes is MIA.

I don't see a lot of distribution from Kes to his wingers,as has been noted for some time now.

Kes plays like a winger,as does Booth and May Ray and Higgins.

As ballisticsports states,the problem is that Kes is a winger playing centre and a playmaking centre,Hodgson,is gone.

#14 RyanKeslord17

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:22 AM

Booth-Hank-Burrows
Danny-Kes-Kassian
Higgins-Pahlsson-Hansen
Malhotra-Lapierre-Bitz
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#15 shazzam

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:25 AM

omg people can't blame raymond anymore

#16 406281dylan

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:30 AM

Kk first I would like to say good job to AV for finally getting Henrik out of his slump with a pretty surprising combination of players but they have been playing well with Henrik (Burrows,Lapierre). I think that a solution to the second line would be to put daniel sedin there when he gets back but that seems a bit unlikley because the team is going to want Lappy to play a more physical roll. It is also obvious to me that when you put Lappy with the right people he can produce, also he was great on the third line last playoffs. These are my line combinations to get everyone at there best.
Daniel-Henrik-Burrows (If they get pushed around then change them up)
Higgins-Kesler-Booth (It has been good before and with a hot higgins who knows)
Lapierre-Pahlsson-Hansen (a very phisical third line which is able to put the puck in the net)
Raymond/Weise/Bitz-Manny-Kassian (depth)

#17 wendythirteenthrashers

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:34 AM

not blaming mayray....if youre referring to my comment about puck hogs...its just my take on that mayray/kes/booth line...they all seem to just want to do it themselves then get doubleteamed and turnover the puck....maybe one outta 15 shifts they actually pass to each other....

Edited by wendythirteenthrashers, 06 April 2012 - 10:35 AM.


#18 Mookie Wilson

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:35 AM

There's one glaring omission in that line-up.........

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I dunno about that goatee.

#19 ice orca

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:43 AM

If Kess and Booth can try to hit the net instead of the defenceman or the glass behind the net the puck might go in. Also maybe pass the puck and then drive to the net.

#20 uber_pwnzor

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:45 AM

Yeah, thought about it too, they really need a break from one another

#21 justsayin

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 10:56 AM

It doesn't seem to work because both Kesler and Booth are selfish and their first instinct is to shoot when passing might be a better option.

#22 gordfish

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 11:06 AM

The second line is not producing and I have a theory as to why that is.

It was thought at the time that because Booth and Kesler had played together in their formative years that there would be a chemistry. Actually I don't know why so much store was put into this factor (maybe it wasn't a factor at all of course as far as AV was concerned) because a) we don't know there was any chemistry back then and B) Kesler's game has changed a lot since coming to the Canucks.

I also imagine the same could be said for David Booth.

The problem as I see it is Booth has not learned to play with his line mates on this team and he seems unwilling to change his style.
We need the second line to be high producers and you won't achieve that if the puck is not circulated. Most of the best lines I have watched know the value of passing and passing early.

For example, watch the last night's Boston game.

I would prefer to see Booth bumped up to first with the Sedins or down to third with Hansen and Pahlsson..............or even 4th if that's what it takes until he gets some team mojo going.

Sedins - Booth
Higgins - Kesler - Burrows/Raymond
Lapierre/Raymond - Pahlsson - Hansen
Ebbett - Manny - Lapierre/Bitz/Kassian/Reinprecht

It may be too late now to try something like this but no one can convince me, the second line will produce with Booth partnering Kesler. If all else fails Booth MUST be told to pass earlier and to get his head up.

Discuss.

Edit Include Burrows/ Raymond/ ........Raymond/Lapierre combinations. Thanks for pointing out my drunken omission. :picard:


The second line needs a playmaker. Someone like, gee I dunno, Cody Hodgson?AV should put Ebbett in place of either Booth or Raymond until Daniel gets back. When Daniel is healthy, this is how I'd start the lines...Burrows / Henrik / LapierreBooth / Kesler / DanielHiggins / Pahlsson / HansenRaymond / Malhotra / Ebbett, Weiss or BitzI said here after the Finals last season that one of the things AV will need to in the coming season is split up the twins for short periods of time. It would make the Sedins more versatile and the entire team harder to defend against.Another line he needs to start using 5 on 5 is the Sedins with Kesler. He hasn't used that line 5 on 5 ever, and it's baffling. Imagine if the Avs never loaded Forsberg and Sakic up on the same line, or if the Wings never put Datsyuk and Zetterberg out together?But whether or not AV gets his head together, if they don't find a way to get their PP going, they could be in for a very short playoff run.Here's a tip, boys:SHOOT THE GODDAM PUCK!

#23 Durl Dixsun

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 11:14 AM

why wasnt raymond traded at the deadline.. i'd rather take my chances on a 7th round pick over raymond.

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#24 CanKnucklehead89

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 11:15 AM

My forward lineup when Daniel comes back would be:

Booth-Hank-Lapierre
Daniel-Kes-Burrows
Hansen-Pahlson-Higgins
Bitz-Malhotra-Raymond/Weise/Reinprecht

#25 Phil_314

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 11:20 AM

I think a simple swap of Booth and Lapierre can help the issue out already:

Burrows - Hank - Booth (Booth here can essentially replace Danny's previous role as the line's go-to shooter; Burr and Hank are strong enough to cycle while Booth gets open in front; either way if he or Burr shoots Hank still has two solid scorers to pass to)
Danny - Kes - Lapierre (Danny can work and make plays for Kes, who will snipe; Lapierre, while being shoot first, is still less selfish (9G, 10A, 19PTS))

good thing this team has guys like Burr, Lapierre and Danny who can be either the shooter OR passer to complement elite passers like Hank, and also shoot-first guys (Kes, Booth)

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#26 CanuckleHead1092

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 11:25 AM

my playoff lineup

Raymond / H.Sedin / Burrows (Shooter, Backpack mode playmaker, Watch out fer Burrows)
D.Sedin / Kesler / Booth (Sniper/playmaker, Beast mode, Pwf drive to net)
Higgins / Pahlsson / Hansen (solid fore-checking, shutdown and scoring threat)
Malhotra / Lapierre / Kassian (shutdown centers, lots of hits, Rookie Pwf Big game player)

Forward Depth: Reinprecht, Bitz, Ebbett, Volpatti(hopefully)

Hamhuis / Bieksa
Edler / Salo
Ballard / Tanev

Defensive Depth: Rome, Alberts, MAG

Badassery at its finest

#27 goblix

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 11:25 AM

meh, I'd rather see what they do in a playoff game before splitting them up, you can juggle in mid game if it's not working out.
Kesler in playoffs = beast.

#28 Spencer Drew

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 11:31 AM

My playoff lineup:

Sedin/Sedin/Kassian
Booth/Kesler/Burrows
Pahlsson/Hansen/Higgins
Malhotra/Lapierre/Bitz

Hamhuis/Bieksa
Edler/Salo
Tanev/Ballard (or Rome/Gragnani)

Luongo/Schneider
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#29 zombieksa

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 11:37 AM

I really think Parenteau may be the player to acquire in the off-season. He has pretty great play making abilities and is a very accurate passer. Both Booth and Kes need this.

Also I know a lot of people say P. A. is overrated. I simply say he is properly rated.
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#30 Onions

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Posted 06 April 2012 - 11:41 AM

HOLD UP! we were playing Boston last night?
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