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How Many Games Should Av Give Mayray In The Playoffs?


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#1 nuck luck

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 12:31 PM

I understand that Raymond will be valuable to us in the playoffs, I know that he's had a major injury, I know his speed might be valuable against LA's D and I know he had a great season previously.

However, the regular season is over now and the real season begins...we don't have the luxury to keep giving players a free ride. Every game matters and every player needs to prove he belongs on the ice...

Line ups at practice:

D. Sedin, H. Sedin, Burrows
Raymond, Kes, Booth
Hansen, Pahlsson, Higgy
Manny, Lappy, Bitz

Should the 2nd line disappear again with Raymond on it, I hope AV puts Lappy back on the 2nd in the following game.

#2 -Vintage Canuck-

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 12:32 PM

Give him two games in the first round. If he looks lost out there and hasn't done much put him in the Press Box. If he impresses everyone and is producing then should remain in the line-up.

Simple.

Edited by Vintage Canuck., 09 April 2012 - 12:34 PM.

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#3 Zach Morris

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 12:35 PM

I have to disagree with you. In no way has Mason had a free ride. He broke his G.D.ed back for the team last year. He is also a work horse out there in terms of his defensive and speed.

He was a little snake bitten this year, and had a tendency of slipping on the ice. Its a brand new season come Wednesday, and a little birdy told me he's gonna try sharpining his skates 3/4" instead of 1/2"!

He'll be in the lineup as long as he is healthy!
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#4 goalie13

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 12:38 PM

This isn't something that can be predetermined before the puck even drops. I am hoping he has a great playoffs and plays in many games. But if things don't go his way, it's not like AV doesn't have options.
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#5 Northern

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 12:51 PM

I have to disagree with you. In no way has Mason had a free ride. He broke his G.D.ed back for the team last year. He is also a work horse out there in terms of his defensive and speed.

He was a little snake bitten this year, and had a tendency of slipping on the ice. Its a brand new season come Wednesday, and a little birdy told me he's gonna try sharpining his skates 3/4" instead of 1/2"!

He'll be in the lineup as long as he is healthy!

That made me laugh at the way you phrased that. nice one. +1 for you.

#6 Blueberries

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 12:51 PM

AV should go with

Sedin-Sedin-Lappy
Burrows-Kesler-Booth
Hansen-Pahlsson-Higgy
Raymond-Manny-Bitz

When Kassian comes back maybe take out Raymond.

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#7 Lychees

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 12:55 PM

If he's making smart plays even without the puck and not scoring, we'll see

#8 Kryten

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 12:55 PM

I think it should depend on two things:

1) Our Opponent - LA Kings have a very stingy defence that use their size to force players to the outside and active sticks to deflect pucks. Raymond does not have the strength to protect the puck during a cycle or the focus to handle the puck at high speeds effectively enough to create plays (especially when considering the King's defensive acumen). Unless Raymond can play every game like the "one" he played after being a healthy scratch, he will be a liability on the second line (the only position available for a player of his stature). I think he gets just the one game to prove himself, but I would personally allow him to watch from the pressbox and use his attributes against a better matchup later on in the post-season.

2) Injuries - If for some reason someone goes down, having Raymond as depth wouldn't hurt, especially if he brings the fire like he did after his last stint in the press box. While I personally would have Ebbett ahead of Raymond on our depth chart (taking recent success into consideration), having either player available in case of disaster is a good problem to have.

While it may seem that I "hate" Raymond, I want to make it clear that I do not. I like him as a player especially when he puts in the effort in both ends of the rink. I just believe that an unobjective view of the situation has Raymond on the outside looking in when taking the above points in consideration.
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#9 Dogbyte

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 12:55 PM

I say give him 16-28 games.

Edited by Dogbyte, 09 April 2012 - 12:56 PM.

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#10 Strawberries

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 12:56 PM

if he plays like he has the potential too , then he has a very valuable player otherwise he should see the box
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#11 -Vintage Canuck-

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 12:58 PM

AV joked that Raymond got taken off the power play because he didn't name his newborn son Alain.

:lol:

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#12 nuck nit

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 12:58 PM

He should be included as a special teams asset.

He has neither the size nor scoring abilities to take up a top six roster spot.

With the third line playing lights out just where is he slotted in?

#13 Lazy but Talented

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 01:03 PM

his past performances in the playoffs show that we shouldn't expect much of anything from him. To me he has a very short leash because he didn't do much at all this season, last season and in previous playoffs

#14 Bauer1337

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 01:04 PM

The real question should be, how many games will AV give lou??!!

#15 Zach Morris

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 01:05 PM

He should be included as a special teams asset.

He has neither the size nor scoring abilities to take up a top six roster spot.

With the third line playing lights out just where is he slotted in?


1. He "is" a special teams asset - not should be! 2. He has the speed to be in the top six if not the size, and is continually involved in really good scoring chances. The reason ppl are on him so much is because he has had recent trouble in his finishing capabilities. The positive is that he is getting those chances. 3. He could fit on any line, and play efectively defensively, if not offensively.
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#16 Puckmonk3y

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 01:11 PM

1. He "is" a special teams asset - not should be! 2. He has the speed to be in the top six if not the size, and is continually involved in really good scoring chances. The reason ppl are on him so much is because he has had recent trouble in his finishing capabilities. The positive is that he is getting those chances. 3. He could fit on any line, and play efectively defensively, if not offensively.


Raymond is where plays go to die. He wasn't impressive last year, he was lousy this year, he's had his chances. I hope he is kept on a short leash we have too many capable forwards waiting in the wings while Raymond stinks it up.
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#17 Zach Morris

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 01:14 PM

Raymond is where plays go to die. He wasn't impressive last year, he was lousy this year, he's had his chances. I hope he is kept on a short leash we have too many capable forwards waiting in the wings while Raymond stinks it up.


I just don't see it your way. His offensive numbers aren't there..... But in no way do I think he's stinking it up... We must be watching different hockey games.
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#18 Raph

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 01:18 PM

I just don't see it your way. His offensive numbers aren't there..... But in no way do I think he's stinking it up... We must be watching different hockey games.


Every line Raymond played on this season has had negative synergy.
Untouchables: Tanev, Jensen, Kassian
Mostly untouchable: Sedins (need someone to man the fort and no trade value)
Open to trade: Everyone else
Drive to airport: Bieksa, Edler

Bring back: Ehrhoff

#19 Kryten

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 01:19 PM

1. He "is" a special teams asset - not should be! 2. He has the speed to be in the top six if not the size, and is continually involved in really good scoring chances. The reason ppl are on him so much is because he has had recent trouble in his finishing capabilities. The positive is that he is getting those chances. 3. He could fit on any line, and play efectively defensively, if not offensively.


I agree that Raymond is defensively responsible and has offensive skills but he has not been using his speed effectively and his lack of focus with the puck has cost himself not only ice-time but what should be a solidified roster spot. I have to add that Raymond does not have size. I wouldn't care less if he did or not for that matter if he is able to stay on his feet, a problem that everyone sees in his game and one that the much larger LA defence will surely take advantage of.

Edited by Kryten, 09 April 2012 - 01:20 PM.

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#20 uber_pwnzor

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 01:32 PM

I would like to see:
Sedin - Sedin - Lappiere; Lappy seemed to have great chemistry with Henrik, plus he can defend them when it gets rough.

Higgins - Kesler - Booth; Amex. Need I say more?

Burrows - Pċhlsson - Hansen; beast of a checking line, plus they're gonna light it upp a few times.

Bitz - Manny - Kassian; they're gonna slaughter, Bitz and Kass especially.

Edited by Über Pwnzor!, 09 April 2012 - 01:35 PM.


#21 Raiun

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 01:43 PM

I would like to see:
Sedin - Sedin - Lappiere; Lappy seemed to have great chemistry with Henrik, plus he can defend them when it gets rough.

Higgins - Kesler - Booth; Amex. Need I say more?

Burrows - Påhlsson - Hansen; beast of a checking line, plus they're gonna light it upp a few times.

Bitz - Manny - Kassian; they're gonna slaughter, Bitz and Kass especially.


I actually do like this lineup. Higgins is going to be great no matter where he is, Burrows proved he can be effective on the third line, and Lapierre can use his size to handle traffic in front of the next more effectively than Burrows can I think.

I do think that Raymond does deserve a chance to show us what he can do in the playoffs though, the guy broke his back last year for us, and he's played a solid season (not an amazing one, but he is still a plus player) since coming back without any summer training camp. He might find another gear in the playoffs just like we are hoping a couple other guys will (Kes, Kassian, and Booth to name a couple) and be very effective.

Edit: Also, this problem is a really good one to have. Mason Raymond would be a guaranteed 2nd liner on a lot of teams, even with his poorer performance this year. The fact that we even have the luxury of suggesting that he sits on the bench is just amazing. I love our depth this year.

Edited by Raiun, 09 April 2012 - 01:45 PM.


#22 TACanucks

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 01:50 PM

I think it should depend on two things:

1) Our Opponent - LA Kings have a very stingy defence that use their size to force players to the outside and active sticks to deflect pucks. Raymond does not have the strength to protect the puck during a cycle or the focus to handle the puck at high speeds effectively enough to create plays (especially when considering the King's defensive acumen). Unless Raymond can play every game like the "one" he played after being a healthy scratch, he will be a liability on the second line (the only position available for a player of his stature). I think he gets just the one game to prove himself, but I would personally allow him to watch from the pressbox and use his attributes against a better matchup later on in the post-season.

2) Injuries - If for some reason someone goes down, having Raymond as depth wouldn't hurt, especially if he brings the fire like he did after his last stint in the press box. While I personally would have Ebbett ahead of Raymond on our depth chart (taking recent success into consideration), having either player available in case of disaster is a good problem to have.

While it may seem that I "hate" Raymond, I want to make it clear that I do not. I like him as a player especially when he puts in the effort in both ends of the rink. I just believe that an unobjective view of the situation has Raymond on the outside looking in when taking the above points in consideration.


This ^^

#23 Kanye West

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 01:52 PM

Booth-Sedin-Burrows
Sedin-Kesler-Higgins
Raymond-Pahlsson-Hansen
Malhotra-Lapierre-Kassian

Splitting the Twins? Yeah I went there :frantic:

It wouldn't hurt to try what they could do in the playoffs separated cause it'll cause confusion to LA on who to check. Just something to think about, so why not try it during a game or for a game?

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#24 Canucks_fo_life

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 01:54 PM

None, if it were my way. His leash should be short, this is the playoffs now, smarten up and toughen up. I'm happy for the guy that he's playing hockey again after he was almost paralyzed by that that tool boychuck in the finals, but he's gotta go to the net and he needs to stop falling down, his balance is horrible. I don't wanna see him trying to make passes he knows he can't make, cause he's been a turnover machine in the past.
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#25 marleau_12

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 01:55 PM

I'd rather have Raymond out there than Weise (per se).
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#26 ChuckNORRIS4Cup

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 02:06 PM

I think if the Canucks were playing San Jose in the first round instead of LA, Raymond wouldn't be playing. LA isn't as physical as San Jose, so speed will help more in this series then if it was against San Jose, San Jose is a way more physical team, so you would rather have your bigger and stronger guys playing in that series to battle back, but this isn't the case, so Raymond can play, but as soon as we play a more physical and stronger team and if Raymond doesn't do anything in the first round you can beat your butt he will be benched.

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#27 fagin

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 02:15 PM

Every line Raymond played on this season has had negative synergy.

This statement isn't quite true unless you're discounting the 2 games where Kesler was replaced by hodgesen as the 2nd line centre.The line scored on both occasions.There was actually a 3rd game where Kesler was replaced and the line scored again.As others have posted Raymond and Kes have little to no chemistry,but I don't believe it's correct to put all the blame on only one of them for this.

Edited by fagin, 09 April 2012 - 02:24 PM.


#28 mcgillnuck

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 02:18 PM

What bugs me about Raymond is that he was our best player for 2 games after being benched, and then he just went right back to his old ways. If he can play like he did after being benched there's a spot for him on this team, if he can't then someone else will have to take his place.

Props to canuckbuddy for the sig

#29 shazzam

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 02:19 PM

Kesler and Booth have struggled as well as Raymond. Raymond is just the easy target.

#30 Iron_Gland

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 02:26 PM

When you have to get scratched to get you going IN A CONTRACT YEAR you know you have issues with a player. There is no more ceiling with Raymond. What you see is what you get. He might have some impact on a lesser team like Calgary or Columbus, but on this team he has no role. His speed is over-rated (how often does he use his feet to breakaway from defenders? I see Burrows, Hanse, Lappy and Kes do it wayyy more), and while he is a good PKer, we have more than enough of those (Hansen, Higgins, Kes, Burr, Pahlsson, etc), he doesn't hit, he doesn't intimidate, he's just an indifferent, useless player. I hope I don't see him in the playoffs at all, but for some reason AV thinks there's more there to him. I hope he's right, but I know he's wrong.




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