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We Should Stop Looking At Raymonds Down Side


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#121 Jaku

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Posted 12 May 2012 - 02:38 PM

upside to may ray? :huh: Speed, no hands, no finish, and small? So we have a player who can fill ice quickly, can't handle the puck, and can't score. Overpaid 4th liner? Wait too small. 2.55M for what? May Ray needs to turn it around right away here.
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#122 nuck nit

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Posted 12 May 2012 - 05:29 PM

We don't have to do anything.It is what it is.

Raymond and GIllis have to hope there is a stop to the down side.
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#123 DaMacNamedDre

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 12:22 PM

I take issue with him having a "hard but inaccurate shot." 1) It doesn't look hard, and 2) is actually uncanny in its accuracy of finding the crest of all puck stoppers.

Seriously, the guy is a poster boy for what ails this team. Speedy, skilled, smallish player that won't hurt a fly, has no playoff gear and is totally devoid of elbow grease. If he's back I'll question the MG extension.

I'll take a late round pick for his rights but wouldn't be upset if we loose him for nothing.



THIS ^^^^^^



Raymond is the opposite of Playoff built. i'd take a Chris Neil over this pansy in a heartbeat.
I will be choked if they resign this kid and don't substantially man up the roster in the offseason.
league minimum on a 2 way deal is all he is worth. even that would be generous.
Playoffs turn savage, every year, we need animals , not pretty boys that fall down on their knees every shift.
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#124 van_ws

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 01:17 PM

The Canucks damn well better ship Raymond out. It will be very disappointing if he is brought back.

Other than skating around in circles, what else can he do? Can't finish to save his life, always on the perimeter and barely ever driving to the net. All he is good for is falling down on his ass every few times a game.
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#125 2gingers1cup

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 01:42 PM

if raymond is back with the canucks come october i will be pissed. he describes everything that is wrong with the canucks.
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#126 xereau

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 02:03 PM

Re-sign Raymond for 2 more years, 1.25-1.50m per.

He is a solid 3rd line player, with an erratic offensive upside.

He is a good/great defensive asset; strong backcheck, great d-zone interceptor, top of the league speed for breakouts.

As the title of this thread infers, there IS an upside to Mason Raymond. Now it is time for the coaching staff to focus on his assets instead of trying to force fit him into a 2nd line offensive role.
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#127 Raph

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 02:33 PM

Re-sign Raymond for 2 more years, 1.25-1.50m per.

He is a solid 3rd line player, with an erratic offensive upside.

He is a good/great defensive asset; strong backcheck, great d-zone interceptor, top of the league speed for breakouts.

As the title of this thread infers, there IS an upside to Mason Raymond. Now it is time for the coaching staff to focus on his assets instead of trying to force fit him into a 2nd line offensive role.


Higgins and Hansen are better options for the 3rd line checking role. Our team has enough checkers as is. There is no more room for Raymond.

And when's the last time you saw Raymond use his skates for a "top of the league speed breakout"? Once a spec of dust gets in his way, he'll slow down or fall.
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#128 Clonedanielsedin

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 05:21 PM

Raymond has had enough chances in a top six role to produce, even in the playoffs hes been given alot of ice time and he continues to fail.

I am ok with him on the 3rd line, hes a good checker and might play better with less pressure on him.

His lack of physical play is a problem for the bottom six though, hes a perimeter player, you need the bottom six to drive to the net.
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#129 Bananas

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 09:28 PM

We're forced to look at his downside because of the amount of times he falls face first in to the ice.

I'm sure we'd all love to see his upside.


I didn't even read the original post... this is exactly what I was going to post. Wouldn't you know it, it was the first response in the thread.


Trade Raymond for a half-decent defensive prospect.
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#130 riffraff

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 09:44 PM

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#131 NLluvitorleaveit

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 08:22 AM

MayRay........

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#132 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 10:35 AM

Re-sign Raymond for 2 more years, 1.25-1.50m per.
br />



It's been pointed out (a few times now) that as an RFA, Raymond must receive a qualifying offer from the Canucks at no less than his current salary. Otherwise, he becomes a UFA.

The Canucks could go that route and then offer him what you suggest, but any other team could step in and make a better offer. If he took the competing offer, the Canucks would have lost him for nothing.

It puts Gillis in a tough spot. 2.5 million is a steep price to pay, but it would also be tough to let him walk after all the time and money the team has put into his development.
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#133 Vansicle

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 11:22 AM

It puts Gillis in a tough spot. 2.5 million is a steep price to pay, but it would also be tough to let him walk after all the time and money the team has put into his development.

That's throwing good money after bad. They can't offer him that much. It's a bad investment until they know he can get back to 20+ goals/50-ish points a season.
I like Raymond, but he does need to recognize that, through no fault of his own, his value has gone down, if not temporarily. I wouldn't blame him for leaving - in this business you have to grab as much money as you can while you can - but if he wants to do the right thing, he will allow the Canucks to resign him at a short term discount after they let him become a UFA. They stuck with him through his difficult last two seasons. He, in my mind, owes them the courtesy of a discounted short term deal. Quid pro quo.
And to restate my position, I like him. I want him back. He needs a chance to show that he can get his game back. But if he can't, then it's best for everyone that he walk. And if he still thinks he's worth 2.5 in his current condition, he should walk. Hard.
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Snake Doctor, on 23 May 2014 - 10:41 AM, said:snapback.png

Miller is not on our list. It's Lack as our #1. There is no reason we would have traded both Schnieder and Luongo if we never intended to give Lack the #1 starting job.  Furthermore, the salary and term Miller is looking for is not in our favor.

 


#134 canucks_dynasty

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 12:01 PM

It's been pointed out (a few times now) that as an RFA, Raymond must receive a qualifying offer from the Canucks at no less than his current salary. Otherwise, he becomes a UFA.

The Canucks could go that route and then offer him what you suggest, but any other team could step in and make a better offer. If he took the competing offer, the Canucks would have lost him for nothing.

It puts Gillis in a tough spot. 2.5 million is a steep price to pay, but it would also be tough to let him walk after all the time and money the team has put into his development.


I think the QO is only for 1 year contract to protect him as an RFA (so he won't immediately be a UFA). I think Canucks can offer him a multi-year deal that can be of lower salary cap hit. He could accept a 3yr $6M contract ($2M salary cap hit).
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#135 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 12:15 PM

That's throwing good money after bad. They can't offer him that much. It's a bad investment until they know he can get back to 20+ goals/50-ish points a season.
I like Raymond, but he does need to recognize that, through no fault of his own, his value has gone down, if not temporarily. I wouldn't blame him for leaving - in this business you have to grab as much money as you can while you can -  but if he wants to do the right thing, he will allow the Canucks to resign him at a short term discount after they let him become a UFA. They stuck with him through his difficult last two seasons. He, in my mind, owes them the courtesy of a discounted short term deal. Quid pro quo.
And to restate my position, I like him. I want him back. He needs a chance to show that he can get his game back. But if he can't, then it's best for everyone that he walk. And if he still thinks he's worth 2.5 in his current condition, he should walk. Hard.


I tend to agree with this. There is also the possibility that Mayray wants to stay and would sign as a UFA to a more reasonable contract...
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#136 Vansicle

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 12:57 PM

I tend to agree with this. There is also the possibility that Mayray wants to stay and would sign as a UFA to a more reasonable contract...

That would please me tremendously.
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Snake Doctor, on 23 May 2014 - 10:41 AM, said:snapback.png

Miller is not on our list. It's Lack as our #1. There is no reason we would have traded both Schnieder and Luongo if we never intended to give Lack the #1 starting job.  Furthermore, the salary and term Miller is looking for is not in our favor.

 


#137 arsenalian

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 01:11 PM

Re-sign Raymond for 2 more years, 1.25-1.50m per.

He is a solid 3rd line player, with an erratic offensive upside.

He is a good/great defensive asset; strong backcheck, great d-zone interceptor, top of the league speed for breakouts.

As the title of this thread infers, there IS an upside to Mason Raymond. Now it is time for the coaching staff to focus on his assets instead of trying to force fit him into a 2nd line offensive role.


Once again, because people can't seem to comprehend. HE CANNOT BE SIGNED FOR LOWER THAN WHAT HE IS MAKING NOW. He's a restricted free agent, he can't be qualified below 2.5M. This is why people want to let him walk. We can't just offer him less money....Aiiiieeeeee, and this has been mentioned numerous times now.
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#138 Grand17

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 02:23 PM

Ive never liked raymond. He is nothing more then filler on the line up card
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#139 Raph

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 03:38 PM

Ive never liked raymond. He is nothing more then filler on the line up card


This is almost the perfect description of Raymond.
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#140 Bananas

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 10:11 PM

Once again, because people can't seem to comprehend. HE CANNOT BE SIGNED FOR LOWER THAN WHAT HE IS MAKING NOW. He's a restricted free agent, he can't be qualified below 2.5M. This is why people want to let him walk. We can't just offer him less money....Aiiiieeeeee, and this has been mentioned numerous times now.


No, I don't think YOU can comprehend...









...people really are THAT stupid.
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#141 TACIC

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 09:02 AM

hes signed now so we have to look at it :emot-parrot: :towel: B)
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#142 22Sedinery33

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 09:03 AM

Then there's not much else to look at beside his speed before he falls <_<
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#143 TACIC

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 09:05 AM

Then there's not much else to look at beside his speed before he falls <_<

hes been training hard this summerand will be in beast mode when he comes back
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#144 Bananas

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 09:25 AM

We're forced to look at his downside because of the amount of times he falls face first in to the ice.

I'm sure we'd all love to see his upside.


nothing more needs to be said.
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#145 TACIC

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 09:30 AM

nothing more needs to be said.

We need to stop ragging on him,I wouldn't mind trading him IMO cause he has decent aulie in a package but if a good one dosent come through keep him
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#146 Sensemaker

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 09:48 AM

In all honesty, I only look at women's downsides...

Edited by Sensemaker, 02 September 2012 - 01:48 PM.

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#147 geezer2

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 01:41 PM

he will get his chance and if he does not stick than so be it... he is good enough to have a chance to make this team and it is up to him whether he does or not ....this is a tough enough business with out a city full of unqualified gm's passing judgement
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#148 Sensemaker

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 01:47 PM

he will get his chance and if he does not stick than so be it... he is good enough to have a chance to make this team and it is up to him whether he does or not ....this is a tough enough business with out a city full of unqualified gm's passing judgement


I think Raymond already made the team... It is not his job to win, like Kassian, Jensen, Schroeder or Gaunce, it i his job to lose, like most players already playing on the team.
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#149 bobopan

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 03:14 PM

Ive never really thought of Raymond having a hard shot.. That's news to me. Im so sick of hearing the injury card played out. The guy was utterly useless well before his injury.
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#150 Linden Legend

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 04:56 PM

I've come to the conclusion that if you are on here defending the way that Mason Raymond plays hockey, then you yourself know NOTHING about hockey!! Raymond is useless. He brings the players around him down. He kills momentum and scoring chances. He falls down all the time. He is not good defensively. His shot sucks. He NEVER looks to pass. He takes low percentage shots from terrible angles that never have a chance. He is NOT THAT FAST.

Sorry for the rant but I am still waiting for someone to explain to me why he is an asset to our team.

And stop playing the injury card.
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