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#31 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 10:11 AM

George McPhee on signing Vokoun: "It was a heck of a move."
Paul Holmgren on trading for Bryzgalov's rights: "We're trying to get better."
Ken Holland on signing Mike Modano: "We feel Mike Modano can help us."
Brian Burke on signing Tim Connolly: "Top line centers don't always become available."
Glen Sather on signing Wade Redden: "We signed him to make an impact."
Pierre Gauthier on trading for Scott Gomez: "We needed a top line center."
Jim Rutherford on signing Tomas Kaberle: "He's a cup champion top-pairing defender who really helps our team."

These are just a few examples.

Obviously, your assessment of Gillis being unique in this regard is false. Every GM plans for success. Cheers.


TOML

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#32 Peace Bond

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 10:23 AM

I, NEVER will be.


Evidently.

#33 nuck nit

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 10:26 AM

No,every GM is not planning on success,they are trying to spin the media to keep their jobs.

#34 nuck nit

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 10:48 AM

yup monumental screwup, sundin only put up 8points in 8 games in the playoffs and was 3rd on the team in scoring that year in the postseason. Picking up PPG centres is such a terrible idea i agree. :picard:


Ten million dollars for eight points.Fair trade.We would have been lucky to pay him twenty million for another year.

Nine goals in 41 games.What an example to the team.Three goals in the post season. Ten million dollars ,no make it twenty.

Was it that Mats that came in here out of shape and AV would not play him?

Was it that Mats that carried the Canucks,showing them the way with a -5 year end performance?

Was it that Mats that held out to go to New York,as in the Rangers,as in the team that is most despised in Canucks history?

Was it that Mats that finished the season with half the goals scored compared to Kyle Wellwood,who was on an entry level contract that never saw the PP time Mats enjoyed? Half the goals scored but twenty times the salary.Nice move.

Was it that Mats Sundin that was outscored by Taylor Pyatt,Mason Raymond,Kevin Bieksa and Steve Bernier?

Oh,yeah,that Mats.

#35 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 10:50 AM

Isn't it the media that likes to spin things? All the GM says are generic statements and then it's the media that creates epic stories out of those generic statements, and then it's the fans that take those partially fabricated stories and translate them into unsubstantiated guesswork and then proceed to rant about it for weeks because we're soooo freakin' bored in this town.

What the hell does that have to do with Gillis being a former agent? Cheers.


TOML

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#36 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 10:54 AM

Btw. Why are people still whining about Sundin when they should still be whining about Hodgson?

The best thing about the Sundin signing is that WE signed him. Us instead of NY, Detroit, Pittsburgh or another contender. Believe it or not, that was huge. It showed the rest of the league that we're for real. And it cost us $5mil. Not $10mil. Not $20mil. Just five. Money that was Aquilini's. Not yours. Cheers.


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#37 nuck nit

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 10:58 AM

The contract offer was 20 million and Mats wanted so bad to go to New York that he finally decided to work half a year for half a year's pay and did not even show up the next year.What a hero.Not.

Regards,

NN

#38 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 11:39 AM

The contract offer was 20 million and Mats wanted so bad to go to New York that he finally decided to work half a year for half a year's pay and did not even show up the next year.What a hero.Not.

You don't make any sense. He wanted so bad to go to New York that he eventually decided to sign with the Canucks? And wasn't a 'bad' part of the contract offer the fact it was two years? Well how is it still bad if he stayed for just one?

Make me understand, 'nuck nit'. Try harder. Cheers.


TOML

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#39 nuck nit

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 12:13 PM

The Rangers did not have the cap to fit him in and as the Canucks were willing to pay him a king's ransom he eventually decided to put in half a year here for five schmil.

For ten million dollars a year you get two Luongo's or a Luongo and a Sedin.

Nine goals for five million.Acquilini's must have loved that.

#40 ccc44

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 12:23 PM

Sundin-before and after he monumentally screwed up he kept spinning it and to this day I hear " Sundin built Kesler and the Twins" .

Yeah,right.Twenty million dollars says Gillis had no idea what he was doing.

What a veteran does for players in the dressing room is nothing fans get to know so how would you know if he did not help them with the mental side of the game ?
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#41 dorrcoq

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 12:35 PM

UHHH Sure...let's over-hype our players so my owner has to pay more to keep them. Man, that makes sense. Another hair-brained idea turned into another senseless thread IMO.

#42 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 12:55 PM

The Rangers did not have the cap to fit him in and as the Canucks were willing to pay him a king's ransom he eventually decided to put in half a year here for five schmil.

For ten million dollars a year you get two Luongo's or a Luongo and a Sedin.

Nine goals for five million.Acquilini's must have loved that.

The Rangers are currently paying Redden a mountain of cash to play in the minors. Cap space isn't an issue for them and it never was. The Canucks signing Sundin was a substantial event, considering how we beat out the Rangers for his services.

Again, these meaningless $10mil and $20mil figures are totally irrelevant. We did not pay Sundin that much. He had no impact on our cap space going forward at all. So why continue to bring it up?

Sundin's impact on Kesler and the Sedins is underrated. He was also a ppg player for us in the playoffs. But that being said, again, it's Aquilini's money. Not yours. I for one would rather have an owner who's willing to spend than one who's not. Or would you rather be in the days of singing the praises of Brad freakin' Isbister again?

You're not doing a good job. Try harder. Cheers.


TOML

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#43 nuck nit

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 01:38 PM

The money was better spent elsewhere and it ain't your dough,either.

Gillis offered $20 million to Sundin whom was outscored 2:1 by Wellwood making an entry level,bare minimum NHL contract.

You keep bringing it up but I am willing to jam it if you continue.

Gillis made a splash at the start of free agency, throwing Mats Sundin a two-year, $20 million offer as the Big Swede was pursued aggressively by other teams including the New York Rangers and the Montreal Canadiens.

#44 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 01:56 PM

The money was better spent elsewhere and it ain't your dough,either.

Gillis offered $20 million to Sundin whom was outscored 2:1 by Wellwood making an entry level,bare minimum NHL contract.

You keep bringing it up but I am willing to jam it if you continue.

Gillis made a splash at the start of free agency, throwing Mats Sundin a two-year, $20 million offer as the Big Swede was pursued aggressively by other teams including the New York Rangers and the Montreal Canadiens.

The money wouldn't have been spent at all and the fact that it's not my money is exactly the point i was trying to make. Not sure what point you're trying to make though. That i'm not the owner of the Canucks? Hey good one.

Kyle Wellwood was another player with his own set of issues. Not going to defend or promote that signing, but let's stick with Sundin, shall we? Esp. since people didn't greatly anticipate a Kyle Wellwood signing for an entire off-season and then half a season.

'Jam it?' What is this basketball? wtf are you talking about? I assume that last sentence was a quote. It's the only one that made sense. Not sure why you quoted it though, since that point was made a few years ago now. I'm not getting your best effort here, am i? Jeez.


TOML

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#45 nuck nit

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 02:27 PM

TO,what are you doing?

I said Sundin wanted to go to NY.He held out until NYR would not sign him and then signed here.

You have argued the Gillis contract offer,the Rangers offer,.got them both wrong.You offer up his great value but was a bust.

Sundin was a waste of time - as are you.

#46 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 03:02 PM

TO,what are you doing?

I said Sundin wanted to go to NY.He held out until NYR would not sign him and then signed here.

You have argued the Gillis contract offer,the Rangers offer,.got them both wrong.You offer up his great value but was a bust.

Sundin was a waste of time - as are you.

I'm waiting for something decent from you.

Already dismissed your NY cap space argument. If he really wanted to play in NY he could've quite easily.

And then you go on to say things and i'm not sure what you're talking about again. Something about the Rangers offer, which hasn't even been mentioned. Then the typical 'Sundin was a bust' statement. He might not have met expectations, but nobody even knew what the expectations were. Was he expected to lead this team to a cup? Pretty hard for him to not be a bust in that case. But if you expect a ppg player in the playoffs and a guy who obviously impacted the Sedins and Kesler quite positively, then he starts meeting some expectations. Again, it's irrelevant as it's only money. It cost us nothing in terms of players or picks to get him and that money not being spent elsewhere, again, is Aquilini's, not yours.

You're not bring much to the table. Just repeating the same ol' bs doesn't help anyone here. I suggest actually researching the material and then developing better communicative skills. Are we clear? Cheers.


TOML

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#47 tiredatwork

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 03:46 PM

No...Kesler and the twins said that.

http://www2.canada.c...45-8e60764ccc79



"We have a different attitude toward the game," Daniel said before the Canucks travelled Sunday to Montreal for tonight's game against the Canadiens. "Looking at Mats, he had a tough start. It didn't bother him. He just came to the rink and did the same things over and over again. He knew it was going to pay off. He still kept his head high and by the playoffs he was awesome.

"We've always put a lot of pressure on ourselves. You learn to deal with that. But Mats put us over the top to see how he handled things."

Henrik said: "To see Mats out there, struggling, getting criticized, but still keeping his shifts short - he never played for himself. I think that's been a key for us."


http://sports.yahoo....?urn=nhl,181593



No idea. I haven't talked it him. We all want him back. Of course, I want him back -- he's my centerman. He definitely helped. He brought my game to the next level.



that's the twins and Kes having class. Of course they are going to say things like that. Do you really think he had that big an impact on their game? If he made every player on every team he ever played 20-30 points better the Leafs would have won several cups and set records for goals scored. Why couldn't he translate that skill to Toronto players if that's the case? That's typical MG fluff, as if the twins or Kes wouldn't be teh same players if it wasn't for those 40 games 3 years ago. C'mon, be serious.

#48 tiredatwork

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 03:52 PM

I'm waiting for something decent from you.

Already dismissed your NY cap space argument. If he really wanted to play in NY he could've quite easily.

And then you go on to say things and i'm not sure what you're talking about again. Something about the Rangers offer, which hasn't even been mentioned. Then the typical 'Sundin was a bust' statement. He might not have met expectations, but nobody even knew what the expectations were. Was he expected to lead this team to a cup? Pretty hard for him to not be a bust in that case. But if you expect a ppg player in the playoffs and a guy who obviously impacted the Sedins and Kesler quite positively, then he starts meeting some expectations. Again, it's irrelevant as it's only money. It cost us nothing in terms of players or picks to get him and that money not being spent elsewhere, again, is Aquilini's, not yours.

You're not bring much to the table. Just repeating the same ol' bs doesn't help anyone here. I suggest actually researching the material and then developing better communicative skills. Are we clear? Cheers.


TOML


I don't understand why you say the Rangers don't have to follow the cap?
I also don't understand why you follow every thought with "cheers"? Do you do this in real life too?

#49 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 03:54 PM

So let's take the word of negative detractors instead of Gillis and the players themselves?

I don't think so. If the word of negative detractors had ever meant anything, Kesler would be a talentless, non-scoring grinder the Sedins would've been career 2nd liners who endlessly cycle the puck for no reason.

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#50 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 03:57 PM

I don't understand why you say the Rangers don't have to follow the cap?
I also don't understand why you follow every thought with "cheers"? Do you do this in real life too?

Can you not read? I pointed out the direct cap circumvention taking place by the Rangers having Wade Redden in the minors.

I suggest you say "cheers" too after every thought too. But then you'd have to have some thoughts. Cheers.


TOML

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#51 tiredatwork

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 04:04 PM

Can you not read? I pointed out the direct cap circumvention taking place by the Rangers having Wade Redden in the minors.

I suggest you say "cheers" too after every thought too. But then you'd have to have some thoughts. Cheers.


TOML

"This is just too easy."


If you send a player to another team, it doesn't count against the cap. If Redden was traded it's ok, but sent to the minors it's circumvention? That doesn't make any sense. Those are the rules, black and white really.

You forgot to answer if you do the "cheers" thing in real life.

I'll pass on it thanks, don't want to look like a total d-bag.

#52 tiredatwork

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 04:12 PM

Can you not read? I pointed out the direct cap circumvention taking place by the Rangers having Wade Redden in the minors.

I suggest you say "cheers" too after every thought too. But then you'd have to have some thoughts. Cheers.


TOML

"This is just too easy."


LOL, how about texting. Do you follow up every text with a "cheers"?

#53 Vansicle

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 04:23 PM

that's the twins and Kes having class. Of course they are going to say things like that. Do you really think he had that big an impact on their game? If he made every player on every team he ever played 20-30 points better the Leafs would have won several cups and set records for goals scored. Why couldn't he translate that skill to Toronto players if that's the case? That's typical MG fluff, as if the twins or Kes wouldn't be teh same players if it wasn't for those 40 games 3 years ago. C'mon, be serious.


I've got no issues with MG, but I agree completely with the rest. 100%.

Snake Doctor, on 23 May 2014 - 10:41 AM, said:snapback.png

Miller is not on our list. It's Lack as our #1. There is no reason we would have traded both Schnieder and Luongo if we never intended to give Lack the #1 starting job.  Furthermore, the salary and term Miller is looking for is not in our favor.

 


#54 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 04:24 PM

If you send a player to another team, it doesn't count against the cap. If Redden was traded it's ok, but sent to the minors it's circumvention? That doesn't make any sense. Those are the rules, black and white really.

You forgot to answer if you do the "cheers" thing in real life.

I'll pass on it thanks, don't want to look like a total d-bag.

LOL, how about texting. Do you follow up every text with a "cheers"?

The point was that NYR isn't bound by the cap due to the Redden demotion. I was pretty clear when I mentioned that in relation to them having the ability to sign Sundin at the time. They could've easily done so. Now moving on to your 'more pressing issues...'

What's wrong with saying cheers? Not a whole heckuva lot, when you think about it. Sigs. Avatars. Blah, blah, blah. These have long been part of internet forums. Come to think of it, it's pretty pathetic to focus on things like sigs, avatars etc. instead of the argument at hand. Imo it is worse than focusing on grammar. Regards.


TOML

"When you have nothing, deflect."

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#55 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 04:26 PM

Yeah, that was a quote at the end of TOML. Something else for you to chew on. Important stuff. Cheers.


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#56 Thrill-House

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 04:47 PM

Other than Sundin, what other free agents were available at the time? What other ways could the team have improved that year? Enlighten us.

It was either play with unused cap space or play with Mats Sundin in the lineup.

Did Gillis anticipate Sundin's effect on the Sedins and Kesler? Who knows. But Gillis took a chance and it payed off.
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#57 tiredatwork

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 05:07 PM

The point was that NYR isn't bound by the cap due to the Redden demotion. I was pretty clear when I mentioned that in relation to them having the ability to sign Sundin at the time. They could've easily done so. Now moving on to your 'more pressing issues...'

What's wrong with saying cheers? Not a whole heckuva lot, when you think about it. Sigs. Avatars. Blah, blah, blah. These have long been part of internet forums. Come to think of it, it's pretty pathetic to focus on things like sigs, avatars etc. instead of the argument at hand. Imo it is worse than focusing on grammar. Regards.


TOML

"When you have nothing, deflect."


They are still bound by the cap, we bring players up and down all the time. Each one factors into the cap. They can only spend X amount on their current roster. Just like us, just like everybody else. How come we can demote...... say Bitz and it affects the cap, yet if they want to send down Redden it's cap circumvention? Huh?

#58 TheEhrhoffEffect

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 05:16 PM

Still not sold on Zack Kassian?

Zack "The Franchise" Kassian was a solid pick-up. He'll bring grit to the bottom six for the next 10-15 years.

#59 Templeton Peck

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 05:20 PM

Would you rather him say our players suck?


If he did it like this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARITnC80VhE
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#60 cmccomb

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Posted 15 May 2012 - 05:24 PM

Sundin-before and after he monumentally screwed up he kept spinning it and to this day I hear " Sundin built Kesler and the Twins" .

Yeah,right.Twenty million dollars says Gillis had no idea what he was doing.


Whether or not Sundin had a positive influence on certain players is irrelevant from a GM perspective.

How you people seemingly forget what this franchise was like for decades. The fact we signed Sundin is the point. This franchise had a hard time signing big name free agents for years, the fact that we signed him was a turning point. It's like hey, we have money and we're spending it. Especially at a time when we had cap space to burn. Certain signings since have been hit or miss but the fact is that the players that might consider playing here has risen and it started with that contract, it should help us in the future. You couple that with all of the other things Gills has been doing with the sleep doctors and the team getting better facilities and all of that and you can see the kind of culture we're trying to create here. Building a winner in 5 years is hard, building long term 20 year success is even harder, and you have to start somewhere.




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