(Vancouver Sun Article) Vigneault ‘Didn't Mean What He Said’ On Luongo Trade Request

[miles.p]

It is indeed the players fault for not being honest. Kesler says after the fact he came back too soon. That's his fault. Cody kept saying his back was fine when in fact it wasn't. That's his fault. The doctors actually listen to and rely upon what the patient tells them. Just as the coach relies on what the medical staff and the player tells him. It all starts with the player being honest.

Btw, I didn't call Cody anything in my previous posts. I simply stated the truth. He lied about the condition of his back for seven weeks and the moment he was cut from the team cried, "Oh my back". Which is exactly what happened. In Cody's case though, had he been honest with the medical staff and coaches maybe the real problem would have been discovered much sooner. Instead Cody tells them his back is fine and isn't bothering him at all and thus medical treatment is at an end. The result was a whole year of back problems as he bounced from doctor to doctor in the east. The muscle tear wasn't discovered until he returned to Vancouver after the season was done and he failed to make the team the following year as well. Whose fault is that? It's his own fault.

[TOMapleLaughs]

I imagine CDC being quite unvisitable if this team really were mediocre.

Amazing how some of these guys portray themselves like they actually know what they're talking about. Heard of offseason hindsight? Pretty lame basing arguments using just that.

Nobody likes to lose. You think all is rosy in Pittsburgh after their seemingly dominant Penguins got humiliated game after game against Philly, only to watch a ho-hum Devils team trounce Philly? You think Detroit was gleeful in watching Nashville trounce the Wings and then witness then watch the Coyotes bounce the Predators a couple weeks later? Boston. Chicago. Washington. NYR. etc. There are a lot of losers every season. There are a lot of hurt feelings every offseason. And there are a lot of misguided trolls spewing a lot of garbage every offseason.

Heard it all before. Bring it on. Cheers.

TOML

[miles.p]

I imagine CDC being quite unvisitable if this team really were mediocre.

Amazing how some of these guys portray themselves like they actually know what they're talking about. Heard of offseason hindsight? Pretty lame basing arguments using just that.

Nobody likes to lose. You think all is rosy in Pittsburgh after their seemingly dominant Penguins got humiliated game after game against Philly, only to watch a ho-hum Devils team trounce Philly? You think Detroit was gleeful in watching Nashville trounce the Wings and then witness then watch the Coyotes bounce the Predators a couple weeks later? Boston. Chicago. Washington. NYR. etc. There are a lot of losers every season. There are a lot of hurt feelings every offseason. And there are a lot of misguided trolls spewing a lot of garbage every offseason.

Heard it all before. Bring it on. Cheers.

TOML

[RUPERTKBD]

except Pittsburgh already won a few years back, and got to the stanley cup finals BACK to BACK. It's not mediocrity when you've managed to get to the SCF back to back and have 1 cup win to show for it. How many do the Canucks have? Last I checked it is 0, and last i checked, we've only gotten to SCF once since 94.

Seriously, just stop, just because other Canadian teams can't make the playoffs, doesn't mean we should gloat about our success, because frankly at the end of the day, we are in the same boat as the other canadian teams. Wait as i recall, Calgary and Edmonton too got the SCF this decade, and they had a vastly inferior team than what the Canucks had. Did they get back? NO?

They've been stuck in mediocrity ever sense. At least Edmonton figured out they have to do it right and build from the draft.

Seriously just because the Canucks won president trophies, doesn't mean they are not mediocre. In terms of playoff success, we are in the same boat as San Jose Sharks. "Oh there is always next year". That's what every other team says too, not just Canucks.

I wouldn't be surprised if Canucks don't reach another SCF for another 20+ years.

[oldnews]

Boston GM and Coach = 1 stanley cup. AV and Gillis = 0 stanley cup Chicago GM and Coach = 1 stanley cup. AV and Gillis = 0 stanley cup LA GM and Coach = playing for the stanley cup and is the favorite to win. AV and Gillis = went golfing and fishing respectively after being bounced in the first . Let's face it, this years LA Kings is what the Canucks should have been last year, after failing over and over and over and over and over again with AV as their coach. So your arguments are all null and void. Please go back to sleep. You are embarrassing us.

[TOMapleLaughs]

except Pittsburgh already won a few years back, and got to the stanley cup finals BACK to BACK. It's not mediocrity when you've managed to get to the SCF back to back and have 1 cup win to show for it. How many do the Canucks have? Last I checked it is 0, and last i checked, we've only gotten to SCF once since 94.

Seriously, just stop, just because other Canadian teams can't make the playoffs, doesn't mean we should gloat about our success, because frankly at the end of the day, we are in the same boat as the other canadian teams. Wait as i recall, Calgary and Edmonton too got the SCF this decade, and they had a vastly inferior team than what the Canucks had. Did they get back? NO?

They've been stuck in mediocrity ever sense. At least Edmonton figured out they have to do it right and build from the draft.

Seriously just because the Canucks won president trophies, doesn't mean they are not mediocre. In terms of playoff success, we are in the same boat as San Jose Sharks. "Oh there is always next year". That's what every other team says too, not just Canucks.

I wouldn't be surprised if Canucks don't reach another SCF for another 20+ years.

[NLluvitorleaveit]

[Red Light Racicot]

I don't see how it relates to "management intelligence" as they are not doctors and rely entirely on what they are told.

[ccc44]

how do you know that? unless you are close to him, i highly doubt he has said anything of the sort.

[Baggins]

moron of the year goes to this guy.

The medical staff's is not to listen to the player, but to do the best for the team. With regards to Kesler, Every canucks fan and their momma knows the importance of Kesler in this team. If he doesn't play at 100%, the canuks lose. It's a fact. The doctor's should have monitored him closely instead of rushing him back. How do you know that it could have been the doctor's that cleared him to play? You don't know what's going on behind the scenes. Rushing players back happens in NBA all the time, whose to say it doesn't happen in NHL.

With regards to Hodgson, the guy was benched last year, so he couldn't complain about being in pain. The guy is a warrior, he wanted to play and wanted a spot on the bench, despite AV's hatred of him. We all know that AV likes to play favorites, no matter how bad they stink up the ice rink. If AV likes you you are guaranteed playing time, if he doesn't, well you're his bitch. Hodgson had no choice but to play through the pain, and when AV denied him a spot, he told everyone he was injured. WHICH HE WAS. Hodgson didn't lie.

The fact that you are sticking up to a dumb coach and a clueless GM that doesn't even seem like he had conversation with AV at all shows me the IQ of canuck fans. AV needs to spit the gum out of his mouth and seal his mouth shut. For someone that is regarded as intelligent, he has many mental lapses too often.

We celebrate mediocrity here. I wouldn't blame though, the city hasn't had anything to cheer for. And no a crapped out version of the NFL doesn't count.

[Baggins]

I would argue that AV (perhaps unknowingly) regards himself as an authority on the health of players, and this has had a negative impact on the team more serious then any misdiagnosis from a team doctor.

AV apparently could not tell that Kesler was not 100%, and continued to play him 20+ minutes per game.

Most everyone else seemed to be able to tell quite easily something was wrong.

Going into next season Im very concerned about AVs tendency to either be in denial or seem completely oblivious to serious team issues.

[Ghostdivision]

If you can't cite a source and back up ridiculous and unfounded claims, then it's all just fictitious crap spewing from someone with their own agenda. Period.

'Suggestions' are NOT FACTS no matter how you want to spin them.

[Ghostdivision]

Also with regards to this big secret about lou asking for a trade, the rumor was out there by kypreos, now gm's may not have taken that report seriously, but when gillis calls up other teams about lou, they will get the hint, there not dumb either. Whatever gillis is doing is more from a fan/pr perspective thats all i can guess. I have no idea who actually believes av simply mispoke about such a big subject, unless we believe av gets his news from kypreos.

[Bertuzzi Babe]

You do realize your on a message board, people share opinions, rumors, gossip, ideas, they are not reporters. And if not take it with a grain of salt, but remember this is cdc of all places. Dont get your news from here.

[Red Light Racicot]

I'm quite sure he could tell he wasn't 100%. But then it's pretty rare for any player to be 100% the entire season and even healthy players have slumps. Although Kesler wasn't scoring he was still solid defensively. Thus he wasn't hurting the team. If he feels well enough and the medical staff clears him, then he's well enough to play. Personally I think Kesler was less than honest about how he was really feeling and came back from surgery sooner than he should have because he simply hates sitting on the outside looking in. But then most veterans do. If AV didn't care at all about players health Daniel would have been in for game one. As I've said, medical staff rely a great deal on what players tell them. AV depends a great deal on what the medical staff tells him.

[Canuck Surfer]

Yip, and there were plenty of people who heard what AV said, and that MG was quoted as having spoken to AV who told him it was a mistake.

You keep saying there is no source. So people should go away without a source. Its painstakenly obvious this occurred. The sources you chastised people for not having on this topic are readily available.

And of course if there was no source,you argued people had no right to an opinion.That everything id fixation of peoples ability to dream stuff up. But considering there is a source; what is your opinion on AV appearing to break ranks?

Part of my opinion is AV is speaking out of place, and it has some potential to damage our position. But that, as TOML pointed out in Lou's case, is probably out of proportion. Paraphrasing > if Lou has a no trade clause and is being shopped, of course he is not happy and wants out. It's obvious because he can veto the trade.

The cruxt of my opinion,is that AV causing waves with the media over Lou, over suggesting Kesler's performance not being injury related and over playing style suggests a lack of discipline in the ranks. It means that office politics is taking over, evidenced by Kesler's agent retorting. The same could be argued that existed at the top. MG called out Hodgson. When salvo's were getting lobbied every direction, its not surprising the team did not perform as well. Poor performances are reflected in unhappy families and infighting?

In alternate posts in other threads, you will find me offering the opinion that the solution lies in resuming productive improvement. In this thread, I commented that MG took a good first step by simply addressing and putting some context and control over this situation by addressing it with AV. And stating publicly, Kesler's output did suffer due to injury but the also expect him to play without excuses, and get better. He's taking back control, rather than feeding the politics. With control back, MG can make moves and improvements that will regain confidence.

People, fans and players, would get look forward to the season more enthusiastically if MG announced another move like acquiring Hamhuis. If you get things moving in the right direction, infighting will dissipate.

Of course I have no source to prove people would get excited over this?

Godwinning the thread now, Canuck Surfer??

But just to play along, there are/were plenty of first-hand accounts from the survivors of the Holocaust, the people who liberated the camps and movie footage of what happened........straight from the horse's mouth, as it were.

But nice try anyway.......

[nuck nit]

"As far as concussions go they are all but impossible to diagnose as doctors depend entirely on what the patient tells them." Baggins

Baggins,it is clear you know squat about concussions so please spare us from your vast knowledge base on the subject.

[Banned01]

Source?

[Banned01]

Banned

More laughable stuff really. Truth is you don't know what happened.

Thanks for weighing in on yet another matter where you don't know what you are talking about. The Vigneault interview was not a month ago. Your silly little list speculating about what has transpired is fictional - as usual. AV did the french language interview a few days ago. The quote where he was quoted as saying Luongo wants out started with "Mais si" - "but if Luongo wants out..." Regardless, if you think the Canucks hand is going to be forced to move Schneider, you are deluded.

Your attempts to suggest that no one would want Luongo are also wishful thinking from a bitter Flames fan - the process your silly list speculates about has not even begun. The Canucks are in a clear position of strength regardless, and retaining the tandem may be what is best for the Vancouver Canucks. If Steve Yzerman wants to quell rumours that Luongo might go to Tampa by saying that he is looking for a younger goaltender, so be it. The Canucks don't need to move Luongo to Tampa, plain and simple.

As for the irony that you consider a $5.3 million cap hit for a goaltender like Luongo not to be cap friendly just reinforces what all your denial regarding the mismanaged Flames indicates - that you don't understand the salary cap, or what a terrilbe cap hit looks like. I understand your denial though - if the Canucks were crippled by ridiculous cap hits like Bouwmeester, Cammalleri, Stajan...

[thehamburglar]

Don't think Luongo's going.