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Jonathan Canuck

Insider Trading on Roberto Luongo

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Guest Dasein

At trade deadline Bob Mackenzie was saying Canucks are getting significant offers for Schneider

/topic/321349-report-tsn-canucks-getting-significant-offers-for-schneider/">http://forum.canucks...-for-schneider/

Teams aren't that interested in Luongo

/topic/330279-bob-mckenzie-not-many-teams-showing-interest-in-luongo/">http://forum.canucks...rest-in-luongo/

Go look through BMacs twitter for the Luongo Schneider value and teams interest in them, I think he said it on the team1040 too. The reason why SY is after Bernier over Luongo is because of age, SY has said he wants a goalie to grow with Stamkos and wants a younger goalie who could become a star. SY said he'd take a 20 year old Luongo

“Obviously I’d love to have a 20-year-old [Roberto]or Martin Brodeur and not worry about goaltending for the next 20 years, but that’s hard to do," Yzerman said on 620 WDAE.

http://www.theglobea...article2442732/

the only one who is talking out of their ass is you, I'm just being realistic, it's simple Schneider holds more value due to age, contract not being so huge and taking him into his 40's and his play which stats and just watching him play he's showing he's the better goalie, he took the starter role from Luongo at the start of the season and again at the end in the playoffs. Luongo is still a great goalie and I think will be for many more years but Schneider is better and because of age a safer option. What blows my mind is your inability to put this together.

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At trade deadline: This is when Luongo was the clear #1 on this team. I don't doubt he had significant offers, but his trade value was definitely not higher than Luongo's. The issue at hand here isn't Schneider's trade value - I'm sure we can get some significant piece(s) for him. The issue is who has a higher trade value - Luongo or Schneider. At the deadline, Luongo clearly would have had a higher trade value if available.

Teams aren't interested in Luongo: Again, teams have to pay a premium for a proven starter like Luongo. You go after the less expensive options and hope that they can get you through the year and into the playoffs. Heck, teams have more interest in Vokoun, who is older and not as good as Luongo, than Luongo right now - that's because he comes cheap and is a short fix. Or teams try for Bernier, who is cheap because he's unproven and take the risk like Colorado did with Varlamov.

Truth is, Luongo is the most expensive goaltender on the market, and rightfully so - he is the most proven commodity and will get you the results. It's premature to say that there is no interest in Luongo a month prior to free agency and a few weeks before the draft during the Stanley Cup Final.

Steve Yzerman: Yzerman can't afford Luongo - if Luongo could be had at the price that Bernier could be had, then there is no way Yzerman would turn down Roberto. Luongo obviously has a higher trade value than Bernier. Age isn't the only factor - it's the pieces you need to give up the player, and you clearly have to give up more for Luongo than Bernier.

Age is the deciding factor definitely - if both players are proven. But the fact of the matter here is, Schneider has never played a full NHL season as a starter, and Luongo has many years and is good for at least 4-5 more years. You need to understand that. If Schneider played 1 full season as the starter and put up the numbers he did this year, no doubt Schneider's value would trump Luongo's. But fact of the matter is, Schneider doesn't have that under his belt.

And good young goaltenders like Schneider are abundant these days - Schneider, Quick, Price Rask, Varlamov, Bernier, Holtby, Pavelec, Lindback, Markstrom, Dubnyk etc - All under the age of 26. A few are already starters, some are backups waiting to be starters. You don't think a team can draft and develop a goaltender to replace Luongo in 4-5 years when he's out of prime and ready to retire? Heck, we have Eddie Lack and Joe Cannata in the AHL who could replace Luongo 4-5 years down the road if we trade Schneider.

But guys like Luongo - who have been starters for a decade and consistently put his team into the playoffs and put up 30+ wins in the latter half - these guys don't come around often. And when they do, teams need to pay a premium because they know exactly what they are getting back in a trade. If there are more teams interested in Schneider, it's not just because he's younger, but also because he can be had for cheaper because he is unproven.

And you still haven't provided me with a quote that says "Schneider's value >>> Luongo's value". Stop beating around the bush with CDC threads that don't actually address the issue.

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Guest Dasein

Your too far gone and have proven to me you have no clue what your talking about when it comes to player values, instead of going back and forth with this stupidity that your very very very wrong about I'll save myself a lot of time and just ignore this topic with you as your too emotionally invested into Luongo that you can't see straight. Also, those CDC threads had links to audio clips and other board members who heard BMac talking about Luongo and Schneider, but again your blind to the truth and that's fine but your very wrong.

Like I said Luongo has some value many posters of other teams think they can get him for a cap dumb and well their just as wrong as you are when it comes to Luongo/Schneider value, but Luongo will not return Gardiner and the 5th overall, maybe Burke will give up the 5th overall(very unlikely imho) but I honestly think he needs to package that pick for a 1st line centre or a potential 1st line centre further along in his development to a team that needs a high end D man prospect, like I said I'd be happy with Schenn and Ashton both bring size, grit, toughness, youth and skill to the team. I honestly think Canucks need to build their farm and future as a hard hitting, gritty team(like the Bruins) that type of team always seems to be a style that wins cups.

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I honestly don't see either Toronto or Tampa that will end up getting Luongo, Yzerman is probably going to go after a younger guy like he said and Burke will lowball. It will end up being a team that no one thought would be interested.

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I'm not emotionally attached to Luongo - you are the one who is blinded by your penchant for new shiny toys such as Schneider. I am completely fine with having Schneider as the starting goaltender next season as I think he can handle it. But fact of the matter is, as an unproven starter, he has only a slight increase in value over the 2nd tier unproven starters like Bernier. His value is not as much as Luongo is as a proven starter.

You take your arguments all over the place and not really stick to the point which is Luongo's trade value vs Schneider's trade value. And I've given you clear reasons why Luongo has a higher value - 4-5 years left in him of excellent goaltending, will retire once out of prime thus cap hit and contract not a concern, gives team room to draft and grow a young goaltender like Schneider in the meanwhile to replace when he is done in 5 years. Schneider, though younger, is not proven - hence cheaper. He comes at a lower asking price because he is unproven.

You claim Schneider has a high value because he's younger but neglect the fact that he has no experience as a starter - he could be the next Toskala, Bryzgalov, and all those backups who left good teams to be starters and bust. Because there is that bust possibility (though it think that is minimal in Schneider), his value is lower than Luongo's. You also claim that all the analysts support your view, but you have provided no evidence of such cases. It's hard to take you seriously when you take the argument all over the board and not back your words up by actually providing analysts who you say have supported your view.

I'm not gonna bother with this anymore because you clearly can't even stay on topic of the argument. Any way you cut it, Luongo as a proven starter has more trade value than Schneider as an unproven goaltender.

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I honestly don't see either Toronto or Tampa that will end up getting Luongo, Yzerman is probably going to go after a younger guy like he said and Burke will lowball. It will end up being a team that no one thought would be interested.

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I'm not gonna bother with this anymore because you clearly can't even stay on topic of the argument. Any way you cut it, Luongo as a proven starter has more trade value than Schneider as an unproven goaltender.

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Perhaps you should agree to disagree. Both are valid arguments.........the more i look at this pending trade the more i believe that they both have pretty even values due to age, cost etc.

Luongo will instantly make the Leafs or Tampa cup contenders. He IS the Premier goaltender available his contract is decent value but there is significant long term risk with 10 yrs remaining and he has shown a degree of inconsistency. Also he needs to approve of his destination limiting suitors.

Schneider as amazing as he has been........still needs to show a greater body of work to be considered a top starter in the NHL ( I have no doubt he will) But hence his risk lies in his unproven status. E.g Crawford of the Hawks looked amazing during a small sample size and this past season the immortal Ray Emery was at times there starter.

Dasein.....Yzerman like Gillis is posturing when he says he's not that interested in Luongo. Just as Gillis says he is prepared to keep both goalies. It's negotiating 101. St.Louis, Malone, Lecavalier, Brewer are not getting any younger and SY would be an idiot to throw away chances at the cup by going with Bernier, Vokoun and the rest of the B team keepers available.

A.Brah.........BMac is hardly an nhl expert or insider and BobMckenzie is a big leaf homer so you have to take what he says with a grain of salt as well. I do like your Lou for Schenn and Ashton trade.

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Guest Dasein

All the hockey insiders like BMac are all saying teams have more interest in Schneider than Luongo and that if Canucks trade Schneider over Luongo that the return will be higher, your very wrong on this topic and people who are regarded as respectable insiders are the ones saying this, I'll take their word over a fan who is too emotionally attached to Luongo and opinion is very wrong and against what insiders are saying. I understand we all have our own opinions and that's fine but my opinion is coming from hearing what hockey insiders are saying vs my personally bias and unknowledgeable guess, like what your claiming.

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So find me a damn quote - if ALL the hockey insiders are saying this. Until then, yours is just as much "my personal bias" as you claim mine to be.

Not true. Luongo is 33 which means he still has 4-5 years at least left in him. Brodeur is too close to retiring and is not a good example. And I did say IF Schneider had just even ONE season as a starter and put up the numbers he did, he would have more value than Luongo because he's younger. If you are as proven as the next guy, age factors in.

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Not true. Luongo is 33 which means he still has 4-5 years at least left in him. Brodeur is too close to retiring and is not a good example. And I did say IF Schneider had just even ONE season as a starter and put up the numbers he did, he would have more value than Luongo because he's younger. If you are as proven as the next guy, age factors in.

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