awalk Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 LOL drafting BIG tough young players has ALWAYS been a smart move in the NHL. People will complain either way. People complained like hell when Gillis drafted two small centermen two years in a row. Then they complained that we didn't (and still don't) have a heavyweight fighter in the lineup. Then Byron Bitz played a couple of games and was heralded. Now people are actually complaining about drafting big players? Would anyone here actually MIND seeing the Canucks draft the next Lucic, or Byfuglien, or hell Getzlaf? You cannot teach size. Skill you can teach, work on, and improve. Size is a gift. People also complain about drafting prospects that take too long to make the NHL, often touting prospects as "busts" if they aren't in the NHL within the first two years of being drafted. Bigger players are almost always closer to being NHL ready than smaller players, because they can handle the physicality sooner. If groomed properly, these big players can become incredibly effective. All that being said, it's quite clear that someone will always find something to b*tch about. I am just shocked that it's actually about drafting big strong Canadian kids. Isn't that what we Canucks fans have been asking for, for years? Or should we try to emulate the Montreal Canadians last two decades... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skyfall Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 The problem is coaching. Both skilled players and big players aren't being maximized in Vancouver by the coaching staff which is why there is this argument. Most players that aren't part of the core that AV grew up with he has a hard time gettin them to be effective. If skilled players can be tough and big players can utilize their skill they should both be effective. Instead both types fail to improve under AV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surtur Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 last two SC winners had Solid D' , Big tough forwards, but that is not why they Won.... They both had Goalies that went on an absolutely insane run. that is all. (ref Bias didn't help) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANUCKLELION Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 Gritty wingers and big hitters rule this league. The "twerps" who do know how to hit and duck. Brown, Keith, Lucic, Edler, Getzlaf, Chara, Phanuef type players rule this league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM24 Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 Two guys are under 5 feet? I guess it would be pretty cool to have a top scoring midget Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juwanski Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 The problem is coaching. Both skilled players and big players aren't being maximized in Vancouver by the coaching staff which is why there is this argument. Most players that aren't part of the core that AV grew up with he has a hard time gettin them to be effective. If skilled players can be tough and big players can utilize their skill they should both be effective. Instead both types fail to improve under AV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanIsleNuckFan Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 Always should take the best players available and then trade as necessary. (Kassian trade sucks tho). Big guys with little talent wont crack the top 6 unless were crape. You can't teach skill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kassassin Train Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 Some 'evidence' also backing up that theory is the Kassian trade. The trade was a mainly based on that series loss and the media only added fuel to that fire by comparing him to Lucic. If he wanted a big power forward type player then he could have gone with Beach in the first place as it was debated around here at the time and probably among the staff. I can name off several players not resembling a Lucic that would have been viable options in return for Cody. Instead, MG went with the Lucic type player despite the fact he is anything but Lucic so far (size and physicality, at times, being about the only thing they have in common) I'm not saying this is the case by any means, but its something to also think about if you believe the OP's theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tortorella's Rant Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 LOL drafting BIG tough young players has ALWAYS been a smart move in the NHL. People will complain either way. People complained like hell when Gillis drafted two small centermen two years in a row. Then they complained that we didn't (and still don't) have a heavyweight fighter in the lineup. Then Byron Bitz played a couple of games and was heralded. Now people are actually complaining about drafting big players? Would anyone here actually MIND seeing the Canucks draft the next Lucic, or Byfuglien, or hell Getzlaf? You cannot teach size. Skill you can teach, work on, and improve. Size is a gift. People also complain about drafting prospects that take too long to make the NHL, often touting prospects as "busts" if they aren't in the NHL within the first two years of being drafted. Bigger players are almost always closer to being NHL ready than smaller players, because they can handle the physicality sooner. If groomed properly, these big players can become incredibly effective. All that being said, it's quite clear that someone will always find something to b*tch about. I am just shocked that it's actually about drafting big strong Canadian kids. Isn't that what we Canucks fans have been asking for, for years? Or should we try to emulate the Montreal Canadians last two decades... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tortorella's Rant Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 Another terrible post by you. Go for Beach?! What the hell has he done for Chicago?! Has he even madew the teams?! And name those options that you could think of been better than Kassian. Enlighten me because I guarantee you the player you are about to name are unavailable.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpt Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 Always should take the best players available and then trade as necessary. (Kassian trade sucks tho). Big guys with little talent wont crack the top 6 unless were crape. You can't teach skill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpt Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 People are jumping the gun there but they also have the right to be concerned, especially with Gillis going for a couple overaged players this time. Overaged players in the draft were passed on by all 30 teams for a reason. How many Gillis' draft picks does are there playing for this team right now? That's a big fat zero. I'll go out on a limb and say that's currently the most pathetic track record going over the last four seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skyfall Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 Tores had a good year here. Bernier sucked, Rypien was wicked hitting,actually the player that know how to hit have no issues on our team. If this is not the case please give me an example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpt Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 The problem is coaching. Both skilled players and big players aren't being maximized in Vancouver by the coaching staff which is why there is this argument. Most players that aren't part of the core that AV grew up with he has a hard time gettin them to be effective. If skilled players can be tough and big players can utilize their skill they should both be effective. Instead both types fail to improve under AV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpt Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 There aren't many grinders who are scoring big goals in the way like LA did. People also look at behind having size but actually tiny weasel Marchand used his speed to beat the d to score many scores. I consider that success. I don't consider Higgins, Lapierre, malhotra, Kassian, etc playin like typical grinders who didn't really add any advantage over the opposition success. Also those type of players are supposed to be grinders who can be easily picked up. Why draft them? Size with skill makes sense but size for the sake of size doesn't. But my whole point is that coaching, whether the lineup is big but unskilled or skilled but not big, will help dictate the effectiveness of the team. If not then it doesn't matter who you draft... Their talents an the teams cup Chances will be squandered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnsey Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 i'm all for adding toughness, but we need have skill too. If Gillis can add both of those things then we'll be all set. Don't know too much about the new draft selections we made, but if they are big guys with potential skill then that is the right move. It's hard to make a perfect team, need to give up some key areas to fix the broken ones :S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GradinToSmyl Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 Another terrible post by you. Go for Beach?! What the hell has he done for Chicago?! Has he even madew the teams?! And name those options that you could think of been better than Kassian. Enlighten me because I guarantee you the player you are about to name are unavailable.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Murray Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 Guys, Gillis needs to stop implementing the 'Detroit' model. Sure, they went to the Finals twice in a row, but now teams like Boston and New York (Rangers) are taking over, and we need to follow their style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awalk Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 People are jumping the gun there but they also have the right to be concerned, especially with Gillis going for a couple overaged players this time. Overaged players in the draft were passed on by all 30 teams for a reason. How many Gillis' draft picks does are there playing for this team right now? That's a big fat zero. I'll go out on a limb and say that's currently the most pathetic track record going over the last four seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tortorella's Rant Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 Detriot doesn't have any picks in the past 4 seasons playing either, and teams consider Detriot the best franchise in the league. Considering MG has only drafted one player higher than 22nd in his career, you can't blame him for those players not being ready in less than 3 years. When you are consistently drafting in the 20s those players are going to take longer to develop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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