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What Gillis wants vs. what Tallon wants to give


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Poll: What Gillis wants vs. what Tallon wants to give (209 member(s) have cast votes)

Which of these young talented players would you most want to come back in a deal for lu ( huberdeau, gudbranson probably not gonna happen )

  1. Quinton Howden (30 votes [14.42%])

    Percentage of vote: 14.42%

  2. Nick Bjugstad (122 votes [58.65%])

    Percentage of vote: 58.65%

  3. Dmitry Kulikov (56 votes [26.92%])

    Percentage of vote: 26.92%

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#31 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:06 PM

Potentially, if Raymond goes back to his 25 goal form. However you are missing a big part of it. It is Raymond's righthat would have to be traded as Raymond is currently a pending RFA, so Mattias >>>>> Raymond's rights


Well still when someone is an RFA it isn't like there is a huge difference in the value.


Especially with someone like Raymond, because he has to play there, no one will offer him an offer sheet, so he has to play there, and we have filed to cut down his salary which would make him slightly more appealing (not that he is very).

That's only with UFA's and either way you could argue Raymond is better, he is just an offensive player who is struggling, much like Higgins was when we picked him up. But Raymond's value now is probably a bit more than Higgins was then.

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#32 CityinFlames

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:07 PM

I don't really see a trade happening with Florida, Tallon is stubborn and doesn't want to give in to the demands of Gillis. I do wish though that Kulikov, Matthias , and Theodore would be involved and for Vancouver I could see Roberto, Malhotra and a second draft pick being shipped off to Florida.

#33 shazzam

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:17 PM

I don't really see a trade happening with Florida, Tallon is stubborn and doesn't want to give in to the demands of Gillis. I do wish though that Kulikov, Matthias , and Theodore would be involved and for Vancouver I could see Roberto, Malhotra and a second draft pick being shipped off to Florida.


and I don't think Tallon needs to. Their goaltending situation is not all that bad. Definitely not worth giving up high end prospects to upgrade.

#34 DarthNinja

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:17 PM

I am Tallon.


Take your Tallons back to South Beach :P

"Have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens & the earth were joined together as one united piece, then We (Allah) parted them? And We have made from water every living thing. Will they not then believe?" (Qur'an 21:30)

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#35 smithers joe

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:17 PM

hopefully florida owners can push tallon to compromise a little more on his offer...and maybe gillis will relax what he is demanding in return...florida wants him, canucks want to trade him and lu wants to go to florida....they both want to be the winners in the trade.....they should check their ego's at the door....gillis wants a player(s) that can make the canucks better this year....tallon doesn't want to give up any top prospects, plus he wants gillis to take cap back....florida owners have said, that taking lu contract wouldn't be a problem....supposedly, the owners really want lu....
it is hard to believe that the two sides can't come to a suitable deal...

#36 Ghostsof1915

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:19 PM

I am Tallon.


If you're Tallon, then I am the LAW!


GO CANUCKS GO!
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#37 Kazmanian Devil

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:20 PM

How? I know Raymond in this market has been useless for the past 2 season, we can excuse 1 cause of the injury.

But he did score 25 Goals, I dont think he fits here anymore but in Florida I could see him scoring 20 atleast. he's like Higgins was when we picked him up, he had just lost his way. Now look at him, that's the comparison I use for Raymond's situation.

and what makes Mattias so valuable? He's probably equivalent of Lappierre here. But Lappierre is probably better/more valuable.


Raymond is a risky acquisition, since he's an RFA, and has failed to do anything significant for the past 2 seasons. Sure, Raymond could score 20 again, but I'm not very convinced. Matthias is a solid third liner who plays a similar style to Lapierre (except less of a pest), and still has room to grow. I'd rather keep the defensively sound, occasionally scoring third liner than the possible one-hit wonder who appears to have lost his offensive instinct.

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#38 Kazmanian Devil

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:22 PM

Also, who cares.


Incorrect punctuation. You're asking a question, so a question mark should be used.

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#39 DarthNinja

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:24 PM

Scottie Upcrap
At 3.5 million dollars for the next four years, no f in way. He is a career plug who had half a good year.


I wouldn't go that far but your overall point is valid.

He has put up some good numbers in more than just a half-year, however he has only played one full 82-game season in the NHL and last year he played only 26 games.

And no, the Canucks are certainly not expected to take on a player who was offered an inflated contract by Tallon just so that his team could make the salary floor.

"Have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens & the earth were joined together as one united piece, then We (Allah) parted them? And We have made from water every living thing. Will they not then believe?" (Qur'an 21:30)

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"Some even believe we are part of a secret cabal working against the best interests of the United States, characterizing my family and me as 'internationalists' and of conspiring with others around the world to build a more integrated global political and economic structure--one world, if you will. If that's the charge, I stand guilty, and I am proud of it.” (David Rockefeller)


#40 CityinFlames

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:25 PM

If you're Tallon, then I am the LAW!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miVoe7U6Lx4


Edited by CityinFlames, 08 July 2012 - 04:25 PM.


#41 Cody9

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:26 PM

GET Quinton Howden for sure and then in a few years get his brother who will be twice the Player Quinton is!

#42 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:28 PM

Raymond is a risky acquisition, since he's an RFA, and has failed to do anything significant for the past 2 seasons. Sure, Raymond could score 20 again, but I'm not very convinced. Matthias is a solid third liner who plays a similar style to Lapierre (except less of a pest), and still has room to grow. I'd rather keep the defensively sound, occasionally scoring third liner than the possible one-hit wonder who appears to have lost his offensive instinct.


You make good points, he's risky no doubt. And he hasn't done much.

But I disgaree about Raymond losing his offensive instincts (and I am a huge Raymond hater) You sort of right but He still has the hands, and he actually has good hands, he has the offensive IQ he just does stupid stuff or atleast it seems stupid, but his style of play and skillset could valuable, he just needs the right fit, and we don't have that fit for him, but he could maybe fidn it on your team, just put him with Weiss and he should be good.

And Mattias could be deemed as expendable, since you guys have some young players expected to make the jump soon, like Huberbeau, Bjugstad, Howden. We might get one of either Bjugstad or Howden but still Huberbeau might make the just aswell as the one we don't get and if one or both do you will need spots for them.

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#43 Ṣpiderman

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:33 PM

There is nothing in Florida worth having. We have a much better team and much better prospects so either keep luongo or send him somewhere where thay have something worth trading for.


Do you even watch hockey?

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#44 Dion Phaneuf

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:34 PM

I wouldn't mind a package of Theodore, Skille, and a 1st rounder for just Luongo.

* I'd expect this to be the package with maybe more if were giving something more. Sort of mirrors the Luongo trade in '06.


Edited by A1 CANUCK, 08 July 2012 - 04:36 PM.

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#45 Jägermeister

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:34 PM

Add in one more thing coming to us, this is the way I see that

Raymond = Mattias
Luongo > Theodore + Howden

You could even argue Raymond is worth more than Mattias.


But that wasn't my proposal. I proposed Bjugstad, not Howden.
Bjugstad has a fairly higher value than Howden does.
And at best Raymond and Matthias are equal. I would say Matthias is more valuable than Raymond, especially when considering the needs the Canucks have.

Edited by Jagermeister, 08 July 2012 - 04:34 PM.

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#46 Southpop45

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 04:57 PM

Panthers fan here. You're not getting Kulikov (Well, you shouldn't be). And we do not want Raymond or Ballard.



You're funny.



You are also funny.


i would like to hear your take on these deals:

theodore, bjugstad, versteeg

or

theodore, bjugstad, and upshall

Edited by Southpop45, 08 July 2012 - 04:58 PM.


#47 K_9

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 05:05 PM

this is just pure speculation from a fans point of view

What Gillis wants:

Jose Theodore - vetran backup for schneider

Kris Versteeg - top six forward to play on kes' other side

Nick Bjugstad/Dmitry Kulikov/Quinton Howden - guys with big potential

What Tallon wants to give:

Jose Theodore - make room for lu

Scottie Upshall - salary dump

Jack Skille - spare part that can be let go


somewhere in there is a comprimise that Tallon and Gillis can reach. my hope is that Bjugstad is one of the pieces coming back. what do you guys think?

note: did not include gudbranson or huberdeau because im trying to be realistic and i think those two are a no go with Tallon.


I dont think Gudbranson is completely out of the question.

TO VANCOUVER:

-Erik Gudbranson (6'5" 210 lbs, 20 years old and mean as hell)
-Jack Skille (6'1" 217 lbs, 25 yo. Versatile winger that can score and isn't afraid to throw the body)
-Scott Clemmensen (34 yo veteran would be an excellent backup to Cory, Also gives FLD a bit more incentive to do the trade in being able to keep their starting goalie last year as a back up, giving them insurance in net)

TO FLORIDA:

-Roberto Luongo (Proven all-star goalie, essentially guarantees FLD a playoff spot next season)
-Rights to Mason Raymond (Swapping Skille for MAY RAY gives VAN a grittier winger while not cutting down on team speed or scoring while giving FLD more team speed and a potential 20 goal 40 point winger if put in the right situation)
-1st round pick (gives FLD the chance to possibly replace Gudbranson in the first round this coming draft)
-Yann Sauve (Probably going to mature into a solid 3rd pairing Dman in the coming years with good PK skills and grit)
-Anton Rodin (Has good potential, could mature into a speedy 2nd liner with a good shot similar to MAY RAY)

I think this is a fair deal for both clubs. Florida gets; a proven all-star starting goalie for a future all-star d-man. A speedy winger who could rejuvenate his career as well as a good offensive prospect in Anton Rodin for a useful and versatile but expendable winger in Skille, and essentially a 1st rounder and a good blue line prospect in Yann Sauve for their back-up from last season.

What Vancouver gets is clear, Gudbranson who is looking like the next Chris Pronger at this point - look at his fights on hockeyfights.com, he's a mean mother f*cker. Aswell as a bigger tougher winger for the 3rd/4th lines than Raymond and a back-up for Corey. I think Tallon could get behind this deal with maybe a little tinkering.
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#48 Onions

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 05:07 PM

Incorrect punctuation. You're asking a question, so a question mark should be used.


Never the less, you avoided answering the question.
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#49 22sedins33

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 05:10 PM

If we were able to get Kulikov I'd be both extremely pleased and surprised. I think with him we'd have one of the scariest defense groups in the NHL.
The day has only just begun and already your mind has snapped like a dry and brittle twig...

#50 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 05:11 PM

But that wasn't my proposal. I proposed Bjugstad, not Howden.
Bjugstad has a fairly higher value than Howden does.
And at best Raymond and Matthias are equal. I would say Matthias is more valuable than Raymond, especially when considering the needs the Canucks have.


Oh you changed it? I would take Howden over Bjugstad, but I'm kinda Biased I like Howden.

He did score 40 goals this year and like the speed he brings but Bjugstad might be better.

And I think Raymond is more valuable imo, not alot but I bit. But sometimes I dont see the full value in those 3rd and 4th line guys like Mattias so this could be the case.

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#51 Vancity_77

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 05:13 PM

Panthers fan here. You're not getting Kulikov (Well, you shouldn't be). And we do not want Raymond or Ballard.



You're funny.



You are also funny.


Funny thing is We (Canucks) are in the drivers seat for this trade not you guys (Florida). You will give up what we want for Lou.


p.s.
Im sick of makin trades with Florida. I hope a trade never happens with them
We are our own worst enemy!

#52 K_9

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 05:15 PM

Panthers fan here. You're not getting Kulikov (Well, you shouldn't be). And we do not want Raymond or Ballard.



You're funny.



You are also funny.


No one (including Tallon and Gillis) cares what you have to say so why should we care who you "want"? its a hockey deal and the GM's have a million times more information on players than either you or I do and could have a very different opinion on someone like Raymond than you think. Why don't you stick to the Florida message board.
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#53 Tortorella's Rant

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 05:15 PM

Add in one more thing coming to us, this is the way I see that

Raymond = Mattias
Luongo > Theodore + Howden

You could even argue Raymond is worth more than Mattias.


Raymond isn't working out here anymore.
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#54 AnInconvenienceBrah

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 05:17 PM

I really hope Gillis is getting a 2013 1st with Luongo, this draft is being compared to the 03!!.

#55 Tortorella's Rant

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 05:20 PM

I dont think Gudbranson is completely out of the question.

TO VANCOUVER:

-Erik Gudbranson (6'5" 210 lbs, 20 years old and mean as hell)
-Jack Skille (6'1" 217 lbs, 25 yo. Versatile winger that can score and isn't afraid to throw the body)
-Scott Clemmensen (34 yo veteran would be an excellent backup to Cory, Also gives FLD a bit more incentive to do the trade in being able to keep their starting goalie last year as a back up, giving them insurance in net)

TO FLORIDA:

-Roberto Luongo (Proven all-star goalie, essentially guarantees FLD a playoff spot next season)
-Rights to Mason Raymond (Swapping Skille for MAY RAY gives VAN a grittier winger while not cutting down on team speed or scoring while giving FLD more team speed and a potential 20 goal 40 point winger if put in the right situation)
-1st round pick (gives FLD the chance to possibly replace Gudbranson in the first round this coming draft)
-Yann Sauve (Probably going to mature into a solid 3rd pairing Dman in the coming years with good PK skills and grit)
-Anton Rodin (Has good potential, could mature into a speedy 2nd liner with a good shot similar to MAY RAY)

I think this is a fair deal for both clubs. Florida gets; a proven all-star starting goalie for a future all-star d-man. A speedy winger who could rejuvenate his career as well as a good offensive prospect in Anton Rodin for a useful and versatile but expendable winger in Skille, and essentially a 1st rounder and a good blue line prospect in Yann Sauve for their back-up from last season.

What Vancouver gets is clear, Gudbranson who is looking like the next Chris Pronger at this point - look at his fights on hockeyfights.com, he's a mean mother f*cker. Aswell as a bigger tougher winger for the 3rd/4th lines than Raymond and a back-up for Corey. I think Tallon could get behind this deal with maybe a little tinkering.


So, basically, Luongo for Gudbranson, Raymond for Skille and two prospects and a first rounder for a back up?
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#56 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 05:23 PM

I dont think Gudbranson is completely out of the question.


Yeah he is, unless we overpay rediculously like in your proposal.

But seriously it was an overpayment...

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#57 jagori78

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 05:23 PM

I would feel glad for Raymond if he got a chance in Florida. I can see why it's a great attraction. Lets face it, if you were a young man, multi-millionaire; Miami can be a good place. Is it any wonder Luongo and his family seem to be leaning towards Florida as opposed to Toronto? Both off and on the ice, it's a no brainer to me.

Anyway back to my point, I think Florida could market Raymond to the fan base in Miami if you get what I'm saying, the same way Bure was. Lol.

#58 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 05:23 PM

Raymond isn't working out here anymore.


Yeah that's why he is in the deal. He goes there and hopefully (for his sake) he gets his game back.

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#59 DeltaSwede

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 05:23 PM

To Vancouver:
Scott Clemmensen
Marcel Goc
2013 1st Round Pick

To Florida:
Roberto Luongo

Not the best possible return but it is what the Canucks can get for Roberto at this point. There are other goalies on the market that could be had for a smaller prize and could possibly offer the same service.

Would I be happy. I would be happy for Roberto and pleased with the return even though we could get more. Goc would fit well into our top 9.

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#60 Trebreh

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 05:26 PM

Someone correct me if im wrong, but isnt Upshall the guy who hates Kesler?? Didnt he make some comment about how much he hates him when we was still with the Flyers??

Also, Eff Upshall or Versteeg (still hate him)

I say get one of their top prospects (Gudbranson,Huberdeau,Bjugstad) then go hard after Doan tommorow... call Liden, Bure Gregor Robertson, Rick Hansen, Steve Nash, Pamela Anderson to convince him, i dont care, just get him here! lol




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