zaibatsu, on 17 July 2012 - 11:28 AM, said:
Your post is a non starter. It is negative, biased and non provable. Riddled with personal attacks against people of faith.
No, no, no.
You realize the argument put forth for a deity and certainly many other assertions for particularly the Christian and Muslim religions are tangible ones right? Their deity is not in the abstract any less than Santa Clause or the Easter Bunny or Greek/Roman Mythological gods.. so what purpose you have comparing to the non-abstract tangible evidence offered up by religious texts to the abstract concept of a deity outside of these religions.. I have no idea, but I can say you are way lost and should have stuck with not caring. According to your logic if there was ever offered up any evidence or proof you'd stick to "I don't know", that's not agnosticism, that's wilful ignorance.
My point is Atheists cannot survive without the mudslinging of negative attacks. You are the 20th guy to prove this. An agnostic would find no need to put anyone down or JUDGE anyone.
Is this an argument you would put up in court as 'evidence' in your 'judgement' ?
Judge : lets hear your case against God
Cause its like believing in the easter bunny
'zaibatsu' : we got non abstract tangible evidence
: wow. After 5,000 years and billions trying to end this debate you finally have concrete evidence. Show me
zaibatsu : Well there technically isnt any evidence God doesnt exist but I damn well know he doesnt !!!!!
'zaibatsu' : Here are the secular 'sources' based entirely on the non spiritual.
: these are all biased from a specific secular point of view. Its not 'evidence' . Evidence needs to be objective of any point of view.
'zaibatsu' Oh come on Judge............those clowns should stick to not knowing..........they are all WILLFULLY IGNORANT.
Judge: How does one prove that? Calling people names proves nothing. Anyways.......how about a theist stating the case.
Drybone: I believe God exists.
Judge : How do you know? this debate has been raging for 5000 years
drybone: We believe from spiritual experiences there is a presence of a higher power.
Judge : Cant that be discarded as believing what you want to believe?
Drybone : Of course, but we believe it goes far deeper than that, and we physically feel better, emotionally feel better and respect the world around us better.
Judge: Nothing wrong with that if it makes you happy. But Religion has its bad apples
Drybone : Everyone has bad Apples. However, believing in god has little to do with the Dogma of religion. Its spiritual, not ritualistic. Many people believe in God , called Theist. but have nothing to do with organized religion in the slightest. Thats an optional choice.
Judge : But everything can become Ritualistic.
Drybone : Agreed. Atheism included.
Judge : But none of this is Proof there is a God
drybone : We dont need to prove to others there is or inst a God.We are content to believe it ourselves. People can decide on their own.
Judge Ok but the Atheist here says there is no God.
Drybone: but he has no right to put others down for believing either. Its negative and unhelpful
Judge : Hmm........well how bout 'zaibatsu' ..........how come you have to put others down who do not believe the same as you do? What right do you have to persecute them?
'zaibatsu' Your honor , they are ignorant . All the 'evidence' is with us. The SCIENCE
Drybone : We believe science is a never ending evolution. Egro what is considered TRUTH today , is replaced tomorrow. Aristotle believed the earth was flat and that was considered gospel truth for 2000 years. All of it based on observable evidence.We of faith accept the theory there is a HUGE 99% universe of truth we dont know yet.
Judge : Fair enough , then how is your faith 'truth'
Drybone; Its based in spiritual principals that have so far been universally sound through the ages. Science changes .
Judge : In other words its a spiritual matter , not a never ending evolving fact based matter like science is.
Drybone : Exactly
Judge Ok. Here the ruling. Neither can prove there is a God or not but here is the difference. The Theists seems quite content with his beliefs, People have the right to believe what they want to believe without fear of persecution.
The Atheist is able to believe what he wants but is fully concerned with pointing the finger at the Theist and ripping them apart in a negative way . This accomplishes nothing.
Judge: I havent heard from you Agnostic. Come say your piece.
Agnostic. No thanks your honor. I dont care.