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Big name players never signing with the Canucks


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#181 danaimo

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Posted 20 July 2012 - 07:30 AM

Most teams don't land a whole bunch of premier UFAs. The fact the Canucks got Lu, Sundin and Messier within the same decade is decent enough for me, not amazing, but decent. You can't just discount Messier because it upsets you to hear his name.






What big name UFAs has Detroit signed? Their top players over the last few years have been: Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Lidstrom, Kronwall and Franzen. None of them were UFAs.

Same with Pittsburgh over the last few years: Crosby, Malkin, Staal, Letang, Fleury. Their big name FA of Paul Martin was nothing to shake a stick at.

Same with Philly. Key players over the last few years: Richards, Carter, Hartnell, Giroux, Carle... (the only meanginful UFA I can think of was Pronger).

The only meaningful UFA I can think of from the Rangers is Richards.

EDIT: and Gaborik.

Can't argue with that. Well said. The fact is that many elite players never get to UFA status and the draft system is designed so that the most promising players go to the worst managed teams. There is way too much hype about players not wanting to come here because the Canucks are a "hated" team. The players don't care what the CBC or Boston media think. They can make their own minds up and team management and pay have a greater influence than whether the team is hated or not.

#182 etsen3

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Posted 20 July 2012 - 10:30 AM

Everyone here loves the Canucks, so they assume that every single player in the league is lining up to play here. All MG has to do is make an OK offer and we can have any player we want. But in real life, players look at it from a more unbiased point of view (except for hometown guys like Hamhuis or Garrison). To them there are a lot of choices with a wide range of pros and cons for each one. And it's not always just about how good the team is. There are lots of non-hockey factors like money, family, weather, things to do, and friends that play on certain teams. The same things anyone considers when they get a job. Even if you go just by chance, the majority of big names just aren't going to sign with the Canucks.

Also, OP saying Messier and Sundin don't count because Sundin is getting old and he doesn't like Messier is ridiculous. They are big names whether you like it or not.

Edited by etsen3, 20 July 2012 - 10:30 AM.


#183 suolucidir

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Posted 20 July 2012 - 10:34 AM

Big name players never sign with Vancouver. Except for the ones that do.
PSN: CloakOfSkill

Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists somewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us.

It bugs me when people pull out the gold medal for an example... Luongo only had to outplay Brodeur.


#184 TimberWolf

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Posted 20 July 2012 - 10:57 AM

Big name players never sign with Vancouver. Except for the ones that do.


Pretty much. It reminds me of the Edmonton writer that called out the Canucks for not having as many Canadians on their team as San Jose. He started by subtracting Luongo because "He's from Montreal and that doesn't count"

One can create a set of rules to make any opinion a fact. Names have signed here, but saying "they don't count" doesn't suddenly make ones opinion correct.

I was saying Lu-Urns...

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#185 danaimo

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 07:52 AM

I think the biggest name they could sign would be Pierre Luc Letourneau Leblond. Now that's a big name.

#186 winacup

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 10:11 AM

bottom line is big name players want to play for a winner. if they don't they're not worth signing.
this franchise has built a 42 year tradition of losing when it matters most. no big name is going to want any part of that.
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#187 TowelPower12

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 02:59 PM

We've traded away guys that ended up being big name players, Neely comes to mind...

We also could have had Kopitar but we took Bourdon (RIP) unfortunately we will never know how good Bourdon would have ended up being

#188 Gollumpus

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 07:27 PM

bottom line is big name players want to play for a winner. if they don't they're not worth signing.
this franchise has built a 42 year tradition of losing when it matters most. no big name is going to want any part of that.


Yeah, you're right. I'd support a different team if I were you.

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Following the Canucks since before Don Cherry played here.

#189 NuckMan

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 07:39 PM

We managed to get Messier and that's STILL biting us in the ass.

#190 NuckMan

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 07:43 PM

Pretty much. It reminds me of the Edmonton writer that called out the Canucks for not having as many Canadians on their team as San Jose. He started by subtracting Luongo because "He's from Montreal and that doesn't count"

One can create a set of rules to make any opinion a fact. Names have signed here, but saying "they don't count" doesn't suddenly make ones opinion correct.


Maybe the Oil should lose a couple 'Canadians' so that they'd make the playoffs.

#191 Baggins

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 10:41 PM

we almost got scott Nidemayer but we choose to sign Naslund over him? am I correct?

All fallacy. The whole "he wants to sign here" bs came from a Province interview. The question asked was "Any chance of signing in Vancouver?" His answer was. "I could see myself playing in Vancouver." When asked the exact same question by a Calgary Sun writer he answered, "I could see myself playing in Calgary."

In other words he was giving a pc answer to reporters and nothing more. It was just blown way out proportion here.
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#192 Baggins

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Posted 17 August 2012 - 11:03 PM

Here's a question for you guys. If you're moving and have no allegiance to a team and you're going to get a huge salary, would you sign with a competitive team in Canada where the taxes are higher or with a competitive team in the US where an extra million or more of that huge salary is going to wind up in your pocket? Not to mention that added anonymity you'd have in a US city. It's why so many high profile UFA's choose US teams over Canadian teams.
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#193 ButterBean

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 01:28 AM

Here's a question for you guys. If you're moving and have no allegiance to a team and you're going to get a huge salary, would you sign with a competitive team in Canada where the taxes are higher or with a competitive team in the US where an extra million or more of that huge salary is going to wind up in your pocket? Not to mention that added anonymity you'd have in a US city. It's why so many high profile UFA's choose US teams over Canadian teams.

An extra million playing in the US? Damn, I didn't know it was that bad.

#194 Sugar baby watermelon

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 04:20 AM

Whoa epic cat fight going on here!!

No star players want to put their ego in check and play on the 2nd line, first line or nothing oopps, already occupied ok I go sign with the next best team.

#195 Sugar baby watermelon

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 04:23 AM

Ding ding ding. And that is EXACTLY the problem with going the Detroit model. Detroits problem is that they ARE getting too old, and they don't have the prospects that they need to dominate as they have in the past. Same thing in a couple of years that Vancouver will most likely go through.

And for the record, I will say that the series against Boston and the series against LA were absolutely NOT exciting hockey series. They were awful. The Canucks were brutal. I don't know what you think was exciting about them...

Regular season success and post season failure is still a failure of a season to me. It may not be to you, but thats your view.

And I wasn't even talking about exciting hockey, I was talking about an exciting culture of the team. And I am around enough NHLers to form an opinion that the Vancouver dressing room is one of the last places numerous players want to be apart of.



Wow non name dropping pretty impressive there guy!!! Someone give him an award!!

#196 Hank to Dank

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 04:25 AM

Between the Canucks and the teams these star players sign with, there are 28 other teams that never signed that player. You want a team no one wants to sign with? Columbus.

#197 davebabychisback

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 09:55 PM

Because we don't want them at the price tag they're asking?

Let me ask you this, what do you figure the ratio is between "Big-name player" UFA's who are overpaid and those who are not?

I'm going to guess the ratio is a little too high.

i.e. - Ryan Suter, $7.5 Million for THIRTEEN YEARS? Worth more than Drew Doughty? No thanks, not without Shea Weber right beside him.

Just one example out of dozens.

Let me just ask you this - if MATT CARLE gets $5.5 Million, are too many GM's paying too much to sign UFA's?

I'll let you answer that question yourself.
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#198 Raph

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Posted 18 August 2012 - 11:29 PM

Variables holding back signing with Vancouver:
-"Sedin" salary cap.
-AV favourite, Kesler, will always play ahead of you.
-AV favourite, Bieksa, will always play more minutes than you.
-Raymond will play more than anyone.
-AV will throw you under the bus for underperforming when injured, unless if your name ends with Sedin, Kesler, or Bieksa.
-If you're under 25, forget about it.
Untouchables: Tanev, Jensen, Kassian
Mostly untouchable: Sedins (need someone to man the fort and no trade value)
Open to trade: Everyone else
Drive to airport: Bieksa, Edler

Bring back: Ehrhoff

#199 debluvscanucks

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Posted 19 August 2012 - 10:02 AM

Regular season success and post season failure is still a failure of a season to me. It may not be to you, but thats your view.

And I wasn't even talking about exciting hockey, I was talking about an exciting culture of the team. And I am around enough NHLers to form an opinion that the Vancouver dressing room is one of the last places numerous players want to be apart of.



1. As someone (below) stated, name dropping doesn't impress anyone or prove anything here. Unless you tell us your name is ____________ and you are the coach/owner/support staff of _________________, it really doesn't. If it includes being a bartender in a bar that players frequent, hotel staff, etc. - you may not get the real/entire scoop from hearsay, rumours, snippets of conversations or casual discussion. People you get your information from may hold some cards close to their chest - as professional athletes often/usually do. Plus, with the number of players IN the NHL, how do you get a good cross section or know that you've covered an overall opinion vs a small segment? I'm not convinced you can...


2. Anyone who does "know" (their hockey) also factors in the fact that, come playoffs, some teams have deficiencies due to injury, suspension, etc. and it isn't a reflection of the team, itself - more, just circumstances beyond their control. No one can fully protect against injury. Yes - good/solid teams will have made provision for that but when you're losing some of your key/top guys - you never bring things up to the same level as if you had them in the lineup. So when looking at regular season success/post season "failures" - it isn't always a problem with a team as much as just plain bad luck. And, timing - goaltenders who get hot/cold often are a key factor in a playoff win/loss.


Plus, the inconsistency in reffing did contribute to a negative series (in others as well, not just ours) and influenced the outcome in some situations - not much a lineup change can do with that. No whining/excuses - just how it is and I'm not sure that you can do much about that. I feel the Canucks made adjustments to try to avoid the ref's attention/eye but, at times, it wasn't enough.


I'd like to hear the inside scoop you have on "why" players don't want to play here. Could you provide that?.....


Because, a team that somehow manages, through a grueling schedule, to come atop all other teams is doing something right. AND should be a fairly attractive destination when considering the accommodations.


From what I can gather, this is a fairly tightknit group...they've gone through a lot together and it's become a brotherhood in many respects. And it speaks volumes that some of the NHL's top names want to stay here, at a discount...if it's a crappy destination/organization, that doesn't happen.

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#200 CamTheCanuckFan

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Posted 19 August 2012 - 10:32 AM

Luongo wasn't signed. We traded for him

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#201 John Garret's moustache

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Posted 19 August 2012 - 05:37 PM

Doan????

;)

Edited by John Garret's moustache, 19 August 2012 - 05:41 PM.

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#202 foozer

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Posted 19 August 2012 - 07:38 PM

Lots of reasons id say pressure of a canadian market where we are actually expected to win, possibly fragmented dressing room, or weather? Havent always shown loyalty to resign players we should have in the past ( Bure, Morrison, Mitchell, Gelinas, Ronning, Aucoin, not to mention trading the most popular player and best human being in the history of our organization after stripping him of the C and handing it to that stiff from the potato chip commercials). And thats not even mentioning the goalies that have came and went since Mclean. I live and die with the Canucks but totally understand atheletes going to sun belt teams where you have mountains of cash, anonymity and loads of beautiful women.

#203 ConnorFutureGM

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Posted 19 August 2012 - 08:01 PM

Probably because the Vancouver Vanuck fan base is too rabid.

Canucks fans love you one day, hate you the next.
Canucks fans want you on their team if you're from BC but if we find out what church your parents go to Canuck fans are going to vandalize it.
Canucks fans may have zero Stanley Cups but already have two riots gaining world publicity.

#204 davebabychisback

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Posted 20 August 2012 - 04:32 PM

Variables holding back signing with Vancouver:
-"Sedin" salary cap.
-AV favourite, Kesler, will always play ahead of you.
-AV favourite, Bieksa, will always play more minutes than you.
-Raymond will play more than anyone.
-AV will throw you under the bus for underperforming when injured, unless if your name ends with Sedin, Kesler, or Bieksa.
-If you're under 25, forget about it.

Yeah? A lot of UFA's under 25 don't sign with the Canucks ;) :lol:
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#205 Sidney Crosby.

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Posted 20 August 2012 - 04:40 PM

As much as it would be nice to get a Suter or Parise, the Canucks just don't have cap room and have already built there team through drafting and trading. I think Vancouver is a much more attractive place to come to then it ever has, but that's what a few winning seasons will do to any franchise. Maybe in a few years when the twins get a bit older we might get a chance to run at a big FA, but right now it doesn't make too much sence. I'm plenty happy with getting Garrison, Hamhuis, Malhotra, etc.

And Luongo was not a FA signing... (OP)

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#206 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 22 August 2012 - 10:33 AM

People have to get over this idea that the fans have any significant impact on free agent signings.

Money, travel, a chance to win, family considerations; these are all high priorities on any UFA's list. The actions of the fanbase is far down the list of important considerations.

Canuck fans have to stop giving themselves so much credit, be it positive or negative. You just aren't as important as you think you are.
Orland Kurtenbach and Dennis Kearns had just been torched 8-1 by the Habs, but they still took time to come out to meet us, some fellow BC boys who were playing hockey in Montreal. THAT"S what being a Canuck is!

#207 ButterBean

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Posted 22 August 2012 - 06:19 PM

People have to get over this idea that the fans have any significant impact on free agent signings.

Money, travel, a chance to win, family considerations; these are all high priorities on any UFA's list. The actions of the fanbase is far down the list of important considerations.

Canuck fans have to stop giving themselves so much credit, be it positive or negative. You just aren't as important as you think you are.

Agreed. People act like we have Philly fans, which are most definitely the worst in the league in my opinion. The way Bryzgalov described it, sounded like torture playing there.

#208 ajhockey

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Posted 22 August 2012 - 06:39 PM

Now, ask yourself, "Is Hamhuis a big name player?". If you're answer is yes, then I don't know what to say.


He was the biggest name on defense that summer.

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#209 L'Orange

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Posted 22 August 2012 - 09:50 PM

Because they know the Canucks are hopeless and that they will never win a cup with this team. LOL. Just telling it like it is. Face it, this team is pathetic and its going nowhere.


Words can't express how stupid your comment is. Really. Go back to the outhouse that spawned you.
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