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Doan: Would you do it?


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#121 L'Orange

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Posted 05 August 2012 - 10:18 AM

Gillis won't offer Doan what has wrongly been attributed to him as a demand for 30 million over 4 years.
Gillis will likely do what he usually does - his offer to Doan will likely max out at what his other veteran stars are making - if Doan is interested in playing in Vancouver, the reality is that the Sedins make 6.1, and the Canucks don't have cap space to be frivolous with.
But regarding moneyball or thinking outside the box - sometimes you just have to look inside the box - the Canucks have a load of natural left wingers, and only Hansen and Kassian as natural right wingers. They also could use a physical force, who can score 20+ goals, throw 200 hits, and who commands respect. Doan is an exception who fits Vancouver's need. If people want to think outside the box, stop assuming he isn't worth a three or four year contract because he is 35 - there are exceptions to that rule as well - and who knows, perhaps the new CBA will come up with better terms for 35+ contracts, which prevent circumvention but also don't essentially penalize veteran players.


By the beard of Zeus, oldnews is onto something there.
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#122 cIutch

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Posted 05 August 2012 - 10:25 AM

people who dont want to sign doan because of his age are really pissing me off

this site crys for free agent signings day and night and now that theres a good chance to get one its "hes tooo old"
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#123 BobLoblaw

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Posted 05 August 2012 - 10:31 AM

As much as Doan would be a great fit on paper, there's no way I'd entertain signing him at more than $5M per year. Particularly when next season's UFA market is much deeper and likely with a more favourable CBA in place.

http://capgeek.com/f...-1&fa_type_id=2

#124 xCANUCKAHOLICx

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Posted 05 August 2012 - 10:33 AM

no no no NO NO NO NOOOOO 2 much to long

#125 Edler Is a Beast

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Posted 05 August 2012 - 10:48 AM

4m? Yes.

7.5m? Doan can rot in Phoenix.

#126 Goal:thecup

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Posted 05 August 2012 - 11:55 AM

Like it is your money!

"I wouldn't pay more than this or that!"

Doan is a great fit for the Canucks.
Aqualini supports management 100%.
Gillman can find a way to get it under the cap.
Gillis can satisfy all of Doan's objectives.

The only thing I see, as said here by a couple guys before, is if Doan is just using this time to get as much as he can, then:
If he is stuck on Phoenix, we are out.
If he gets a bigger offer from NYR, we are out.
If we're in the ballpark, and he likes Vancouver, we win.

Somebody (Provost?) posted that the following year of a contract cannot be for less than half the current year.
With that knowledge then, and the 5 year averaging provision, with Doan (perhaps) not playing years 4 and 5:
Year 1: $10m
Year 2: $8m
Year 3: $4m
Year 4: $2m
Year 5: $1m
= $5m cap hit and nice big year 1 and 2 paydays for incentive to win the Cup with Vancouver.
Should satisfy all those who think he will be too old in a few years.

It is not your money.

#127 King Heffy

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Posted 05 August 2012 - 02:11 PM

Like it is your money!

"I wouldn't pay more than this or that!"

Doan is a great fit for the Canucks.
Aqualini supports management 100%.
Gillman can find a way to get it under the cap.
Gillis can satisfy all of Doan's objectives.

The only thing I see, as said here by a couple guys before, is if Doan is just using this time to get as much as he can, then:
If he is stuck on Phoenix, we are out.
If he gets a bigger offer from NYR, we are out.
If we're in the ballpark, and he likes Vancouver, we win.

Somebody (Provost?) posted that the following year of a contract cannot be for less than half the current year.
With that knowledge then, and the 5 year averaging provision, with Doan (perhaps) not playing years 4 and 5:
Year 1: $10m
Year 2: $8m
Year 3: $4m
Year 4: $2m
Year 5: $1m
= $5m cap hit and nice big year 1 and 2 paydays for incentive to win the Cup with Vancouver.
Should satisfy all those who think he will be too old in a few years.

It is not your money.


Enjoy us getting tagged for his caphit after he retires.

In this situation, I'd BACKload the contract, to give him more incentive to actually play

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Put Gino in the ROH


#128 Dynamic Innovator

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Posted 05 August 2012 - 08:27 PM

By the beard of Zeus, oldnews is onto something there.


Great Scott! Zut Alors! ¡Qué extraño!

The Beard of Zeus!!

#129 brewdog

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Posted 05 August 2012 - 08:58 PM

Doan, 22G, 28A, -8, 19:36 TOI
$6-7.5M ???

Burrows, 28G, 24A, +24, 18:28 TOI
$2M

Higgins, 18G, 25A, +11, 16:19 TOI
$1.9M

Hansen, 16G, 23A, +18, 14:54 TOI
$1.35M

I like the idea of him on our team, but it's a little frightening to think what his $/points would be. Last season he was barely ahead of Higgins and Hansen, despite being given more ice time. How many minutes would Doan get in a Vancouver jersey?

I know there are intangibles that he would bring, but it also needs to make sense on the gamesheet each night.

#130 nuck nit

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Posted 05 August 2012 - 10:25 PM

Doan is precisely the type of player this team has needed for the entire Gillis regime.

Dan is now a concussed superstar,Kes has been ground right into the ice with no support from the Mason Raymond figure skaters of the world,Booth is on the cusp of leaving hockey altogether with a fourth concussion.

It is Doan or bust-this window is closing shut.

#131 Bodee

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 03:46 AM

Personally after all I have heard about the Messier fiasco a) I doubt if MG would put himself in that position. B) There seems too many possibilities for such a move to go wrong.

For a start the guy is a one team man and you get the impression that where he wants to be is not Vancouver. Secondly I don't think he brings enough to the table, his points are not great (averaging 20 goals and 55 pts over last 3 seasons) and we don't know that at his age, 35 he would provide the deterrent the Sedins need.

Many aspects of this set up mirrors the Messier scenario. From the fact that he doesn't want to leave Phoenix but they don't want to pay him what he is asking for down to the guy being a veteran and may be prone to injury or would not be able to change his ways/fit into what is already a tight dressing room. The only difference here is that this Canuck team is elite.

I would rather we tried to trade for Perry, Clowe or Kane along with Arnott. I don't think we need to pay premium for more leadership, we have that already, we need more pushback.

Perry averaged 38 goals and 78 pts over last 3 seasons. More importantly he averaged 114 PIM
Clowe also averaged 20 golas and 55 pts over last 3 seasons (same as Doan) but almost 50 PIM more per season.

Perry is 27 years of age and Clowe is 29. Both young enough to get their full potential in a 3/4 year contract.

My ideal would be to get them both, put Perry with the Sedins trade Booth and insert Clowe into a line of Clowe-Kesler-Burrows.

Edited by Bodee, 06 August 2012 - 03:50 AM.

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#132 Bodee

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 03:54 AM

people who dont want to sign doan because of his age are really pissing me off

this site crys for free agent signings day and night and now that theres a good chance to get one its "hes tooo old"


It's not so much his age...........it's a combination of age, salary and production. There has to be something more in it for us.
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#133 Bodee

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 04:00 AM

almost think maybe its Bobby Ryan time mayne.


Would be a good move but we better get our skates on as I read Philly are sniffing about.
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#134 Gollumpus

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 04:14 AM

Like it is your money!

"I wouldn't pay more than this or that!"

Doan is a great fit for the Canucks.
Aqualini supports management 100%.
Gillman can find a way to get it under the cap.
Gillis can satisfy all of Doan's objectives.

The only thing I see, as said here by a couple guys before, is if Doan is just using this time to get as much as he can, then:
If he is stuck on Phoenix, we are out.
If he gets a bigger offer from NYR, we are out.
If we're in the ballpark, and he likes Vancouver, we win.

Somebody (Provost?) posted that the following year of a contract cannot be for less than half the current year.
With that knowledge then, and the 5 year averaging provision, with Doan (perhaps) not playing years 4 and 5:
Year 1: $10m
Year 2: $8m
Year 3: $4m
Year 4: $2m
Year 5: $1m
= $5m cap hit and nice big year 1 and 2 paydays for incentive to win the Cup with Vancouver.
Should satisfy all those who think he will be too old in a few years.

It is not your money.

Enjoy us getting tagged for his caphit after he retires.

In this situation, I'd BACKload the contract, to give him more incentive to actually play


As Number14 is suggesting, the biggest issue with signing Doan to a multi-year deal is the "35+" aspect to his contract.

Players who sign multi-year contracts when they are age 35 or older (calculated on June 30 of the season the contract begins) count toward the cap under all circumstances, regardless of where (or if) the player is playing. The only cap relief is $100,000 from the player's cap hit if he is assigned to the minors after the first year of the contract.
CBA reference: Section 50.5 (d-i-B-5) (P. 203)

Giving Doan a 5 year deal for cap purposes could really hurt the team should Doan not be able to fulfill his obligations.

Imagine if you were an NHL GM and your cap was $5 million dollars less than everyone else? That's the risk.

regards,
G.
Following the Canucks since before Don Cherry played here.

#135 nuck nit

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 05:08 AM

Bodee,comparing Messier to Doan is like comparing a great white shark(Messier) to a large,graceful fish (Doan).

Think tuna or marlin (Doan) landed by Gillis on the dock ,not shark(Messier) eating Gillis along with half the boat (Caucks organisation) and then taking out the dock(Canucks fans).

Doan will never be Messier.It is beyond comparison or comprehension.

Edited by nuck nit, 06 August 2012 - 07:38 AM.


#136 Sugar baby watermelon

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 06:00 AM

How about we sign him to a cheap contract but load it up with bonuses like everyone else seems to be signing.

#137 Canucklehead420

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 08:53 AM

I don't think we should be believing everything the media is trying to spoonfeed us. obviously none of us personally know doan but he seems like a reasonable man. if he wants to win I'm pretty sure him and Gillis can hammer out a reasonable deal. hopefully along the lines of 3 years for 15M.

#138 Canucklehead420

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 08:59 AM

Personally after all I have heard about the Messier fiasco a) I doubt if MG would put himself in that position. B) There seems too many possibilities for such a move to go wrong.

For a start the guy is a one team man and you get the impression that where he wants to be is not Vancouver. Secondly I don't think he brings enough to the table, his points are not great (averaging 20 goals and 55 pts over last 3 seasons) and we don't know that at his age, 35 he would provide the deterrent the Sedins need.

Many aspects of this set up mirrors the Messier scenario. From the fact that he doesn't want to leave Phoenix but they don't want to pay him what he is asking for down to the guy being a veteran and may be prone to injury or would not be able to change his ways/fit into what is already a tight dressing room. The only difference here is that this Canuck team is elite.

I would rather we tried to trade for Perry, Clowe or Kane along with Arnott. I don't think we need to pay premium for more leadership, we have that already, we need more pushback.

Perry averaged 38 goals and 78 pts over last 3 seasons. More importantly he averaged 114 PIM
Clowe also averaged 20 golas and 55 pts over last 3 seasons (same as Doan) but almost 50 PIM more per season.

Perry is 27 years of age and Clowe is 29. Both young enough to get their full potential in a 3/4 year contract.

My ideal would be to get them both, put Perry with the Sedins trade Booth and insert Clowe into a line of Clowe-Kesler-Burrows.


what kind of assets do we have to give up to get a perry? young 40 goal scorers would require giving up Kesler or Edler, a prospect and a first round pick.

#139 Bodee

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 09:15 AM

"Remember when Garrison was reported to be demanding 6 mil+? Yeah, what happened there...."

His mom gave him a shake and he woke up.
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#140 Bodee

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 09:19 AM

Bodee,comparing Messier to Doan is like comparing a great white shark(Messier) to a large,graceful fish (Doan).

Think tuna or marlin (Doan) landed by Gillis on the dock ,not shark(Messier) eating Gillis along with half the boat (Caucks organisation) and then taking out the dock(Canucks fans).

Doan will never be Messier.It is beyond comparison or comprehension.


Point taken.
I wasn't actually comparing them as players (how could I? :) ) only the similarity of some of the factors surrounding the signing.

Edited by Bodee, 06 August 2012 - 09:20 AM.

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#141 Bodee

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 09:25 AM

what kind of assets do we have to give up to get a perry? young 40 goal scorers would require giving up Kesler or Edler, a prospect and a first round pick.


I suggested Booth for Clowe, perhaps he could be part of the Perry deal instead.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not opposed to trading anyone below the Twins, Hamhuis, Burrows or Bieksa if it gets us where we need to be. Surely that is where the skill and the judgement required by a General Manager comes into play.
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#142 Hockey Fever

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Posted 06 August 2012 - 02:09 PM

6.100.000 for 4 years, same as the Sedins. It's only fair or you start creating disgruntled players.

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#143 CanucskDominateOnceAgain

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 02:25 AM

I wouldnt sign Doan for 4 year, 30 million. Heck I wouldnt even sign him at all. Hes getting to old. I dont see him helping the team like some think. Remember Messier? Do we want a repeat of that? I know I dont. NO TO DOAN!




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