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Why not a fresh start?


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#1 miles.p

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 02:33 PM

With a lockout threatening the entire 2012-2013 season, can anyone honestly say that the Canucks can again be a top team in the WCF, let alone be in the finals?

We all saw what happened last playoffs. the Canucks not skilled enough or tough enough to hang with the big boys. Let's face it, even if we had beaten LA, other teams would not have been a cake walk either, which is what most of you were thinking at the time.

I suggest that we blow up the team and start fresh. Trade the twins and get the first and second round picks. Stockpile on talent as much as we can. Hire a strong scouting team to find us players that are NHL Ready, meaning that they will be drafted and play right away.

I'm tired of prospects, waiting to see if a player is "Nhl Ready". Look at Edmonton, they have a better future than us. They have good talent, good coaching staff and a great direction. In comparison, look at Calgary, they fluked out to the finals one year, and kept the majority of their players, thinking that by adding what was missing in their previous runs, they can compete again. How bad have they become now?

Sometimes you gotta face the music, and look at the mirror and say, this team is just not good enough. We have 3rd stringers playing on our first and second lines, and we have a coaching staff that refuses to play players that would help win games, rather cares too much about who he likes and does not like.

The lockout should be looked as a blessing for Canucks. It's time to realize what they have and what direction their going, because as of right now, the Canucks don't look very good on paper anymore.
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#2 Pears

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 02:35 PM

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I stopped reading after 'Trade the Twins.'
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#3 Gooby

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 02:36 PM

Wait, you are serious?

Edited by Gooby, 14 August 2012 - 02:37 PM.

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#4 Tortorella's Rant

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 02:39 PM

Even if that was the best course of action, Gillis would never do that because he already has stated his intentions and has and still is doing his best to act upon them. Flip flopping on team structure and mentality shows you have no idea what the hell you're doing.
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#5 goalie13

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 02:40 PM

Trade the twins and get the first and second round picks. Stockpile on talent as much as we can.


So you want to stockpile on talent by trading it away?
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#6 Shift-4

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 02:42 PM

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ah great


just fixed my stupid meter......


...then I wander into this
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#7 Niloc009

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 02:44 PM

I stopped reading after 'Trade the Twins.'


I didn't even notice that there were paragraphs after that phrase.


edit: just read it. It doesn't get any more intelligent.

Edited by Niloc009, 14 August 2012 - 02:45 PM.

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#8 elvis15

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 02:52 PM

I stopped reading after 'Trade the Twins.'

You made it that far? I stopped after he asked if anyone could honestly say the Canucks could be a top team in the WCF.

I can honestly say the Canucks could be a top team in the WCF again soon, or be in the finals.
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#9 keslerian one

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 02:53 PM

Hmm....be one of the best teams in the league.... or blow up the team..... you're right, that is a tough one.
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#10 King of the ES

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 02:55 PM

I don't agree with the strategy, but this is still one of the better-written, more discussion-ready topics on this site.

Why not debate the man, instead of berate him? Valid opinion.
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#11 mj vic

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 02:58 PM

This is what happens when the neg button is removed...
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#12 Sedinstwin

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:03 PM

Do we really have to rate this topic 1-5? I'd give it a -10.

Edited by Sedinstwin, 14 August 2012 - 03:03 PM.

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#13 Raiun

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:05 PM

With a lockout threatening the entire 2012-2013 season, can anyone honestly say that the Canucks can again be a top team in the WCF, let alone be in the finals?

We all saw what happened last playoffs. the Canucks not skilled enough or tough enough to hang with the big boys. Let's face it, even if we had beaten LA, other teams would not have been a cake walk either, which is what most of you were thinking at the time.

I suggest that we blow up the team and start fresh. Trade the twins and get the first and second round picks. Stockpile on talent as much as we can. Hire a strong scouting team to find us players that are NHL Ready, meaning that they will be drafted and play right away.

I'm tired of prospects, waiting to see if a player is "Nhl Ready". Look at Edmonton, they have a better future than us. They have good talent, good coaching staff and a great direction. In comparison, look at Calgary, they fluked out to the finals one year, and kept the majority of their players, thinking that by adding what was missing in their previous runs, they can compete again. How bad have they become now?

Sometimes you gotta face the music, and look at the mirror and say, this team is just not good enough. We have 3rd stringers playing on our first and second lines, and we have a coaching staff that refuses to play players that would help win games, rather cares too much about who he likes and does not like.

The lockout should be looked as a blessing for Canucks. It's time to realize what they have and what direction their going, because as of right now, the Canucks don't look very good on paper anymore.


Do you seriously feel like we weren't skilled enough to be in the playoffs last season? The playoffs I saw we were plenty skilled, just not big and tough enough to goon our way through, or survive being gooned.

Edmonton has no future other than being the NHL's farm team. They haven't accomplished anything with their young talented team other than being rock bottom for years in a row. Those players are going to abandon ship like crazy once they get the chance, and Edmonton won't be able to afford to keep them all. By contrast, we have skilled, proven NHL level players and the reason we don't use our prospects as much is because they may not be better than the players we already have. We don't have the luxury of slotting first overall picks directly into our lineup like Edmonton does (for the last three years)

You're right when you say we're not good enough. Weirdly enough that's why MG signed Garrison and is looking at some other players to round out the lineup a bit. We are a lot closer than you seem to think.


We haven't been at the bottom of the league, in fact, quite the opposite. I don't understand how you can think blowing up a league leading team and a proven contender team is a good idea. That's like saying "My sports car broke down, so I'm going to just trash it and buy a new one rather than buying some parts to fix it".

It's expensive and ridiculous and a waste of an otherwise perfectly good car.

I don't agree with the strategy, but this is still one of the better-written, more discussion-ready topics on this site.

Why not debate the man, instead of berate him? Valid opinion.


You're welcome.

Edited by Raiun, 14 August 2012 - 03:06 PM.

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#14 Alex the Great

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:16 PM

You made it that far? I stopped after he asked if anyone could honestly say the Canucks could be a top team in the WCF.

I can honestly say the Canucks could be a top team in the WCF again soon, or be in the finals.

This.
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#15 Alex the Great

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:18 PM

I don't agree with the strategy, but this is still one of the better-written, more discussion-ready topics on this site.

Why not debate the man, instead of berate him? Valid opinion.

No point debating with the non-smart fellers.
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#16 Jägermeister

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:27 PM

No reasonable person could be that stupid.
Hes just trolling.
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#17 Kola Nuts

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:29 PM

Haha this is too good!!!! hONK HONK!!
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#18 miles.p

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:31 PM

No reasonable person could be that stupid.
Hes just trolling.


ya of course, let's just keep lying to ourselves and say "there's always next year". That will certainly get the team a cup, much like it has worked so well for Flames.
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#19 CHodgson9

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:37 PM

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#20 Pears

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:37 PM

ya of course, let's just keep lying to ourselves and say "there's always next year". That will certainly get the team a cup, much like it has worked so well for Flames.

Sorry, but trading the Sedin's would leave us with absolutley ZERO chance of winning the Cup any time soon.
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#21 Forsy

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:38 PM

I stopped reading

I stopped reading after 'Trade the Twins.'

I stopped reading altogether because of the thread
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#22 NucksBruins

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:45 PM

I keep reading about how great the Oilers are going to be. I agree they have a lot of prospects, but can they keep them beyond the ELC? They won't become contenders if players take off as soon as they are UFA or ask for a trade after their ELC runs out. They don't have a good track record in terms of attracting top tier talent to the team either. I say this as a hockey fan who wants to see the Oilers succeed.

The idea of taking a team that finished first overall and blowing it up to start over is baffling. It's never been done in any sport because of a lockout or for any other reason. Gillis intends to get a younger and bigger team and a lockout could help. I am also wondering why we're worried about losing the entire season in August. Yes, it happened in 2005, but I find the talks more encouraging now than I did then. There seems to be effort to work together whereas in 2005 everyone dug in their heels and waited for the other side to flinch.

I don't think the season will start on time, but I could see it dragging into October and there not being hockey until early December, maybe a 50 game schedule. This could actually be a real benefit to the Canucks.
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#23 Gino Odjick

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:54 PM

K.
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#24 Jester13

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:58 PM

The Calgary that fluked out and went to the finals is not our Canuck team that went to the finals, horrible comparison.

There better be a season this year, I can't handle an entire YEAR off of this kind of dribble. Ok, back to Twitter to see if HockeyyInsiderr has anything new to report;)
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#25 Mtl_Dan

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:58 PM

It seems like tanking is pretty trendy these days, every team has at least one discussion post full of fans hoping for a good ol tank. I mean, if we were in a situation like the Flames, I might agree, but we are still a very very good team. Maybe not the team that we were two years ago, but still a team that has a legit shot at winning a cup. Remember, this is still the best team that the Canucks have had in their history......it took us 40 someodd years to get a team of this quality..... you don't just hit reset and magically end up with a new team of the same quality 5 years down the road. Even if you are bad, it is far from a guarantee that you will get a top 5 pick (or 3 first overalls in a row for that matter), you don't just get a good pick handed to you because you choose to gut your team. For every Edmonton, Chicago, and Pittsburgh, there are a handful of teams who get stuck in perpetual rebuilds or fail to realize any decent success from tanking. Also, on a personal note, I really don't think that some people understand what a full on 4-5 year rebuild means. I will fully admit that I am a very impatient person here, but this would mean absolutely no remotely meaningful hockey for a full half a decade. Your entire university life (or high school for some people maybe), no getting excited for a hockey game, no playoffs, just losing.

IMO, the Canucks should follow the model (and it seems like they are) of teams like Detroit, Ottawa, San Jose, ect. Teams that don't go all in for one big push, they consistently keep their first rounders and develop their prospects. They may not end up with a flashy top five prospect, but with a good scouting and development system they can remain powerhouses (or at least drastically shorten rebuilding times; see Ottawa.).

Cheers
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#26 Zedlee

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 03:59 PM

I don't agree with the strategy, but this is still one of the better-written, more discussion-ready topics on this site.

Why not debate the man, instead of berate him? Valid opinion.


why waste time on something that will NEVER happen. Nor should it.
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#27 RonMexico

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 04:15 PM

The idea definitely has merit....but you are dealing with a mass amount of homers on this board. I get their side of it too. Why blow up a team that you know can win first overall? It sucks to know that this team hasn't really improved since it's first round ousting. Swap Garrison for Salo is essentially the only noticeable move which netted a younger, durable replacement with a similar skill set. When you do very little and expect a better outcome, you are reaching. I guess they are just hoping for a better matchup? Since it is easier to just keep tinkering and hoping for different results, that is all that happen. I'm not a fan of this approach, but i'll watch and not be upset about it. But I won't go out of my way to watch every game as I really only care about playoff success at this point. Hopefully by the time the Sedins have declined to the point of retirement, there will be someone to replace them. If not, oh well, at least I got to see two of the best players this organization has had.
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#28 HorseGem2007

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 04:15 PM

miles.p
you have to be kidding !!!!
trolling ?
can't believe what I read and I read it all :sick:
why don't you try to blow yourself up instead

just can't believe it still ... this is the worst I've read
and please the comparisons to Edmonton and Calgary are worthless

Edited by HorseGem2007, 14 August 2012 - 04:16 PM.

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#29 Rounoush

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 04:34 PM

Ugh. I hate when people say, "let's face it" like what they are speaking is fact. <_<
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#30 etsen3

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 04:54 PM

So basically you wanna rebuild and start tanking for draft picks before we even start sucking? We still have lot of good player who haven't quite left their prime yet. Mike Gillis is currently working on going in a younger direction, which is why he signed Garrison, got Kassian as opposed to an older player, traded Samuelsson and Sturm for Booth, and is keeping Schneider. But we don't need a full on rebuild for a few years yet.

And the whole "I'm tired of prospects" thing is something you're just gonna have to get used to. Very few players are NHL ready right out of the draft, and no matter how good of a scouting staff you have, you're probably not getting them unless you draft very high, which is how Edmonton got their talent (sucking for years in a row and drafting 1st overall).
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