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Obama vs Romney 2012 - CDC Election


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Poll: Obama vs Romney (329 member(s) have cast votes)

Who would you vote for?

  1. Obama (279 votes [85.32%])

    Percentage of vote: 85.32%

  2. Romney (48 votes [14.68%])

    Percentage of vote: 14.68%

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#91 Grapefruits

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 03:52 PM

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#92 Drybone

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 03:53 PM

Few on this thread have the slightest clue what is actually going on . We who live in the United States and actually have a say in all this appreciate your concern .
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#93 Buddhas Hand

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 04:10 PM

Few on this thread have the slightest clue what is actually going on . We who live in the United States and actually have a say in all this appreciate your concern .



Few on this thread have the slightest clue what is actually going on . We who live in the United States and actually have a say in all this appreciate your concern .


few in america know WTF is going on inside or outside of their borders .

and we who live outside the USA , who are affected by the decisions that are made by the leader of the country which has the most powerful armed forces on the planet, hope you make the correct decision , not vote in some asshole that will start another war on the pretext of looking for weapons of mass destruction .
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"These are the things to keep in mind. These are not just academic exercises. We're not analyzing the media on Mars or in the eighteenth century or something like that. We're dealing with real human beings who are suffering and dying and being tortured and starving because of policies that we are involved in, we as citizens of democratic societies are directly involved in and are responsible for, and what the media are doing is ensuring that we do not act on our responsibilities, and that the interests of power are served, not the needs of the suffering people, and not even the needs of the American people who would be horrified if they realized the blood that's dripping from their hands because of the way they are allowing themselves to be deluded and manipulated by the system."
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Jesus didn’t say yes to everyone. I mean Jesus knew that there was a place for everything and it is not necessarily everyone’s place to come to Australia
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#94 Sharpshooter

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 04:14 PM

They will do whatever they can to gain more power and money. They're puppets for companies.


Obama and Romney could make more unscrutinized money as private citizens than as public officials currently. So what makes you think they, or more specifically Obama wants more power and money? As a mean to what ends exactly?
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#95 Sharpshooter

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 04:15 PM

Few on this thread have the slightest clue what is actually going on . We who live in the United States and actually have a say in all this appreciate your concern .


What is going on exactly?
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#96 Grapefruits

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 04:38 PM

Few on this thread have the slightest clue what is actually going on . We who live in the United States and actually have a say in all this appreciate your concern .


Typical arrogant American comment
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#97 CanuckClown

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 04:53 PM

Well you decided to use the straw man of 100%.. why would percentages suddenly not matter? I bet it's because it's no longer a convenience to your argument.

Deregulation is better when the markets are left alone, and government isn't playing favourites through subsidies and bailouts. That way, each business is ( :o) actually responsible for itself if it wants to succeed, and not given a golden parachute or extensive subsidies. This is why as I get older I'm becoming less and less favourable to Keynes' vision.. it's one thing to have a vision, it's another to have it taken over and caricatured to the corporatist point seen today.

It's doubtful Ron Paul wants complete deregulation, it's nearly impossible that he'd even be able to accomplish it pretending he did.. what I'm trying to figure out is where your belief of regulation ends? I'm perfectly accepting of a little of A and B in moderation, but right now all I see is you and extremes.


You cling to a footnote in my post and declare I am presenting a straw-man. In doing so you clearly show you do not understand the first thing about macro-economics. This is illustrated further with your pie-in-the-sky declarations that the U.S.'s largest financial and productive institutions should fail if required.
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#98 mrawfull

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 05:00 PM

Obsession with authoritarianism on this forum couldn't be any more evident.
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#99 CanuckClown

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 05:04 PM

Obsession with authoritarianism on this forum couldn't be any more evident.


Says the conservative. Highly ironic.
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#100 jmfaminoff

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 05:07 PM

Where I live, people need jobs. It all comes down to that. A budget has passed the House of Representatives, and has gone no where in the Senate. This budget needs to pass because it contains tax rules that affect small businesses, which are not run like corporations, and without it, it will affect future hiring trends.

The ACA also known as Obamacare will affect hiring because it mandates that employers provide health insurance. Instead of paying your employees more, or adding more employees, employers will now have to add this benefit. The average benefit plan costs an employer about $15,000 per employee per year for a family plan. A true free market would allow employers to pay their employees more, say $10,000 a year or more, and let them buy their own insurance plan on the free mareket or whatever they want to spend that money on. More money in their pocket, more money they will spend, and the better the overall economy will do.
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#101 jmfaminoff

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 05:08 PM

Obsession with authoritarianism on this forum couldn't be any more evident.

American ideology is not built upon authoritariansim, but it is built upon paternalism.
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#102 CanuckClown

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 05:13 PM

Where I live, people need jobs.  It all comes down to that.  A budget has passed the House of Representatives, and has gone no where in the Senate.  This budget needs to pass because it contains tax rules that affect small businesses, which are not run like corporations, and without it, it will affect future hiring trends.

The ACA also known as Obamacare will affect hiring because it mandates that employers provide health insurance.  Instead of paying your employees more, or adding more employees, employers will now have to add this benefit.  The average benefit plan costs an employer about $15,000 per employee per year for a family plan.  A true free market would allow employers to pay their employees more, say $10,000 a year or more, and let them buy their own insurance plan on the free mareket or whatever they want to spend that money on.  More money in their pocket, more money they will spend, and the better the overall economy will do.


You do realize that the very term "free-market" is a contradiction when used in crazy conservative-speak. "Freedom" according to right-wing nutbags is equated to supposedly doing what ever you want (so long as your beliefs coincide with their beliefs) without government involvement. This is extended to the market. Of course, as any critical person would know, the "market" does not exist without government regulation. Money has to be sanctioned and honoured by the state, rules have to be put in to place so as to ensure that one person's dollar is equal to another person's dollar and on and on it goes. There are literally hundreds (if not thousands) of regulations put in to place so as to ensure a "free" market. Without even getting into the economics of it one should be able to realize that much of the con-speak is flat out BS.

Edited by CanuckClown, 29 August 2012 - 05:14 PM.

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#103 Jaimito

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 05:33 PM

Where I live, people need jobs. It all comes down to that. A budget has passed the House of Representatives, and has gone no where in the Senate. This budget needs to pass because it contains tax rules that affect small businesses, which are not run like corporations, and without it, it will affect future hiring trends.

The ACA also known as Obamacare will affect hiring because it mandates that employers provide health insurance. Instead of paying your employees more, or adding more employees, employers will now have to add this benefit. The average benefit plan costs an employer about $15,000 per employee per year for a family plan. A true free market would allow employers to pay their employees more, say $10,000 a year or more, and let them buy their own insurance plan on the free mareket or whatever they want to spend that money on. More money in their pocket, more money they will spend, and the better the overall economy will do.


I live in the US too, I disagree with what ur saying. Employer-sponsored health insurance have been going on since WWII in the US, that's nothing new. it was popular when there was a wage freeze, and employers use that as a way to attract people to work for them. the obama individual mandate requires individuals to have insurance, so those who dont have coverage from their employer will have to pitch in. the plans will therefore be cheaper by most estimates, since insurance company will have tons of new customers, majority of them are healthy young people. so they make more money, and thus the plan is cheaper overall because there more healthy people in the pool.

From wiki: "Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act will impose a $2000 per employee tax penalty on employers with over 50 employees who do not offer health insurance to their full-time workers. (In 2008, over 95% of employers with at least 50 employees offered health insurance.)"

so, if over 95% of employers already pay their worker's insurance, the new law will only affect very few businesses. a drop in the bucket when looking at the whole country as a whole.

Edited by Jaimito, 29 August 2012 - 05:37 PM.

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#104 Ossi Vaananen

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 05:37 PM

I'm laughing my ass off at the RNC right now. Attny. Gen of Florida just claimed rights were given by god, not the constitution. This is absolutely ridiculous. This makes me lose further faith in the American brain trust.
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Credit to -Vintage Canuck-


#105 ronthecivil

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 05:54 PM

3 hypocritical Republican paradoxes that I can't see how anyone in their party can justify:

1) They claim to want to balance the budget, BUT always support huge tax cuts for the wealthy and corporations despite that they are proven to increase the defecit.

2) They claim to want to slash government spending as much as possible, BUT not only do they always refuse to cut defense spending, they persistently insist on increasing it.

3) They say that government should have virtually no involvement in people's lives, BUT they want a constitutional ban on abortion.

Even if I supported this party's economic policies (which anyways I don't), if I was an American I just couldn't bring myself to vote for them, because they're some of the slimiest, most dishonest crooks in the country.


It's all because of the Americans for Tax Reform lobby and their damn pledges.

What would be nice to see is a bipartisan plan that simplified the tax code (it could even decrease overall taxes so long as net revenue was the same or even a little higher and get all the advantages of lowering taxes even if you actual set the simplified plan to collect slightly more) and then did all the Republican cuts.

And while it might frighten that some of the loonier are so anti abortion as to want a constitutional amemendant for it the odds of that happening are slim to none.
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#106 Satan's Evil Twin

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 06:08 PM

Where I live, people need jobs. It all comes down to that. A budget has passed the House of Representatives, and has gone no where in the Senate. This budget needs to pass because it contains tax rules that affect small businesses, which are not run like corporations, and without it, it will affect future hiring trends.

The ACA also known as Obamacare will affect hiring because it mandates that employers provide health insurance. Instead of paying your employees more, or adding more employees, employers will now have to add this benefit. The average benefit plan costs an employer about $15,000 per employee per year for a family plan. A true free market would allow employers to pay their employees more, say $10,000 a year or more, and let them buy their own insurance plan on the free mareket or whatever they want to spend that money on. More money in their pocket, more money they will spend, and the better the overall economy will do.


There's something delicious about Osama here complaining about jobs while supporting the GOP. :lol:

"Free market" ::D :picard:
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#107 Common sense

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 06:19 PM

And there shouldn't be much surprise with the results, this November. ;)


Really?

http://in.reuters.co...E87S18U20120829


(Reuters) - Republican Mitt Romney pulled even with President Barack Obama in a Reuters/Ipsos poll on Wednesday, getting a boost from his party's nominating convention in Tampa this week.


In a four-day rolling poll, Romney and Obama were deadlocked among likely voters at 43 percent each. That was an improvement for Romney from Obama's two-point lead on Tuesday and four-point lead on Monday.


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#108 kyledude

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 07:00 PM

I vote for Obamney
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#109 Tearloch7

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 07:11 PM

Few on this thread have the slightest clue what is actually going on . We who live in the United States and actually have a say in all this appreciate your concern .


That just means you are a "part of the problem" .. get yer crape in a pile, please ..
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#110 Squirrels.Gone.Wild

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 07:12 PM

I vote for Obamney


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Edited by Squirrels.Gone.Wild, 29 August 2012 - 07:15 PM.

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#111 Tearloch7

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 07:13 PM

Economic booms and busts are inherent to our way of life - it matters not who is in power. People want to blame the last crisis on Bush, or Obama, or whomever. the reality is that mortgage backed securities became a reality for an entirely different reason. The increased polaraziation of wealth - a smaller middle class, a growing working/lower class and more billionaires than ever - resulted in more capital in the hands of fewer and fewer people. Of course, with said polarization a problem arises. What does one do with their capital? (After all, if it is not used to augment itself is ceases to become capital.)

The first question is why is there a smaller middle class in N. America/West today? The reasons are numerous but I would suggest that the biggest reason would be due to the free trade agreements so typical since the 60s; which took hold like never before in the 80s. This was a reaction to the increased power of the middle class. They were receiving higher wages than ever before, and as a result profits were down. The easiest was to combat this was to break labour. This was done by way of opening up other labour markets. That is, increasing the supply of labour to the point whereby its pricce decreased. Interestingly enough this shift corresponds with the shift of power to Merchant and Fincance capital and the decrease of power in Production capital. Companies such as Wal-Mart and Visa have become bigger than ever, whereas most people have no idea as to the name of the Chinese company who made their jeans or hats and has since been branded and sold by another company. This have become possible because of the deregulation of markets.

Moreover, companies like Visa, Mastercard and any other creditor grew and grew in part 'cause of the wage stagnation that resulted from the disciplining of labour. People continued to earn less relative to the cost of living but remained focused on a certain way of life/level of consumption. Hence, a crisis of effective demand (no one to buy goods) was avoided for a good amount of time. Moreover, as the geography of multinational companies grew and grew, the more important finance became. Having the right amount of money and the right speed and time became critical in order to ensure a seemless realization of profits.

What this all amounts to, as I stated earlier, was record profits. The amount of capital accumulated by a small amount of people has become simply astounding. Here is the problem however. The more capital one accumulates the harder it becomes to find places to put it back into circulation. That is, there are less and less markets where one can realize a return. So what is one to do? The simplified version, in my opinion, is to invent a market. And there you have the birth of derivatives, sub-prime mortgages and so on.

I have rambled for far too long, so I will only say this: It is in my opinion that not a single President, Prime Minister, Chancellor or what have you, in the past 30 years, could have stopped this trend from happening. There are certain things that could slow it: wars, natural disasters and so on (allowing for the reopening of markets), but aside from that politics is a sideshow with very little impact in my opinion.

And for the Ron Paul lovers out there: being a libertarian would simply speed up the process highlighted previously. There is a reason the saying "a capitalist will sell you the rope you use to hang him with" exists. If markets are deregulated 100% then all hell would break loose.

/rant.


Excellent perspective .. ignore those who pull at "loose threads" on here, as they are for the most part "unraveled" .. **points at zaibatsu**
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#112 Sharpshooter

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 07:17 PM

Really?

http://in.reuters.co...E87S18U20120829


(Reuters) - Republican Mitt Romney pulled even with President Barack Obama in a Reuters/Ipsos poll on Wednesday, getting a boost from his party's nominating convention in Tampa this week.


In a four-day rolling poll, Romney and Obama were deadlocked among likely voters at 43 percent each. That was an improvement for Romney from Obama's two-point lead on Tuesday and four-point lead on Monday.



That article acknowledges that conventions give a candidate a bump. Regardless, talk to me about polls in mid-to late October.
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#113 inane

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 08:03 PM

http://www.bbc.co.uk...canada-19418514
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#114 inane

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 08:04 PM

on top of this

http://www.bbc.co.uk...canada-19414600

Sure are a classy bunch.
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#115 Navyblue

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 09:39 PM

Obama.

While they're quite similar (because CNN told me so)...Romney just bothers me.

Edited by Navyblue, 29 August 2012 - 11:35 PM.

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#116 key2thecup

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 10:17 PM

Another Obamney supporter here!

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#117 Sharpshooter

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 10:23 PM

Anyone who thinks Obama and Romney are substantively the same across the board on all or even most policy issues clearly don't have a clue and are being at best mistaken, and at worst, willfully ignorant.
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#118 KoreanHockeyFan

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 11:06 PM

Anyone who thinks Obama and Romney are substantively the same across the board on all or even most policy issues clearly don't have a clue and are being at best mistaken, and at worst, willfully ignorant.


They aren't the same, but the results will be, regardless of the policies they try to enact. A congress that can never seem to come to a compromise for these past four years along with a corrupt financial district that essentially runs the country, Republican or Democrat, there won't be a substantial difference.

I still support Obama over Romney for a simple and common reason. He's just the lesser of the two evils. Maybe he'll have a change of character and actually do the things he promised to do four years ago. Regardless, I'm not getting my hopes up.

Edited by KoreanHockeyFan, 29 August 2012 - 11:08 PM.

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#119 kyledude

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Posted 29 August 2012 - 11:30 PM

Anyone who thinks Obama and Romney are substantively the same across the board on all or even most policy issues clearly don't have a clue and are being at best mistaken, and at worst, willfully ignorant.


I think the point is, regardless of political ideology, they both play for the same team - the foreign bankers.

One is a much better actor than the other, which is why he'll be re-elected.

The other says a whole lotta nothing - mostly fluff - and then tries to **** you from behind. He also believes that an angel named Moroni delivered golden plates, which no-one ever saw, to some guy named Joseph Smith - the "truth" of Jesus Christ. It's pretty nutty.

Either way, it's a gigantic fail for America and will ensure them at least 4 more years of misery. Not looking forward to it.
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#120 Sharpshooter

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 12:11 AM

I think the point is, regardless of political ideology, they both play for the same team - the foreign bankers.

One is a much better actor than the other, which is why he'll be re-elected.

The other says a whole lotta nothing - mostly fluff - and then tries to **** you from behind. He also believes that an angel named Moroni delivered golden plates, which no-one ever saw, to some guy named Joseph Smith - the "truth" of Jesus Christ. It's pretty nutty.

Either way, it's a gigantic fail for America and will ensure them at least 4 more years of misery. Not looking forward to it.


I don't even think they play for the same team. One would increase banking regulations and the other would further deregulate. The POTUS can't enact banking regulations on his own. You need to look at the ineptitude of Congress, and both chambers, for those that are in bed with the bankers on Wallstreet.....from both sides of the aisles, but weighted to one side moreso, imo.
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