Do you honestly believe we improved enough?

[Gollumpus]

Ah,Gump,your argument was Edler AND the Twins-like for days you repeatedly threatened to kick me out of your CDC family if I did not recognise your position and standing.

[nuck nit]

Garrison won't be paired with an elite d man playing first line minutes.He will have inconsistent Eddy playing second line minutes.

With the 40 or 50 penalty minutes Eddy will garner Garrison will be playing a lot more d this year.

If Edler and Garrison end up being teamed with the twins on the first unit PP then his +/- stats will benefit,but that is not a given,is it?

[Gollumpus]

Garrison won't be paired with an elite d man playing first line minutes.He will have inconsistent Eddy playing second line minutes.

With the 40 or 50 penalty minutes Eddy will garner Garrison will be playing a lot more d this year.

If Edler and Garrison end up being teamed with the twins on the first unit PP then his +/- stats will benefit,but that is not a given,is it?

[nuck nit]

So, you believe Garrison play with the twins and Hamhuis or Bieksa will play on the second.

And you are seeing through the crystal ball to inform us that Garrison will play with the twins on the PP and not on the second unit.

You are very confused or obtuse which leads to endless posts with no substance,for your own personal gain or game.

Your contention was not what I wrote.Do unto others,Gump.

[Gollumpus]

So, you believe Garrison play with the twins and Hamhuis or Bieksa will play on the second.

And you are seeing through the crystal ball to inform us that Garrison will play with the twins on the PP and not on the second unit.

You are very confused or obtuse which leads to endless posts with no substance,for your own personal gain or game.

Your contention was not what I wrote.Do unto others,Gump.

[Tearloch7]

canucks are synonymous with fail

[higgyfan]

If Garrison's shot from the point is as good as projected, he just may end up on the #1 power play unit. One would think that the best passers (Sedins) would be the setup guys for Garrison.

[Gollumpus]

If Garrison's shot from the point is as good as projected, he just may end up on the #1 power play unit. One would think that the best passers (Sedins) would be the setup guys for Garrison.

[NucksBruins]

This would be my thought as well. I figure Garrison will be given every chance throughout camp, pre-season and a goodly way into the regular season to show that he cannot produce, or even just be a threat and play well on the power play. With the Sedins and whomever else the Canucks have on the ice, he should get ample opportunities to shoot at the net... and should the opposition start to key on him, then they have created a 4 on 3 for themselves with the Sedins on the ice.

I don't see anyone else on the team, at least at the moment, who could fill that role of the big shot from the point, and if they are already on the team from last year, why didn't they play more on the power play? It's possible that Connauton could show up to camp and be the offensive d-man threat he has been touted to be, but until such time Garrison looks to be the top candidate for that role.

regards,

G.

[nuck nit]

Garrison has never played one single minute in a Canucks uniform.

Yes,it is likely he will get a chance to play with everyone but it is also a complete mystery as to where he fits in and ends up.

Speculation does not improve your +/- .

[oldnews]

Garrison won't be paired with an elite d man playing first line minutes.He will have inconsistent Eddy playing second line minutes.

With the 40 or 50 penalty minutes Eddy will garner Garrison will be playing a lot more d this year.

If Edler and Garrison end up being teamed with the twins on the first unit PP then his +/- stats will benefit,but that is not a given,is it?

[SamJamIam]

So, you believe Garrison play with the twins and Hamhuis or Bieksa will play on the second.

And you are seeing through the crystal ball to inform us that Garrison will play with the twins on the PP and not on the second unit.

You are very confused or obtuse which leads to endless posts with no substance,for your own personal gain or game.

Your contention was not what I wrote.Do unto others,Gump.

[beer&meat]

It's different for many reasons:

-Luongo explicitly LOST the starting job to Schneider after Game 2 versus the Kings

-Luongo asked for a trade after the series, acknowledging the fact that the Canucks are rightfully going to be running with Schneider

-Schneider signs a 3-year extension, at $4M per, to explicitly be our starting goaltender

[nuck nit]

You seem to think that the 1st defensive unit always plays with the 1st offensive unit. This is not how hockey works. Lines are also subject to change whenever the coach likes so he can mix and match d men for PP duties. Even if Garrison is on the second line (which I think is a fair assertion, I don't think AV wants to split Hammer and Juice) then clearly the 2nd unit will be the much more offensively-minded unit. 1st will play shutdown in a more consistent style and 2nd will play a puck-moving, scoring and PP style of play.

Making a clear division of labour between the d men is nothing but a good thing. This is why Ehrhoff looked so good on this team and why Bieksa and Hamhuis had drops in +/- after he left. They had to take risks and be jacks of all trades (and masters of none) in an attempt to score more to offset the loss of Ehrhoff. Combined with the fact Garrison is an awesome shutdown d man (his +/- might not look amazing but on a Panthers team that has a much higher GA than GF, it's a big deal) we have gained an astonishing amount of depth and talent by signing one guy.

Your "you can't know how he'll play" comments are just an attempt to stave off admitting that you have nothing more to add and have been rebutted in full. Sure, we don't know if Weber will be a great d man next year either but based on past experience, I think we're all happy betting that he will be.

[oldnews]

What I said is that when the first line is on the ice Juice and Hammer will be with them.The PP units are up in the air at this point in time.

I played the game and the position,but thanks for your opinions.They are noted as such.

PP is the unknown variable and as Garrison has never played one moment in a Nucks jersey it remains an unknown variable.

Take out the fact Garrison is playing with Eddy and not Campbell and the fact Campbell takes minimal penalty minutes whereas Eddy takes one penalty at least every other game + means Garrison will also be subject to playing with a fifth and sixth d man (instead of alongside a Norris candidate every shift as in Florida) and there are some distinct differences,already.

Weber is a known quantity and is an all-star,as is Campbell.There is a distinction between superstars and Garrison.

Bieksa and Hamhuis did not alter their play after Ehrhoff left.Ehrhoff's absence left the team offensively far less effective.Bieksa clearly does not have Ehrhoff's offensive abilities.Without Hamhuis ,Bieksa's +/- stats would look like they did before he played with Dan.

You can't make a marginally offensive d man or a strictly defensive d man an effective offensive one and this team has stumbled since Ehrhoff left.

The greatest variable that can improve Campell's/Garrison's +/- game is Eddy becoming an offensive force,coming into his own,becoming a d man that has consistent,elite,offensive game each and every night.

That has yet to happen but the potential is there.

[nuck nit]

I'm not concerned at all but it was the crux of the debate.

Edler averages 40 minutes of penalty time over his NHL/Canucks tenure.

This team has no offensively gifted d man that replicates Ehrhoff's skill level.

Eddy can fill that void but as of yet,has not.

Edler registered 0 +/- last year,the second time in four years.

Campbell was a positive 51 in the last three years in Chicago.

Cambell played consistent 30 minute + games last year on a rebuilding team.

To answer your question,no,I don't believe Eddy's extra penalty minutes is the largest issue.

Playing without Campbell is.

[oldnews]

I like Campbell and I think Chicago underestimated him / made a mistake in letting him go, despite his cap hit. Campbell for Olesz = Tallon fleecing Chicago. Tallon knew what Campbell brought to the Blackhawks - it's pretty telling that he went way outside the Panthers' bubble in bringing Campbell's cap hit to that very budget conscious team.

I also like Edler though, and I think he and Garrison will make one hell of a pairing. I see both of those guys as serious reasons behind the fact that Ehrhoff appeared as good as he did in Vancouver, and Campbell had as good of a season as he did last year.

Ehrhoff was a very good pp quarterback, but otherwise is not much of a blueliner. Edler did a great job of complementing him.

I don't think either Edler or Garrison depended upon their partners for their success - they are both young 'real deals' in their own right.

[nuck nit]

I agree that this pairing could assist Eddy's game and help him transform into an elite d man.

It is early but the potential and hope is great.

Moving the puck /the rapid transition to skilled forwards like the Sedins is the niche Christian filled.

He has an exceptional stick and views the ice extremely well.

Eddy has to grow and needs consistent support,as you said.He will have it in Garrison.

[oldnews]

I agree that this pairing could assist Eddy's game and help him transform into an elite d man.

It is early but the potential and hope is great.

Moving the puck /the rapid transition to skilled forwards like the Sedins is the niche Christian filled.

He has an exceptional stick and views the ice extremely well.

Eddy has to grow and needs consistent support,as you said.He will have it in Garrison.

[L'Orange]

While there is no way of knowing until we see them together, Garrison and Edler could be a defensive pairing that could possibly usurp Hamuis and Bieksa as the top pairing. However this relies on Edler leaving his inconsistent play behind him.

http://www.theprovin...9058/story.html

The following is an excerpt from an article written on May 26th, 2011 by Jim Jamieson:

"What happened to Alex Edler?

The big defenceman might not be quite up there for playoff under-achievement with Pittsburgh goaltender Marc-Andre Fleury, who seemed incapable of making even a routine save at some points of the Penguins' opening-round series with Philadelphia. But Edler's gaffes in the Canucks' playoff series with the Kings were killers and he was one of the team's difference-makers who failed to do that with the season on the line.

Yes, Edler had his best season from a points-production perspective – 49 points (11-38), tying him for sixth in the NHL amongst defencemen. Yes, his regular season, which was punctuated by his first participation in the NHL All-Star Game, likely had him in some conversations for the Norris Trophy.

But his play down the stretch was characterized by disturbing inconsistency. At one point in mid-March, after Edler was partially responsible for all four Montreal goals in an embarrassing 4-1 loss at Rogers Arena, head coach Alain Vigneault said: “I don't know where he is right now.”

The playoffs? In Game 1, Edler coughed up the puck in his own zone late in the game and the resulting Kings goal stood up as the winner. In Game 2, his drop pass on the power play was intercepted by Kings' Anze Kopitar and resulted in Dustin Brown's first of two shorthanded goals. Late in Game 3, with his team trailing 1-0 and pressing for the equalizer, he fired the puck over the glass to take a delay of game minor.

Not that Edler's overall play was poor – it wasn't – but the moments he chose to come unglued had a major impact on his team.

How 2011-12 went: If you look at Edler's numbers (11-38-49), what's not to like?

His career-best points total was tied (with Shea Weber) for sixth amongst NHL defencemen.

He was also tied at sixth with Weber for power-play points (22).

Edler was fourth in the league in shots by a defenceman (228) and led the Canucks in blocked shots (145). A regular on both special teams, Edler's ice-time of 23:51 per game led the Canucks and ranked him 16th in the league amongst D-men.

A search for a different partner down the stretch was a curiosity. After the March debacle against Montreal, the coaching staff opted to split up the season-long partnership of Edler and Sami Salo. A pairing with Kevin Bieksa made some sense on paper but didn't work in action. After the disastrous team showing in Game 1, Edler and Salo were back together.

What the future brings: The Canucks have to decide whether Edler's struggles down the stretch and nightmarish playoff was just a one-off or needs to be addressed in some way.

Is he struggling under the weighty expectations of finally growing in to that No. 1 defenceman the team desperately needs?

Do they need to bring in an experienced top-four D-man that Edler can play with and, more importantly, play off?

Might the Canucks decide that Edler is a piece they'll have to include in a deal for a true No. 1 defenceman?

Contract status: The other aspect of Edler's future, which may play into the previous point, is that he is entering the the final year of a deal that pays him $3.25 million annually, after which he would become an unrestricted free agent. That also means the team can begin the process of re-signing him anytime after July 1.

Team options: Edler will certainly be seeking a healthy increase on his current salary, an increase that would make him the team's highest-paid D-man over a significant term. The Canucks have to decide whether Edler has the remaining up-side to justify such an investment. He's a tantalizing package of size, power and skill, but can he bring it consistently?

Key statistics:

-- His career-best points total (11-38-49) was tied (with Shea Weber) for sixth amongst NHL defencemen.

-- He was also tied at sixth with Weber for power-play points (22).

-- He was fourth in the league in shots by a defenceman (228).

-- He led the Canucks in blocked shots (145).

Read more: http://www.theprovin...l#ixzz26BtOlfFB"

If Alex Edler can play to or near his potential every game vs. disappearing in some games, there is real hope for the Canucks defense to take the next step into being one of the leagues best.

Neither Ehrhoff or Salo were the shutdown, physical defensman that Vancouver needed. Sami Salo was a great Canuck, no doubt, as his contributions in the offensive zone were essential to playoff success for the Canucks. His two goals in less than two minutes against San Jose are the stuff of legend. However, Sami never quite cut it as a physical defensman (except if your Brad Marchand who felt Sami to be a threat to his life.....what a rat). Garrison brings a much needed physicality to the blueline.