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How did the Canucks Lose so bad then ?


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#31 Wilbur

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Posted 08 September 2012 - 03:07 PM

*
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cuz they're the canucks.
what's changed?
they're still cupless 15 years later.

Let's see since then the Canucks have in those 15 years:

-made to a Stanley Cup final
-won their first 2 presidents trophies
-had players claim the franchises first ever Art Ross trophies in back to back years
-had a player win the franchises first ever Hart Trophy
-had the most exciting/energizing line in hockey for the better part of 2 years in the West Coast Express
-went from a franchise that was a "phone call away from being moved" to one of the richest, most stable, hockey businesses

We've had a lot to celebrate, do I need to go on?

I'd give my left nut for the Canucks to win the Cup but what's the point in only celebrating Stanley Cup wins? Sure, we shouldn't celebrate the above as much as we would a Cup win, but if the Stanley Cup was the only thing that was worth celebrating we'd be happy at most 1 night a year. That's not very entertaining.
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#32 TowelPower12

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Posted 08 September 2012 - 04:08 PM

messier was well past his prime, naslund and bertuzzi hadn't become stars yet, lots of the players hated mike keenan
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#33 thema

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Posted 08 September 2012 - 05:01 PM

Unless I'm mistaken this list doesn't even include the Canucks player of the year that year, the illustrious brown noser Brian Noonan (who played exactly 6 more NHL games after that year). Want to guess who did the selecting for this award?
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#34 van_ws

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Posted 08 September 2012 - 07:20 PM

The late 90s in particular were a very lousy time to be a sports fan in Vancouver, with the Canucks and Grizzlies losing so much.

Dark days indeed. Thank god we are long past them.
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#35 NucksBruins

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Posted 08 September 2012 - 07:45 PM

I remember that season, even have old Hockey News magazines and books from the late 90s. Anytime I get upset with the current Canucks, I look over that team.

I won't even consult those books for this though.

Pavel Bure - He stopped playing the physical game. He never stopped scoring, but he was streaky and it was obvious he wasn't happy in Vancouver and that he wanted out.

Trevor Linden - He did not mesh with Keenan at all. Few did.

Mark Messier - He was a total disaster in Vancouver through injury and unrealistic expectations heaped on him by the team and fans alike.

Alexander Mogilny - No one floated more than Mogilny. He was invisible and disinterested a LOT.

Marcus Naslund - As others have said, Markus (not Marcus) wasn't the 40 goal scorer he would become and was also a disaster early on in his Canucks career.

Todd Bertuzzi - He had injury issues and took time to develop as power forwards do.

Martin Gelinas - He was the one Canuck I was really upset over losing from that era, probably moreso than Greg Adams or Cliff Ronning who went a few years earlier.

Geoff Sanderson - He was a plug in Vancouver. He was very overrated and streaky.

Brad May - Why is he on the list? He was a decent fourth line guy, but never a game breaker.

Peter Zezel - Tail end of his career when he came to Vancouver. Not a top 6 guy at that point.

Gino Odjick - His days as a useful third line guy were done then.

Donald Brashear - He wound up scoring eleven goals one season more due to a lack of anyone to play ahead of him than anything else.

Mattias Ohlund - Rookie, talented, not a game breaker at that point either though.

Jyrki Lumme - On his way out the door, no one on the blueline has ever made me shout "Shoot the puck!" more than Lumme.

Adrian Aucoin - He had a couple of decent seasons, but he was young at that point as well.

Bryan Mcabe - McCabe would become a good defenceman and then get shipped out to get us the Sedins. In 97, he was still starting out.

Dana Murzyn - Great team guy, but a total pylon.

Grant Ledyard - He barely played for the Canucks, career was done when he got here.

Steve Staios - I am honestly surprised at the career he has put together since he was very average and lacked anything that made him look like a full time NHLer when he was here.

Kirk Mclean - Some careers slowly go downhill. Others steamroll into oblivion. McLean steamrolled.

Sean Burke - He never got a chance to prove himself in Vancouver. He came and went quickly after, part of the goalie graveyard issue.

Arturs Irbe - He was the most talented goaltender we had in the late 90s, but he was short so Keenan wanted him gone. It still baffles me that they let him go.

Corey Hirsch - There were flashes from Hirsch, but he never showed enough to convince anyone he was a starter at any point.

So, yeah, there isn't a good Canucks story to be had with any of these players at that time. The ownership was a joke, GM position in shambles, coaching without a plan and a team that didn't want to play in Vancouver and barely seemed to like each other some nights. They played like a team that was trying not to lose instead of a team that wanted to win.

This is why I appreciate the team the Canucks have now that much more.
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#36 TowelPower12

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Posted 08 September 2012 - 11:37 PM

The late 90s in particular were a very lousy time to be a sports fan in Vancouver, with the Canucks and Grizzlies losing so much.

Dark days indeed. Thank god we are long past them.


They'll be back once the Sedins/Kesler/Burrows etc. get older and eventually retire
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#37 Riviera82

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 07:28 AM

I remember that season, even have old Hockey News magazines and books from the late 90s. Anytime I get upset with the current Canucks, I look over that team.

I won't even consult those books for this though.

Pavel Bure - He stopped playing the physical game. He never stopped scoring, but he was streaky and it was obvious he wasn't happy in Vancouver and that he wanted out.

Trevor Linden - He did not mesh with Keenan at all. Few did.

Mark Messier - He was a total disaster in Vancouver through injury and unrealistic expectations heaped on him by the team and fans alike.

Alexander Mogilny - No one floated more than Mogilny. He was invisible and disinterested a LOT.

Marcus Naslund - As others have said, Markus (not Marcus) wasn't the 40 goal scorer he would become and was also a disaster early on in his Canucks career.

Todd Bertuzzi - He had injury issues and took time to develop as power forwards do.

Martin Gelinas - He was the one Canuck I was really upset over losing from that era, probably moreso than Greg Adams or Cliff Ronning who went a few years earlier.

Geoff Sanderson - He was a plug in Vancouver. He was very overrated and streaky.

Brad May - Why is he on the list? He was a decent fourth line guy, but never a game breaker.

Peter Zezel - Tail end of his career when he came to Vancouver. Not a top 6 guy at that point.

Gino Odjick - His days as a useful third line guy were done then.

Donald Brashear - He wound up scoring eleven goals one season more due to a lack of anyone to play ahead of him than anything else.

Mattias Ohlund - Rookie, talented, not a game breaker at that point either though.

Jyrki Lumme - On his way out the door, no one on the blueline has ever made me shout "Shoot the puck!" more than Lumme.

Adrian Aucoin - He had a couple of decent seasons, but he was young at that point as well.

Bryan Mcabe - McCabe would become a good defenceman and then get shipped out to get us the Sedins. In 97, he was still starting out.

Dana Murzyn - Great team guy, but a total pylon.

Grant Ledyard - He barely played for the Canucks, career was done when he got here.

Steve Staios - I am honestly surprised at the career he has put together since he was very average and lacked anything that made him look like a full time NHLer when he was here.

Kirk Mclean - Some careers slowly go downhill. Others steamroll into oblivion. McLean steamrolled.


Sean Burke - He never got a chance to prove himself in Vancouver. He came and went quickly after, part of the goalie graveyard issue.

Arturs Irbe - He was the most talented goaltender we had in the late 90s, but he was short so Keenan wanted him gone. It still baffles me that they let him go.

Corey Hirsch - There were flashes from Hirsch, but he never showed enough to convince anyone he was a starter at any point.

So, yeah, there isn't a good Canucks story to be had with any of these players at that time. The ownership was a joke, GM position in shambles, coaching without a plan and a team that didn't want to play in Vancouver and barely seemed to like each other some nights. They played like a team that was trying not to lose instead of a team that wanted to win.

This is why I appreciate the team the Canucks have now that much more.


Just about anybody's career would steamroll if their wife was cheating on them with a co-worker(teammate).
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#38 combover

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 10:28 AM

EGO's .

coach
leadership.
goaltending was inconsistent at the best of time for all the net minders invovled.
plus Murzyn
who one of the worst d-men to ever suit up for the nucks
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my warn status is for calling it like i saw it with Dave the donut Nonis. apparently the owners agreed

#39 Burnsey

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 01:35 PM

I wasn't properly into the Canucks and the NHL for that matter until the early 2000's. I know the late 90's were a dark time and when you see a team on paper you can't assume they will win the cup. I mean this time last year I thought Canucks looked better than the previous year and we were knocked out in the first round. Never thought LA would even be in the finals to begin with, yet they won the cup...
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#40 VanCityScout

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 02:00 PM

other teams were obviously a lot stronger and more skilled
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#41 VanCityScout

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 02:03 PM

Detroit won back to back cups around that time if I remember correctly


Scotty Bowman was large and in charge back then!!
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#42 RWMc1

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 02:04 PM

The room was split between Bure's offense only players and Linden's two-way players. When Messier the slime arrived, the room was splint into three factions. That's why they couldn't win.
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#43 riffraff

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 02:22 PM

EGO's .

coach
leadership.
goaltending was inconsistent at the best of time for all the net minders invovled.
plus Murzyn
who one of the worst d-men to ever suit up for the nucks


I remember hearing people scream, "get off the ice Nordmark!"

At least Dana would take a punch.
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CanucksSayEh, on 12 March 2013 - 10:12 PM, said:
When the playoffs come around, nobody is scared of getting in a fight, but every night, they get their mom to check under the bed for Raffi Torres.

#44 ThaBestPlaceOnEarth

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 02:49 PM

No chemistry, Keenan was terrible behind the bench, nobody was really on the same page. Keenan would trash guys in the press or to each other in the room as some kind of divide-and-conquer motivational technique, it didn't work at all, just made guys give up. Didn't help that it was only three years since the '94 series and now those guys had Keenan and Messier as coach/captain, just bad chemistry.
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Ceterum censeo Chicaginem delendam esse


#45 NucksBruins

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 03:22 PM

Just about anybody's career would steamroll if their wife was cheating on them with a co-worker(teammate).


Well that was why Jeff Brown was traded for a bag of pucks. I noticed he bounced around the league a lot after that, wondered if he started out asking his new teammates where the wives sit.
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#46 Mcfly

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 10:58 PM

From Quinn to Keenan?
That would shake up any team. Whether it was in a good way or a bad way is arguable.
I Couldn't get even behind Messier as our captain.

Didn't even watch again until the West Coast Express showed up.

Those were my dark Canuck fan days for sure.
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#47 D-Bo7

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Posted 09 September 2012 - 11:19 PM

Let's see since then the Canucks have in those 15 years:

-made to a Stanley Cup final
-won their first 2 presidents trophies
-had players claim the franchises first ever Art Ross trophies in back to back years
-had a player win the franchises first ever Hart Trophy
-had the most exciting/energizing line in hockey for the better part of 2 years in the West Coast Express
-went from a franchise that was a "phone call away from being moved" to one of the richest, most stable, hockey businesses

We've had a lot to celebrate, do I need to go on?

I'd give my left nut for the Canucks to win the Cup but what's the point in only celebrating Stanley Cup wins? Sure, we shouldn't celebrate the above as much as we would a Cup win, but if the Stanley Cup was the only thing that was worth celebrating we'd be happy at most 1 night a year. That's not very entertaining.


Totally agree. Obviously a cup would mean so much to Canucks fans, but it shouldn't completely discredit other successes.

There are lots of sports franchises with long histories of not winning it all, but they are still proud franchises with proud fans. There's no reason why Canucks fans shouldn't be the same way.

Look at the Blackhawks. It took them 50 years to win a cup post original 6, and now look how cocky all their fans are. One cup can change everything. Same with the Boston Bruins. It took them 40 years to win a cup since they won it back when the league was half the size and way less competitive.
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#48 brewdog

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 02:54 AM

The late 90s Canucks had a tonne of their own problems, but there were also some Godzillas in the Western Conference to contend with - Detroit, Colorado, Dallas, St Louis. Even if the Canucks were a cohesive team, they weren't going to beat any of those guys in the 2nd round.

It's no wonder I blanked out my memory of the Canucks from Linden's trade until the WCE emerged.
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#49 grandmaster

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 04:54 AM

The late 90s Canucks had a tonne of their own problems, but there were also some Godzillas in the Western Conference to contend with - Detroit, Colorado, Dallas, St Louis. Even if the Canucks were a cohesive team, they weren't going to beat any of those guys in the 2nd round.

It's no wonder I blanked out my memory of the Canucks from Linden's trade until the WCE emerged.


Those teams, minus St Louis, owned the Western Conference.

Our best had no chance against;

Colorado
Forsberg, Sakic, Hejduk, Tanguay, Blake, Foote, Roy

Detroit
Yzerman, Federov, Larionov, Shanahan, Lidstrom, Chelios, Hasek

Dallas
Modano, Hull, Nieuwendyk, Hatcher, Zubov, Sydor, Belfour
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Favorite all time Canuck: Bertuzzi 2002-2003 season
Most clutch all time Canuck: Linden 1994 Stanley Cup Playoffs
Most exciting all time Canuck: Pavel Bure 90's

#50 brewdog

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 06:29 AM

Those teams, minus St Louis, owned the Western Conference.

Our best had no chance against;

Colorado
Forsberg, Sakic, Hejduk, Tanguay, Blake, Foote, Roy

Detroit
Yzerman, Federov, Larionov, Shanahan, Lidstrom, Chelios, Hasek

Dallas
Modano, Hull, Nieuwendyk, Hatcher, Zubov, Sydor, Belfour


How many Hall of Famers do I count there? 15? Crazy teams, those were.
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#51 NucksBruins

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 06:55 AM

How many Hall of Famers do I count there? 15? Crazy teams, those were.


Smart management combined with high salaries certainly helped. The West winner was usually heavily favored against whoever emerged from the Eastern Conference and rightly so.
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#52 winacup

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 05:38 PM

Totally agree. Obviously a cup would mean so much to Canucks fans, but it shouldn't completely discredit other successes.

There are lots of sports franchises with long histories of not winning it all, but they are still proud franchises with proud fans. There's no reason why Canucks fans shouldn't be the same way.

Look at the Blackhawks. It took them 50 years to win a cup post original 6, and now look how cocky all their fans are. One cup can change everything. Same with the Boston Bruins. It took them 40 years to win a cup since they won it back when the league was half the size and way less competitive.


of course those teams have proud fans. their teams had won cups before.
we have no cups........ever. we therefore look like fools when we try to take pride in a president's trophy or a dvision banner.
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#53 D-Bo7

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 06:07 PM

of course those teams have proud fans. their teams had won cups before.
we have no cups........ever. we therefore look like fools when we try to take pride in a president's trophy or a dvision banner.


If the last time your team won was in the 60's or 70's, you don't have any more right to brag than us IMO.

If your team hasn't made the playoffs in the last 6 years, you shouldn't be bragging either.

I don't see anything wrong with bragging about recent accomplishments.
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#54 Pears

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 06:12 PM

If the last time your team won was in the 60's or 70's, you don't have any more right to brag than us IMO.

If your team hasn't made the playoffs in the last 6 years, you shouldn't be bragging either.

I don't see anything wrong with bragging about recent accomplishments.

He's a troll. Ignore him.
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#55 canucks.bradley

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 06:28 PM

serious sure,why not?
Dominate or not,Naslund and Bertuzzi still had skill set didnt they?
They were not expected to be the go to guys at the time, no pressure or top players/checkers to play against

I think canacks1970 response was a good reason why,as well as under performing


oh come on that is the most bs statement i have read all day. That is like saying stamkos as the age of should be good enough because he has the same skill? Look at Kesler. Kesler in 2005 is the same player he is today? The sedins of 2001 are the same player they are today?

bulls**t. your reasoning and logic is flawed
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3000th post - September, 2010

K guys I nd hlp fast. Im @ a girls I rly like & txtng from my iphone. I did a #2 in the bathroom and it plugged, water is almost overflowing toilet. Srsly I dunno wut 2 do somebody help!


Watch Bowness somehow mess up Tampa Bay's already amazing 2 powerplay units...he'll probably tell Stamkos to do drop passes from centre ice, take him out from the faceoff dot, and place him infront of the goalie :lol:


#56 ba;;isticsports

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 07:52 PM

oh come on that is the most bs statement i have read all day. That is like saying stamkos as the age of should be good enough because he has the same skill? Look at Kesler. Kesler in 2005 is the same player he is today? The sedins of 2001 are the same player they are today?

bulls**t. your reasoning and logic is flawed


are you off Your meds?
Geez if not please look into something
Naslund was Not a 18 yr old kid
He was 24 !
Naslund was Not the 1st line Player,So Naslund Never had to play against the Top players in the League
I Never said Naslund was the Naslund he would later become
I said he had to have had the skill set and dedication to have become that player
Try comprehending what You read,before spouting off on someone


In
2001 Henrik Sedin was 20
2005 Kesler was 21
Stamkos became the 6th player in NHL history to score over 50 goals before turning 23
your point and logic are ?

I suggest that makes Your Post the most bs You should have read all day ! ( problem is Your comprehending what You write too I suppose) and therefore makes Your logic flawed

Edited by ba;;isticsports, 10 September 2012 - 08:02 PM.

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#57 Riviera82

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 08:01 PM

If the last time your team won was in the 60's or 70's, you don't have any more right to brag than us IMO.

If your team hasn't made the playoffs in the last 6 years, you shouldn't be bragging either.

I don't see anything wrong with bragging about recent accomplishments.


We have had our fill of regular season accomplishments. The Stanley Cup is all that counts now. Who really brags about Presidents Trophies or division titles?
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#58 D-Bo7

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 08:09 PM

We have had our fill of regular season accomplishments. The Stanley Cup is all that counts now. Who really brags about Presidents Trophies or division titles?


I would take those over missing the playoffs year in and year out and not improving.

People who remember the dark Keenan years should realize how fortunate we are to have such stable ownership and a chance to win every season.

If we knock on the door enough times year after year, eventually we're gonna break through. Until then it's important to look on the bright side, and not be bitter self loathing fans.
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#59 brewdog

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 08:31 PM

If a TO fan is ever giving you a hard time about the lack of Vancouver Cups, remind them that the Leafs have never won a Cup that required more than 2 series wins.

Can you believe that the Islanders won 19 straight Playoff series? Just think about that.
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#60 Riviera82

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Posted 10 September 2012 - 08:49 PM

Good points D-Bo7 and brewdog ^^. Noted but still not satisfied.
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