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#91 Sharpshooter

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 11:57 PM

I don't know, but with all these muslim extremists, its probably a smart idea not to release cartoons, movies etc that make fun of or bash their religion. These types of things just gives them more motivation to do these things.


Then there's something wrong with those people obviously.

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#92 dajusta

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:01 AM

Oh great, i've taken post-secondary cultural anthropology as well and comparative religions courses.

And you're right, it doesn't.....nor any expertise in seeing religiously motivated violence for what it is as well.


So what? You're back peddling now?

I'l say it again, shame on the creator of the video, for foolishly making a video that just causes more harm and suffering.

The fact that the guy is in hiding is indicative of his own shame. He won't even use his real name. What shame.
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#93 Pouria

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:00 AM

blah blah blah blood for oil blah blah blah athiests bashing religion blah blah blah religious people being all post-modern all of a sudden, do you people realize how boring these political threads are?


Maybe to little kids. Do you want to talk about iPhone 5 and how people will now spend their savings to buy one. I guess that is more important news than the current major world events.

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#94 dajusta

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:06 AM

The Young Turks breaks it down - shows that actors had no idea the movie was on Muhammad because during filming, they used the name 'Master George' ... the creator of the video dubbed in Muhammad afterwards. Skip to 6:00.

The cast and crew were duped into making this horrific movie.


Edited by dajusta, 13 September 2012 - 12:09 AM.

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#95 Pouria

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:10 AM

Then there's something wrong with those people obviously.


I know for a fact that Muslims take their religion more seriously than Christians, to the point where they would shed blood for it. The fact that Islam is way more strict than Christianity when it comes to prayers, marriage, ect. shows how much influence it can have on the daily life of an individual. I mean time and time again, these things have happened in response to something that made fun of the Muslims and yet people don't learn from this lesson and keep releasing movies, cartoons and caricatures that make fun of their religion. Then you wonder what happened? Duh...

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#96 VICanucksfan5551

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:10 AM

blah blah blah blood for oil blah blah blah athiests bashing religion blah blah blah religious people being all post-modern all of a sudden, do you people realize how boring these political threads are?

I didn't realize that they were around to entertain you. Hey guys, change it up a little. Humble Rodent is bored.
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#97 Pouria

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:14 AM

So what? You're back peddling now?

I'l say it again, shame on the creator of the video, for foolishly making a video that just causes more harm and suffering.

The fact that the guy is in hiding is indicative of his own shame. He won't even use his real name. What shame.


Yep, I don't know why they keep doing this. People here will say about freedom of speech and blah blah, but those things don't exist in the middle east. Nothing might happen here but the consequence is different overseas.

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#98 Pouria

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:15 AM

I didn't realize that they were around to entertain you. Hey guys, change it up a little. Humble Rodent is bored.


I say if he wants to be entertained, he should take a trip to Libya. He will be REALLY entertained there lol

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#99 dajusta

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:15 AM

Yep, I don't know why they keep doing this. People here will say about freedom of speech and blah blah, but those things don't exist in the middle east. Nothing might happen here but the consequence is different overseas.


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#100 Canada Hockey Place

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:24 AM

...........U.S. officials believe the militants were using the demonstration against the video as a cover to get into the consulate and then take as much revenge as they could on Americans, Martin reports.

While the White House has been hesitant to call the attack planned, House Intelligence Committee Chairman Mike Rogers was not so ambiguous.

"Absolutely it's a terrorist attack," Rogers told CBS News Capitol Hill producer Jill Jackson. "This was not done by the Libyan government. It was done by an external group we believe has at least extremist ties, maybe al Qaeda ties, and the style and the signature of the attack clearly would be something that we have seen before and would be in line with something al Qaeda would do."


http://www.cbsnews.c...-hunt-in-libya/
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#101 لني

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:25 AM

so you think the middle east is the same as Hitler and Nazi Germany? That's what your sentence implies.


A caliphate could be comparable to the Reichs intentions.
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It is not my intent to get in circular arguments with anybody. The reason i have avoided saying anything specific is because i know you or someone else will attempt to find an alternate explanation to my points which i intern will have to defend. I see no point in getting involved with the circular argument that is already well under way in this thread. I simply intended to voice my opinion on the subject. In the end either you accept the possibility of corruption and conspiracy or you don't.

Also i find your comments to be very childish. Does taking what i say out of context, paraphrasing and misquoting it make you feel good about yourself? Grow up.


Logic at its finest.

#102 Bill Sikes

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 03:51 AM

I know for a fact that Muslims take their religion more seriously than Christians, to the point where they would shed blood for it. The fact that Islam is way more strict than Christianity when it comes to prayers, marriage, ect. shows how much influence it can have on the daily life of an individual. I mean time and time again, these things have happened in response to something that made fun of the Muslims and yet people don't learn from this lesson and keep releasing movies, cartoons and caricatures that make fun of their religion. Then you wonder what happened? Duh...

So its perfectly acceptable to kill people and burn buildings down because you don't like a movie or cartoon? Maybe if they take it so seriously they should try READING THEIR OWN BOOK, suicide is forbidden, so is killing for revenge or any reason other than self defense (this is actually true for all the Abrahamic faiths from what I have read). If Muslims want to be respected perhaps they should try showing some respect, when they show nothing but contempt for the rest of the world what do you think they will get back?

Edited by Norman Clegg, 13 September 2012 - 04:15 AM.

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#103 Carpe Diem

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 05:30 AM

So what? You're back peddling now?

I'l say it again, shame on the creator of the video, for foolishly making a video that just causes more harm and suffering.

The fact that the guy is in hiding is indicative of his own shame. He won't even use his real name. What shame.


No. The fact that one can have his own life threatened for making a stupid movie is the shame.

#104 Carpe Diem

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 05:34 AM

And how are you going to do that?? Wipe them off the map lol! That won't happen because if it did, it wouldn't just be the middle east, it would be Asia, Africa, North America etc etc. you get my point.


no. Their idealogy needs to be wiped. Christian used to behave like this and they stopped. Due to the enlightenment and secularism. The same needs to happen in the muslim world.

#105 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 08:24 AM

Agreed. World peace starts with a secular middle east. Starts.

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#106 bolt

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 08:39 AM

Wow, I wouldn't want Romney anywhere close from being able to orchestrate attacks and or possible nuclear strikes. Made constant stupid lack of judgement mistakes throughout his entire life. For instance, he chained his dog on the top of his car and thinks it was perfectly fine. What a nut job. I guess there would be no dog as a the traditional whitehouse pet if the American people are dumb enough to vote him in. People like him are the reason why Americans are so hated around the world.

Edited by bolt, 13 September 2012 - 08:41 AM.




#107 Sharpshooter

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 08:55 AM

I know for a fact that Muslims take their religion more seriously than Christians, to the point where they would shed blood for it. The fact that Islam is way more strict than Christianity when it comes to prayers, marriage, ect. shows how much influence it can have on the daily life of an individual. I mean time and time again, these things have happened in response to something that made fun of the Muslims and yet people don't learn from this lesson and keep releasing movies, cartoons and caricatures that make fun of their religion. Then you wonder what happened? Duh...


I agree that Muslims can be very fanatical and especially militant due to the intensity of their brainwashing and the lack of reformation and enlightenment period that's never occurred in that particular cult.

I would have no doubts that a muslim from today from many parts of the world would have no trouble or real changes in their daily lives if they were among the fellow desert dwellers 500 years ago. In fact they may actually prefer the more puritan surroundings.

You can lead the uncivilized out of the desert but you can't make them civil.

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#108 Zamboni_14

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:09 AM

I know for a fact that Muslims take their religion more seriously than Christians, to the point where they would shed blood for it. The fact that Islam is way more strict than Christianity when it comes to prayers, marriage, ect. shows how much influence it can have on the daily life of an individual. I mean time and time again, these things have happened in response to something that made fun of the Muslims and yet people don't learn from this lesson and keep releasing movies, cartoons and caricatures that make fun of their religion. Then you wonder what happened? Duh...


does that excuse the actions taken for "revenge?" If we wanted to use that logic, than you've just justified any civilians killed by the US in the middle east since the Iranian hostage crisis.

#109 Sharpshooter

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:23 AM

And there we have it.....looks like my suspicions were correct....a christian pretending to be a jew attacking muslims and muslims knee-jerkingly react.



Convicted criminal revealed as filmmaker behind anti-Islam YouTube clip that incited deadly riots

Convicted criminal Nakoula Basseley Nakoula is behind the anti-Muslim film being blamed for mob attacks in Egypt, Libya and Yemen that have led to the deaths of four Americans, including Christopher Stevens, the U.S. ambassador to Libya, a U.S. law enforcement official has confirmed.

A man who calls himself Sam Bacile has said he created the film, but The Associated Press on Wednesday connected Nakoula to the Bacile persona.

The official spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to discuss an ongoing investigation.

As part of his sentence after being convicted on bank fraud charges in 2010, Nakoula was forbidden from using computers or the Internet without permission from his probation officer, adding another wrinkle to Nakoula’s alleged online activity under the name “Sam Bacile.”

The self-proclaimed director of “Innocence of Muslims” initially claimed a Jewish and Israeli background. But others involved in the film said his statements were contrived as evidence mounted that the film’s key player was a southern Californian Coptic Christian with a checkered past.

Nakoula, 55, told The Associated Press in an interview outside Los Angeles Wednesday that he managed logistics for the company that produced “Innocence of Muslims,” which mocked Muslims and the prophet Muhammad.

Nakoula denied he had directed the film, though he said he knew the self-described filmmaker, Sam Bacile. But the mobile phone number that the AP contacted Tuesday to reach the filmmaker who identified himself as Bacile traced to the same address near Los Angeles where Nakoula was located.

Nakoula told the AP he is a Coptic Christian and supported the concerns of Christian Copts about their treatment by Muslims.


The film was implicated in protests that resulted in the burning of the U.S. consulate Tuesday in the eastern Libyan city of Benghazi. Libyan officials said Wednesday that Ambassador Chris Stevens and three other embassy employees were killed during the mob violence, but U.S. officials now say they are investigating whether the assault was a planned terrorist strike linked to Tuesday’s 11-year anniversary of the Sept. 11 terror attacks.

Nakoula denied he had posed as Bacile. Federal court papers filed in a 2010 criminal prosecution against him said Nakoula had used numerous aliases in the past. Among the fake names, the documents said, were Nicola Bacily and Erwin Salameh.

During a conversation outside his home, Nakoula offered his driver’s license to show his identity but kept his thumb over his middle name, Basseley. Records checks by the AP subsequently found that middle name as well as other connections to the Bacile persona.

The AP located Bacile after obtaining his cellphone number from Morris Sadek, a conservative Coptic Christian in the U.S. who had promoted the anti-Muslim film in recent days on his website. Egypt’s Christian Coptic populace has long decried what they describe as a history of discrimination and occasional violence from the country’s Arab majority.

Pastor Terry Jones, of Gainesville, Florida, who sparked outrage in the Arab world when he burned Qurans on the ninth anniversary of Sept. 11, said he spoke with the movie’s director on the phone Wednesday and prayed for him. Jones said he has not met the filmmaker in person but added that the man contacted him a few weeks ago about promoting the movie. Jones and others who have dealt with the filmmaker said Wednesday that Bacile was hiding his real identity.

“I have not met him. Sam Bacile, that is not his real name,” Jones said. “I just talked to him on the phone. He is definitely in hiding and does not reveal his identity. He was quite honestly fairly shook up concerning the events and what is happening. A lot of people are not supporting him. He was generally a little shook up concerning this situation.”

The YouTube account under the username “Sam Bacile,” which was used to publish excerpts of the provocative movie in July, was used to post comments online as recently as Tuesday, including this defence of the film written in Arabic: “It is a 100% American movie, you cows.”

Nakoula, who talked guardedly about his role, pleaded no contest in 2010 to federal bank fraud charges in California and was ordered to pay more than $790,000 in restitution. He was also sentenced to 21 months in federal prison and ordered not to use computers or the Internet for five years without approval from his probation officer.

Cont'd....

http://news.national...d-deadly-riots/


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#110 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:23 AM

Warlords are warlords, regardless of religion. What, Muslims are more prone to violence than Christians? Please...

This kind of thinking is at the root of the problem. Christians are not 'holier' in any way. Present day or historically. But of course both sides think they are good, and that God is on their side. It's bloody ridiculous to assume this, but that's not the point. The point is to justify their atrocities through 'God's will'. And that is also bloody ridiculous, since both their rulebooks clearly specify that it's very wrong to commit these atrocities.

If both sides were agnostic instead, you'd find that IQ's would shoot way up and that the amount of wars would go way down. In fact, there might not even be any 'sides' at all. Instead of pretending to know everything, they (we) would be focusing on learning. Like what we should be doing as human beings.

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#111 taxi

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:27 AM

I agree that Muslims can be very fanatical and especially militant due to the intensity of their brainwashing and the lack of reformation and enlightenment period that's never occurred in that particular cult.

I would have no doubts that a muslim from today from many parts of the world would have no trouble or real changes in their daily lives if they were among the fellow desert dwellers 500 years ago. In fact they may actually prefer the more puritan surroundings.

You can lead the uncivilized out of the desert but you can't make them civil.


500 years ago islam was in many ways less puritan that it is now. The Saudis have done a great job of spreading their own brand of religion around the world. Wahhabism and Salafism, which is where many of the less moderate strains of islam come from, weren't founded until the 18th century.

#112 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:27 AM

There are fanatics on all sides. These few people are the problem.

The vast majority of the people on the planet are prepared to live in peace. We are the ones who need to act. Unfortunately, we're all waiting for something. And we've been trained to expect an end more than a new beginning.

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#113 Dittohead

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:40 AM

well maybe the other 2 billion Muslims should do something about these groups that are giving their faith and culture a bad name instead of protecting them. If it's so few of them.

#114 Sharpshooter

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:42 AM

500 years ago islam was in many ways less puritan that it is now. The Saudis have done a great job of spreading their own brand of religion around the world. Wahhabism and Salafism, which is where many of the less moderate strains of islam come from, weren't founded until the 18th century.


Were they riding around on horses killing people in the name of Islam all over the Arabian Penninsula, before the wahabi's injected their desert tribal customs?

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#115 Sharpshooter

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:44 AM

well maybe the other 2 billion Muslims should do something about these groups that are giving their faith and culture a bad name instead of protecting them. If it's so few of them.


Nah, they prefer to give cover instead. Plus, they're just as much bullied by the violent ones as the rest of world is, except they don't do anything much to combat them and their violence.

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#116 taxi

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:48 AM

Were they riding around on horses killing people in the name of Islam all over the Arabian Penninsula, before the wahabi's injected their desert tribal customs?


Some were. Other muslims had formed complex societies that were way ahead of the curb on human rights and scientific advances.

#117 Sharpshooter

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:59 AM

Some were. Other muslims had formed complex societies that were way ahead of the curb on human rights and scientific advances.


Islam did not advance science. I don't know where you got that idea from. If anything they retarded the gains that were made, by the Arabs of the time....which I agree were much more advanced than other cultures at the time. We owe algebra and mamy astronomical discoveries to the early arab civilizations.

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#118 dajusta

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:03 PM

And there we have it.....looks like my suspicions were correct....a christian pretending to be a jew attacking muslims and muslims knee-jerkingly react.


Yup, you are back peddling.

Shame on this stupid video maker, who makes a really dumb video, sure expressing his freedom, but to what avail? To what purpose? Causing more death and destruction?

You just don't do that. Don't add fuel to the fire.
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#119 Mr. Ambien

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:17 PM

Yup, you are back peddling.

Shame on this stupid video maker, who makes a really dumb video, sure expressing his freedom, but to what avail? To what purpose? Causing more death and destruction?

You just don't do that. Don't add fuel to the fire.

Shame on Muslims who suppress and publicly denounce equality for females and homosexuals. To what avail? To what purpose? Causing more death and destruction? You just don't do that, don't add fuel to the fire.

This blaming expression thing for murder and terrorism sure is fun, thanks for showing me how. Now if only there was someone to commit violence upon misogynists and homophobes there. Hell, a one word, one bomb philosophy seems fine to me, and justifiable too thanks to the logic provided to me here.

Edited by zaibatsu, 13 September 2012 - 12:20 PM.


#120 dajusta

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Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:37 PM

Shame on Muslims who suppress and publicly denounce equality for females and homosexuals. To what avail? To what purpose? Causing more death and destruction? You just don't do that, don't add fuel to the fire.

This blaming expression thing for murder and terrorism sure is fun, thanks for showing me how. Now if only there was someone to commit violence upon misogynists and homophobes there. Hell, a one word, one bomb philosophy seems fine to me, and justifiable too thanks to the logic provided to me here.


Not sure if you are ignorant or purposely facetious.

Did I ever condone what Muslim lifestyle and culture is? No. Did I ever condone the treatment of women in Muslim family structure? No. Not once did I uphold their religion or lifestyle that of Muslims.. So don't make it sound like I do.

If you look at the immensely dire situation of the middle east and review all the solutions there are to it.. the last thing you want to do is make a gut wrenching and insulting video about them and their beliefs.

That's like poking George W. Bush in the face when he's holding on to the most destructive nuclear trigger this earth has to offer.

YOU JUST DON'T DO IT.

The creator of the video even knows it. He's in freaking hiding right now. He used a different name.

Don't even try and label the knee-jerk reaction at the US Embassy a form of "terrorism".. that just flat out labels you to new lows.

Edited by dajusta, 13 September 2012 - 12:42 PM.

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