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[Discussion] Roberto Luongo Trade Thread 3.0


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#331 oldnews

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 12:30 AM

Again, Luongo - BETTER THAN CAREER AVERAGE NUMBERS LAST YEAR

DERP!

You can use the one year argument if you want, whatever. What you can't do, though, is say that Lecavalier's declining because his numbers are declining, but the Sedin's aren't declining because their numbers are also declining. Comparing it to their historical average? Really? That's your answer? Hilarious. It's not Lecavalier's fault that the Sedin's used to suck, which brings down their average significantly.


ReDerp
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#332 The Kassassin Train

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 01:34 AM

This thread is hilarious I'm going to laugh so hard at everyone debating about the Laffs fragile core if MG doesn't even deal him to the Laffs.

I'm going to say that if we do deal Luongo with the Laffs you're seeing this coming back AT LEAST...

Colborne + Kulemin +
Colborne + Grabo +
Colborne + Carter + 1st

Kadri + Kulemin +
Kadri + Grabo +
Kadri + Carter + 1st

Gardiner + 1st + Cap dump.

That's all.
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The key difference is that Sopel can fill in for Seabrook and Campbell just fine. Bieksa, he is garbage so in that sense he is like the worst defenseman in the league.


When Cody (Hodgson) gets older, he might be better than Datsyuk.


Let's not push this guy (Kassian). He's still immature, and if he fails on the 2nd line it's because he isn't ready. Some guys really need years to develop, it's how well and how fast players adapt to the game. In my opinion, I'd rather have Horvat getting 2nd line minutes. He will start off on the 3rd line next season but I see him making the transition, being a great compliment to whoever plays his wings.

At this point, I don't see Kassian fitting in to any role other than a 3rd. If players like Kassian start getting 2nd line minutes then we just stay inconsistent as a team.


The idiocy on CDC....

#333 Pears

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 01:36 AM

Gardiner + 1st + Cap dump.

Deal.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

   ryan kesler is going to the chicago blackhawks ...       quote me on it


#334 The Bookie

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 02:17 AM

Mullet, would you seriously take that over Colborne+Carter+1st?
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#335 Ossi Vaananen

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 02:28 AM

Mullet, would you seriously take that over Colborne+Carter+1st?


Does he mean Carter Ashton, as in the last name Ashton? I doubt this kid gets traded twice in a year. He was Toronto's deadline pick up last year, managed to rack up a -10 in 15 games... Colborne has also been a disappointment, 3rd liner at best.

Ya I'd take Gardiner, probably the Leafs best defenseman, and what would be a very high 1st for Luongo. Doesn't matter if Komisarek comes back our way, I'm sure he'll shine on the Wolves.
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Credit to -Vintage Canuck-


#336 Pears

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 02:55 AM

Mullet, would you seriously take that over Colborne+Carter+1st?

I'd take Gardiner, 1st and a cap dump (Lombardi, Connolly, Komisarek etc) and not look back. Like really, we don't know much about Colbourne other than he's big, same thing with Ashton. With Gardiner we have a young, puck-moving D man who others have said is the Leafs' best D man. And if the 'cap dump' is either Lombardi or Connolly instead of Komisarek I'd be extremely happy with that deal.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

   ryan kesler is going to the chicago blackhawks ...       quote me on it


#337 King of the ES

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 05:46 AM

Schneider's value is going nowhere but up.
Luongo's value is steady - perennial top 10 guy.
You've been whining for a hundred pages that Gillis blew it, should have moved Schneider, waited too long, fighting for table scraps now for Luongo, waivers, blah blah etc.
But what you say about the guy you claim he should have kept -
"He's now 33, has a shaky reputation, and is coming off of a so-so year on the President's Trophy team. If you think this is the same guy that arrived in 2006, you are dreaming."
Why keep him then, king of contradictions?


Very dangerous thing to say, right there - "nowhere but up". That's total speculation. NHL history is littered with guys who theoretically should've gotten better, but they really didn't. I'm not saying that it's going to happen, but I'm also certainly not ruling it out. I think that there are a lot of negatives about the Canucks right now, and that this season has disaster potential for this team if/when it starts.

We at least know what Luongo is, whereas Schneider is a 1st-time starter. On this team, a 1st-time starter doesn't seem too wise. Too much risk.

And even though Luongo's not the guy that he was in 2006, that doesn't mean that he can't still be very good, which he is. Goalies tend to be more durable than players, and the decline is not as noticeable/impactful.
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#338 Boudrias

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 09:02 AM

Gardiner looked good in the Marlie-Dogs game. Is he L or R?
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#339 oldnews

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 09:18 AM

Gardiner looked good in the Marlie-Dogs game. Is he L or R?


L
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#340 oldnews

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 09:20 AM

I think that there are a lot of negatives about the Canucks right now,
this season has disaster potential for this team if/when it starts.
Too much risk.


King in a nutshell

Edited by oldnews, 22 October 2012 - 09:23 AM.

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#341 The-Impersonator

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 11:19 AM

Lu 100% wants to go to Florida but Florida is using this trying to not trade us back anything of significance. The Oilers are making a hard play for him. They know they can't keep all their young stars. They are dangling Gagner since he's dad works for the organization and they are trying to use that. Gillis is intrigued enough that he's made a counter proposal which includes one of the young stars but don't think the Oilers will bite. He'll end up in Toronto. Burke will make the best offer since he know's the Leafs haven't made the playoffs in 8 years and Lu will get them there.
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#342 elvis15

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 11:23 AM

Lu 100% wants to go to Florida but Florida is using this trying to not trade us back anything of significance. The Oilers are making a hard play for him. They know they can't keep all their young stars. They are dangling Gagner since he's dad works for the organization and they are trying to use that. Gillis is intrigued enough that he's made a counter proposal which includes one of the young stars but don't think the Oilers will bite. He'll end up in Toronto. Burke will make the best offer since he know's the Leafs haven't made the playoffs in 8 years and Lu will get them there.

Do you have a source detailing the Edmonton info you mentioned? I haven't heard anything other than rumblings from Botchford that Edmonton might be a destination, which I don't really see.

Edited by elvis15, 22 October 2012 - 11:23 AM.

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Tanev is going to EDM. I can put my life savings down on it

 


#343 The-Impersonator

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 11:53 AM

Do you have a source detailing the Edmonton info you mentioned? I haven't heard anything other than rumblings from Botchford that Edmonton might be a destination, which I don't really see.


Yes.

However, I just don't see Edmonton giving up what Vancouver wants, especially to a Division rival and Lu may not be as likely to go to waive his NTC to go there. Toronto is at least only a 2 hour or so flight to FLA.
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#344 elvis15

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 12:14 PM

Yes.

However, I just don't see Edmonton giving up what Vancouver wants, especially to a Division rival and Lu may not be as likely to go to waive his NTC to go there. Toronto is at least only a 2 hour or so flight to FLA.

:picard:

Perhaps I should be more specific: what is the source you have for the Edmonton info you mentioned?
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Tanev is going to EDM. I can put my life savings down on it

 


#345 The-Impersonator

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 12:44 PM

:picard:

Perhaps I should be more specific: what is the source you have for the Edmonton info you mentioned?


I am sorry, I am not going to tell you that in respect of where I get the info from.
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#346 elvis15

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 12:48 PM

I am sorry, I am not going to tell you that in respect of where I get the info from.

So, in other words, you have no identifiable source and we have no reason to believe you. Do you by chance have a twitter account that spells your name as @Thee-Impersonatorr?
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Tanev is going to EDM. I can put my life savings down on it

 


#347 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 01:02 PM

Mullet, would you seriously take that over Colborne+Carter+1st?


Gardiner > or = Colbourne + Ashton

I would do that Gardiner deal in a heatbeat.

But there is absolutely no chance in.. Heck that Gardiner is in the deal, he's pretty much untouchable right now.
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#348 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 01:07 PM

This thread is hilarious I'm going to laugh so hard at everyone debating about the Laffs fragile core if MG doesn't even deal him to the Laffs.

I'm going to say that if we do deal Luongo with the Laffs you're seeing this coming back AT LEAST...

Colborne + Kulemin +
Colborne + Grabo +
Colborne + Carter + 1st

Kadri + Kulemin +
Kadri + Grabo +
Kadri + Carter + 1st

Gardiner + 1st + Cap dump.

That's all.


No chance of the Gardiner deal, 0 chance.

- Burke doesn't wanna give up the first, so the Colbourne/Kadri + Ashton + 1st Deal's would be more like: Kadri/Colbourne + Ashton + 2nd.

- If Grabo is the roster player we get, there won't be an extra +, it will just be Grabo and one other thing.

- I don't really think they wanna give up Kulemin all that much either, but ditto probably goes above, if we do get 2 extra things, it will be a Colbourne/Kadri/Ashton type thing and probably a 2nd or 3rd.
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#349 The Bookie

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 01:21 PM

Gardiner is hyped beyond belief in TO. I watch all their games, he is a great player but he's not what we need, not assuming we keep Edler and Garrison and have Connauton on the way up.
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#350 sampy

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 01:37 PM

Ray Ferraro on 1040 this morning was saying the Canucks should take Bozak over Colbourne.

Lu, Sauve, Alberts, 3rd
For
Bozak, Gardiner/Rielly and Connolly (cap dump)

Edited by sampy, 22 October 2012 - 01:39 PM.

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#351 The-Impersonator

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 02:08 PM

So, in other words, you have no identifiable source and we have no reason to believe you. Do you by chance have a twitter account that spells your name as @Thee-Impersonatorr?


No, that is not my twitter account.
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#352 elvis15

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 02:48 PM

No, that is not my twitter account.

Posted Image

Edited by elvis15, 22 October 2012 - 02:51 PM.

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Tanev is going to EDM. I can put my life savings down on it

 


#353 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 03:09 PM

Ray Ferraro on 1040 this morning was saying the Canucks should take Bozak over Colbourne.

Lu, Sauve, Alberts, 3rd
For
Bozak, Gardiner/Rielly and Connolly (cap dump)


We won't get either.

I would take Bozak over Colbourne myself aswell.
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#354 The Kassassin Train

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 05:17 PM

No chance of the Gardiner deal, 0 chance.

- Burke doesn't wanna give up the first, so the Colbourne/Kadri + Ashton + 1st Deal's would be more like: Kadri/Colbourne + Ashton + 2nd.

- If Grabo is the roster player we get, there won't be an extra +, it will just be Grabo and one other thing.

- I don't really think they wanna give up Kulemin all that much either, but ditto probably goes above, if we do get 2 extra things, it will be a Colbourne/Kadri/Ashton type thing and probably a 2nd or 3rd.


Personally I don't see Luongo going to the Leafs. I believe Gillis this time around. Comfortable with Luongo on the team then the trade deadline...more suitors.
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The key difference is that Sopel can fill in for Seabrook and Campbell just fine. Bieksa, he is garbage so in that sense he is like the worst defenseman in the league.


When Cody (Hodgson) gets older, he might be better than Datsyuk.


Let's not push this guy (Kassian). He's still immature, and if he fails on the 2nd line it's because he isn't ready. Some guys really need years to develop, it's how well and how fast players adapt to the game. In my opinion, I'd rather have Horvat getting 2nd line minutes. He will start off on the 3rd line next season but I see him making the transition, being a great compliment to whoever plays his wings.

At this point, I don't see Kassian fitting in to any role other than a 3rd. If players like Kassian start getting 2nd line minutes then we just stay inconsistent as a team.


The idiocy on CDC....

#355 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 05:44 PM

Personally I don't see Luongo going to the Leafs. I believe Gillis this time around. Comfortable with Luongo on the team then the trade deadline...more suitors.


I highly doubt that, who else is going to jump in?

There are only two options.

- Florida

- Toronto

I dont see anyone else seriously jumping in like they have.

Who else do you have in mind?
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#356 TmanVan

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 06:48 PM

I highly doubt that, who else is going to jump in?

There are only two options.

- Florida

- Toronto

I dont see anyone else seriously jumping in like they have.

Who else do you have in mind?


Chicago, Tampa Bay, New Jersey, Edmonton, Columbus, San Jose, Washington, Ottawa to name a few.

I think people are underestimating how quickly a teams situation can change. If Luongo does end up starting the season with the Canucks there are numerous scenarios that can take place over a relatively short period of time.

What if Braden Holtby absolutely tanks Steve Mason style? What if Anders Lindback is nowhere near ready to be an nhl starter? What if Brodeur has a freak injury pretty much assuring he will not return? What if the Islanders bury DiPietro in the minors or buy him out? What if Columbus is better than expected and gives us an offer we absolutely can't refuse so they can make a playoff push? What if San Jose simply decides to go in a different direction instead of Niemi?

Don't reiterate that crap about "well Luongo won't waive his no trade clause to go there....." If we're testing Luongo's pride vs Mike Gillis' patience I put my money on Mike Gillis' patience everytime. I can see Luongo waving his no trade clause even for a place like Long Island or Columbus if it meant he was the number 1 guaranteed starter ( and assuming they had a decent chance at the playoffs at the time Luongo was to be traded)
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#357 oldnews

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 07:16 PM

Chicago, Tampa Bay, New Jersey, Edmonton, Columbus, San Jose, Washington, Ottawa to name a few.

I think people are underestimating how quickly a teams situation can change. If Luongo does end up starting the season with the Canucks there are numerous scenarios that can take place over a relatively short period of time.

What if Braden Holtby absolutely tanks Steve Mason style? What if Anders Lindback is nowhere near ready to be an nhl starter? What if Brodeur has a freak injury pretty much assuring he will not return? What if the Islanders bury DiPietro in the minors or buy him out? What if Columbus is better than expected and gives us an offer we absolutely can't refuse so they can make a playoff push? What if San Jose simply decides to go in a different direction instead of Niemi?

Don't reiterate that crap about "well Luongo won't waive his no trade clause to go there....." If we're testing Luongo's pride vs Mike Gillis' patience I put my money on Mike Gillis' patience everytime. I can see Luongo waving his no trade clause even for a place like Long Island or Columbus if it meant he was the number 1 guaranteed starter ( and assuming they had a decent chance at the playoffs at the time Luongo was to be traded)


A source with no credibility suggested that Luongo vetoed a deal to Toronto for Schenn. A poster here parroted that nonsense endlessly, but neither his nor his source's words were capable of making myth into truth. In fact, the same source later backtracked and acknowledged that Gillis actually rejected that offer and countered with a deal that would be acceptable to Vancouver.

Luongo has said he'd like to go to Florida, but he also followed that statement directly with a number of qualifiers - that it would have to depend on them wanting him, and that he's not going to stand in the way of other deals.

In fact, Luongo's position has been pretty consistent and very amenable: "I'll waive my no-trade clause if I'm asked to" ... and he's been pretty unambiguous... "I don't want to be one of those guys that will stand in the way of anything".

In other words, I agree when you say "dont reiterate that crap" - there are some people assuming on Luongo's behalf that he would refuse to waive to go to certain destinations - they literally don't know what they are talking about.
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#358 oldnews

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 07:20 PM

So you agree then that Garrison is on the rise.


Well played.

Oh, but Garrison has only had one (or two) good years hahaha!!
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#359 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 07:21 PM

Chicago, Tampa Bay, New Jersey, Edmonton, Columbus, San Jose, Washington, Ottawa to name a few.

I think people are underestimating how quickly a teams situation can change. If Luongo does end up starting the season with the Canucks there are numerous scenarios that can take place over a relatively short period of time.

What if Braden Holtby absolutely tanks Steve Mason style? What if Anders Lindback is nowhere near ready to be an nhl starter? What if Brodeur has a freak injury pretty much assuring he will not return? What if the Islanders bury DiPietro in the minors or buy him out? What if Columbus is better than expected and gives us an offer we absolutely can't refuse so they can make a playoff push? What if San Jose simply decides to go in a different direction instead of Niemi?

Don't reiterate that crap about "well Luongo won't waive his no trade clause to go there....." If we're testing Luongo's pride vs Mike Gillis' patience I put my money on Mike Gillis' patience everytime. I can see Luongo waving his no trade clause even for a place like Long Island or Columbus if it meant he was the number 1 guaranteed starter ( and assuming they had a decent chance at the playoffs at the time Luongo was to be traded)


Chicago: Trading him there without getting a big piece back (Hossa, Sharp, exc.) would be a career killer for MG. And I dont see any chance of them giving up a big piece. So what are we gunna get? Stalberg? They probably won't move Leddy, maybe Hjalmalsson but that's not a need we have a solid top 4, so what are we gunna get? Nothing, it won't work. if we give that core a star goaltender, then Idk how we will be able to beat them in the playoffs. This doesn't seem likely at all.

Tampa Bay: Stevie Y was interested in Schneider, the only way he wants Lu is if Lecavalier goes the other way, that's the only way. and No thanks to that, even if we only do have to eat up 3.5-4 million of it, (which might not even be the case, who knows what will be in CBA) but either way he isn't worth it, he isn't the 100 point player he was, he isn't even the 70 point player, who knoe's if he is even a 60 point player, I would say his best now is 40-50, he's aging, hes not worth the contract, I would rather just get Bozak rather than him. And they won't give us anything else that is really appealing.

New Jersey: If there playoff run proved anything it is that Marty Brodeur can still play at a high level, and with the contract they just signed him too there is no chance they will want Lu, and what are they gunna give us? They lost a few big pieces from there run, Parise, Ponikarovsky. So now that there line-up is greatly weaker what can they afford to give us? Nothing, it's not a likely scenerio at all.

Edmonton: Idk why Botch had to bring this up, there not going to give us anything big, and they dont really have alot that they could give us, plus it's probably not a huge priority for them, Dubnyk has been getting better and better, he has shown he can give them a chance to win and improving there defense is probably a much bigger priority for them as apposed to improving there goaltending. Very unlikely aswell.

Columbus: Lu won't waive his NTC to go there, and even if he would somehow, when you really think about it. why would they want him? sure a goalie like Luongo would be nice for them for sure but why would they want to do it at the price MG will want? They are a young team, they just lost there star, they aren't really in playoff contention, they are just building to a better future, why would they want to trade assets for a 33 year old goalie like Luongo. when those asset's could pay off in a much bigger way in the future when they are a good team? Unlikely aswell.

San Jose: They have Niemi, who is a starter and what are they gunna give us? Clowe. That's maybe it, but I dont know if they would do it and idk if I even want him, we wouldn't be able to get the same value and I highly doubt they even want him, Niemi has been fine, it's not Luongo is gunna be a huge difference maker, he's not gunna do a ton more than Niemi already has, that team has a decent goalie, they need to start getting younger and fix up some area's of there team, and right now I don't think goaltending is huge priority for them, not to mention there isn't alot they would be willing to part ways with. Again probably not likely.

Washington: They have 2 young goalies there, both played well (Neuvirth in the season, Holtby in the playoffs) those two can carry that team just fine as a tandem, then they can focus there assets on improving there forward group, and the rest of there skaters. There goaltending has been fine, it's not an issue at all as we saw in the playoffs, if anything it iss a strong point right now, they have other things to focus on.

Ottawa: Why? Anderson is fine for the time being and they have two good young goalies up and coming in Bishop and Lehner, then behind them Driedger isn't bad either. There team isn't ready to contend, last year was just a pleasant surprise, not saying they won't make the playoffs but right now they just have to go through this transition period where all there good young talent develops and replaces the old talent. This isn't them building into a cup contender. so since there not a contender, there is no reason to waste assets that could be better served later on.

NY Islanders: Similar thing to Columbus, they are young, they are waiting for there young talent to develop and the goaltending they have right now is good enough to hold the fort until Poulin can take the torch, and why would they want 2 goalies on lifetime contracts cause there is no way Dipietro is coming back our way.

Again, I dont see the same fit in any of these other teams like I do in Florida or Toronto, and right now Toronto seems the best.

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 22 October 2012 - 07:28 PM.

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#360 Smashian Kassian

Smashian Kassian

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 07:24 PM

Those people who think he will waive his NTC to go to Columbus have no clue what they are talking about.

Yes he made those comments but that was more directed at the notion that he wouldn't go to Toronto.

He earned his NTC, and why would he want to waive it to go to Columbus, think about it? He would rather stay here then go there.
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