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[Discussion] Roberto Luongo Trade Thread 3.0


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#751 WiDeN

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 07:07 PM

Wow king...wow, just wow. Vancouver would be LUCKY to get Paajarvi for not only Luongo but Ballard as well?? And that still wouldn't be enough for Magnus freaking Paajarvi?!!?!!? You just brought yourself down to a whole new level of dumb :picard:

Amen
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#752 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 07:58 PM

You assume way too much and once again it is your opinion that I am biased against Lou. He still is an NHL calibre goaltender, I just don;t put him on the pedestal that some of you do. The fact that I don;t refute your facts is that they are skwed to your beliefs and you are not open to other views.


It's not opinion, it's clear to anyone who can read that you are biased against him. And don't try to act like your not.

And no Dubnyk is an NHL Calibre goaltender, Luongo is a star goalie, a proven starter and star, and Dubnyk is niether.

And of course since the facts back up my point you say they are skewed.

and I'm not sure what other views there are? only 2. Either you think he is a star goalie (Me) or you don't think he is as good as people think (You) and the stats seem to back me up a bit more.

Now as I asked before, can you explain why you think Luongo isn't a better option for Edmonton than Dubnyk?

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 06 November 2012 - 12:59 AM.

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#753 smurf47

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 09:30 PM

The 2011-12 team was arguably not as good as the 2010-11 team and we still won and we still won another Presidents Trophy. Also due to the fact that Luongo is miles better than Dubnyk (you'd be stupid to argue this). If you put Luongo and a couple solid D men on the Oilers they would be getting into the playoffs/winning Presidents Trophy's too.

And dog breath? That's an insult you came up with? Thats a sad attempt at one smurf...

The 2011-12 team was arguably not as good as the 2010-11 team and we still won and we still won another Presidents Trophy. Also due to the fact that Luongo is miles better than Dubnyk (you'd be stupid to argue this). If you put Luongo and a couple solid D men on the Oilers they would be getting into the playoffs/winning Presidents Trophy's too.

And dog breath? That's an insult you came up with? Thats a sad attempt at one smurf...

The 2011-12 team was arguably not as good as the 2010-11 team and we still won and we still won another Presidents Trophy. Also due to the fact that Luongo is miles better than Dubnyk (you'd be stupid to argue this). If you put Luongo and a couple solid D men on the Oilers they would be getting into the playoffs/winning Presidents Trophy's too.

And dog breath? That's an insult you came up with? Thats a sad attempt at one smurf...

The 2011-12 team was arguably not as good as the 2010-11 team and we still won and we still won another Presidents Trophy. Also due to the fact that Luongo is miles better than Dubnyk (you'd be stupid to argue this). If you put Luongo and a couple solid D men on the Oilers they would be getting into the playoffs/winning Presidents Trophy's too.

And dog breath? That's an insult you came up with? Thats a sad attempt at one smurf...

b...again..the valued opinion of a 16 yr old midget hockey player.....
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#754 WolfxHaley

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 09:23 PM

b...again..the valued opinion of a 16 yr old midget hockey player.....

You want to quote that one more time please... I missed it!
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#755 Mighty Walrus

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 09:26 PM

.

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#756 smurf47

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 09:30 PM

It's not opinion, it's clear to anyone who can read that you are biased against him. And don't try to act like your not.

And no Dubnyk is and NHL Calibre goaltender, Luongo is a star goalie, a proven starter and star, and Dubnyk is niether.

And of course since the facts back up my point you say they a skewed.

and I'm not sure what other view there are? only 2. Either you think he is a star goalie (Me) or you don't think he is as good as people think (You) and the stats seem to back me up a bit more.

Now as I asked before, can you explain why you think Luongo isn't a better option for Edmonton than Dubnyk?

It's not opinion, it's clear to anyone who can read that you are biased against him. And don't try to act like your not.

And no Dubnyk is and NHL Calibre goaltender, Luongo is a star goalie, a proven starter and star, and Dubnyk is niether.

And of course since the facts back up my point you say they a skewed.

and I'm not sure what other view there are? only 2. Either you think he is a star goalie (Me) or you don't think he is as good as people think (You) and the stats seem to back me up a bit more.

Now as I asked before, can you explain why you think Luongo isn't a better option for Edmonton than Dubnyk?

L:ous stats were middle of the pack on a first place team....so..how do you think he'll do on a defense weak second tier team...Dubnyk is technically better than Lou, quicker , younger and more up side and cheaper.
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#757 oldnews

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 09:38 PM

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You've got it wrong again. I'm not suggesting that the Canucks will get Paajarvi; I'm suggesting that they'd be lucky to.

This most recent argument stems from the fact that you're aghast at the gall of me suggesting that the Canucks would accept "just" Paajarvi, while simultaneously targeting Nick Bjugstad and some other "big, mean D", which is strange, since Paajarvi's produced at both the AHL and the NHL level, while Bjugstad's a complete gamble at this point, playing against a bunch of stoners in the NCAA. You talk about contradictions, this is the greatest of them all.



This is funny.

This is the same guy going on and on about Michael Frolik, and how guys like he and MPS have "fallen off the charts" on their respective teams. Scottie Upshall had 2 goals last year as a member of the Florida Panthers, in 26 games played (on pace for about 6). Scottie Upshall has played on 4 different teams since 2008. His career high in point totals is 34 - which MPS reached in 2010-11 as a 19 year-old rookie! Yet you want to commit $10.5M of cap space to this guy, over 3 years, who really has no offensive upside (unlike Frolik - who has scored 20 goals twice - or Paajarvi), and who will surely be relegated to our bottom six?

Of all of the supposed contradictions that you claim that I make (BS), care to explain this one to me? You want Scottie Upshall, yet you're appalled by the suggestion of Michael Frolik or Magnus Paajarvi.


Nope. You're wrong again. I think there is absolutely no chance in hell that the Canucks would accept Paajarvi for Luongo - let alone throw in Ballard as well.
Paajarvi is a one-trick wonder - if he isn't scoring, he isn't much of a hockey player. The same goes for your uber-soft Michael Frolik. Ironic that you'd suggest adding so much more soft to the roster.
I guess I'll have to repeat myself - as usual where you are concerned - the guy you refer to as "some other d" is Petrovic - he's a big, physical right handed blueliner with a huge shot and a mean streak - the very type of prospect the Canucks could use to add balance to their pool of d prospects. Bjugstad is a center (aren't you the guy who considers Schroeder a bust?) - while Paajarvi is yet another left wing. In case you are as oblivious as you appear to be, the Canucks already have a few guys who are natural left wings on the roster - Daniel, Booth, Burrows, Higgins, and Raymond. Great idea you have there King - let's use the Luongo return to land a 6th roster left winger. DUH. Paajarvi and Frolik would be misfits who'd be lucky to crack the roster.

Oh, you have a big problem with the third piece I proposed in that deal, but that only evidences, again, that you don't know much about what you speak. Upshall's career high was 32 points - which he managed in 49 games - he's scored 177 points in 387 career games - or .46 points a game - which translates into a 38 point average over 82 games in his career - which has been riddled with bad luck and injuries. Upshall would be a great guy to take a risk on - he plays a two-way game, is a solid skater, has good hands, no shortage of grit, is a character guy who works very hard, and he actually hits people - hard. Paajarvi threw 40 hits in his 121 game career - Upshall topped that in 26 games last year, coming off an injury. Yeah - I'd be pretty willing to take a chance on a guy who scores, hits, plays hockey in his own end of the ice, adds some much valued grit to the club and is versatile - can and has played a lot of right wing. A healthy Upshall has a much better chance of playing in the top 9 or 6 than your two grossly overvalued misfits (and an unhealthy Upshall does not count against the cap). Florida sheds his salary, the Canucks take back 3.5 while 5.3 goes the other way, and the cap hit is contingent on Upshall's health.
What's your problem with the deal?

Edited by oldnews, 05 November 2012 - 09:43 PM.

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#758 BuretoMogilny

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 09:38 PM

No thanks. For Lou Ballard and a 2nd I would want something more like Bozak, Ashton, and a 1st. Or Kadri, Finn, and a 1st

No thanks. For Lou Ballard and a 2nd I would want something more like Bozak, Ashton, and a 1st. Or Kadri, Finn, and a 1st


Kadri is junk dude, I live in T.O, he's going nowhere, 3 years in the minors now, AHL decent, but won't translate to NHL, he's a tweener, doesn't do anything great. And this year was critisized for coming to camp fat/out of shape...smart for a guy drafted so high and with a team as terrible as the leafs in need of offense....he's a career AHL'er
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#759 smurf47

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 09:39 PM

L:ous stats were middle of the pack on a first place team....so..how do you think he'll do on a defense weak second tier team...Dubnyk is technically better than Lou, quicker , younger and more up side and cheaper.

L:ous stats were middle of the pack on a first place team....so..how do you think he'll do on a defense weak second tier team...Dubnyk is technically better than Lou, quicker , younger and more up side and cheaper.

Dubnyk...SP .914 on last place div team Lou .919 on first place team..... .005 better than Dubnyk......hardly a massive improvement !
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#760 BuretoMogilny

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 09:43 PM

Talk about desparation and hockey withdrawl. There is no season yet, no hockey trades and everything in on hold, and yet this thread goes on adnauseum. Go out and play golf, get a life ! Wait and see where Lou goes . This all speculative and without substance, opinions upon opinions, without verification , and none of it matters. Its like pissing into the wind !


yet you found the time to tell everyone that? wow...who needs a life? if you had one you wouldn't be commenting. let people chat / discuss, that's kinda what this board is for dolt.
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#761 Dogbyte

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 09:48 PM

They play for teams at opposite ends of team spectrum dog breath ! Ask yourself...what numbers would Dubnyk post on the Canucks and what numbers would Lou post playing or the botton feeder Oilers. No comparison on the 2 teams at all...


He may possibly post similar numbers to Luongo. On a president's trophy team sometimes any decent goalie, and pretty much all the players will look pretty good. I can't believe you think at this point in time Luongo doesn't have more upside in terms of pedigree and the stature he brings to the rink along with his skillset, especially for an up and coming team. So you're saying if you had a choice you'd take Dubynk over Luongo straight up? Luongo beat him in pretty much every category last year so to basically pick a last place goalie that hasn't been great on a bad defensive team, without terribly good numbers is pretty unfair to someone in Luongo's position. This viewpoint is either incredibly astute, completely ignorant, or just completely biased, and most definitely unfounded and speculative at best.

It seems obvious to me that only someone who has an axe to grind would make such an odd comparison and statement.

And with regards to your statement I said that Luongo played very well last year, not that Dubnyk couldn't post good numbers on the Canucks or a better team. I've watched every game the Canucks have played in the past 4 years minus what I could count on my fingers and if you couldn't see that Lou played very well considering everything that has occurred you are either blind, don't watch the games, or see what you want. For the record I bashed Lou a bit at times I'll admit it, I'm no fan boy and I favor Schnieder but the level of senseless comments regarding this situation is beyond comprehension sometimes.
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#762 Pears

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 09:52 PM

b...again..the valued opinion of a 16 yr old midget hockey player.....

lol. As if age matters on one's knowledge of hockey, which you have proven many times you have very little of.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

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#763 ConnorFutureGM

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 10:10 PM

lol. As if age matters on one's knowledge of hockey, which you have proven many times you have very little of.

Do you know more and have a greater understanding of hockey now than you did a year ago?

Do you think you will have a greater understanding of hockey 10 years into the future than you do now?
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#764 Pears

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 10:26 PM

Do you know more and have a greater understanding of hockey now than you did a year ago?

Do you think you will have a greater understanding of hockey 10 years into the future than you do now?

Obviously. Will your's, King's, and smurf's hockey knowledge grow in the future? Doubtful.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

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#765 Hunter Shinkaruk #9

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 10:43 PM

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#766 smurf47

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 10:52 PM

He may possibly post similar numbers to Luongo. On a president's trophy team sometimes any decent goalie, and pretty much all the players will look pretty good. I can't believe you think at this point in time Luongo doesn't have more upside in terms of pedigree and the stature he brings to the rink along with his skillset, especially for an up and coming team. So you're saying if you had a choice you'd take Dubynk over Luongo straight up? Luongo beat him in pretty much every category last year so to basically pick a last place goalie that hasn't been great on a bad defensive team, without terribly good numbers is pretty unfair to someone in Luongo's position. This viewpoint is either incredibly astute, completely ignorant, or just completely biased, and most definitely unfounded and speculative at best.

It seems obvious to me that only someone who has an axe to grind would make such an odd comparison and statement.

And with regards to your statement I said that Luongo played very well last year, not that Dubnyk couldn't post good numbers on the Canucks or a better team. I've watched every game the Canucks have played in the past 4 years minus what I could count on my fingers and if you couldn't see that Lou played very well considering everything that has occurred you are either blind, don't watch the games, or see what you want. For the record I bashed Lou a bit at times I'll admit it, I'm no fan boy and I favor Schnieder but the level of senseless comments regarding this situation is beyond comprehension sometimes.

Pedigree and stature don;t stop pucks...and all things being equal...yes. I'd opt for Dubnyk...a first round pick over inconsistant Luongo !
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#767 ConnorFutureGM

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 10:54 PM

Obviously. Will your's, King's, and smurf's hockey knowledge grow in the future? Doubtful.

I'm in my twenties and trust me, you don't know nothing when you're 16.
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#768 Riviera82

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 10:55 PM

Luongo was the second best goaltender on the Canucks, not because he played poorly though. Schneider put on a clinic.

His save percentage of .937 was only beat by Elliot's .940 - nobody else (who played more than a few games) even came close. And then his .960 save percentage in the playoffs - although in limited duty - was the best in the league by a wide margin.

Schneider is the real deal. He's cheaper and younger too. That is why Luongo is available. Not because he isn't significantly better than at least half of the starting goaltenders in the league - ESPECIALLY than the scrubs the Leafs and Oilers have.


I agree with this, however Luongo was not exceptional or "elite" as many people like to say and his playoffs while not terrible were underwhelming.
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#769 Riviera82

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 11:09 PM

Thought I provide a little food for thought with this question: What do you guys think Luongo's value would be if say, he posted numbers last season that were similar to 2010-11?


I'd say a second line caliber forward or a 3/4 defenseman and a 2nd rounder.
He is pushing his mid-30s with an unattractive contract and a pretty serious hangup in the playoffs.
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#770 Pears

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 11:12 PM

I'm in my twenties and trust me, you don't know nothing when you're 16.

Riiight. Coming from the guy that proposed Omark, Belanger and Hamilton for Luongo.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

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#771 Dogbyte

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 11:27 PM

Pedigree and stature don;t stop pucks...and all things being equal...yes. I'd opt for Dubnyk...a first round pick over inconsistant Luongo !


Well you have the right to your opinion. I would venture that if you polled a hundred of the top minds in hockey at least 95 would take Luongo.

A proven top notch goalie who has played on two consecutive presidents cup teams and played in every game on the way to the 7th game of the Stanley Cup final. He is 33 years old and in good health after being selected as one of the best two Candian goalies in hockey just two years ago. He is hungry to win, apparently works out like a beast, and is still super dedicated. Either him or an average young goalie, who is so far no better than lots of other young goalies, with no guarantee to do anything. I think most GM's would out right laugh at you.

Edited by Dogbyte, 06 November 2012 - 12:19 AM.

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#772 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 11:39 PM

L:ous stats were middle of the pack on a first place team....so..how do you think he'll do on a defense weak second tier team...Dubnyk is technically better than Lou, quicker , younger and more up side and cheaper.


No actually he isn't quicker and better and the only reason we finished first is because of our goaltending, from January and Feburary on we struggled to score and Lu put together great effort after great effort to keep us on top of the pack down the stretch, and in the playoff games he played he was our best player.

He would do fine on there team because our Defense was just as bad at times and we still kept winning, thanks to Lu.

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 05 November 2012 - 11:40 PM.

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#773 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 11:51 PM

Pedigree and stature don;t stop pucks...and all things being equal...yes. I'd opt for Dubnyk...a first round pick over inconsistant Luongo !


Oh and Smurf! (This reply isn't about your post BTW, I just replied to a random post of yours to get your attention, anyways..)

If you think that Dubnyk is better for Edmonton than Luongo is, then why would they even want him? why would they be in the market for him?
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#774 WiDeN

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 11:55 PM

I'm in my twenties and trust me, you don't know nothing when you're 16.

You mean, you don't know ANYTHING when you're 16? Your 20's have served you well.
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#775 Ossi Vaananen

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Posted 06 November 2012 - 12:31 AM

I think one of these days King is just going to say "GOTCHA" in regards to this flaming/trolling. No one in their right mind would believe Dubnyk is better than Luongo, or that Dubnyk has a higher upside. Same goes for Paajarvi, he'll be an NHLer but even Edmonton isn't over the moon with him. I'm starting to think this is all just incendiary.
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#776 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 06 November 2012 - 01:05 AM

Nope. You're wrong again. I think there is absolutely no chance in hell that the Canucks would accept Paajarvi for Luongo - let alone throw in Ballard as well.
Paajarvi is a one-trick wonder - if he isn't scoring, he isn't much of a hockey player. The same goes for your uber-soft Michael Frolik. Ironic that you'd suggest adding so much more soft to the roster.
I guess I'll have to repeat myself - as usual where you are concerned - the guy you refer to as "some other d" is Petrovic - he's a big, physical right handed blueliner with a huge shot and a mean streak - the very type of prospect the Canucks could use to add balance to their pool of d prospects. Bjugstad is a center (aren't you the guy who considers Schroeder a bust?) - while Paajarvi is yet another left wing. In case you are as oblivious as you appear to be, the Canucks already have a few guys who are natural left wings on the roster - Daniel, Booth, Burrows, Higgins, and Raymond. Great idea you have there King - let's use the Luongo return to land a 6th roster left winger. DUH. Paajarvi and Frolik would be misfits who'd be lucky to crack the roster.


Oh, you have a big problem with the third piece I proposed in that deal, but that only evidences, again, that you don't know much about what you speak. Upshall's career high was 32 points - which he managed in 49 games - he's scored 177 points in 387 career games - or .46 points a game - which translates into a 38 point average over 82 games in his career - which has been riddled with bad luck and injuries. Upshall would be a great guy to take a risk on - he plays a two-way game, is a solid skater, has good hands, no shortage of grit, is a character guy who works very hard, and he actually hits people - hard. Paajarvi threw 40 hits in his 121 game career - Upshall topped that in 26 games last year, coming off an injury. Yeah - I'd be pretty willing to take a chance on a guy who scores, hits, plays hockey in his own end of the ice, adds some much valued grit to the club and is versatile - can and has played a lot of right wing. A healthy Upshall has a much better chance of playing in the top 9 or 6 than your two grossly overvalued misfits (and an unhealthy Upshall does not count against the cap). Florida sheds his salary, the Canucks take back 3.5 while 5.3 goes the other way, and the cap hit is contingent on Upshall's health.
What's your problem with the deal?


Bravo..... Bravo

this is the part of your post that earned my +1.


Not sure what kind of dumb argument King will try against this, even though clear fact is staring him straight in the face.

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 06 November 2012 - 01:05 AM.

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#777 WolfxHaley

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Posted 06 November 2012 - 01:43 AM

I'm in my twenties and trust me, you don't know nothing when you're 16.

It will be a dark day when you become this "Future GM"...Based on your logic and the way you run your mouth I sense another coming of Milbury.

Edited by SonGoku23, 06 November 2012 - 01:44 AM.

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#778 ConnorFutureGM

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Posted 06 November 2012 - 02:01 AM

Riiight. Coming from the guy that proposed Omark, Belanger and Hamilton for Luongo.

Until you can grow facial hair, your opinion means nothing.
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#779 vv2

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Posted 06 November 2012 - 02:07 AM

It will be a dark day when you become this "Future GM"...Based on your logic and the way you run your mouth I sense another coming of Milbury.

exactly what I was thinking

Edited by vv2, 06 November 2012 - 02:07 AM.

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#780 ConnorFutureGM

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Posted 06 November 2012 - 02:09 AM

You mean, you don't know ANYTHING when you're 16? Your 20's have served you well.

I was trying to come up with something that combined correcting internet message board grammar with lame and waste of life. I'm sure you'll come up with something.
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