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#301 Jester@wraiths.ca

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 01:55 PM

Both these posts seem to clearly indicate a need for BETTER PARENTING, not physical punishment.

Particularly your example Jester...where do you think that bully child learned his negative, physical behaviour from? I'm glad that the child stopped bullying other kids but would it not be better if he'd not learned to start doing it in the first place from his own parents?


We've been banging the "better parenting skills" drum for more than a decade now and look at what society it's producing... Look at all the bullies ranging in age from 10-16, it's epidemic. Kids that have grown up with no punishment that makes them think they shouldn't do something is what we're getting.

No consequence = no reason to change behavior
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#302 Jester@wraiths.ca

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:11 PM

People learn because of consequences. You put your hand on a burner and you quickly learn not to do it again.

I certainly don't advocate hitting kids, but a spanking on the bottom can teach a lesson.

If a consequence doesn't bother a kid, he won't learn anything from it, he won't change his behavior, and you've accomplished nothing.

Do you think it's a coincidence that in the enlightened age of "omg you can't spank your child" we are seeing such a heightened level of misbehavior and extreme lack of respect for others by young people? We're seeing the first generation of kids raised with no real threat of consequences, and it is disturbing to say the least. Kids go through all their formative years learning that they can do anything and there really isn't any consequence for it.
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#303 J.R.

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:28 PM

We've been banging the "better parenting skills" drum for more than a decade now and look at what society it's producing... Look at all the bullies ranging in age from 10-16, it's epidemic. Kids that have grown up with no punishment that makes them think they shouldn't do something is what we're getting.

No consequence = no reason to change behavior


You seem to be confusing "better parenting" with a "lack of parenting". Most of the issues you see from kids are due to either a lack of involvement/boundaries/consequences and where it comes to things like bullying, likely from them learning that behaviour at home.

I agree that kids "grown up with no punishment' or consequences is a HUGE problem. What we disagree on is that those consequences need to be of a abusive nature.

Too many parents want to be their kids friend instead of their parent and just give in to their whims and tantrums because it's "easier". They don't want to do the real work, set real boundaries, deal with their kids pissy mood because they didn't get there way etc. It's got nothing to do with whether they've been whipped in to submission.
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#304 SkeeterHansen

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:30 PM

We've been banging the "better parenting skills" drum for more than a decade now and look at what society it's producing... Look at all the bullies ranging in age from 10-16, it's epidemic. Kids that have grown up with no punishment that makes them think they shouldn't do something is what we're getting.

No consequence = no reason to change behavior


This. And it's only going to get worse, as kids now a days haven't been brought up under the proper parenting skills, so won't know how to return it once they become a parent.
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/=S=/


#305 Buddhas Hand

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:46 PM

This. And it's only going to get worse, as kids now a days haven't been brought up under the proper parenting skills, so won't know how to return it once they become a parent.


Mom and dad, how'd you get so rad?
When exactly did you get so hip?
Wearing teenage clothes
You're always coming to my shows
And telling me that I should mellow out
It's absurd, they're singing every word
You're not supposed to like my band
Things I like you don't understand
So please put down that rum and Coke
That's not behavior for old folk
Can we just hang on holidays
Dad and mom, what planet are you from?
And what convinced you to pack up and leave
Doing drugs and asking me for hugs
What's the matter with parents today?
Not again when will it end?
Dad's dressing like Motley Crew
And why is moms hair dyed bright blue?
And stayin' out till two or three
Then having sex publicly
I thought the apple fell far from the tree
Mom and dad, I think you ought
To quit smoking so much pot
And hanging with my friends
Laying round, on the couch
With my Misfits records out
Softly banging your head
Maybe its just a passing phase
What's the matter with my parents these days?

mike burdett
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#306 debluvscanucks

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:46 PM

We've been banging the "better parenting skills" drum for more than a decade now and look at what society it's producing... Look at all the bullies ranging in age from 10-16, it's epidemic. Kids that have grown up with no punishment that makes them think they shouldn't do something is what we're getting.

No consequence = no reason to change behavior


You're right, but I don't know that the consequences have to include physical discipline. The other route is harder - takes more effort because when you ground a kid and take away their gadgets, then you have a bored kid on your hands. So parents, at times, get lazy and don't want to take things away because it makes their job harder.

Kids are spoiled these days - they drive luxury cars at 16, have more electronics than is good for them and part of it is a sense of entitlement and lack of appreciation/gratitidue. But I still feel that taking things away (like their freedom, their game systems, their phones, their computers) gives them time to think and hits them hard. But parents don't seem to do that stuff because the resistance they face in that becomes too demanding.
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#307 SkeeterHansen

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:48 PM

Mom and dad, how'd you get so rad?
When exactly did you get so hip?
Wearing teenage clothes
You're always coming to my shows
And telling me that I should mellow out
It's absurd, they're singing every word
You're not supposed to like my band
Things I like you don't understand
So please put down that rum and Coke
That's not behavior for old folk
Can we just hang on holidays
Dad and mom, what planet are you from?
And what convinced you to pack up and leave
Doing drugs and asking me for hugs
What's the matter with parents today?
Not again when will it end?
Dad's dressing like Motley Crew
And why is moms hair dyed bright blue?
And stayin' out till two or three
Then having sex publicly
I thought the apple fell far from the tree
Mom and dad, I think you ought
To quit smoking so much pot
And hanging with my friends
Laying round, on the couch
With my Misfits records out
Softly banging your head
Maybe its just a passing phase
What's the matter with my parents these days?

mike burdett


That was fantastic.
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/=S=/


#308 ronthecivil

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:52 PM

I'm genuinely surprised you don't let the little bastards go out and forage for their own food, after all, you are giving them a place to sleep at the end of the night, and some hay in the corner to rest up in


You would be surprised how much you learn to appreciate no wasting food when you are forced to forage for it!
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#309 ronthecivil

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:53 PM

You're right, but I don't know that the consequences have to include physical discipline. The other route is harder - takes more effort because when you ground a kid and take away their gadgets, then you have a bored kid on your hands. So parents, at times, get lazy and don't want to take things away because it makes their job harder.

Kids are spoiled these days - they drive luxury cars at 16, have more electronics than is good for them and part of it is a sense of entitlement and lack of appreciation/gratitidue. But I still feel that taking things away (like their freedom, their game systems, their phones, their computers) gives them time to think and hits them hard. But parents don't seem to do that stuff because the resistance they face in that becomes too demanding.


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#310 ronthecivil

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:57 PM

You're right, but I don't know that the consequences have to include physical discipline. The other route is harder - takes more effort because when you ground a kid and take away their gadgets, then you have a bored kid on your hands. So parents, at times, get lazy and don't want to take things away because it makes their job harder.

Kids are spoiled these days - they drive luxury cars at 16, have more electronics than is good for them and part of it is a sense of entitlement and lack of appreciation/gratitidue. But I still feel that taking things away (like their freedom, their game systems, their phones, their computers) gives them time to think and hits them hard. But parents don't seem to do that stuff because the resistance they face in that becomes too demanding.


Unless they have a job and went out and bought those things with their hard earned money wouldn't those things actually be the parents?

Someone should remind those parents that when those kids hit the real world and discover the world actually owes them nothing it would be in their best interest to prepare them for that.
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#311 Sharpshooter

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:58 PM

We've been banging the "better parenting skills" drum for more than a decade now and look at what society it's producing... Look at all the bullies ranging in age from 10-16, it's epidemic. Kids that have grown up with no punishment that makes them think they shouldn't do something is what we're getting.

No consequence = no reason to change behavior


Are you suggesting that 10-16 year old didn't bully each other 10, 25, 50, 100 or more years ago?

It's a fallacious kind of logic to suggest that because you hear about more cases because of our increased inter-connectivity that bullying is the result of a new found epidemic and that it wasn't the case when you were growing up or at other times in the past.

That's called 'The Good Ol' Days' fallacy. It's something that people use when talking about crime. Because we get more reports of violent crimes nowadays one could conclude that people are more violent nowadays....but the truth is that violent crime rates are down across the board since the 70's.

You have to start addressing the way in which you may be formulating fallacious ideas and thoughts.

Again, violence begets violence....and sometimes it starts in the home and finds its way into society. Don't discount that, for the easier conclusion that people are just more violent nowadays, and the answer is violence. All that does is feed the beast of violence further, and then we all suffer from those consequences.
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#312 Sharpshooter

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:59 PM

You would be surprised how much you learn to appreciate no wasting food when you are forced to forage for it!


Wonderful, then tell your kids to come round my place, i'll leave some scraps out for them tonight. I assume they'll be the ones in burlap sacks.
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#313 Buddhas Hand

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:11 PM

Unless they have a job and went out and bought those things with their hard earned money wouldn't those things actually be the parents?

Someone should remind those parents that when those kids hit the real world and discover the world actually owes them nothing it would be in their best interest to prepare them for that.


But we owe it to our kids to lead by example , to treat others with respect and compassion , to share with those who do not have the quality of life that we do , and to hand over to them a better world than the one we have been raised in .
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The Real war is not between the east and the west. The real war is between intelligent and stupid people.

Marjane Satrapi

tony-abbott-and-stephen-harper-custom-da

That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons that history has to teach.

Aldous Huxley.


#314 fwybwed

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:20 PM

Wow....Im sure she put her hands on him first Big dummy she is lol BOOM!
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#315 Bertuzzi Babe

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:27 PM

Isn't there a joke about a lawyer driving people to his house so they can eat the grass?

*Inappropriate content removed*

Since there seems to be no conclusive proof one way or the other;
IMO I'd reserve the physical discipline for those events that were life threatening such as running into traffic or deliberate improper use of dangerous tools


You repost a Supermod deleted post? Wow.........what's that thing about consequences for actions, again?

Edited by Bertuzzi Babe, 15 October 2012 - 03:28 PM.

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#316 Sharpshooter

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:40 PM

You repost a Supermod deleted post? Wow.........what's that thing about consequences for actions, again?


Maybe he needs a 'timeout'? ;)
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#317 gurn

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:50 PM

Had i known it was deleted by mods I would not have reposted.
PM to the mod on the way.

Edited by gurn, 15 October 2012 - 03:55 PM.

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#318 jovocop55

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:55 PM

she's pretty tough.. most people would be out cold.. and she still got fight in her left afterwards.. :)
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#319 Jester@wraiths.ca

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:01 PM

Are you suggesting that 10-16 year old didn't bully each other 10, 25, 50, 100 or more years ago?

It's a fallacious kind of logic to suggest that because you hear about more cases because of our increased inter-connectivity that bullying is the result of a new found epidemic and that it wasn't the case when you were growing up or at other times in the past.

That's called 'The Good Ol' Days' fallacy. It's something that people use when talking about crime. Because we get more reports of violent crimes nowadays one could conclude that people are more violent nowadays....but the truth is that violent crime rates are down across the board since the 70's.

You have to start addressing the way in which you may be formulating fallacious ideas and thoughts.

Again, violence begets violence....and sometimes it starts in the home and finds its way into society. Don't discount that, for the easier conclusion that people are just more violent nowadays, and the answer is violence. All that does is feed the beast of violence further, and then we all suffer from those consequences.


Of course there was bullying, I experienced it. The levels it extends to is worsening though.

A slap on your ass when you were young did no damage but it seemed horrible in your mind, and you sure as hell didn't want to do anything that would get you spanked again... Sitting in a corner? big deal. deter someone from anything? no. Take away things they like? maybe they just sneak out of the house and rebel further then...

A friend was beaten to death by people who grew up with not caring about anything they did to another person, no consequences so nothing mattered. Hell, they even barely got punished by the law after beating a guy to death brutally.

The number of suicides happening is because of how this generation is growing up, not caring about what they do to other people. I saw bullying as a kid, but didn't even see one person kill themselves because of that back then. Now, it's happening more and more...

You can yap about my view of the good old days all you want, but the truth is, if you talk to people from the era of getting spanked they'll almost universally say "Wow, I'd NEVER have done that when I was that kids age, my dad would have tanned my hide". We wouldn't have done half the crap kids do these days, because we faced consequences for it if we did.
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#320 MillerGenuineDraft

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:26 PM

You're right, but I don't know that the consequences have to include physical discipline. The other route is harder - takes more effort because when you ground a kid and take away their gadgets, then you have a bored kid on your hands. So parents, at times, get lazy and don't want to take things away because it makes their job harder.

Kids are spoiled these days - they drive luxury cars at 16, have more electronics than is good for them and part of it is a sense of entitlement and lack of appreciation/gratitidue. But I still feel that taking things away (like their freedom, their game systems, their phones, their computers) gives them time to think and hits them hard. But parents don't seem to do that stuff because the resistance they face in that becomes too demanding.


Those who criticize our generation forget who raised it.

Keep that in the back of your mind when you talk about spoiled kids. It's because of those parents with 6 figure incomes that there are kids driving these luxury cards. It is because of parents that kids are still throwing house parties until 3am. I'm sorry, but as much as I hate the blame game, no child on this planet would know what bullying is, homophobia is, or anything negative for that manner, if it wasn't for the way parents brought them up. When someone grows up in the environment where something is believed, or something is looked down upon, is has a major, lifetime effect on that person.
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#321 Sharpshooter

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:28 PM

Of course there was bullying, I experienced it. The levels it extends to is worsening though.

A slap on your ass when you were young did no damage but it seemed horrible in your mind, and you sure as hell didn't want to do anything that would get you spanked again... Sitting in a corner? big deal. deter someone from anything? no. Take away things they like? maybe they just sneak out of the house and rebel further then...

A friend was beaten to death by people who grew up with not caring about anything they did to another person, no consequences so nothing mattered. Hell, they even barely got punished by the law after beating a guy to death brutally.

The number of suicides happening is because of how this generation is growing up, not caring about what they do to other people. I saw bullying as a kid, but didn't even see one person kill themselves because of that back then. Now, it's happening more and more...

You can yap about my view of the good old days all you want, but the truth is, if you talk to people from the era of getting spanked they'll almost universally say "Wow, I'd NEVER have done that when I was that kids age, my dad would have tanned my hide". We wouldn't have done half the crap kids do these days, because we faced consequences for it if we did.


Great, so you acknowledge there was bullying back then too. Now, why do you think there was bullying back in the good old days of 'hide tanning'? Is is because the hides weren't properly tanned? Or because they weren't tanned often enough? Why exactly did kids in the good old days continue to bully even when they knew they'd get a tanned hide?? He who smacked hardest had the best kids, perhaps?

You also seem to acknowledge that slapping a kid in the ass didn't do physical damage, but it was "horrible" in the minds of the children. Are you saying that you're ok with the emotional or psychological harm that comes to kids, as long as it isn't physical? That's a bit of a slippery slope wouldn't you say?....let alone an archaic understanding of child development.

And if they were old enough to sneak out of the house, do you really think that smacking them on the bottom would deter them? I mean, i assume 5 year olds weren't sneaking out of the house back in the good old days right? And if they were older, you don't believe that treating older kids with a bit of respect and understanding would work better than to give them a tanned hide? I'll tell you from my personal experience, that by the time I was about 15 years old, my father nor mother would have dared raise a hand to me, or they'd have found more than their own hides tanned. Fortunately my father was smarter than that, and never raised a hand to me, except once, for which he's shameful about till this day. I still remember it, and it still sticks between us as a sore point (excuse the pun once again) In all our time, violence was not how we solved things and we're much better off today as father and son because of it. Fear and intimidation of children in not an investment that will pay relationship dividends down the road, most of the time. Humans simply don't react well to either.

Why do you assume that 'go sit in the corner' is the be all and end all of consequences for poor behaviour? Is that really what you think the only non-violent alternatives are??

Suicide rates for the ages between 15-19 have been pretty constant in Canada.

Posted Image
http://www.statcan.g...-chart6-eng.htm

Kinda blows away that whole 'suicide nowadays is happening more and more' fallacy, eh?

Again, you may think i'm just 'yapping' but the data and studies speak for themselves.

Maybe you need to have a bit of a rethink about your own views.

Edited by Sharpshooter, 15 October 2012 - 04:30 PM.

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#322 JoeyJoeJoeJr. Shabadoo

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:34 PM

Are you suggesting that 10-16 year old didn't bully each other 10, 25, 50, 100 or more years ago?

It's a fallacious kind of logic to suggest that because you hear about more cases because of our increased inter-connectivity that bullying is the result of a new found epidemic and that it wasn't the case when you were growing up or at other times in the past.

That's called 'The Good Ol' Days' fallacy. It's something that people use when talking about crime. Because we get more reports of violent crimes nowadays one could conclude that people are more violent nowadays....but the truth is that violent crime rates are down across the board since the 70's.

You have to start addressing the way in which you may be formulating fallacious ideas and thoughts.

Again, violence begets violence....and sometimes it starts in the home and finds its way into society. Don't discount that, for the easier conclusion that people are just more violent nowadays, and the answer is violence. All that does is feed the beast of violence further, and then we all suffer from those consequences.


Agreed, I don't see much if any difference in the amount of bullying but the methods sure have changed. In fact with the increased sensitivty regarding matters such as these the more visible types of bullying we experienced as children has given way to other forms such as cyber bullying. And with cell phones and social media at seemingly everyones disposal it is difficult for victims to escape. It's also not difficult for kids these days to avoid retribution by staying anonymous, it also allows them to be particularly cruel.
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#323 Jester@wraiths.ca

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:42 PM

Great, so you acknowledge there was bullying back then too. Now, why do you think there was bullying back in the good old days of 'hide tanning'? Is is because the hides weren't properly tanned? Or because they weren't tanned often enough? Why exactly did kids in the good old days continue to bully even when they knew they'd get a tanned hide?? He who smacked hardest had the best kids, perhaps?

You also seem to acknowledge that slapping a kid in the ass didn't do physical damage, but it was "horrible" in the minds of the children. Are you saying that you're ok with the emotional or psychological harm that comes to kids, as long as it isn't physical? That's a bit of a slippery slope wouldn't you say?....let alone an archaic understanding of child development.

And if they were old enough to sneak out of the house, do you really think that smacking them on the bottom would deter them? I mean, i assume 5 year olds weren't sneaking out of the house back in the good old days right? And if they were older, you don't believe that treating older kids with a bit of respect and understanding would work better than to give them a tanned hide? I'll tell you from my personal experience, that by the time I was about 15 years old, my father nor mother would have dared raise a hand to me, or they'd have found more than their own hides tanned. Fortunately my father was smarter than that, and never raised a hand to me, except once, for which he's shameful about till this day. I still remember it, and it still sticks between us as a sore point (excuse the pun once again) In all our time, violence was not how we solved things and we're much better off today as father and son because of it. Fear and intimidation of children in not an investment that will pay relationship dividends down the road, most of the time. Humans simply don't react well to either.

Why do you assume that 'go sit in the corner' is the be all and end all of consequences for poor behaviour? Is that really what you think the only non-violent alternatives are??

Suicide rates for the ages between 15-19 have been pretty constant in Canada.

Posted Image
http://www.statcan.g...-chart6-eng.htm

Kinda blows away that whole 'suicide nowadays is happening more and more' fallacy, eh?

Again, you may think i'm just 'yapping' but the data and studies speak for themselves.

Maybe you need to have a bit of a rethink about your own views.


And go back farther. Your chart is nice in that it doesn't demonstrate how much lower is was decades before that at the height of the tanned hides eras... nor does it show that in the last few years, suicides among teen girls in some countries had risen by 76%...

It's fine, you don't think consequences are beneficial, that's your right to think that. I think you couldn't be more wrong, and it's my right to think that. Maybe when someone close to you dies because of the actions of people who just never learned to care about anyone but themselves, or that tormenting others is wrong, you'll look at things differently.

If the busdriver had run someone over because of the chick hitting him, people would be saying "why didn't someone punch that bitch..."
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#324 J.R.

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:47 PM

And go back farther. Your chart is nice in that it doesn't demonstrate how much lower is was decades before that at the height of the tanned hides eras... nor does it show that in the last few years, suicides among teen girls in some countries had risen by 76%...

It's fine, you don't think consequences are beneficial, that's your right to think that. I think you couldn't be more wrong, and it's my right to think that. Maybe when someone close to you dies because of the actions of people who just never learned to care about anyone but themselves, or that tormenting others is wrong, you'll look at things differently.

If the busdriver had run someone over because of the chick hitting him, people would be saying "why didn't someone punch that bitch..."


Did anybody else hear that giant *WOOOOOSH*.

What part of anything anybody has said makes you think we don't believe children should learn and have consequences for their actions?

Why is it that you insist on thinking "consequences" MUST be physical punishment? Can you honestly not think of other and better ways to teach children consequences for their actions?
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#325 Jester@wraiths.ca

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 05:03 PM

Did anybody else hear that giant *WOOOOOSH*.

What part of anything anybody has said makes you think we don't believe children should learn and have consequences for their actions?

Why is it that you insist on thinking "consequences" MUST be physical punishment? Can you honestly not think of other and better ways to teach children consequences for their actions?


Your side of the fence keeps saying other consequences... what is effective? We're in the era of a generation growing up with minimal physical consequence for their actions, and it's more like we're raising a society of completely uncaring psychopaths. Is no physical consequence working really well? really?

You've got timeouts, grounding, scolding, taking away privileged, and opposite, rewarding for good behavior etc. I don't see any of that as particularly effective. I got grounded as a kid, i got scolded. I had TV privileges taken away. But the one thing that made me far less likely to do something was thinking I might get spanked for it. And honestly I think I got spanked once ever, yet it made more of a difference than anything else...

But it's fine, I guess I just view our society different. It's all good. random attacks on people for fun are good. Tormenting people is A-OK. I wonder how the next generation that gets raised by these wonderful people will be?
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#326 Sharpshooter

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 05:19 PM

And go back farther. Your chart is nice in that it doesn't demonstrate how much lower is was decades before that at the height of the tanned hides eras... nor does it show that in the last few years, suicides among teen girls in some countries had risen by 76%...

It's fine, you don't think consequences are beneficial, that's your right to think that. I think you couldn't be more wrong, and it's my right to think that. Maybe when someone close to you dies because of the actions of people who just never learned to care about anyone but themselves, or that tormenting others is wrong, you'll look at things differently.

If the busdriver had run someone over because of the chick hitting him, people would be saying "why didn't someone punch that bitch..."


And if you go back far enough, the problem arises of under-reporting, as most domestic violence was. That's why people in the good old days didn't report spousal abuse or suicide. It was thought dishonourable.

Basically, what you're saying is that you don't care what facts or arguments are presented to you, you're going to stick with the way you think, because that's the way you think, right? Yeah, i suppose you have the right to be stubborn if you want to.
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#327 Jester@wraiths.ca

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 05:28 PM

Basically, what you're saying is that you don't care what facts or arguments are presented to you, you're going to stick with the way you think, because that's the way you think, right? Yeah, i suppose you have the right to be stubborn if you want to.


What I'm saying is I don't think anything you've said is even close to convincing me that the no-real-consequences-to-fear parenting style has helped. I am saying I feel it is part of the problem that has us seeing the most uncaring generation treating people with zero respect and feeling that it's totally fine for them to be like that. A generation of sadistic pricks is being raised without a spanking.
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#328 Sharpshooter

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 05:44 PM

What I'm saying is I don't think anything you've said is even close to convincing me that the no-real-consequences-to-fear parenting style has helped. I am saying I feel it is part of the problem that has us seeing the most uncaring generation treating people with zero respect and feeling that it's totally fine for them to be like that. A generation of sadistic pricks is being raised without a spanking.


And so you're remedy is to rear children using fear, violence and intimidation in order to prompt the behaviour you want.

Gotcha....that's certainly worked well over the years.

When the homicide rate was the highest it ever was in B.C....in the mid to late 70's fyi....what era do you think those people who committed those homicides grew up in? Oh that's right, those model citizens grew up in the tan hidin era of the 50's, and 60's.

Sure did a lot of good back in the good ol' days eh?


Look, you can 'feel' whatever you want to 'feel'. What i'm trying to display for you is that your feelings run counter to the data and to numerous academic and field studies. What do you think has more weight in reality. The feelings you have that come your biased musings, or the research?

Corporal punishment does not work.....and this is why there are now 32 countries that have outright banned it....and more are considering it every year. 32 different countries and the ones now moving to banning it outright, can't all be wrong, as more and more data and research presents itself to them, that it doesn't work and that it's harmful.

You can accept that, or reject it, if you want.
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#329 hockeyfan87

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:24 PM

And so you're remedy is to rear children using fear, violence and intimidation in order to prompt the behaviour you want.

Gotcha....that's certainly worked well over the years.

When the homicide rate was the highest it ever was in B.C....in the mid to late 70's fyi....what era do you think those people who committed those homicides grew up in? Oh that's right, those model citizens grew up in the tan hidin era of the 50's, and 60's.

Sure did a lot of good back in the good ol' days eh?


Look, you can 'feel' whatever you want to 'feel'. What i'm trying to display for you is that your feelings run counter to the data and to numerous academic and field studies. What do you think has more weight in reality. The feelings you have that come your biased musings, or the research?

Corporal punishment does not work.....and this is why there are now 32 countries that have outright banned it....and more are considering it every year. 32 different countries and the ones now moving to banning it outright, can't all be wrong, as more and more data and research presents itself to them, that it doesn't work and that it's harmful.

You can accept that, or reject it, if you want.


I'm on your side of the debate but to suggest that homicide peaked during the 70s because of corporal punishment is a bit of a reach. It's much more likely because of the baby boomers and the age prime cohort for homicide (young males) being at their largest proportion of the total population.
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#330 VICanucksfan5551

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:29 PM

I'm on your side of the debate but to suggest that homicide peaked during the 70s because of corporal punishment is a bit of a reach. It's much more likely because of the baby boomers and the age prime cohort for homicide (young males) being at their largest proportion of the total population.

I think he was suggesting that it didn't stop the homicide rate from spiking, not that it caused the spike.
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