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Luongo Trade Theory 101


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#151 Gollumpus

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Posted 06 November 2012 - 07:24 PM

Meh, US election results are on. Can you believe that most of the folks south of the border don't even care about hockey?

regards,
G.
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Following the Canucks since before Don Cherry played here.

#152 Riviera82

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 12:48 AM

This is so laughable, because anyone who watched the games that season would realize that Luongo won AV the Jack Adams trophy, I don't even know how it is debatable. That wasn't a playoff team, it was just Lu. The skater roster had gotten worse after a season in which we missed the playoffs. And who was more benefical to our success? Luongo or AV? Luongo is the clear correct choice.

As for the rest, I guess you also didn't see the terrible play by our players, go back and watch the full highlights in games 4 and 5? and you will see how terribly we played and how much better than Hawks were playing than we were.

Your argument is just another case of: When we lose it is all Roberto's fault, when we win it is inspite of Roberto. Which really is an age old argument that niether side will ever win, you just have to be able to realize that it is a team sport, and you have to look at everyone's play before you assess the blame to one person, which people in this city clearly don't do enough.


So Luongo did not benefit whatsoever from AV's defense first system, understood.
I never said that all of the team's shortcomings were all entirely Luongo's fault. He was however a very noticeable negative factor during points in 3 straight playoff years before 2012.
Even if the team was playing like crap whenever Luongo got ventilated, no other "elite" goaltender that I can think of has folded like a cheap tent with such regularity. It seems the Canucks are the only team who's skaters leave their goaltender out to dry every year. Does this sound about right?
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#153 King of the ES

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 04:34 AM

Also Luongo is much more proven than Halak is, thus will get a higher return for Vancouver than what Halak got for Montreal.


Oh OK, so are you saying that Luongo would get a higher return than Schneider would? Much more proven, right?

Not how it works.
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#154 King of the ES

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 04:37 AM

If you believe that Luongo will be traded in a timely fashion, why are you so concerned about his continued presence on the team? It is a major harping point on your part.

Just out of curiosity, how do you define "in a timely fashion"? Hours after the new CBA is signed? A day? A week? A month? From the tone of some of your posts, if Luongo was around for perhaps a week(?), then things would go south for the team.


I'm not "so concerned", just don't understand how people can claim that there's "no rush" to trade him, can wait until the deadline, the draft, etc. That would not be smart.

As for timeline, I suspect that he's played his last game as a Canuck, yes.

And you are reaching for the low-point from which to base your opinion, in my opinion. When could Gillis have dealt with this sooner? At the draft? This makes your suggestion one of panic selling where there is no alternative but to take less than what Luongo is worth. Get the most used pucks in the bucket of used pucks and move on. I don't abide with that view.


I'm of the opinion that he should've dealt with this sooner by trading Schneider, before the blow-up happened in Los Angeles.
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#155 Pears

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 08:18 AM

Oh OK, so are you saying that Luongo would get a higher return than Schneider would? Much more proven, right?

Not how it works.

I never even said Luongo would get a better return than Schneider, I said he'd get a better return than Halak. Poor reading comprehension to say the least.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

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#156 King of the ES

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 08:54 AM

I never even said Luongo would get a better return than Schneider, I said he'd get a better return than Halak. Poor reading comprehension to say the least.


You said that he'd get a better return than Halak because he's more proven.

That being the case, then, it would logically follow that he'd also get a better return than Schneider, since he also is more proven than him. Do you see the flawed logic that you've offered?
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#157 Pears

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 09:04 AM

You said that he'd get a better return than Halak because he's more proven.

That being the case, then, it would logically follow that he'd also get a better return than Schneider, since he also is more proven than him. Do you see the flawed logic that you've offered?

Luongo is also better than Halak, but Schneider is younger and arguably better than both of them.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

   ryan kesler is going to the chicago blackhawks ...       quote me on it


#158 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 10:40 AM

So Luongo did not benefit whatsoever from AV's defense first system, understood.


I think it should be phrased like this.

"AV's defense first system benefitted from Luongo"

You make a decent point, obviously he helped a bit but it wasn't a big factor, and we had to go defense first when you think about it, we had gotten signficantly worse offensively with the lose of Bert and Jovo exc.

I'm not an AV fan really so maybe I am a bit biased, but I think AV's impact on the team that season was overrated. IMO it was all/mostly Lu.

I never said that all of the team's shortcomings were all entirely Luongo's fault. He was however a very noticeable negative factor during points in 3 straight playoff years before 2012.
Even if the team was playing like crap whenever Luongo got ventilated, no other "elite" goaltender that I can think of has folded like a cheap tent with such regularity. It seems the Canucks are the only team who's skaters leave their goaltender out to dry every year. Does this sound about right?


I think the positive impact he made on those playoff years outways the negative impact.

He has had his bad moment's no one is doubting that, I do think however as a team we have collapsed in those situations, just look against Chicago, the way we would let players just walk in and get good chances (Most notably Hossa in game 5) is atrocious.


And you say no other elite goaltender has, but I don't recall any elite goaltender being able to carry a team through the playoffs when a team can't play well, why should we expect it here? If the entire team, skater and Lu can't play well enough we deserve to get eliminated. But insted everyone just pins all the lose on Lu and everyone else who played just as bad if not worse gets a free pass.

Look at Lundqvist, as great as he is, it's not like he has had anymore playoff success than Luongo, in fact less. teams just get eliminated when they play bad, that's just the way hockey works, yes Lu didn't help the cause but why should we take his head, if everyone else had played better he would have too.

And there are times when they leave him out to dry and he plays great, as i've already said. But you can't expect him to carry the team everytime we play like crap.
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#159 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 10:47 AM

That being the case, then, it would logically follow that he'd also get a better return than Schneider, since he also is more proven than him. Do you see the flawed logic that you've offered?


He was talking about Halak's value then vs Luongo's now, he never said anything about Schneider

Schneider's scenerio is different than both, so it's not really a good comparison.
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#160 King of the ES

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 02:02 PM

He was talking about Halak's value then vs Luongo's now, he never said anything about Schneider

Schneider's scenerio is different than both, so it's not really a good comparison.


Halak's value then was far higher than Luongo's is now, so I still don't know what you're talking about.
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#161 ConnorFutureGM

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 04:13 PM

A lot of Canucks' fans' expectations of what Luongo will return is a fantasy.

The best indicator is to see past trades of goaltenders and see if there are any comparables.

Lindback, FOR

Bobrovsky FOR 2nd, 4th, 4th (2013)

Giguere FOR Vesa Toskala and Jason Blake

Varlomov FOR 1st conditional, 2nd conditional

Lethonen FOR Ivan Vishnevskiy, 4th

Bishop FOR 2nd

Halak FOR Eller, Schultz

Luongo, Krajicek, 6th FOR Todd Bertuzzi, Allen, Auld
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#162 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 04:36 PM

Halak's value then was far higher than Luongo's is now, so I still don't know what you're talking about.


How? Halak had been a backup goalie up until the playoffs, why do you think the price was so low? Because it was a risk.

There was a chance that the spectacular playoffs he put together was just a one off, and that he just hit his peak at the right time, and it was possibilty that he wouldn't be able to continue that kind of star play.

whereas Luongo is the exact opposite, a proven all-star, proven Vezina calibre goalie, and so-on like MG said.
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#163 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 04:40 PM

A lot of Canucks' fans' expectations of what Luongo will return is a fantasy.

The best indicator is to see past trades of goaltenders and see if there are any comparables.

Lindback, FOR

Bobrovsky FOR 2nd, 4th, 4th (2013)

Giguere FOR Vesa Toskala and Jason Blake

Varlomov FOR 1st conditional, 2nd conditional

Lethonen FOR Ivan Vishnevskiy, 4th

Bishop FOR 2nd

Halak FOR Eller, Schultz

Luongo, Krajicek, 6th FOR Todd Bertuzzi, Allen, Auld


There are really no comparables out of all those.

The most comparables are the Halak and (past) Luongo deal (and even those aren't great comparables), the return will probably be somewhere in the middle of those two.
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#164 King of the ES

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 06:19 PM

How? Halak had been a backup goalie up until the playoffs, why do you think the price was so low? Because it was a risk.


Halak was the Schneider equivalent - the backup who had outplayed the starter. Look at his numbers from that regular season: 26-13-5, 5 SO, .924 SVP. Then he basically took the team on his back to the ECF as the 8th seed. He was also only 24 years old.

There's really no comparison. Montreal "only" got what they got because it's not easy to trade a goaltender - always just a few buyers.
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#165 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 06:34 PM

Halak was the Schneider equivalent - the backup who had outplayed the starter. Look at his numbers from that regular season: 26-13-5, 5 SO, .924 SVP. Then he basically took the team on his back to the ECF as the 8th seed. He was also only 24 years old.

There's really no comparison. Montreal "only" got what they got because it's not easy to trade a goaltender - always just a few buyers.


Were comparing him to Luongo, not Schneids.

Him and Price were a Tandem, both were at the same point in there careers, so it's really not a big deal that he replaced Price, and him overtaking Price isn't as hard or as impressive as Schneids overtaking Lu imo.

But like I said the reason it was so low was (well first off Gauthier made a bad deal), and because he was still not entirely proven, he had one solid year and an amazing playoffs, if he had had the same success for a few season's earlier then the price would have been much higher.

Although Gauthier really dropped the ball on that deal, that's why it's not a good comparison, that's like looking at the Goligoski/Neal trade and saying every average top 4 defenseman should get that kind of a return.

The reason Lu will get a better return is: He's a proven star, which Halak wasn't at the time, and because Gillis will press for a fair price and not give him away for nothing like Gauthier seems to have done.
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#166 King of the ES

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 08:33 PM

The reason Lu will get a better return is: He's a proven star, which Halak wasn't at the time, and because Gillis will press for a fair price and not give him away for nothing like Gauthier seems to have done.


Halak wasn't 33 years old with 9 years remaining on his contract that pays him $5.2M per year. Halak also did not ultimately dictate where he went.

But, sure, whatever makes you sleep at night. Luongo's going to bring us back 5 All-Stars and we'll only lose 3 games next season, if that's what you want to believe.
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#167 ConnorFutureGM

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 08:49 PM

Halak was the Schneider equivalent - the backup who had outplayed the starter. Look at his numbers from that regular season: 26-13-5, 5 SO, .924 SVP. Then he basically took the team on his back to the ECF as the 8th seed. He was also only 24 years old.

There's really no comparison. Montreal "only" got what they got because it's not easy to trade a goaltender - always just a few buyers.

Exactly
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#168 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 11:13 PM

Halak wasn't 33 years old with 9 years remaining on his contract that pays him $5.2M per year. Halak also did not ultimately dictate where he went.

But, sure, whatever makes you sleep at night. Luongo's going to bring us back 5 All-Stars and we'll only lose 3 games next season, if that's what you want to believe.


I'm pretty sure I asked you to stop telling me that I said stuff that I didn't say in the last post, but I guess you didn't read. (Sigh)

And yes Halak wasn't 33 and all that stuff, but he also wasn't a proven starter, let a lone a proven star goalie with the resume to prove it like Roberto.

(And 5.2 is actually not a bad cap # for a star goalie like Roberto btw.)

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 08 November 2012 - 12:23 AM.

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#169 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 11:21 PM

- "It's not an easy goaltender to trade - always just a few buyer"

Exactly


So this means where gunna throw him away for nothing?? There are 2 teams that really want/need him (possibly more), so we can at least get something that will offer us some value in return.

This won't be a homerun or great deal or anything by any means but we won't get trash like you 2 seem to think, MG won't allow it.
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#170 ConnorFutureGM

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 12:19 AM

I'm pretty sure I asked you to stop telling me that I said stuff that I didn't in the last post, but I guess you didn't read. (Sigh)

And yes Halak wasn't 33 and all that stuff, but he also wasn't a proven starter, let a lone a proven star goalie with the resume to prove it like Roberto.

(And 5.2 is actually not a bad cap # for a star goalie like Roberto btw.)

- "It's not an easy goaltender to trade - always just a few buyer"

If Luongo had 3 years left at 5 mil then he would likely get a much better return. It's the 10 years that eats away at the value he would have.

So this means where gunna throw him away for nothing?? There are 2 teams that really want/need him (possibly more), so we can at least get something that will offer us some value in return.

This won't be a homerun or great deal or anything by any means but we won't get trash like you 2 seem to think, MG won't allow it.

Gillis has to do what is best for the Canucks.

With that being said, a lot of Canuck fans think it is simply the return on Luongo that drives him. The fact is when players asked to be traded (we all know he asked to be traded even if he didn't state it as such publicly) their value already goes down. Teams know that the team more or less needs to trade the player.

Another thing that I mentioned earlier is his huge contract. Not only do teams know he is available but that they will have to commit to him for the next 10 years. He may retire earlier but teams can't count on that.

Another factor is that he has a NTC. Whatever market there is for him or a goaltender in gneral, it just got shrunk. He probably wouldn't go to Columbus. Would he go to Toronto or Edmonton? Is he just waiting out for Florida?

Then there's the fact he isn't a closer. Fans can rave about how great he played on stretches but the fact is he has hard a tie to shut the door when he is given the opportunity.

Gillis will not get a impact player, a top prospect and a 1st.

The only 1st he might get would be from Chicago. If it's a draft pick from another team I expect him to get a 2nd.

There will not be a bluechip prospect in this trade. Maybe a B prospect.

The "impact player" going back to the Canucks will determine the rest of the return. If it's actually a salary dump (ie a player with negative value) then the draft pick or prospect could be upgraded. The best I see this "impact player" being is a 2nd liner or under performing player. In that case, the prospect and or pick will stay the same or get worse.
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#171 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 12:38 AM

Gillis has to do what is best for the Canucks.

With that being said, a lot of Canuck fans think it is simply the return on Luongo that drives him. The fact is when players asked to be traded (we all know he asked to be traded even if he didn't state it as such publicly) their value already goes down. Teams know that the team more or less needs to trade the player.

Another thing that I mentioned earlier is his huge contract. Not only do teams know he is available but that they will have to commit to him for the next 10 years. He may retire earlier but teams can't count on that.

Another factor is that he has a NTC. Whatever market there is for him or a goaltender in gneral, it just got shrunk. He probably wouldn't go to Columbus. Would he go to Toronto or Edmonton? Is he just waiting out for Florida?

Then there's the fact he isn't a closer. Fans can rave about how great he played on stretches but the fact is he has hard a tie to shut the door when he is given the opportunity.


Your right about the trade request thing, everyone knows that it is eventually what will have to happen. but so far I think Gillis has done a great job of being patient and not throwing him away, like I said before I don't expect a home run or great deal out of this but Gillis has to get something worth while.

The contract isn't as big of a deal as people make it out to be, knowing Roberto like you do (if you are a fan of this team and have followed them constently since he got here) do you really think Lu will play till he is 42? I say he will retire at about 36 or 37, and the Cap hit is good.

The Contract card is more used as a bargaining chip when negotiating a deal, I don't really think its a huge factor tbh.

We'll he has stated he will be willing to waive it, maybe there are a couple teams he might not want to go too, but I don't believe Toronto is one of them, and the one's that he wouldn't want to go to probably aren't interested anyways. So though this is a factor to consider, judging by the fact himself that he doesn't want to be one to stand in the way of the team, I think he will waive to go when a deal is made.

And that tie the door shut comment is very debatable, you can say there are times that he hasn't and you would be right, but there are just as many times where he has shut the door in tough situations, maybe more times he has than hasn't.

And really you could say the same thing about a # of fellow star goalies (Lundqvist, Miller, exc.) So I don't really think that carries alot of weight or is a big deal in the trade negotiations honestly.

Gillis will not get a impact player, a top prospect and a 1st.

The only 1st he might get would be from Chicago. If it's a draft pick from another team I expect him to get a 2nd.

There will not be a bluechip prospect in this trade. Maybe a B prospect.

The "impact player" going back to the Canucks will determine the rest of the return. If it's actually a salary dump (ie a player with negative value) then the draft pick or prospect could be upgraded. The best I see this "impact player" being is a 2nd liner or under performing player. In that case, the prospect and or pick will stay the same or get worse.


Everyone knows we won't be getting a 1st line player, that's why there is no way we will make a deal with Chicago.

As for everything else you say, I agree to an extent but I think it depends on the circumstances, like for Example, if the impact player we get is a 3rd line calibre player like Bozak, then there is maybe a chance we get a good prospect, or a 1st (one or another, but not both). It also depends on how you classify top notch prospect and B prospect.

But basicly the points you made about that (and that I have just made in repliance) are why I think. Bozak, Biggs and a 2nd is fair.
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#172 Lui's Knob

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 01:06 AM

Lp
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#173 ConnorFutureGM

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 01:14 AM

Your right about the trade request thing, everyone knows that it is eventually what will have to happen. but so far I think Gillis has done a great job of being patient and not throwing him away, like I said before I don't expect a home run or great deal out of this but Gillis has to get something worth while.

The contract isn't as big of a deal as people make it out to be, knowing Roberto like you do (if you are a fan of this team and have followed them constently since he got here) do you really think Lu will play till he is 42? I say he will retire at about 36 or 37, and the Cap hit is good.

The Contract card is more used as a bargaining chip when negotiating a deal, I don't really think its a huge factor tbh.

We'll he has stated he will be willing to waive it, maybe there are a couple teams he might not want to go too, but I don't believe Toronto is one of them, and the one's that he wouldn't want to go to probably aren't interested anyways. So though this is a factor to consider, judging by the fact himself that he doesn't want to be one to stand in the way of the team, I think he will waive to go when a deal is made.

And that tie the door shut comment is very debatable, you can say there are times that he hasn't and you would be right, but there are just as many times where he has shut the door in tough situations, maybe more times he has than hasn't.

And really you could say the same thing about a # of fellow star goalies (Lundqvist, Miller, exc.) So I don't really think that carries alot of weight or is a big deal in the trade negotiations honestly.



Everyone knows we won't be getting a 1st line player, that's why there is no way we will make a deal with Chicago.

As for everything else you say, I agree to an extent but I think it depends on the circumstances, like for Example, if the impact player we get is a 3rd line calibre player like Bozak, then there is maybe a chance we get a good prospect, or a 1st (one or another, but not both). It also depends on how you classify top notch prospect and B prospect.

But basicly the points you made about that (and that I have just made in repliance) are why I think. Bozak, Biggs and a 2nd is fair.

I classify a blue chip prospect as a player who can play top 6/top 4 while being on a cheap contract and or a player projected to be an elite player.

A "B" prospect is a player who might turn out to be a 2nd liner/2nd pairing player but will take work and time to get there.

I think your proposal from Toronto is reasonable and something Toronto might offer. I also think that Toronto is the team that would offer the most. I also think it is very possible that Luongo doesn't want to go to Toronto. I see him preferring Edmonton before Toronto.

My guess of the pecking order of teams that Luongo would want to go to.

1. Florida
2. Tampa Bay
3. Chicago
4. Edmonton
15. Toronto
31. Columbus
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#174 King of the ES

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 04:31 AM

And yes Halak wasn't 33 and all that stuff, but he also wasn't a proven starter, let a lone a proven star goalie with the resume to prove it like Roberto.



If that's the case, then I guess you also think that Schneider's not a proven starter? Halak was more proven as Montreal's backup then Schneider was as Vancouver's (more games played).

(And 5.2 is actually not a bad cap # for a star goalie like Roberto btw.)


It is if you're committed to paying that star goalie that amount of money until he's 42 years old.

Edited by King of the ES, 08 November 2012 - 04:32 AM.

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#175 Riviera82

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 08:07 AM

I think it should be phrased like this.

"AV's defense first system benefitted from Luongo"

You make a decent point, obviously he helped a bit but it wasn't a big factor, and we had to go defense first when you think about it, we had gotten signficantly worse offensively with the lose of Bert and Jovo exc.

I'm not an AV fan really so maybe I am a bit biased, but I think AV's impact on the team that season was overrated. IMO it was all/mostly Lu.



I think the positive impact he made on those playoff years outways the negative impact.

He has had his bad moment's no one is doubting that, I do think however as a team we have collapsed in those situations, just look against Chicago, the way we would let players just walk in and get good chances (Most notably Hossa in game 5) is atrocious.


And you say no other elite goaltender has, but I don't recall any elite goaltender being able to carry a team through the playoffs when a team can't play well, why should we expect it here? If the entire team, skater and Lu can't play well enough we deserve to get eliminated. But insted everyone just pins all the lose on Lu and everyone else who played just as bad if not worse gets a free pass.

Look at Lundqvist, as great as he is, it's not like he has had anymore playoff success than Luongo, in fact less. teams just get eliminated when they play bad, that's just the way hockey works, yes Lu didn't help the cause but why should we take his head, if everyone else had played better he would have too.

And there are times when they leave him out to dry and he plays great, as i've already said. But you can't expect him to carry the team everytime we play like crap.


You make a decent argument.
Personally I just expected him to be better in the playoffs than in the regular season. Whether or not the team plays like crap I think you must admit that losing in blowouts had become a trend for Luongo in the playoffs more so than the regular season. I could understand that for a goalie of Dan Cloutier's caliber but not Luongo. Lundquist may not have as many wins as Luongo in the playoffs (25 to 32), but he has had 3 very respectable showings compared to Luongo's 1 or 1.5.
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#176 Riviera82

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 08:20 AM

There are really no comparables out of all those.

The most comparables are the Halak and (past) Luongo deal (and even those aren't great comparables), the return will probably be somewhere in the middle of those two.


I cant see how we will get back even close to as much for Luongo as we gave up. Looking back we didn't really give up much of value.
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#177 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 08:51 AM

I cant see how we will get back even close to as much for Luongo as we gave up. Looking back we didn't really give up much of value.


Well the margin is pretty big, I don't think we will get that value back either, but from the examples he gave that's about accurate, somewhere in the middle, probably closer to the Halak deal.
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#178 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 08:55 AM

You make a decent argument.
Personally I just expected him to be better in the playoffs than in the regular season. Whether or not the team plays like crap I think you must admit that losing in blowouts had become a trend for Luongo in the playoffs more so than the regular season. I could understand that for a goalie of Dan Cloutier's caliber but not Luongo. Lundquist may not have as many wins as Luongo in the playoffs (25 to 32), but he has had 3 very respectable showings compared to Luongo's 1 or 1.5.


Not a bad argument either, I just like to point out that for all the bad times Luongo played bad, he has had about: The same amount to twice the amount of good preformences.

And I also pointed out that other goalies that are looked up to as stars haven't done any better. But I think do agree that while as a team we probably deserved to lose all the games were blown out in, Luongo didn't help the matter.
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#179 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 10:33 AM

I classify a blue chip prospect as a player who can play top 6/top 4 while being on a cheap contract and or a player projected to be an elite player.

A "B" prospect is a player who might turn out to be a 2nd liner/2nd pairing player but will take work and time to get there.


If that is what you classify it as, then there really aren't many of them available to us with the teams that are interested, Huberbeau, Gudbranson and maybe Rielly are the only one's, and I dont see any chance we get any of those.


I think your proposal from Toronto is reasonable and something Toronto might offer. I also think that Toronto is the team that would offer the most. I also think it is very possible that Luongo doesn't want to go to Toronto. I see him preferring Edmonton before Toronto.

My guess of the pecking order of teams that Luongo would want to go to.

1. Florida
2. Tampa Bay
3. Chicago
4. Edmonton
15. Toronto
31. Columbus


Yeah I agree, I think they would too since they have the greatest need for goaltending.

I do think he would rather go to Toronto though over Edmonton, I don't think he would want to stay out here in western canada (and go to a less appealing market), aswell as it being a division rival, I think he would rather go East.

Here's where I think he would want to go in the order of interest (of just the teams you mentioned):

1. Florida
2. Tampa Bay
3. Toronto
4. Chicago
5. Edmonton
6. Columbus


Unfortunately I only see Toronto and Florida as teams that are realistic trading partners at this point.
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#180 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 10:43 AM

[/i]

If that's the case, then I guess you also think that Schneider's not a proven starter? Halak was more proven as Montreal's backup then Schneider was as Vancouver's (more games played).



It is if you're committed to paying that star goalie that amount of money until he's 42 years old.


No when you think about it Schnieder isn't proven, but based on what we have seen I have a good feeling he will be fine. Just like I felt with Halak, but in both cases it still doesn't excuse the fact that they aren't proven starters, regardless of how good you feel about it.

And of course Halak had played more games, he had played parts of 4 season's in Montreal.

I'm not sure what point your trying to make with that, I wasn't arguing that Schneider is a proven starter.


And as for the 42 years old comment, like I said earlier to Connor:

The contract isn't as big of a deal as people make it out to be, knowing Roberto like you do (if you are a fan of this team and have followed them constently since he got here) do you really think Lu will play till he is 42? I say he will retire at about 36 or 37, and the Cap hit is good.


And judging by the way the CBA talks are progressing, if there is a penalty on front loaded deals (like as been discussed at times), when he retires the cap hit will tag onto us, not the other team, which would make Luongo a bit more appealing.
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