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(Discussion) Value of: Alexander Edler to Pittsburgh


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#1 Pears

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Posted 21 October 2012 - 11:11 PM

I haven't made a proposal thread in awhile so I wanted to make one on something that I've been pondering lately: What could the Pittsburgh Penguins offer for Alex Edler? The only true top pair defenseman they have IMO is Kris Letang, while I personally view Brooks Orpik as a top 4 D man, although the Pens pair Orpik with Letang sometimes.

So what do you guys think we could get from Pittsburgh?
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

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#2 Zach Parise

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Posted 21 October 2012 - 11:14 PM

in b 4 someone says crosby !
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#3 Phil_314

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Posted 21 October 2012 - 11:17 PM

Malkin :bigblush:

I want something built around acquiring either Brandon Sutter or Chris Kunitz in return, though the back end would of course need to get patched up as well with Alex gone (but I doubt they'd include really good young D prospects as part of the deal with guys like Brandon or Chris already coming back).
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#4 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 21 October 2012 - 11:30 PM

James Neal.

They seem like they are in the exact same situations, they both just became (or are becoming) top line players, both are a similar age.

That's what I would ask if we have to move Edler, but I would rather just keep Edler as I think he would make a bigger impact than adding another star forward to be honest.

Defense is important and he is huge part of this team.
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#5 Jägermeister

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Posted 21 October 2012 - 11:35 PM

They don't have much that we would want, and anyone we would want they wouldn't be willing to part with them.
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#6 Pears

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Posted 21 October 2012 - 11:45 PM

James Neal.

They seem like they are in the exact same situations, they both just became (or are becoming) top line players, both are a similar age.

That's what I would ask if we have to move Edler, but I would rather just keep Edler as I think he would make a bigger impact than adding another star forward to be honest.

Defense is important and he is huge part of this team.

I doubt they would give up Neal since they are already dry on top six forwards. I was thinking something like this:

To Vancouver: Tyler Kennedy + 2013 1st

To Pittsburgh: Alex Edler

Probably not the best package but it could start negotiations.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

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#7 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 21 October 2012 - 11:48 PM

I doubt they would give up Neal since they are already dry on top six forwards. I was thinking something like this:

To Vancouver: Tyler Kennedy + 2013 1st

To Pittsburgh: Alex Edler

Probably not the best package but it could start negotiations.


Ya but I dont really want to trade Edler, and right now I dont see any reason too.

If they want him then Neal for him straight across is the approach I would take, unless it becomes evident that we wont get Eddie under contract then maybe look at something else but if they want him right now then I would just say that's what it will take.

Although I do think we will get Edler signed.
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#8 elvis15

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 08:50 AM

I doubt they would give up Neal since they are already dry on top six forwards. I was thinking something like this:

To Vancouver: Tyler Kennedy + 2013 1st

To Pittsburgh: Alex Edler

Probably not the best package but it could start negotiations.

Well, what else do they have to offer then? We don't want bottom 6 forwards so much and goaltending coming back is hardly helpful. Are they going to try and entice us with low round picks? You suggest Tyler Kennedy, but is a 3rd line center, really the return we want for Edler?

I doubt they would be a good trading partner unless they want to pay for it. Out of their prospects, the best ones they have are on D. So look at it from their perspective, why would they want to give up a lot for a D-man (who's due for a raise) when they have a few good D coming up in the system?
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#9 zombieksa

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 09:13 AM

Kennedy + Glass + 1st :)
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#10 Lups

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 09:31 AM

I'd say nothing right now...

http://forum.canucks...g-disk-in-back/

That is a pretty serious injury

Remember Belfour anyone?

Edited by Henrik Sedin, 22 October 2012 - 09:35 AM.

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#11 Monty

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 03:06 PM

I've been a Vancouver fan for years. But since moving back to Winnipeg 7 years ago, and now being a Jets fan first and foremost, I've been able to step back from the insanity that comes with being a Canucks fan.

That out of the way now, "Are you insane?" Why, even for the fun of it, would you want to trade Edler? So he had a bad playoff last year, so did the rest of the team. Otherwise, he truly is a stud defenseman. Trading him would be a huge mistake.

Yes, James Neal is a good player, but on what line do you put him on? The Canucks would have to make trades on the top 6 to accomodate that addition. The Canucks do not need to become more top heavy, nor move a young defenseman who is only getting better.

FAIL THREAD
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#12 Pears

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 03:32 PM

I've been a Vancouver fan for years. But since moving back to Winnipeg 7 years ago, and now being a Jets fan first and foremost, I've been able to step back from the insanity that comes with being a Canucks fan.

That out of the way now, "Are you insane?" Why, even for the fun of it, would you want to trade Edler? So he had a bad playoff last year, so did the rest of the team. Otherwise, he truly is a stud defenseman. Trading him would be a huge mistake.

Yes, James Neal is a good player, but on what line do you put him on? The Canucks would have to make trades on the top 6 to accomodate that addition. The Canucks do not need to become more top heavy, nor move a young defenseman who is only getting better.

FAIL THREAD

Don't single me out on proposing we trade Edler as I am not the only member who has done so.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

   ryan kesler is going to the chicago blackhawks ...       quote me on it


#13 palindrom

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 03:45 PM

How long do you expect the lockout to last and at what age do you expect the UFA eligibility will be fix after the lockout?

Without these parameter know, its just impossible to estimate the value of Edler.

Edited by palindrom, 22 October 2012 - 03:46 PM.

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#14 mrsasaki

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 11:15 PM

I don't think Pittsburgh will really want him with all their young defensemen coming through the system (Morrow, Despres, Maatta, Pouliot, Dumolin, Harrington), and they're doing quite fine without some real quality defense. They have 3 top 4 guys, and Despres and Morrow will be ready soon, especially Despres.
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#15 Hunter Shinkaruk #9

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 11:22 PM

Kennedy, Despres + 1st.
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#16 Alex Burrows 14

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 11:57 AM

Fleury fr insurance in goal. We dont have enough depth at goalie
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#17 kanucks1

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 07:48 PM

James Neal.

They seem like they are in the exact same situations, they both just became (or are becoming) top line players, both are a similar age.

That's what I would ask if we have to move Edler, but I would rather just keep Edler as I think he would make a bigger impact than adding another star forward to be honest.

Defense is important and he is huge part of this team.


Good idea.
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#18 kanucks1

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 07:49 PM

I've been a Vancouver fan for years. But since moving back to Winnipeg 7 years ago, and now being a Jets fan first and foremost, I've been able to step back from the insanity that comes with being a Canucks fan.

That out of the way now, "Are you insane?" Why, even for the fun of it, would you want to trade Edler? So he had a bad playoff last year, so did the rest of the team. Otherwise, he truly is a stud defenseman. Trading him would be a huge mistake.

Yes, James Neal is a good player, but on what line do you put him on? The Canucks would have to make trades on the top 6 to accomodate that addition. The Canucks do not need to become more top heavy, nor move a young defenseman who is only getting better.

FAIL THREAD


CALM DOWN! It's just a proposal.
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#19 LeanBeef

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 08:14 PM

Kennedy, Engelland, 1st
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#20 palindrom

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 08:48 PM

James Neal.

They seem like they are in the exact same situations, they both just became (or are becoming) top line players, both are a similar age.


How a player who is under contract until 2017 (Neal) and a player who could become UFA at the end of the season (Edler), and not even play a single game with his team if we have a year long lockout, are in the exact same situation ?

Edited by palindrom, 23 October 2012 - 08:52 PM.

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#21 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 08:55 PM

How a player who is under contract until 2017 (Neal) and a player who could become UFA at the end of the season (Edler), and not even play a single game with his team if we have a year long lockout, are in the exact same situation ?


Well how do you know that he will be a UFA? The latest proposal's had UFA changed to 28 or 8 years, which would make Edler (27) and RFA.

And I didn't mean contract situation I ment as a player, both have become/are becoming top line players, and not all that far apart in age, only like 2 years or something.

So in terms of there pedigree they are very similar just different positions.
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#22 FullMetalOilDrum

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 10:11 PM

Letang alone maybe.
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#23 bossram

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 10:24 PM

I haven't made a proposal thread in awhile so I wanted to make one on something that I've been pondering lately: What could the Pittsburgh Penguins offer for Alex Edler? The only true top pair defenseman they have IMO is Kris Letang, while I personally view Brooks Orpik as a top 4 D man, although the Pens pair Orpik with Letang sometimes.

So what do you guys think we could get from Pittsburgh?


Pending UFA Edler wouldn't have that much value and the only suitable player I would want is James Neal or a package of something like Depres + Brandon Sutter. I don't think Pittsburgh makes either of those moves.

I've said it before on Edler topics, but we simply cannot afford to move Edler unless we get a suitable replacement on defense elsewhere. Our blueline is already thin and removing our most talented defenseman does not help that situation. Trade Edler and we run a Hamhuis-Bieksa Ballard-Garrison Alberts-Tanev blueline. That is nowhere near good enough to contend for a Cup. If anything we need to add a defeseman.
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#24 palindrom

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 10:38 PM

Well how do you know that he will be a UFA? The latest proposal's had UFA changed to 28 or 8 years, which would make Edler (27) and RFA.

And I didn't mean contract situation I ment as a player, both have become/are becoming top line players, and not all that far apart in age, only like 2 years or something.

So in terms of there pedigree they are very similar just different positions.


I didnt say he will become UFA i say he could.

A question for you: how much difference in trade value between Edler now, or a Edler signed for the next 5 years at a reasonable contract ?
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#25 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 10:50 PM

I didnt say he will become UFA i say he could.

A question for you: how much difference in trade value between Edler now, or a Edler signed for the next 5 years at a reasonable contract ?


Well if the CBA changes that then no he couldn't be.

Probably a bit, not a huge huge difference, I dont think anyways since it's the begining of the year but it would make a fairly significant one.
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#26 palindrom

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 11:23 PM

Well if the CBA changes that then no he couldn't be.

Probably a bit, not a huge huge difference, I dont think anyways since it's the begining of the year but it would make a fairly significant one.


I would say it become a significant difference, especially for team who have hard time to attract UFA / re sign their player.

Put yourself, for example, in the shoes of Colombus's GM.

If they acquire Edler who is scheduled to be UFA next summer (or maybe summer 2013 according to the future CBA) what are the chance they would retain Edler after his contract expire ?

A Edler signed for the next 5 years would be significantly more valuable for them. There was a reason they was willing to give a lot to acquire Carter. Imagine if Carter was going to be UFA ? Im not even sure Colombus would had given anything of value to acquire him, or at least their bid would be so low, other team would outbid them.

So instead of losing a Carter for next to nothing as UFA, because Carter didn't want to play there. They was able to trade him back for something of value.
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#27 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 11:35 PM

I would say it become a significant difference, especially for team who have hard time to attract UFA / re sign their player.

Put yourself, for example, in the shoes of Colombus's GM.

If they acquire Edler who is scheduled to be UFA next summer (or maybe summer 2013 according to the future CBA) what are the chance they would retain Edler after his contract expire ?

A Edler signed for the next 5 years would be significantly more valuable for them. There was a reason they was willing to give a lot to acquire Carter. Imagine if Carter was going to be UFA ? Im not even sure Colombus would had given anything of value to acquire him, or at least their bid would be so low, other team would outbid them.

So instead of losing a Carter for next to nothing as UFA, because Carter didn't want to play there. They was able to trade him back for something of value.


It all depends on the CBA.

If he's an RFA then its not that significant. because they will retain his rights. and if they dont think they will get a deal done (for more than one year) they can trade him and still get good return.

Although hopefully we dont trade him and I know we won't, im confident that we will get him signed and good thing cause we need him.
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#28 palindrom

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Posted 24 October 2012 - 03:34 AM

It all depends on the CBA.

If he's an RFA then its not that significant. because they will retain his rights. and if they dont think they will get a deal done (for more than one year) they can trade him and still get good return.

Although hopefully we dont trade him and I know we won't, im confident that we will get him signed and good thing cause we need him.


Well, that's kinda why i question the pertinence to make proposal involving player whose value could value greatly according to the new CBA. What if the lockout last the entire season, then Edler become UFA and sign with Pittsburgh ?

The trade value of Edler could be ZERO or a lot. according to the duration of the lockout and how old will be the UFA eligibility.

So lets just wait until we have a new CBA, then we can start again making proposal about player in Edler situation.

Edited by palindrom, 24 October 2012 - 03:35 AM.

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#29 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 24 October 2012 - 03:34 PM

Well, that's kinda why i question the pertinence to make proposal involving player whose value could value greatly according to the new CBA. What if the lockout last the entire season, then Edler become UFA and sign with Pittsburgh ?

The trade value of Edler could be ZERO or a lot. according to the duration of the lockout and how old will be the UFA eligibility.

So lets just wait until we have a new CBA, then we can start again making proposal about player in Edler situation.


Well I'm not the one making the proposal, Im of other mind actually that I dont think we should trade him so you should tell that to the OP not me lol.

But Edler's value wouldn't be zero, even if it doesn't change, we would still get something decent in return, just not as much as we could with a long term deal.
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#30 Canuck Surfer

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Posted 24 October 2012 - 07:05 PM

:unsure: Really this ONLY happens if the vaunted Lou trade surprises with Dan Boyle or Brian Campbell.

Then you trade for a stud prospect to clear cap space and reload. But I don't see much, which they would be willing to give us that has any value. Their strength is in being top heavy; so behind Malkin, Crosby, Fleury and Letang, most likely Neal, who do they have we could use?

- Kunitz? If he gets only 60 points playing with Malkin, and we have a logjam at left wing anyway...
- Sutter? After what they gave up to get him..., but more importantlydon't they need centre depth in case Syd gets clocked again?
- A first and a second round pick? Thinkin finally, but again being top heavy they need to keep supplies of ELC eligible players as long as they can if they expect to keep Malkin, Crosby and Letang together...

Not a whole lot here is my conclusion?

Niskanen is a young right handed shot... :unsure: He would clear space for Connauton on the left, add size and some roster depth; if they would give us him and a first...? :rolleyes:

Edited by Canuck Surfer, 24 October 2012 - 07:11 PM.

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