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*Official* CBA Negotiations and Lockout Thread


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#4291 chisoxin12

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:19 PM

I'm gonna watch me some NFL. Bye for now! Oh, and thanks Gary, great job controlling those greedy bas*ard owners.
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#4292 Opmac

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:20 PM

If Oct.11 was Bettman's "drop-dead date", then why did they start negotiating so late and low-ball the NHLPA with a horrendous initial offer?!?

According to Doug MacLean, it was the NHLPA that did not want to negotiate earlier.
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#4293 poetica

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:21 PM

Real_ESPNLeBrun
Bettman says league is not interested in bringing back mediators as per NHLPA request




Bettman may not have a "drop dead date" for the season, but if this crap keeps up they're going to find out when mine for the NHL is!
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#4294 RunningWild

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:22 PM

Well, I've spent the last few yrs of my life negotiating agreements, albeit not in labor law. And what's abundantly clear to me after watching todays pressers are:

1) It's got to personal, on both sides. It's why rule #1 is - have a 3rd party who isn't tied to the outcome negotiate your agreements.
2) The league is clearly a dictator, not a negotiator. They've clearly taken their strategies from Hilters regime. They want what they want, and that's it.
3) Bettman and Daly are losing it. Bettman is the face of this process on NHL side and he just 'publicly' lost it. To me, it speaks to the chaos going on behind close doors.
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#4295 DeNiro

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:23 PM

"Going back to an Era where the league is struggling an unsuccessful is not something we want"


You mean the era that's happening now?

He pretends like the league is healthy when it's really not. Why else would he have to take away so much money from the players.

This league has half of its teams doing well and half struggling to even make a profit or not go under. He's ignoring the real problem in this whole thing which is broken markets that nee to be addressed.
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#4296 Hobble

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:24 PM

According to Doug MacLean, it was the NHLPA that did not want to negotiate earlier.


Then I hate Fehr even more.
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#4297 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:24 PM


Adam Proteau@Proteautype

Sorry for my quietness through this Bettman news conference. Each time he says something outrageous, I faint in anger & don't finish the Twe




Exactly how I feel.

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#4298 The Bookie

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:24 PM

Bettman may not have a "drop dead date" for the season, but if this crap keeps up they're going to find out when mine for the NHL is!


Mine is and always has been if they cancel the season. Taking a min. 3 years off the NHL, at which my point my attention will have been diverted to another league or sport.

Man .... really didn't see this coming. Methinks Gary is so tweaked out is he knows his job and legacy are on the line if the whole season goes down.
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#4299 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:26 PM

You mean the era that's happening now?

He pretends like the league is healthy when it's really not. Why else would he have to take away so much money from the players.

This league has half of its teams doing well and half struggling to even make a profit or not go under. He's ignoring the real problem in this whole thing which is broken markets that nee to be addressed.


Ugh I know.

It's just so frustrating, it's like he's blind.
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#4300 Deets

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:28 PM

I'm still not panicking. Lots of American teams fail to make money until after the football season. Superbowl is in february so they aren't going to rush a decision. If they don't make a deal early in the new year then I'd worry.
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#4301 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:30 PM


Scottie Upshall@ScottieUpshall

Plain and simple these owners think they can break us apart. GOOD LUCK! We r stronger than we've ever been and r behind Fehr %100.



Scottie Upshall@ScottieUpshall
There's no pressure yet on the owners to lose this year, that's why they still treat us like Cattle. They'll need a partner come January.



MG should get him on our team, love this guy.
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#4302 ashbury

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:32 PM

anywhere I can watch bettmans little meltdown? it sounds entertaining
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#4303 WHL rocks

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:33 PM

listened to the whole Bettman Daly presser, I'm a bit confused on one part. Can someone clarify please.

Is entire make whole off the table or just what they was added to make whole this week?

He did say concept but he did not seem like he wanted to commit either way.
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#4304 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:33 PM

TSN but it's over now.


anywhere I can watch bettmans little meltdown? it sounds entertaining


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#4305 WHL rocks

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:35 PM


Pierre LeBrun@Real_ESPNLeBrun

Bettman says the Make Whole provision in its entirety as a concept is OFF the table.

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#4306 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:37 PM

Pierre LeBrun@Real_ESPNLeBrun
Bettman says the Make Whole provision in its entirety as a concept is OFF the table.


What a smart way to negotiate eh?
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#4307 DeNiro

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:38 PM

listened to the whole Bettman Daly presser, I'm a bit confused on one part. Can someone clarify please.

Is entire make whole off the table or just what they was added to make whole this week?

He did say concept but he did not seem like he wanted to commit either way.


Well he said that the new make whole figure had to be packaged with the 10 year CBA and contract limits, otherwise it wouldn't be accepted.

The players tried to accept the make whole offer, but refuse the changes to contracts and the CBA length. SO now that offer is off the table. Which means the NHL is likely going to cancel another big block of games, and that figure will be different if they make another offer in the future.
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#4308 theminister

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:38 PM

POOF!!!

That's it. As I have been saying, if this season is cancelled in it's entirety then the next NHL we will see will bear no resemblance to the NHL of the last few seasons.

No guaranteed contracts
No salary cap
No revenue sharing
No commissioner's office

Nothing.
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#4309 DeNiro

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:43 PM

No one person or group of people are bigger than the game. The players and owners need to be reminded of this.

Their profession and their businesses only exist because the fans allow them to exist. Without the fans, there is no NHL and there is no money.

Too many egos on both sides. The players seem to think that they are the game, and the owners seem to think that they are the NHL. If either of them had respect for the game or the NHL, they wouldn't be treating this so lightly. They're playing a dangerous game, which equal the end of the NHL altogether if they continue this.
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#4310 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:45 PM

POOF!!!

That's it. As I have been saying, if this season is cancelled in it's entirety then the next NHL we will see will bear no resemblance to the NHL of the last few seasons.

No guaranteed contracts
No salary cap
No revenue sharing
No commissioner's office

Nothing.


I certainly hope so :rolleyes:
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#4311 nowhereman

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:45 PM

What a smart way to negotiate eh?

The players have been anything but smart during this negotiation, so it's not surprising that the NHL is taking their ball and going home. Donald Fehr is a parasite and has done nothing but muck this process up.

I started out as a moderate but the more and more I dig into the process, the father I drift from the players' side. My respect for Bettman has gone up after this PC, even though I've never really liked the guy. I think most fans are starting to feel the same way:

http://hfboards.hock...d.php?t=1303891

Edited by nowhereman, 06 December 2012 - 06:47 PM.

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#4312 Giant Inflatable Beaver

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:46 PM

I'm gonna watch me some NFL. Bye for now! Oh, and thanks Gary, great job controlling those greedy bas*ard owners.


really? the game tonight is terrible.
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#4313 Mighty Walrus

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:47 PM

.
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#4314 vancouverdepression

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:48 PM

Lets see... NFL till February, Walking Dead Returns in February...which takes me to start of the MLB season in april .... then mid summer the final 8 episodes of Breaking Bad are back so summer is awesomely full...then CFL starts up so thats cool, and world series post season starts in the fall, then Walking Dead is back again too and NFL is back.... sooooo NHL locks out the league? Thats ok, I lockout the NHL with far better things to watch thanks.. see you in.... hmmm 3 years, maybe, im busy!
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#4315 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:53 PM

The players have been anything but smart during this negotiation, so it's not surprising that the NHL is taking their ball and going home. Donald Fehr is a parasite and has done nothing but muck this process up.

I started out as a moderate but the more and more I dig into the process, the father I drift from the players' side. My respect for Bettman has gone up after this PC, even though I've never really liked the guy. I think most fans are starting to feel the same way:

http://hfboards.hock...d.php?t=1303891


I feel the exact opposite, I actually didn't mind GB and thought he was unfairly picked on.

Now I think it's clear he is blind to the process.


He think the Owner's are giving, when this entire lockout is about getting more and more and more from the PA, and the players have given, a ton more than the owner's for sure. And that's an understatement.

Both Fehr and Gary have continued to played their games but when it comes down to the actual sides, the players are fighting the good fight IMO.
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#4316 theminister

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:53 PM

I certainly hope so :rolleyes:


Just to make myself clear why I say that, it is my understanding that the Commissioner's office is a direct response to having a PA on the other side. Prior to collective bargaining there was simply an NHL President, a very different office in it's function.

If the Union goes away then there is functionally no need for a Commissioner. There may be a President again but he would have much less power than the demigod Bettman there is now.


I think as well there is the very real possibility that if the season is cancelled the NHL may lose the rights to the Stanley Cup.
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#4317 thad

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:56 PM

The players have been anything but smart during this negotiation, so it's not surprising that the NHL is taking their ball and going home. Donald Fehr is a parasite and has done nothing but muck this process up.

I started out as a moderate but the more and more I dig into the process, the father I drift from the players' side. My respect for Bettman has gone up after this PC, even though I've never really liked the guy. I think most fans are starting to feel the same way:

http://hfboards.hock...d.php?t=1303891


why, because they wont bend over and take it this time around? imo the NHLPA is the only side negotiating, the NHL keeps saying take it or leave it and as soon as the PA counters, they quickly dismiss it and take a break.

If the players didnt have fehr they would be completely screwed by the league. The NHL has not given them anything in this lockout, its an entire take from what the players previously had.
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#4318 thad

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:59 PM

I think as well there is the very real possibility that if the season is cancelled the NHL may lose the rights to the Stanley Cup.


really?.. i dont know much about that, why would they lose the rights?
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#4319 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:59 PM

Just to make myself clear why I say that, it is my understanding that the Commissioner's office is a direct response to having a PA on the other side. Prior to collective bargaining there was simply an NHL President, a very different office in it's function.

If the Union goes away then there is functionally no need for a Commissioner. There may be a President again but he would have much less power than the demigod Bettman there is now.


I think as well there is the very real possibility that if the season is cancelled the NHL may lose the rights to the Stanley Cup.


I Hope so (And hope not at the same time) but that would teach the NHL, they lose the rights to the most fabled prize in all of sports (IMO).

And I see, either way if we lose the year. I don't know how Gary can continue to have his job.

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 06 December 2012 - 07:00 PM.

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#4320 Drybone

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 06:59 PM

Damn, I wonder what could be causing this mass exodus. They seem to both agree on the critical issues, I have a tough time believing players are pushing for more on a make whole that the owners have generously conceded on. Contract length and variance limit are not worth the battle. Players have issues with a longer CBA ... why go through this again in your career?


I have no idea. Without Fehr in the room they seemed to make huge progress. Bring Fehr back in, therefore Bettman has to come back in, and we right back to the egomania again.

I think the owners offer should be voted on. Its fair. The 7 year deals for teams that own the players is more than the owners wanted. The make whole was WAY more than the league wanted.

I think the 10 year offer is so that we dont have to do this again for at least 10 years. I have no idea why the players wont take the deal and just go back to work.

I think at this point the owners and players have a deal. They have to THROW IN THE EGO TOWELS and just sign the deal.
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