Jump to content

Welcome to canucks.com Vancouver Canucks homepage

Photo

Israel takes out top Hamas commander after missiles launched from Gaza


  • Please log in to reply
527 replies to this topic

#1 Special Ed

Special Ed

    Canucks Second-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,466 posts
  • Joined: 09-February 09

Posted 14 November 2012 - 01:23 PM

http://www.guardian....emists-analysis


Operation Pillar of Defence has been anticipated for many months following increasing rocket fire into Israel from Gaza, which one former Israeli military commander described as "holding hostage half the population".

But the risks of a major military operation in the changing landscape of the Middle East are enormous.

In Gaza itself, the emergence of radical militant organisations, largely beyond the control of the ruling Hamas, make the consequences of Israel's operation highly unpredictable.

Hamas itself has felt the heat from these ultra-extremist groups, whose members claim the ruling faction has abandoned military resistance against Israel for the comfort and privileges of quasi-government.

These jihadist groups have close ties with militants in the Egyptian Sinai, just across Gaza's southern border, which Israel says are driven by an ideology akin to that of al-Qaida. They are disinclined to listen to Egyptian government mediators, who have brokered a series of ceasefires following escalations of violence.

"There are more jihadist groups in Gaza who don't abide by the rules of the game," said retired Brigadier-General Michael Herzog, a former chief of staff in the Israeli ministry of defence. "The Egyptians don't have the same leverage with the jihadists as they do with Hamas."

Some analysts in Israel have warned that if Hamas were to be toppled in a sustained military operation, such groups could fill a power vacuum. Israel could conceivably find itself with an enemy even worse than Hamas, they say.

Egypt is another major cause of concern. Before its revolution in the spring of 2011, Israel could count on the support of the country's deposed president Hosni Mubarak. But his successor, Mohammed Morsi, who has long ties with the Muslim Brotherhood Hamas's parent organisation is likely to vehemently oppose the latest Israeli operation. It could even threaten the 1979 peace treaty between Israel and Egypt.

The offensive against Gaza may also ignite solidarity action from Hezbollah in Lebanon. Israel's border with Lebanon has been relatively quiet since the war in 2006, but Israel repeatedly says that Hezbollah has thousands of Iranian-supplied rockets aimed at the Jewish state.

There will also be international condemnation if the Israeli military operation causes widespread civilian casualties in Gaza. In Operation Cast Lead, the 22-day offensive which began in December 2008, around 1,400 people were killed in Gaza, including more than 300 children. Thousands of homes and schools were destroyed in intense bombardment.

Israeli airstrikes are now much more precisely targeted. But civilian casualties are inevitable in a major operation.

Cast Lead took place between Barack Obama's election and his inauguration, which limited US response. Since then, Obama has repeatedly said Israel has the right to defend itself against rocket attacks from Gaza, but his re-election may produce much sharper condemnation of civilian casualties than four years ago.

Israel is also going to the polls in January. Most Israeli politicians swiftly endorsed operation mindful that security is a major factor in all Israeli elections.

-----------------

Personally I have always supported Israeli attacks into Gaza as being justified due to unmanageable militias who answer to nobody. These militias seem to never cease with these launches into Israel. And could care less about their own civilian casualties when eventually Israel has to answer back.

Regardless this seems to be a dramatic escalation of recent events. In other words... Here we go again.

Video of the Hamas commander being targeted: http://www.liveleak....=cd5_1352914976

Video of missiles being fired into Israel recently: http://www.liveleak....=c83_1352921667

Note: those links go to the site 'Liveleak' which does contain graphic language and material.

Edited by Special Ed, 14 November 2012 - 01:25 PM.

  • 2

If you like looking at statistics to determine who's better, you're just a casual fan.

2.41 season GAA isn't very impressive. Let's not get into playoffs and his SV%.

Cory Schneider is the next Patrick Roy.


#2 Spitfire_Spiky

Spitfire_Spiky

    Comets Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 738 posts
  • Joined: 28-March 09

Posted 14 November 2012 - 01:48 PM

Crazy... you think they would of learned by now. This is just going to end badly for all parties involved and nothing will be solved by another needless war..
  • 0
Mess with the Best, Die like the Rest

#3 Dittohead

Dittohead

    Canucks First-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,189 posts
  • Joined: 13-August 04

Posted 14 November 2012 - 01:54 PM

Nice
  • 1

#4 J.R.

J.R.

    Canucks All-Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 15,020 posts
  • Joined: 04-July 08

Posted 14 November 2012 - 02:11 PM

Oh good...
  • 1

"Science is like an inoculation against charlatans who would have you believe whatever it is they tell you."
- Neil deGrasse Tyson

jg4428.jpg2s9up7p.jpg


#5 Tortorella's Rant

Tortorella's Rant

    Canucks First-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,122 posts
  • Joined: 11-April 12

Posted 14 November 2012 - 02:27 PM

Conflict in the Middle East? Unheard of!
  • 1
Posted Image

#6 Tearloch7

Tearloch7

    Canucks First-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,438 posts
  • Joined: 15-July 10

Posted 14 November 2012 - 02:44 PM

Let's just nuke the whole region and start over again in a couple of thousand years! .. IF there is a "God" and IF these are His precious "tribes", then surely He, in all His magnificence, will stop such "nuking" .. at last .. a sign from the heavens?
  • 2

"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

"Always tell the Truth. That way, you don’t have to remember what you said"  ~ Mark Twain ~
 


#7 hsedin33

hsedin33

    Canucks Third-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,649 posts
  • Joined: 14-February 10

Posted 14 November 2012 - 03:10 PM

Let's just nuke the whole region and start over again in a couple of thousand years! .. IF there is a "God" and IF these are His precious "tribes", then surely He, in all His magnificence, will stop such "nuking" .. at last .. a sign from the heavens?


So in order to prevent them from klling eachother you want the US to kill them instead? :P lol Besides, its not the wars the West cares about, heck, the west is causing lots of the wars there, its the Oil that lays in thier dirt that is important.

Edited by hsedin33, 14 November 2012 - 03:13 PM.

  • 0

#8 Buddhas Hand

Buddhas Hand

    Canucks First-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,000 posts
  • Joined: 19-December 11

Posted 14 November 2012 - 03:27 PM



This documentary is a powerful and moving piece of film making , that is a must see for anyone who is even remotely interested in this conflict .
  • 0

The Real war is not between the east and the west. The real war is between intelligent and stupid people.

Marjane Satrapi

tony-abbott-and-stephen-harper-custom-da

That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons that history has to teach.

Aldous Huxley.


#9 CanuckRow

CanuckRow

    Canucks First-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,050 posts
  • Joined: 13-February 07

Posted 14 November 2012 - 03:35 PM

http://www.state.gov...2/11/200551.htm

We strongly condemn the barrage of rocket fire from Gaza into southern Israel, and we regret the death and injury of innocent Israeli and Palestinian civilians caused by the ensuing violence. There is no justification for the violence that Hamas and other terrorist organizations are employing against the people of Israel. We call on those responsible to stop these cowardly acts immediately. We support Israel’s right to defend itself, and we encourage Israel to continue to take every effort to avoid civilian casualties.

Hamas claims to have the best interests of the Palestinian people at heart, yet it continues to engage in violence that is counterproductive to the Palestinian cause. Attacking Israel on a near daily basis does nothing to help Palestinians in Gaza or to move the Palestinian people any closer to achieving self determination.


-US Department of State

Also...

November 14, 2012 - Canadian Foreign Affairs Minister John Baird today issued the following statement:

“We fundamentally believe that Israel has the right to defend itself and its citizens from terrorist threats.

“Far too often, the Jewish people find themselves on the front lines in the struggle against terrorism, the great struggle of our generation. Just last weekend, more than 100 rockets rained down on civilians in southern Israel from positions in the Gaza Strip.

“Canada condemns the terrorist group Hamas and stands with Israel as it deals with regional threats to peace and security.”


Edited by CanuckRow, 14 November 2012 - 04:04 PM.

  • 2

15yezck.jpg

 

 @Chel24Seven


#10 DonLever

DonLever

    Canucks Third-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,221 posts
  • Joined: 11-December 08

Posted 14 November 2012 - 04:07 PM

10 civilans were killed, including a 11 month old baby and a 6 year old child. 45 were wounded.

http://www.smh.com.a...1115-29d9n.html


The Israelis always called the terrorists baby killers, yet they do the same thing. Of course, they say they don't target innocent civilians like the terrorists do but the end result is the same thing. A dead baby is a dead baby.

Does killing a Hamas Commander really change anything? Someone will replace him anyway.

The Israelis have done nothing to address the core of the problem: The Occupation. Unless the right wing wackos in charge of Israel change policy, the endless cycles of violence will continue.
  • 2

#11 D-Money

D-Money

    Canucks Franchise Player

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 12,789 posts
  • Joined: 14-February 06

Posted 14 November 2012 - 04:13 PM

MMMMmmmm...hamas

Posted Image
  • 0
Posted Image

#12 Gretzky's Mullet

Gretzky's Mullet

    Canucks Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,598 posts
  • Joined: 12-August 05

Posted 14 November 2012 - 04:21 PM

*
POPULAR

I think it's embarrassing that neither Canada nor the USA nor any other western country has recognized the state of Palestine. Frankly, until the Israelis withdraw to 1967 borders, every death that takes place in the disputed territories is their fault and some of the blame rests in the hands of western countries who refuse to consider a neutral approach.
  • 8
Posted Image

LUC BOURDON: FEB 16TH, 1987 - MAY 29TH, 2008

#13 theminister

theminister

    Canucks Franchise Player

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 12,170 posts
  • Joined: 07-July 03

Posted 14 November 2012 - 04:31 PM

I'm just going to leave this here.

Posted Image
  • 3

small.pngNEW YORK ISLANDERS ROSTER - CDC GM LEAGUEsmall.png


2013 CDCGML CUP CHAMPIONS


#14 taxi

taxi

    Canucks Third-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,282 posts
  • Joined: 16-September 06

Posted 14 November 2012 - 04:32 PM

*
POPULAR

I think it's embarrassing that neither Canada nor the USA nor any other western country has recognized the state of Palestine. Frankly, until the Israelis withdraw to 1967 borders, every death that takes place in the disputed territories is their fault and some of the blame rests in the hands of western countries who refuse to consider a neutral approach.


Why 1967? You do realize that Jordan kicked all the Jews out of the West Bank and East Jerusalem between 1949 and 1967. Why is Israel expected to give any territority to a nation that is devouted to its destruction for that matter?
  • 11

#15 Ossi Vaananen

Ossi Vaananen

    Canucks Third-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,820 posts
  • Joined: 25-April 12

Posted 14 November 2012 - 04:48 PM

Knowing Harper we'll be right behind the Americans if this thing blows up.
  • 0

2d7ye0p.jpg

 

Credit to -Vintage Canuck-


#16 Tearloch7

Tearloch7

    Canucks First-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,438 posts
  • Joined: 15-July 10

Posted 14 November 2012 - 05:40 PM

So in order to prevent them from klling eachother you want the US to kill them instead? :P lol Besides, its not the wars the West cares about, heck, the west is causing lots of the wars there, its the Oil that lays in thier dirt that is important.


Geez .. so much for a pragmatic approach .. double standards abound .. if the Israelis have the bomb and are not afraid to use it?? .. then what follows is "whats good for the goose is good for the gander" .. no? ..

We can always develop oil drilling robots that can drill and pump all we need ..
  • 2

"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

"Always tell the Truth. That way, you don’t have to remember what you said"  ~ Mark Twain ~
 


#17 The Wizard of AZ

The Wizard of AZ

    Canucks Third-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,701 posts
  • Joined: 27-January 10

Posted 14 November 2012 - 06:11 PM

Knowing Harper we'll be right behind the Americans if this thing blows up.


The way things have gone between Harper and Israel, he's likely to jump in no matter when America does.
  • 1

Posted Image


#18 morrissex95

morrissex95

    Comets Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 534 posts
  • Joined: 21-March 12

Posted 14 November 2012 - 08:53 PM

10 civilans were killed, including a 11 month old baby and a 6 year old child. 45 were wounded.

Civilian casualties are unavoidable in the most densely populated place on Earth. If Israel were to send in a Special Forces unit to deal with al-Jabari, a terrorist would inflict unacceptable casualties on the unit. Hamas Qassam and Grad Rockets are designed to target vulnerable Israeli civilian targets. A powerful airstrike is meant to wipe al-Jabari and his guards off the face of the Earth.

The Israelis have done nothing to address the core of the problem: The Occupation.

This proves how ignorant you really are about the conflict.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel's_unilateral_disengagement_plan
  • 4
Posted Image

#19 morrissex95

morrissex95

    Comets Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 534 posts
  • Joined: 21-March 12

Posted 14 November 2012 - 08:59 PM

I'm just going to leave this here.

Posted Image


What are you implying with your clever little map?
  • 0
Posted Image

#20 Buddhas Hand

Buddhas Hand

    Canucks First-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,000 posts
  • Joined: 19-December 11

Posted 15 November 2012 - 01:40 AM

Israeli Settlements
on Palestinian Land


Israel currently has 170 Jewish-only settlements and 99 "outposts" built on confiscated Palestinian land.

Palestinians do not have any
settlements on Israeli land.




Number of Settlements on Others LandIsraelPalestinians070140210280
Number of Settlements on Others Land



Source: According to <a href="http://peacenow.org/map.php" target="_blank">Americans for Peace Now's "Facts on the Ground" Map Project, there are 170 official Israeli settlements and 99 informal outposts on Palestinian land, including 24 neighborhoods in East Jerusalem de facto annexed to Israel. APN's interactive settlement map shows the name, location, and population for each settlement and outpost on Palestinian territory, all of which are considered illegal under international law.

Posted Image

“Land Grab:
Israel’s Settlement Policy in the West Bank”


Published in May 2002.

B’Tselem, the Israeli Information Center for Human Rights in the Occupied Territories, endeavors to document and educate the Israeli public and policymakers about human rights violations in the Occupied Territories, combat the phenomenon of denial prevalent among the Israeli public, and help create a human rights culture in Israel.

Historical Background

Since 1967, each Israeli government has invested significant resources in establishing and expanding settlements in the Occupied Territories. As a result of this policy, approximately 500,000 Israeli citizens now live on the settlements on the West Bank, including those established in East Jerusalem.
The [peace] process between Israel and the Palestinians did not impede settlement activities, which continued under the Labor government of Yitzhak Rabin (1992-1996) and all subsequent governments. These governments built thousands of new housing units, claiming that this was necessary to meet the "natural growth” of the existing population. As a result, between 1993 and 2000 the number of settlers on the West Bank (excluding East Jerusalem) increased by almost 100 percent.
International Law

International humanitarian law prohibits [an] occupying power [from transferring] citizens from its own territory to the occupied territory (Fourth Geneva Convention, article 49). The Hague Regulations prohibit the occupying power [from undertaking] permanent changes in the occupied area, unless these are due to military needs in the narrow sense of the term, or unless they are undertaken for the benefit of the local population.
The establishment of the settlements leads to the violation of the rights of the Palestinians as enshrined in international human rights law. Among other violations, the settlements infringe on the rights to self-determination, equality, property, an adequate standard of living, and freedom of movement.
Taking Control of the Land

Israel has used a complex legal and bureaucratic mechanism to take control of more than fifty percent of the land in the West Bank. This land has been used mainly to establish settlements and create reserves of land for the future expansion of the settlements.
Israel uses the seized lands to benefit the settlements, while prohibiting the Palestinian public from using them in any way. This use is forbidden and illegal in itself. As the occupier in the Occupied Territories, Israel is not permitted to ignore the needs of an entire population and to use land intended for public needs solely to benefit the settlers.
The Policy of Annexation and Local Government

The Israeli administration has applied most aspects of Israeli law to the settlers and the settlements, thus effectively annexing them to the State of Israel…This annexation has resulted in a regime of legalized separation and discrimination. This regime is based on the existence of two separate legal systems in the same territory, with the rights of individuals being determined by their nationality.
The areas of jurisdiction of the Jewish local authorities, most of which extend far beyond the built-up area, are defined as "closed military zones” in the military orders. Palestinians are forbidden to enter these areas without authorization from the Israeli military commander. Israeli citizens, Jews from throughout the world and tourists are all permitted to enter these areas without the need for special permits.
Encouragement of Migration to Settlements

The Israeli governments have implemented a consistent and systematic policy intended to encourage Jewish citizens to migrate to the West Bank…settlers and other Israeli citizens working or investing in the settlements are entitled to significant financial benefits.
The Planning System

The planning system on the West Bank, implemented by the Civil Administration, is one of the most powerful mechanisms of the Israeli occupation. As with the other bureaucratic systems, the planning system operates on two distinct tracks: one for Jews and the other for Palestinians.
This system is responsible for transforming the map of the West Bank because it is the planning system that approves the outline plans for the settlements and issues building permits for the establishment and expansion of settlements and for the construction of by-pass roads. Israel changed the composition of the planning institutions on the West Bank and transferred numerous planning powers to the Jewish local authorities, while expropriating these powers from Palestinian planning institutions.
While facilitating Jewish settlement, the planning system works vigorously to restrict the development of Palestinian communities. The main tool used to this end is to reject requests for building permits filed by Palestinians. In most cases, the requests are rejected on the grounds that the regional outline plans – approved in the 1940s during the British Mandate – prohibit construction in the relevant area of land. These plans do not reflect the development needs of the Palestinian population, and the planning system deliberately refrains from preparing revised plans. Houses built by Palestinians without building permits are demolished by the Civil Administration, even in cases when the construction took place on private land.
Conclusions

Israel has created in the Occupied Territories a regime of separation based on discrimination, applying two separate systems of law in the same area and basing the rights of individuals on their nationality. This regime is the only one of its kind in the world, and is reminiscent of distasteful regimes from the past, such as the Apartheid regime in South Africa.
Under this regime, Israel has stolen hundreds of thousands of dunam of land from the Palestinians. Israel has used this land to establish dozens of settlements in the West Bank and to populate them with hundreds of thousands of Israeli citizens. Israel prohibits the Palestinians as a group from entering and using these lands, and uses the settlements to justify numerous violations of the Palestinians’ human rights, such as the right to housing, to earn a livelihood, and the right to freedom of movement. The drastic change that Israel has made in the map of the West Bank prevents any real possibility for the establishment of an independent, viable Palestinian state as part of the Palestinians’ right to self-determination.
The settlers, on the contrary, benefit from all the rights available to Israeli citizens living within the Green Line [Israel proper], and in some cases are even granted additional rights. The great effort that Israel has invested in the settlement enterprise – in financial, legal and bureaucratic terms – has turned the settlements into civilian enclaves in an area under military rule, with the settlers being given priority status. To perpetuate this situation, which is a priori illegal, Israel has continuously breached the rights of the Palestinians.
Particularly evident is Israel’s manipulative use of legal tools in order to give the settlement enterprise an impression of legality. In so doing, Israel trampled on numerous restrictions and prohibitions established in the international conventions to which it is party, and which were intended to limit infringement of human rights and to protect populations under occupation.


Israeli and Palestinian Children Killed
September 29, 2000 - Present

126 Israeli children have been killed by Palestinians and 1,476 Palestinian children have been killed by Israelis since September 29, 2000. (View Sources & More Information) Posted Image

Israelis and Palestinians Killed
September 29, 2000 - Present
Posted Image
1,096 Israelis and at least 6,568 Palestinians have been killed since September 29, 2000. (View Sources & More Information)

Israelis and Palestinians Injured
September 29, 2000 - Present

10,792 Israelis and 59,575 Palestinians have been injured since September 29, 2000. (View Sources & More Information.) Posted Image

Daily U.S. Military Aid to Israel and the Palestinians
Fiscal Year 2011
Posted Image
During Fiscal Year 2011, the U.S. is providing Israel with at least $8.2 million per day in military aid and $0 in military aid to the Palestinians. (View Sources & More Information)
Current Number of Political Prisoners and Detainees Posted Image
0 Israelis are being held prisoner by Palestinians, while 5,604 Palestinians are currently imprisoned by Israel. (View Sources & More Information)

Demolitions of Israeli and Palestinian Homes
1967 - Present

0 Israeli homes have been demolished by Palestinians and 24,813 Palestinian homes have been demolished by Israel since 1967. (View Sources & More Information) Posted Image

Israeli and Palestinian Unemployment Rates Posted Image
The Israeli unemployment rate is 6.4%, while the Palestinian unemployment in the West Bank is 16.5% and 40% in Gaza. (View Sources & More Information)

Current Illegal Settlements on the Other’s Land
Israel currently has 236 Jewish-only settlements and ‘outposts’ built on confiscated Palestinian land. Palestinians do not have any settlements on Israeli land. (View Sources & More Information) Posted Image

If americans only knew , website .
  • 3

The Real war is not between the east and the west. The real war is between intelligent and stupid people.

Marjane Satrapi

tony-abbott-and-stephen-harper-custom-da

That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons that history has to teach.

Aldous Huxley.


#21 Offensive Threat

Offensive Threat

    Canucks Second-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,404 posts
  • Joined: 18-March 03

Posted 15 November 2012 - 02:44 AM

The Palestinian attacks are "terrorist attacks"
The Israeli attacks are "military actions"
So what if way more innocent people are killed by the Irealis. They put a nice official spin on it.

The powerful Jewish voting and lobbying groups in the US keep The Gov squarly in Israels corner no matter what.
  • 3

Posted Image


#22 Donky

Donky

    Canucks First-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,680 posts
  • Joined: 11-January 03

Posted 15 November 2012 - 03:25 AM

Posted Image

Jabari's car....I think they got him...
  • 0
“When facism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross.”-Sinclair Lewis

A human being is a part of a whole, called by us _universe_, a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings as something separated from the rest... a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty."-Albert Einstein

#23 Special Ed

Special Ed

    Canucks Second-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,466 posts
  • Joined: 09-February 09

Posted 15 November 2012 - 03:29 AM

Land grabs still don't justify lobbing rockets over and over at civilians who had nothing to do with anything. You will never justify those attacks on israel to me. The palestinian fighters embed themselves with civilians and target civilians purposely which is terrorism. If Israel wanted to kill the Palestinian civilians purposely they could have easily done so to all of them.

To me this is more about one culture grabbing at straws and making excuses to try and destroy another. If Israel gave up some land i believe the attacks would still continue and that the terrorists would follow the israelis even if they moved.This isn't about land. It's about the destruction of Israel.

Saying at this point that Israel should sit there and do nothing while rockets fly over is absurd. No matter what history says. As well as any implication that the Israeli civilians somehow deserve to be terrorized is idiotic. Israelis didn't put the Palestinians in such a horrible state. The Islamic ideology that ruins nearly every islamic state and uncontrollable militias do that far better than Israel ever could.

At some point the Palestinian people have to stop and only then I may see Israel as the aggressor. But I don't believe that will ever happen. Because it seems the Palestinians have already been deeply rooted by hate, all the way down to their children. Who's ultimate goal is only to grow up and destroy Israel, passed down to them by their parents.

Every culture has had land grabbed from them at some point. But this to me is as much to do about land as much as 9/11 was a false flag op. Islam isn't a culture which only has problems with Israel, one only has to look around the world to see the problem. How many Islamic states are living in peaceful harmony during this day in age?

That is all I have to say.

Edited by Special Ed, 15 November 2012 - 03:33 AM.

  • 3

If you like looking at statistics to determine who's better, you're just a casual fan.

2.41 season GAA isn't very impressive. Let's not get into playoffs and his SV%.

Cory Schneider is the next Patrick Roy.


#24 Buddhas Hand

Buddhas Hand

    Canucks First-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,000 posts
  • Joined: 19-December 11

Posted 15 November 2012 - 03:47 AM

The Dier Yassin Massacre

Early in the morning of Friday, April 9, 1948, commandos of the Irgun, headed by Menachem Begin, and the Stern Gang attacked Deir Yassin, a village with about 750 Palestinian residents. It was several weeks before the end of the British Mandate. The village lay outside of the area that the United Nations recommended be included in a future Jewish State. Deir Yassin had a peaceful reputation and was even said by a Jewish newspaper to have driven out some Arab militants. But it was located on high ground in the corridor between Tel Aviv and Jerusalem and one plan, kept secret until years afterwards, called for it to be destroyed and the residents evacuated to make way for a small airfield that would supply the beleaguered Jewish residents of Jerusalem.

By noon over 100 people, half of them women and children, had been systematically murdered. Four commandos died at the hands of resisting Palestinians using old Mausers and muskets. Twenty-five male villagers were loaded into trucks, paraded through the Zakhron Yosef quarter in Jerusalem, and then taken to a stone quarry along the road between Givat Shaul and Deir Yassin and shot to death. The remaining residents were driven to Arab East Jerusalem.

That evening the Irgunists and the Sternists escorted a party of foreign correspondents to a house at Givat Shaul, a nearby Jewish settlement founded in 1906. Over tea and cookies they amplified the details of the operation and justified it, saying Deir Yassin had become a concentration point for Arabs, including Syrians and Iraqis, planning to attack the western suburbs of Jerusalem. They said that 25 members of the Haganah militia had reinforced the attack and claimed that an Arabic-speaking Jew had warned the villagers over a loudspeaker from an armored car. This was duly reported in The New York Times on April 10.

A final body count of 254 was reported by The New York Times on April 13, a day after they were finally buried. By then the leaders of the Haganah had distanced themselves from having participated in the attack and issued a statement denouncing the dissidents of Irgun and the Stern Gang, just as they had after the attack on the King David Hotel in July 1946. A 1987 study undertaken by Birzeit University's Center for Research and Documentation of Palestinian Society found "the numbers of those killed does not exceed 120".

The Haganah leaders admitted that the massacre "disgraced the cause of Jewish fighters and dishonored Jewish arms and the Jewish flag." They played down the fact that their militia had reinforced the terrorists' attack, even though they did not participate in the barbarism and looting during the subsequent "mopping up" operations.

They also played down the fact that, in Begin's words, "Deir Yassin was captured with the knowledge of the Haganah and with the approval of its commander" as a part of its "plan for establishing an airfield."

Ben Gurion even sent an apology to King Abdullah of Trans-Jordan. But this horrific act served the future State of Israel well. According to Begin:


Arabs throughout the country, induced to believe wild tales of "Irgun butchery," were seized with limitless panic and started to flee for their lives. This mass flight soon developed into a maddened, uncontrollable stampede. The political and economic significance of this development can hardly be overestimated.

Of about 144 houses, 10 were dynamited. The cemetery was later bulldozed and, like hundreds of other Palestinian villages to follow, Deir Yassin was wiped off the map. By September, Orthodox Jewish immigrants from Poland, Rumania, and Slovakia were settled there over the objections of Martin Buber, Cecil Roth and other Jewish leaders, who believed that the site of the massacre should be left uninhabited. The center of the village was renamed Givat Shaul Bet. As Jerusalem expanded, the land of Deir Yassin became part of the city and is now known simply as the area between Givat Shaul and the settlement of Har Nof on the western slopes of the mountain.

The massacre of Palestinians at Deir Yassin is one of the most significant events in 20th-century Palestinian and Israeli history. This is not because of its size or its brutality, but because it stands as the starkest early warning of a calculated depopulation of over 400 Arab villages and cities and the expulsion of over 700,000 Palestinian inhabitants to make room for survivors of the Holocaust and other Jews from the rest of the world

Edited by The Ratiocinator, 15 November 2012 - 03:48 AM.

  • 1

The Real war is not between the east and the west. The real war is between intelligent and stupid people.

Marjane Satrapi

tony-abbott-and-stephen-harper-custom-da

That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons that history has to teach.

Aldous Huxley.


#25 theminister

theminister

    Canucks Franchise Player

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 12,170 posts
  • Joined: 07-July 03

Posted 15 November 2012 - 04:18 AM

What are you implying with your clever little map?


Not my map.

And I am not sure how 'clever' it is as much as it is down right insane.
  • 0

small.pngNEW YORK ISLANDERS ROSTER - CDC GM LEAGUEsmall.png


2013 CDCGML CUP CHAMPIONS


#26 Tearloch7

Tearloch7

    Canucks First-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,438 posts
  • Joined: 15-July 10

Posted 15 November 2012 - 07:07 AM

The Palestinians are stuck with using the same tactics the Israeli's used against the British .. of course, when the Jew's used such tactics, they were hailed proudly as "freedom fighters" .. so I guess if you allow 6 million of your peoples to be exterminated, you can justify any kind of action for ever after? ..

The "God" they so fiercely profess to believe in must be very disappointed .. I know I am .. imprison a people in a cage and then kill them when they fight back? .. this is so damn wrong ..
  • 1

"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

"Always tell the Truth. That way, you don’t have to remember what you said"  ~ Mark Twain ~
 


#27 D-Money

D-Money

    Canucks Franchise Player

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 12,789 posts
  • Joined: 14-February 06

Posted 15 November 2012 - 09:28 AM

The Palestinians are stuck with using the same tactics the Israeli's used against the British .. of course, when the Jew's used such tactics, they were hailed proudly as "freedom fighters" .. so I guess if you allow 6 million of your peoples to be exterminated, you can justify any kind of action for ever after? ..


"History is written by the victors" - Winston Churchill

IMO, all terrorism is war, and all war is terrorism.


The "God" they so fiercely profess to believe in must be very disappointed .. I know I am .. imprison a people in a cage and then kill them when they fight back? .. this is so damn wrong ..


According to the bible, the God they profess to believe in got sick of them a long time ago.
  • 1
Posted Image

#28 taxi

taxi

    Canucks Third-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,282 posts
  • Joined: 16-September 06

Posted 15 November 2012 - 09:58 AM

Posted Image

Jabari's car....I think they got him...


The IDF released video of it too:


  • 0

#29 Tearloch7

Tearloch7

    Canucks First-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,438 posts
  • Joined: 15-July 10

Posted 15 November 2012 - 10:01 AM

Well if God, in his wisdom, has turned his back on these "tribes", then who are we to argue? .. a nuclear inferno fits right in with all that fire and brimstone that is promised?? .. self prophesying? ..
  • 0

"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

"Always tell the Truth. That way, you don’t have to remember what you said"  ~ Mark Twain ~
 


#30 taxi

taxi

    Canucks Third-Line

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,282 posts
  • Joined: 16-September 06

Posted 15 November 2012 - 10:04 AM

The Palestinians are stuck with using the same tactics the Israeli's used against the British .. of course, when the Jew's used such tactics, they were hailed proudly as "freedom fighters" .. so I guess if you allow 6 million of your peoples to be exterminated, you can justify any kind of action for ever after? ..

The "God" they so fiercely profess to believe in must be very disappointed .. I know I am .. imprison a people in a cage and then kill them when they fight back? .. this is so damn wrong ..


"If you allow".....what other choice did the victims of the holocaust have?

You honestly don't expect the Isreaelis to defend themselves? The bottom quarter of the country was shut down with rocket fire. Rocket fire launched from a territory they withdrew from. For the first time in history there are no Jews living in the Gaza Strip, it's been ethnically cleansed. Now the Palestinians use that land as a launchpad to fire rockets into Israel.

It's also not just Israel that keeps them in their "cage". The Gaza Strip also borders Egypt. The restrictions on the Gaza Strip were not put in place until Hamas took over. From Hamas's charter:

"The Day of Judgement will not come about until Muslims fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Muslims, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree, would not do that because it is one of the trees of the Jews." (related by al-Bukhari and Muslim).



Why exactly does Israel have an obligation to help Hamas?
  • 2




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

Canucks.com is the official Web site of The Vancouver Canucks. The Vancouver Canucks and Canucks.com are trademarks of The Vancouver Canucks Limited Partnership.  NHL and the word mark and image of the Stanley Cup are registered trademarks and the NHL Shield and NHL Conference logos are trademarks of the National Hockey League. All NHL logos and marks and NHL team logos and marks as well as all other proprietary materials depicted herein are the property of the NHL and the respective NHL teams and may not be reproduced without the prior written consent of NHL Enterprises, L.P.  Copyright © 2009 The Vancouver Canucks Limited Partnership and the National Hockey League.  All Rights Reserved.