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Port Mann Tolls


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#61 Pouria

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 07:03 PM

There is no "transit tax" on top of the gas tax. The gas tax not only pays for transit, it pays for roads in Metro Vancouver as well.

See: http://www.metrovanc...Jan11/MapB2.pdf

The carbon tax does not pay for anything.

TransLink has already found $139 million in efficiencies.

Money is needed now because there has been no significant infrastructure upgrades around Metro Vancouver for ~50 years. The last time significant money was spent on road infrastructure was during the freeway/highway/suburban craze in the post-war period. They all need to be upgraded/replaced now.

The population in Metro Vancouver was 790,741 in 1961. The population is now 2,313,328.

.
Would you suggest TransLink should be privatized then since private corporations always do things better...


All am seeing is constructions all over the road. And I've seen too many lazy construction workers for my liking. I think the money is just not being utilized effectively but that is true for all government jobs. All the jobs that have unions are being taken for granted and thats why we have bunch of lazy bum workers twiddling their thumb and doing nothing for significant salary. We would probably use 1/100th of the budget if we started hiring workers from other countries to do the job. The quality of labor is down yet their salary have skyrocketed to undeserved rates. Fact of the matter is that Translink has already milked enough money from the public to introduce other ways of getting money. Maybe if they didn't waste money on building those fare gates, they would've already had the money to do road upgrades etc. Their budgeting just plain sucks and they keep wasting money on things that aren't necessities.
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#62 Pouria

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 08:49 PM

Nope. Taxes go to general revenue. That general revenue can't even keep up with existing budgets.

If you wanted to say target gas taxes to infrastructure that's fine but you would need to increase income or sales taxes to make up the difference. As is were running a deficit which only makes things worse down the road.


The deficit is because of mismanagement. Its as simple as that. The government mismanages money more than any other corporation. Otherwise we are living in one of the most expensive cities because of all the fees and taxes that the BC government collects yet they still can't get their budget together. Its pretty pathetic. I've talked to some of my friends who work in the government agencies (health inspection, ICBC etc.) and they also say that government's budget system is a joke.
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#63 Opmac

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 10:32 PM

All am seeing is constructions all over the road. And I've seen too many lazy construction workers for my liking. I think the money is just not being utilized effectively but that is true for all government jobs. All the jobs that have unions are being taken for granted and thats why we have bunch of lazy bum workers twiddling their thumb and doing nothing for significant salary. We would probably use 1/100th of the budget if we started hiring workers from other countries to do the job. The quality of labor is down yet their salary have skyrocketed to undeserved rates. Fact of the matter is that Translink has already milked enough money from the public to introduce other ways of getting money. Maybe if they didn't waste money on building those fare gates, they would've already had the money to do road upgrades etc. Their budgeting just plain sucks and they keep wasting money on things that aren't necessities.

The construction you see is repaving city roads and sewer replacement. Those are paid for by the city. It's not replacing bridges and replacing highways which are billions of dollars.

Oh yeah, not spending $171 million on the faregates will pay for the new Pattullo Bridge and Massey Tunnel. :rolleyes:

What is this TransLink wasting money on non-necessities are you speaking of? Do you suggest abolishing TransLink?
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#64 Pasific Coluseum

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 11:08 PM

At least this issue doesn't effect me. I live in Vancouver and there's absolutely nothing east of the Port Mann that interests me. Why would I want to travel to Surrey, Langley, Abbottsford or Chilliwack? It's all farming and boonie land.
Seems like the only ones complaining are the ones who come to Vancouver for work. Solution is to maybe work closer to your home.
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#65 wiseupsucker

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 11:19 PM

All am seeing is constructions all over the road. And I've seen too many lazy construction workers for my liking. I think the money is just not being utilized effectively but that is true for all government jobs. All the jobs that have unions are being taken for granted and thats why we have bunch of lazy bum workers twiddling their thumb and doing nothing for significant salary. We would probably use 1/100th of the budget if we started hiring workers from other countries to do the job. The quality of labor is down yet their salary have skyrocketed to undeserved rates. Fact of the matter is that Translink has already milked enough money from the public to introduce other ways of getting money. Maybe if they didn't waste money on building those fare gates, they would've already had the money to do road upgrades etc. Their budgeting just plain sucks and they keep wasting money on things that aren't necessities.


Aww...muffin....using this as a platform for something else?

Bring in the immigrant workers bud!
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#66 No5Butcher

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 11:23 PM

Yeah, and other North American cities have a nonexistent public transit system. The gas tax funds both roads and transit.

Gas prices in Vancouver is simply among the highest regardless of the gas tax or not. Gas prices go up, more people are using transit, more service hours are needed, TransLink needs more money, and they increase the gas tax to generate revenue. Not sure if this is the right way to go though.

A road pricing scheme is the best. It is unfair for people that cross only the Port Mann Bridge to carry the burden for the road upgrades on Highway 1 from Langley to Vancouver. Road pricing will generate the required revenue to replace aging infrastructure and help relieve congestion by offering discount rates on non-peak hours. it will force people to make smarter choices.


Every time a person rides transit, they pay a usage fee through a fare. Why should drivers be exempt from a usage fee on the roads?

That might be a valid point if the usage fees were anywhere near the cost of the service.
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#67 Opmac

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 11:48 PM

That might be a valid point if the usage fees were anywhere near the cost of the service.

Yeah and a regional distance based tolling system would be anywhere near the cost of building the infrastructure?

It is my understanding is the SkyTrain lines all break-even. It is the buses that don't because they are no way as efficient.

Public services and infrastructure is always and will always be highly subsidized.
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#68 inane

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 11:48 PM

That might be a valid point if the usage fees were anywhere near the cost of the service.


Can we apply this theory to driving?
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#69 Gerg

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 01:46 AM

At least this issue doesn't effect me. I live in Vancouver and there's absolutely nothing east of the Port Mann that interests me. Why would I want to travel to Surrey, Langley, Abbottsford or Chilliwack? It's all farming and boonie land.
Seems like the only ones complaining are the ones who come to Vancouver for work. Solution is to maybe work closer to your home.

Don't be so clueless, most of the jobs are on the other side of the bridge. Why do you think they had to expand the fcking bridge in the first place? So many people have to cross it to get to work. If the jobs were there, I'm sure many commuters would forego that hour long wait from 176 in order to work from home.
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#70 ronthecivil

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 09:56 AM

At least this issue doesn't effect me. I live in Vancouver and there's absolutely nothing east of the Port Mann that interests me. Why would I want to travel to Surrey, Langley, Abbottsford or Chilliwack? It's all farming and boonie land.
Seems like the only ones complaining are the ones who come to Vancouver for work. Solution is to maybe work closer to your home.


In that case we should put a toll all around Vancouver (the one place that has transit that people can use as an alternative) and use it to fund transit to the places that don't.
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#71 Harbinger

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 07:19 PM

So I just found out today that the half price crossing or the "introductory offer" is actually only good for one year. So really all they are doing is trying to get your Credit card number so they can cut out some of the overhead of trying to get their payments. No thanks.
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#72 Grapefruits

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 07:25 PM

At least this issue doesn't effect me. I live in Vancouver and there's absolutely nothing east of the Port Mann that interests me. Why would I want to travel to Surrey, Langley, Abbottsford or Chilliwack? It's all farming and boonie land.
Seems like the only ones complaining are the ones who come to Vancouver for work. Solution is to maybe work closer to your home.


Careful, your high level of ignorance is showing...

So I just found out today that the half price crossing or the "introductory offer" is actually only good for one year. So really all they are doing is trying to get your Credit card number so they can cut out some of the overhead of trying to get their payments. No thanks.


Definitely seems like a great reason to pay more than you have to for the one year period, I like your logic.

Edited by zero-ONE-three, 29 November 2012 - 07:28 PM.

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#73 Harbinger

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 07:28 PM

Damn I just read now that the 20 free tolls have to be used by a certain date as well. They are like drug dealers.
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#74 LuongoG1

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:35 PM

Damn I just read now that the 20 free tolls have to be used by a certain date as well. They are like drug dealers.


Well what do you expect? They have to eventually start making revenue somehow, the project won't pay for itself.

At least this issue doesn't effect me. I live in Vancouver and there's absolutely nothing east of the Port Mann that interests me. Why would I want to travel to Surrey, Langley, Abbottsford or Chilliwack? It's all farming and boonie land.
Seems like the only ones complaining are the ones who come to Vancouver for work. Solution is to maybe work closer to your home.


Yeah, tell everyone who works downtown to get jobs close to their home in teh suburbs where there are no jobs. While you're at it, why don't you tell them all to buy a place downtown and live there with their families? It's not like family homes downtown cost a fortune anyways.

THINK people!
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#75 mpt

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 04:21 AM

Its funny that they toll the working man to cross the port mann trying to earn an income; yet they don't toll the playing man on his way to spend money at whistler.

I honestly would rather have a small toll on every bridge and even out the dispersement then toll one bridge and have everyone find alternate routes and cause traffic jams at every other crossing. If every bridge was tolled the same people would just take the shortest route.

Its ridiculous though that they toll the Port Mann and not the sea-to-sky.
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#76 ronthecivil

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 04:03 PM

Its funny that they toll the working man to cross the port mann trying to earn an income; yet they don't toll the playing man on his way to spend money at whistler.

I honestly would rather have a small toll on every bridge and even out the dispersement then toll one bridge and have everyone find alternate routes and cause traffic jams at every other crossing. If every bridge was tolled the same people would just take the shortest route.

Its ridiculous though that they toll the Port Mann and not the sea-to-sky.


I would kind of do it similar to the transit zones (which off topic should have a fourth zone that includes White Rock, Cloverdale, Langleys, and everything west of the Pitt River bridge).

You put in what will eventually be the south fraser screenline. Move the toll from the Golder ears to the Pitt River Bridge.

Make another one on the two north shore bridges.

Toll sea to sky just north of Lion's bay (at the edge of the GVRD).

With all those tolls you could charge a dollar on all of them and would have enough to fix all the crossing and have lots left to booste up transit alternatives.
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#77 Pouria

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 04:26 PM

I would kind of do it similar to the transit zones (which off topic should have a fourth zone that includes White Rock, Cloverdale, Langleys, and everything west of the Pitt River bridge).

You put in what will eventually be the south fraser screenline. Move the toll from the Golder ears to the Pitt River Bridge.

Make another one on the two north shore bridges.

Toll sea to sky just north of Lion's bay (at the edge of the GVRD).

With all those tolls you could charge a dollar on all of them and would have enough to fix all the crossing and have lots left to booste up transit alternatives.


The problem with this is the fact that we still have to pay the gas tax and all these extra fees to Translink.
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#78 J.R.

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 05:43 PM

The problem with this is the fact that we still have to pay the gas tax and all these extra fees to Translink.


No the problem is that vast swaths of the public see little tangible benefit from paying those taxes/fees. I have no problem with paying them if I can actually use transit and/or not be stuck in congestion.
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#79 AbbyNucksFan

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 10:25 PM

The New Brunswick tollbooths opened for their first full day of service on Jan. 5, 1999.
. A few months after construction on the New Brunswick highway began, Federal Transport Minister David Collenette introduced legislation preventing provinces from introducing any more tolls on the Trans-Canada Highway.


how exactly did the toll happen? I was under the impression tolls on Highway 1 weren't allowed...
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#80 ronthecivil

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Posted 19 September 2013 - 08:03 AM

how exactly did the toll happen? I was under the impression tolls on Highway 1 weren't allowed...

The province did it anyways? Who knows? What are the feds going to do about it? Either way the tolls are going up at the end of the year. Too bad construction won't be done by then.
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#81 inane

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Posted 11 February 2014 - 01:53 PM

So, how's the new Port Mann doing? Surprise surprise...

http://www.vancouver...2118/story.html

Comment on that story here:

http://pricetags.wor...the-watch-list/

With a fun graph illustrating the idiocy of it all here:

http://daily.sightli...affic-delusion/

All so silly.
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#82 kodos

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Posted 11 February 2014 - 02:01 PM


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#83 Tre Mac

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Posted 11 February 2014 - 04:11 PM

I cross the Alex Fraser at about 6:30am and have notice a slight increase in volume. I am sure they'll just toll every bridge eventually around the same time gas hits $2/L. Yay.
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#84 hsedin33

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Posted 11 February 2014 - 05:50 PM

I still don't understand why they didn't build an extra couple lanes for a skytrains out to Langley on the new Port Mann.. It saves us from pollution, raises money, reduces traffic congestion... Not to mention Vancouver City wants people to come DT to spend money but don't want to share the cost of a bridge bringing people into the city.
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#85 jovocop55

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Posted 11 February 2014 - 08:36 PM

I still don't understand why they didn't build an extra couple lanes for a skytrains out to Langley on the new Port Mann.. It saves us from pollution, raises money, reduces traffic congestion... Not to mention Vancouver City wants people to come DT to spend money but don't want to share the cost of a bridge bringing people into the city.


we know the ppl up top don't use their brains.. just sit around and collect big fat paycheque and bonuses... if they just charge $1 or $1.50, ppl will keep using the bridge and benefits everyone..
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#86 PowerIce

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Posted 12 February 2014 - 12:42 AM

I used it today.. I've used it 3 times since it opened.

Its been avoided at all cost, I like scenic (free) routes more anyways.
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#87 Pouria

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Posted 12 February 2014 - 12:45 AM

we know the ppl up top don't use their brains.. just sit around and collect big fat paycheque and bonuses... if they just charge $1 or $1.50, ppl will keep using the bridge and benefits everyone..


They just want to add to their big fat paycheque. I mean $3 for crossing the bridge, so $6 for a return trip is pretty ridiculous considering the transit tax on top of the gas tax. They will probably destroy the good ol' Patullo bridge and replace it with another tolled bridge. It will get to the point where riding a taxi would be cheaper than driving a car considering tolls, gas prices, insurance, parking prices etc.
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#88 Pouria

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Posted 12 February 2014 - 12:48 AM

I used it today.. I've used it 3 times since it opened.

Its been avoided at all cost, I like scenic (free) routes more anyways.


Am just waiting till the invention of jet packs becomes commercialized. Then we won't have any worries about tolls, insurances and other crap.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yolum7_0UCA


Edited by Pouria, 12 February 2014 - 12:58 AM.

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#89 ronthecivil

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Posted 12 February 2014 - 12:57 PM

So, how's the new Port Mann doing? Surprise surprise...

http://www.vancouver...2118/story.html

Comment on that story here:

http://pricetags.wor...the-watch-list/

With a fun graph illustrating the idiocy of it all here:

http://daily.sightli...affic-delusion/

All so silly.


Hey, you should be cheering that building the road didn't increase demand! Well, one with a toll at least.

But don't worry, the free options will be going away sooner rather than later. There will be tolls on the Putello and Massey tunnel/bridge soon enough which will leave just the Alex Fraser as free. Which of course will simply make North Delta loose their mind.

And when that comes there will be plenty of incoming toll revenue (to be swallowed up into general revenue of course.).
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#90 inane

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Posted 12 February 2014 - 01:02 PM

Way to ignore the point. That graph says it all. We haven't learned a thing.

Also, you really need to learn the difference between lose and loose.

Edited by inane, 12 February 2014 - 01:10 PM.

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