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Henrik Sedin and Kevin Bieksa Speak Out Against Owners: "Mind-Boggling."


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#1 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 12:57 PM

"I think from Day 1, this has fallen into what we really thought was going to happen," Sedin told the paper. "I don't know if they [owners] think they're dealing with kids or that we're stupid or think the fans are stupid. It's a little mind-boggling when you see what's coming out of their side. I want to hear a change, that they're actually going to give us something in return for the things we've given them.

"I doubt that may happen tomorrow [Tuesday] but it's a start. It's good to see that there are new owners coming into the meeting, but the bad thing is there are still some of the tight group that has been there since Day 1. That's a concern."


Defenceman Kevin Bieksa stated that the players don't want to give up on the season, but the players wonder what the owner's agenda really is.

"That's the one thing we've kind of been puzzled by in this whole negotiation," he said. "When do they want to settle and what do they want to settle for? Is it just a money issue or the contracting rights and what are the reasons for them? Owners doing it face-to-face [Tuesday] with players on their team and to look those guys in the eye, it should be good."


During a totally unjustified lockout, it's going to be tough for anyone to see what the owners actually want.
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#2 Snake Doctor

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 01:00 PM

I just read the article on TSN.ca. Surprised to see Hank's comments but I would not read too much into it. Everyone is frustrated. These guys want to play hockey and both sides have legitimate concerns.
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#3 Captain Aerosex

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 01:28 PM

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I think saying 'stupid' is probably the closest Hank's come to cursing :lol:
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#4 Drybone

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 01:36 PM

Tsn originally put it up as Daniel im pretty sure.

Anyways, all of this is so talked out its insane. Regardless of how this lock out turns out, there wont be another one for a very , very long time.

This one was just bone dead stupid. They should have made the 50% deal last year while they were still playing.
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#5 Snake Doctor

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 02:07 PM

Tsn originally put it up as Daniel im pretty sure.

Anyways, all of this is so talked out its insane. Regardless of how this lock out turns out, there wont be another one for a very , very long time.

This one was just bone dead stupid. They should have made the 50% deal last year while they were still playing.


Agreed
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#6 Jaku

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 02:49 PM

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The owners aren't going to move unless they get everything they want. Power and money, that's all this is. It's sad to see the NHL owners stoop to this low of a level.
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#7 TheWheeler

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 03:12 PM

The owners aren't going to move unless they get everything they want. Power and money, that's all this is. It's sad to see the NHL owners stoop to this low of a level.


Isn't that just it though? The owners OWN the teams. It's the OWNER'S money, and it's the OWNERS that essentially keep people employed.

Obviously they want their best interests looked after. You would have to be absolutely crazy to not want that if you've invested several hundred million dollars into your business.

I don't understand why this is so hard for people to understand. If YOU were an owner, you'd be doing the exact same thing.
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#8 SamJamIam

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 03:43 PM

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Isn't that just it though? The owners OWN the teams. It's the OWNER'S money, and it's the OWNERS that essentially keep people employed.

Obviously they want their best interests looked after. You would have to be absolutely crazy to not want that if you've invested several hundred million dollars into your business.

I don't understand why this is so hard for people to understand. If YOU were an owner, you'd be doing the exact same thing.


I think it speaks very poorly of your character if you can see yourself acting as many owners have during this lockout. The fact that your opinion seems oblivious to any personal or empathetic issues and is solely focused on maximizing financial return paints an eerie picture of distorted priorities.
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#9 Jaku

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 03:48 PM

Isn't that just it though? The owners OWN the teams. It's the OWNER'S money, and it's the OWNERS that essentially keep people employed. Obviously they want their best interests looked after. You would have to be absolutely crazy to not want that if you've invested several hundred million dollars into your business. I don't understand why this is so hard for people to understand. If YOU were an owner, you'd be doing the exact same thing.


Wouldn't their best interest be the product? The players? They aren't making any progress by throwing all of these restrictions at the players. They want more and more money to go back into their pockets (Owners) after they agreed to all of these contracts with the players.
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#10 Jai604

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 05:19 PM

The whole process has just been a ???? gong show.
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#11 Dancin'Droid

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 05:58 PM

Tsn originally put it up as Daniel im pretty sure.

Anyways, all of this is so talked out its insane. Regardless of how this lock out turns out, there wont be another one for a very , very long time.

This one was just bone dead stupid. They should have made the 50% deal last year while they were still playing.


That's what I don't understand, why wait till the last minute to come up with a deal. It was stupid of the owners to think that if they give a "last chance offer" that the players would agree to it.
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#12 nuck nit

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 06:22 PM

Isn't that just it though? The owners OWN the teams. It's the OWNER'S money, and it's the OWNERS that essentially keep people employed.

Obviously they want their best interests looked after. You would have to be absolutely crazy to not want that if you've invested several hundred million dollars into your business.

I don't understand why this is so hard for people to understand. If YOU were an owner, you'd be doing the exact same thing.


The owners may own teams but most of them are leveraged up the ying yang because they have gone into non traditional markets on a Bettman promise of US TV revenues that never happened.
So,the owners were sold down a river and the billionaires now want everybody else to pay for his mistake ,in which some brain dead owners have gone along with.
The owners do not own players,as much as they would like to.
The owners do not own the game.
The owners do not own the fans.
If they wanted their best interests looked after the traditional markets would support one another and boot Bettman and his fantasy US weak franchises that have brought three lockouts ,one cup and one full season lost forever.

If I were an owner I would stand up for the league that gave me a chance to become filthy rich and tell Bettman and his flaky bunch of US owners to kiss my shiny knob at the end of my stick.

Melnyk and Snider are owners with common sense that stood up for the game during this lockout.

Bieksa and Hank just soared into a new realm in my opinion.Bravo!

Edited by nuck nit, 04 December 2012 - 06:24 PM.

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#13 cmpunk

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 06:38 PM

The only difference is players come out and make it seem as if they just want to play hockey and will settle for anything and will graciously accept it. Owners can say the same things the players are.
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#14 ngunn91

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 08:01 PM

It is interesting to analyze this lockout with a perspective on the recently released Forbes Magazine valuation of teams. Looking at the rankings by Forbes you can see that of the 30 teams in the NHL, 13 of those teams lost money last year! Those teams were:

1) San Jose Sharks= -0.9 million
2) Washington Capitals= -1.0 million
3) Nashville Predators= -3.4 million
4) Minnesota Wild= -3.9 million
5) Carolina Hurricanes= -9.4 million
6) St. Louis Blues= -10.0 million
7) Buffalo Sabres= -10.4 million
8) Anaheim Ducks= -10.8 million
9) Florida Panthers= -12.0 million
10) Tampa Bay Lightning= -13.1 million
11) New York Islanders= -16.0 million
12) Columbus Blue Jackets= -18.7 million
13) Phoenix Coyotes= -20.6 million

The other 17 teams all made a profit.

1) Los Angeles Kings= 1.8 million
2) New Jersey Devils= 2.8 million
3) Dallas Stars= 3.0 million
4) Colorado Avalanche= 4.5 million
5) Pittsburgh Penguins= 9.1 million
6) Philadelphia Flyers= 10.9 million
7) Calgary Flames= 11.0 million
8) Winnipeg Jets= 13.3 million
9) Boston Bruins= 14.2 million
10) Ottawa Senators= 14.5 million
11) Edmonton Oilers= 16.2 million
12) Chicago Blackhawks= 20.5 million
13) Detroit Red Wings= 20.8 million
14) Vancouver Canucks= 30.4 million
15) Montreal Canadiens= 51.6 million
16) New York Rangers= 74.0 million
17) Toronto Maple Leafs= 81.9 million

Of those 17 teams I would say only two of them (The New Jersey Devils and Dallas Stars) are in a precarious financial situation despite the profits. So basically at the end of the day you have half the league doing well and the other half not doing so well.

The players solution to this problem (for the most part) is to drastically increase revenue sharing among the teams. While I can see the need to share some of the revenue that the wealthy teams generate due to the existance of the money losing teams (i.e. ticket sales from those games) I don't think the owners should have to share more than that. The reason being is because sharing more money than that is utilizing resources inefficiently IMO.

The owners solution is to cut labor costs as a percentage. I don't have a problem with this as in both the NBA and NFL the owners get a higher percentage and as well in most hockey league in Europe (With the exception of the KHL) the players are paid less. This is not me bashing on the players I'm simply arguing they should get what the market dictates. In fact, keeping in tune with this idea is the fact that on contracting issues (Such as UFA age and Contract term) I support the players position that the UFA age should be lower and that players should be allowed to sign for as long as they and their owners agree to as long as the bogus years are eliminated.

So to summarize I believe the following ar compromises the owners and players have to make:

Owners:

1) Compromise on Revenue Sharing
2) Compromise on Contracting Issues
3) Compromise on Make Whole

Players:

1) Compromise on the Revenue Percentage Share they get
2) Compromise the length of the CBA (Usually the PA comes out with proposals that are shorter in length rather than longer)
3) Compromise on Salary Cap Floor (Not Sure if owners have asked about lowering it but I would think some of the poorer teams want this)
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#15 youngbob_007

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 08:51 PM

If you're going to read into this it's Hank and Bieksa venting a bit of frustration over a lost season, not lamenting lost wages. As much as the Canucks have become negative poster boys for the NHL, these responses are well thought out, fair and measured. There's no griping about money, no bad talking the union and overall nothing that will result in any member of the team being thought less of by his peers.

To cry about spilled milk (money) at this point is disgusting, and pandering to the media is just embarrassing but what Henrik and Bieksa are saying is true. The argument people keep using is the players are the product so the owners make the rules, but how would you feel if your office job rolled back your pay because they didn't want to fulfill their previously stated financial obligation to you? The owners are hiding behind the Bettman scapegoat while the players are the ones taking the hit to the reputation, and for guys like the Sedins there aren't many years left.

It's understandable that the NHL wants to set a mandate for future contracts, but with the current contracts already in place the expectation that they should be honored is still a valid opinion. What he's saying is, regardless of who's present at the meeting the owners and Bettman share a common goal and that the only progress made has been for the owners to step out of the shadows and take a bit of the spotlight in all this.
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#16 DeNiro

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 09:45 PM

It is interesting to analyze this lockout with a perspective on the recently released Forbes Magazine valuation of teams. Looking at the rankings by Forbes you can see that of the 30 teams in the NHL, 13 of those teams lost money last year! Those teams were:

1) San Jose Sharks= -0.9 million
2) Washington Capitals= -1.0 million
3) Nashville Predators= -3.4 million
4) Minnesota Wild= -3.9 million
5) Carolina Hurricanes= -9.4 million
6) St. Louis Blues= -10.0 million
7) Buffalo Sabres= -10.4 million
8) Anaheim Ducks= -10.8 million
9) Florida Panthers= -12.0 million
10) Tampa Bay Lightning= -13.1 million
11) New York Islanders= -16.0 million
12) Columbus Blue Jackets= -18.7 million
13) Phoenix Coyotes= -20.6 million


Hmm, more than half of those 13 losing teams were either part of expansion or relocation under Bettman's watch. Yet, he has the nerve to try and say that the players should take a big cut in the amount of money they make? BS.

Imagine how well they would be doing right now if they took out those 7 losing expansion teams. Bottom line is, this league expanded faster than it should have expecting that times would be great forever. And now the owners and the NHL are trying to blame anyone but themselves for their poor business decisions.

Edited by DeNiro, 04 December 2012 - 09:46 PM.

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#17 Forsy

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 10:11 PM

All owners want to maximize profits.

The reality though is that the majority of the owners continue to make retarded, greedy mistakes.
Then they want the players (the main targets) and the fans (not as much) to pay for their mistakes.

The Great owners maximize profits, while still keeping players and fans happy, or at least, "ok".
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#18 Geoff Peterson

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 10:26 PM

It all starts at the top.... BETTMAN.
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#19 Kesler's Nose

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 10:32 PM

Finally... Been waiting for some of the Canucks to say something. lol Would be very interested to hear what Kes has to say on the subject.
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#20 oldnews

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 11:05 PM

Henrik Sedin never fails to comman my utmost respect.
And really - a person who opens his own wallet wide and gives back the way that he does has every right to speak out as he has.
Not a single person in the NHL I'd rather have representing the home team.


Alleged losses:
1) San Jose Sharks= -0.9 million
2) Washington Capitals= -1.0 million
3) Nashville Predators= -3.4 million
4) Minnesota Wild= -3.9 million
5) Carolina Hurricanes= -9.4 million
6) St. Louis Blues= -10.0 million
7) Buffalo Sabres= -10.4 million
8) Anaheim Ducks= -10.8 million
9) Florida Panthers= -12.0 million
10) Tampa Bay Lightning= -13.1 million
11) New York Islanders= -16.0 million
12) Columbus Blue Jackets= -18.7 million
13) Phoenix Coyotes= -20.6 million

Forbes valuations:
1) San Jose Sharks= 223 million
2) Washington Capitals= 250 million
3) Nashville Predators= 167 million
4) Minnesota Wild= 218 million
5) Carolina Hurricanes= 162 million
6) St. Louis Blues= 130 million
7) Buffalo Sabres= 175 million
8) Anaheim Ducks= 192 million
9) Florida Panthers= 170 million
10) Tampa Bay Lightning= 174 million
11) New York Islanders= 155 million
12) Columbus Blue Jackets= 145 million
13) Phoenix Coyotes= 134 million

100 hundred million, 200 hundred million dollars... for money "losing" ventures...
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#21 jovocop55

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 12:33 AM

it's mainly the hard line owners that want lockout.... like boston and philly..
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#22 frazzY

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 12:49 AM

I think it speaks very poorly of your character if you can see yourself acting as many owners have during this lockout. The fact that your opinion seems oblivious to any personal or empathetic issues and is solely focused on maximizing financial return paints an eerie picture of distorted priorities.


Wow, O'leary on dragons den/shark tank would tear a strip out of you...

Thats business, its harsh. The players need to just agree on whats put forth, they play hockey for a living.. The owners likely went through years of university and started off as young entrepreneurs working their butts off to be where they are.

Logging industries, teachers, fisheries, etc etc all take paycuts during recessions/tough times, thats the nature of the beast, highs and lows. Just like the opposite how gas and oil sands are booming!

Hockey isnt soccer in europe or football in the states. And unless canada becomes a world power with hundreds of millions of people any time soon, hockey will never become that.

The players gotta realize that the last few years theyve been fortunate, and now the axe is coming down! They are the ones who need to get a reality check!

You should too...


My hands are sore im texting all this on my phone damn u!!
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#23 keslerian one

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 01:10 PM

Wow, O'leary on dragons den/shark tank would tear a strip out of you...

Thats business, its harsh. The players need to just agree on whats put forth, they play hockey for a living.. The owners likely went through years of university and started off as young entrepreneurs working their butts off to be where they are.

Logging industries, teachers, fisheries, etc etc all take paycuts during recessions/tough times, thats the nature of the beast, highs and lows. Just like the opposite how gas and oil sands are booming!

Hockey isnt soccer in europe or football in the states. And unless canada becomes a world power with hundreds of millions of people any time soon, hockey will never become that.

The players gotta realize that the last few years theyve been fortunate, and now the axe is coming down! They are the ones who need to get a reality check!

You should too...


My hands are sore im texting all this on my phone damn u!!



Not sure what kind of a job you have. If your employer one day says, well times are slow and you're lucky I employ you, so I'll cut your salary to keep my profit high(er), then I would be pretty pissed. Especially if I'm the best in the world at something i.e. hockey.

Canada's relative world power? Newsflash - more than half of NHL teams are in the states. Even if it was just about Canada, that has nothing to do with evaluating the financials of a league. And if you really believe that the billionaire owners all started out with nothing, that's also not correct. But again, that has nothing to do with evaluating the financials of the league to justify these demands.

You're right. It's business. And business requires unbiased evaluation of what's wrong with the league to justify taking it from the players for the benefit of the owners. If the job of the players is to play hockey and most agree that we are seeing one of the most exciting hockey being played nowadays, you gotta ask if the owners/nhl is doing its job in running the business of hockey.
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#24 Mountain Man

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 02:25 PM

Finally... Been waiting for some of the Canucks to say something. lol Would be very interested to hear what Kes has to say on the subject.


I heard they have a press conference scheduled for him at the aquatics centre after he is done teaching his diving lessons.
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Hockey season must be back on, the crazies are coming out again....


#25 qwijibo

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 02:49 PM

Another whiney player refusing to accept the players role in this stoppage. Both sides are culpable here but the players keep spouting off on how it's all ownerships fault.
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#26 Baggins

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 03:31 PM

Not sure what kind of a job you have. If your employer one day says, well times are slow and you're lucky I employ you, so I'll cut your salary to keep my profit high(er), then I would be pretty pissed. Especially if I'm the best in the world at something i.e. hockey.

Canada's relative world power? Newsflash - more than half of NHL teams are in the states. Even if it was just about Canada, that has nothing to do with evaluating the financials of a league. And if you really believe that the billionaire owners all started out with nothing, that's also not correct. But again, that has nothing to do with evaluating the financials of the league to justify these demands.

You're right. It's business. And business requires unbiased evaluation of what's wrong with the league to justify taking it from the players for the benefit of the owners. If the job of the players is to play hockey and most agree that we are seeing one of the most exciting hockey being played nowadays, you gotta ask if the owners/nhl is doing its job in running the business of hockey.


You might be pissed but at least you'd still have a job.

When almost 50% of the owners are losing money the option is 50% of the players losing their jobs or 100% of the players taking less of the pie.

Edited by Baggins, 05 December 2012 - 03:32 PM.

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#27 thehamburglar

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 06:14 PM

Love to see Hank stand up and say something.
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#28 CookieCrumbs

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 03:02 AM

Blah blah blah
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#29 frazzY

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 05:50 AM

Not sure what kind of a job you have. If your employer one day says, well times are slow and you're lucky I employ you, so I'll cut your salary to keep my profit high(er), then I would be pretty pissed. Especially if I'm the best in the world at something i.e. hockey.

Canada's relative world power? Newsflash - more than half of NHL teams are in the states. Even if it was just about Canada, that has nothing to do with evaluating the financials of a league. And if you really believe that the billionaire owners all started out with nothing, that's also not correct. But again, that has nothing to do with evaluating the financials of the league to justify these demands.

You're right. It's business. And business requires unbiased evaluation of what's wrong with the league to justify taking it from the players for the benefit of the owners. If the job of the players is to play hockey and most agree that we are seeing one of the most exciting hockey being played nowadays, you gotta ask if the owners/nhl is doing its job in running the business of hockey.


Reason why i said that about the world power thing..

If we had the population of usa we wouldnt even need american teams. Look at the nfl.

If they want more money, maybe they should have played soccer or football when they were younger instead.

And i wasnt talking about myself getting a paycut, but it is common all over the world. Why do teachers go on strike for example.

The players need to suck it up
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#30 Westcoasting

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 09:42 AM

Tired of whiny players pretending they know how to run a business. The longer this goes on the more it hurts them, the owners can weather this, the players can't.
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