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[Proposal] Vancouver - Columbus

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#1 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 03:39 PM

To Vancouver: Derrick Brassard

To Columbus: Mason Raymond, Anton Rodin, 5th


Basically a swap of struggling players.

For Us: Brassard brings decent size, decent speed, and is a good two-way player. He can play either C or W. And since he known as a "pass-first" player he might be the solution on the 2nd line with Kes and Booth or else he can play on the third since he is reliable defensively.

For CBJ: Since CBJ got Anisimov and Dubinsky they have enough center's to fill Brassard's spot (And they also have Johansen, Prospal and Umberger who can play C) Raymond brings more speed to there line-up (Which doesn't have a ton of top notch speed), then Rodin is the sweetener who will get much better opportunities in Columbus.

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 24 December 2012 - 03:40 PM.

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#2 BuretoMogilny

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 05:03 PM

To Vancouver: Derrick Brassard

To Columbus: Mason Raymond, Anton Rodin, 5th


Basically a swap of struggling players.

For Us: Brassard brings decent size, decent speed, and is a good two-way player. He can play either C or W. And since he known as a "pass-first" player he might be the solution on the 2nd line with Kes and Booth or else he can play on the third since he is reliable defensively.

For CBJ: Since CBJ got Anisimov and Dubinsky they have enough center's to fill Brassard's spot (And they also have Johansen, Prospal and Umberger who can play C) Raymond brings more speed to there line-up (Which doesn't have a ton of top notch speed), then Rodin is the sweetener who will get much better opportunities in Columbus.


LOL!!!

Dont think CBJ is takin our scraps there dude
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#3 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 05:08 PM

LOL!!!

Dont think CBJ is takin our scraps there dude


Brassard isn't exactly fresh meat himself.

As I noted at the beginning of the post when I said "Struggling players".

Brassard is also struggling and hasn't done much more than Raymond if anything more at all. Don't see how its lopsided at all.
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#4 eretz canucks

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 06:19 PM

yeah whoever thinks that Brassard is this young up and coming power forward, is misled. He has struggled indeed and columbus has a glutton of centers for sure.
I would do this if we cannot pry Johansen out of CBJ (which would be a challenge). This guy's cap hit is a bit high for what he is (3.2mill) but I think if we actually want to get bigger, he would be a good guy to have.
I feel like his main draw back is motivation-what is it with these big forwards that lack motivation to be physical and drive to the net??
not to mention motivation to remain consisted-kassian, booth, brassard, a line of big an at times unmitovated players -lol
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#5 Zoolander

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 06:31 PM

I like it. If Brassard can prove himself as a consistent playmaker who can also find the back of the net, then we have found our solution to the 2nd line. If he becomes inconsistent, like he has been in Columbus, he will still centainly be an upgrade on pahlsson. He is bigger, stronger and has more offensive upside than Pahlsson, plus has grit to go along with it.

Besides if you play him Booth and Kes, and he struggles, just put him on a line with Chris 'Duct tape' Higgins and he'll do fine!
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#6 SkeeterHansen

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 08:58 PM

Finally a real proposal.

If I'm Columbus, I do this not only for their sake, but because both Brassard and Raymond need a fresh start. Anton Rodin is a guy who could still make an impact in the NHL down the road, but under CBJ's development...lol
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Posted 24 December 2012 - 09:24 PM

Sure I would of done this in the past CBA, but moving forward if the cap goes down it may be a bit more difficult for us to take on more salary.

Brassards numbers arent that bad, I guess just not up to expectations that people had of him.
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#8 Gollumpus

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 12:40 AM

To Vancouver: Derrick Brassard

To Columbus: Mason Raymond, Anton Rodin, 5th


Basically a swap of struggling players.

For Us: Brassard brings decent size, decent speed, and is a good two-way player. He can play either C or W. And since he known as a "pass-first" player he might be the solution on the 2nd line with Kes and Booth or else he can play on the third since he is reliable defensively.

For CBJ: Since CBJ got Anisimov and Dubinsky they have enough center's to fill Brassard's spot (And they also have Johansen, Prospal and Umberger who can play C) Raymond brings more speed to there line-up (Which doesn't have a ton of top notch speed), then Rodin is the sweetener who will get much better opportunities in Columbus.


1.) Brassard does have a lot of scoring potential, and he does have size, skating ability and flexibility in where he can play, which can be helpful as a 3rd line checker/grinder. Playing with Hansen and Higgens could result in him getting more than 14g 27a from last season.

Also, depending on the result of the assumed Luongo trade, Brassard could even find himself on the wing with Kesler and Booth.

2.) I am concerned about his +/- (okay, what can we expect with him being with the CBJ?), and also his results in the faceoff circle. Being at 45% could be as a result of his inexperience. Should it not improve, then this could cause a lot of problems as AV has liked to use his 3rd line in the defensive zone, and having Malhotra winning 61.7% and 58.5% of his faceoffs these past two seasons has been a real luxury.

3.) I would agree with eretz that Johansen looks to be the more desireable player, and I too would try to get him first and use Brassard as a fallback position.

As Playstation has pointed out, Brassard does carry an extra million (approximately) over what Raymond is paid. With this in mind, Johansen is actually paid less than Raymond, which is another reason to consider him over Brassard.

4.) I could see the CBJ raising an issue with Raymond. He has had two significant injuries (finger, back) which have had an impact on his play.

Raymond is also a UFA at the end of the season while Brassard still has one more full season before he hits RFA status (Rodin will also become an RFA at the end of this season).

I could see the CBJ wanting something a bit more than Rodin and a 5th to back the deal up should Raymond walk (maybe something as low as a conditional pick in 2014?).


Otherwise, an interesting proposal. :)


regards,
G.
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#9 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 12:51 AM

1.) Brassard does have a lot of scoring potential, and he does have size, skating ability and flexibility in where he can play, which can be helpful as a 3rd line checker/grinder. Playing with Hansen and Higgens could result in him getting more than 14g 27a from last season.

Also, depending on the result of the assumed Luongo trade, Brassard could even find himself on the wing with Kesler and Booth.

2.) I am concerned about his +/- (okay, what can we expect with him being with the CBJ?), and also his results in the faceoff circle. Being at 45% could be as a result of his inexperience. Should it not improve, then this could cause a lot of problems as AV has liked to use his 3rd line in the defensive zone, and having Malhotra winning 61.7% and 58.5% of his faceoffs these past two seasons has been a real luxury.

3.) I would agree with eretz that Johansen looks to be the more desireable player, and I too would try to get him first and use Brassard as a fallback position.

As Playstation has pointed out, Brassard does carry an extra million (approximately) over what Raymond is paid. With this in mind, Johansen is actually paid less than Raymond, which is another reason to consider him over Brassard.

4.) I could see the CBJ raising an issue with Raymond. He has had two significant injuries (finger, back) which have had an impact on his play.

Raymond is also a UFA at the end of the season while Brassard still has one more full season before he hits RFA status (Rodin will also become an RFA at the end of this season).

I could see the CBJ wanting something a bit more than Rodin and a 5th to back the deal up should Raymond walk (maybe something as low as a conditional pick in 2014?).


Otherwise, an interesting proposal. :)


regards,
G.


The point of it is more or less struggling player for struggling player, with both players having the potential to achevie more and perhaps a change could do it for both.

To get Johansen it would take a ton, they highly covet him, I wouldn't be surprised if they asked for Schneider. So I really have on desire for Johansen knowing what the asking price would be.

And as you pointed out he has decent size and good skating ability aswell as offensive ability and a good two way game, his faceoff might be a concern but that's not what I would base the deal off. And due to his skillset (Physical and otherwise) and the fact that he can play Wing proficiently and is a "pass first" player he might be the player we are looking for on the 2nd line.

It's calculated risk with a chance it could pay off in spades (But not much of a risk IMO) since he beings more size, could fill multiple roles and can't possibly be worse than Raymond.
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#10 Riviera82

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 12:49 AM

I like this deal. The Canucks get bigger and Raymond probably gets 1st line minutes in Columbus.
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#11 King of the ES

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 08:27 AM

To Vancouver: Derrick Brassard

To Columbus: Mason Raymond, Anton Rodin, 5th


Brassard has far more potential than anyone else above, so I'd say that it'd be very doubtful that they'd do this. For them to even consider moving him, we'd probably need to include either Jensen or Schroeder instead of Rodin & the 5th, which is practically nothing.
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#12 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 08:30 AM

Brassard has far more potential than anyone else above, so I'd say that it'd be very doubtful that they'd do this. For them to even consider moving him, we'd probably need to include either Jensen or Schroeder instead of Rodin & the 5th, which is practically nothing.


Brassard is 25 and hasn't put up 20 goals or 50 points yet in his career. He doesn't have much potential, about the exact same as Raymond.

He's never gunna be the 1st liner they hoped for, maybe a true 2nd liner but not on that team, that's the whole point of this deal, two struggling players, similar ages and at similar areas in there career.
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#13 King of the ES

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 08:44 AM

Brassard is 25 and hasn't put up 20 goals or 50 points yet in his career. He doesn't have much potential, about the exact same as Raymond.

He's never gunna be the 1st liner they hoped for, maybe a true 2nd liner but not on that team, that's the whole point of this deal, two struggling players, similar ages and at similar areas in there career.


Brassard is 2 years younger, and a former 6th overall pick. To say that he has the same amount of potential as Mason Raymond, who's had 2 consecutive years of decline on the NHL's best team, is insane.

You've gotta ask yourself what other teams might give up to get a guy like Brassard. If you think that out of the entire NHL, the best offer that CBJ could get is a Vancouver forward who's hanging onto his job by a thread and a 2nd round pick who's not showing any evidence at all of being able to have an NHL future, I think you're mistaken.
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#14 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 09:02 AM

Brassard is 2 years younger, and a former 6th overall pick. To say that he has the same amount of potential as Mason Raymond, who's had 2 consecutive years of decline on the NHL's best team, is insane.

You've gotta ask yourself what other teams might give up to get a guy like Brassard. If you think that out of the entire NHL, the best offer that CBJ could get is a Vancouver forward who's hanging onto his job by a thread and a 2nd round pick who's not showing any evidence at all of being able to have an NHL future, I think you're mistaken.


Alex Daigle was a 1st overall pick, Pavel Brendl was a 4th Overall Pick, Alex Svitov was a top 3 Pick.

Draft position means nothing once you leave the draft floor. And they were drafted 1 year apart.


To say that Brassard who has had done nothing thus-far in his NHL career besides being an overpaid dissapoint has far more potential than Raymond, is simply wrong.

Brassard is no better than Tyler Bozak. Brassard's job is hanging by a thread just as much as Raymond's is, I'm sorry King but your going to have to wake up and realize that he has proven himself thus-far to be a 3rd liner. And he is overpaid. For us judging by the fact Raymond (Though has the potential to be that player he once was) doesn't really fit in our line-up, the move makes sense, because it is basicly trading the same # of apples for the same # of oranges, your making a move that is even just fills different needs.

It works out for Columbus too, since they added Anisimov, Dubinsky, and have the rest of there future hopes on Johansen (Who will get more time) it makes sense for them to move a center who needs a change, to add more speed and a player who has already proven that he can be a good top 6 forward, something Brassard has not.

Now before you come back and continue to deny reality, re-search Brassard, then re-search Bozak and even Raymond if you want (And by re-search I mean look beyond stats on paper, which shows them to be pretty even anyways) and you will see they are all the same calibre right now, 2nd/3rd liners.
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#15 King of the ES

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 09:14 AM

To say that Brassard who has had done nothing thus-far in his NHL career besides being an overpaid dissapoint has far more potential than Raymond, is simply wrong.


If that's the case, then why do you want to trade for him?

This is typical of the proposal around this site - bash whoever you're trying to acquire, inflate the guy you're trying to trade :lol:

Now before you come back and continue to deny reality, re-search Brassard, then re-search Bozak and even Raymond if you want (And by re-search I mean look beyond stats on paper, which shows them to be pretty even anyways) and you will see they are all the same calibre right now, 2nd/3rd liners.


If you think that either Tyler Bozak or Mason Raymond would command more attention on the open market than Derick Brassard, you, sir, are the one that is in clear denial of reality. Brassard is younger and far more gifted than either of the two. He's been on a woefully hopeless team. There would be a lot of interest in Derick Brassard.
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#16 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 09:22 AM

If that's the case, then why do you want to trade for him?

This is typical of the proposal around this site - bash whoever you're trying to acquire, inflate the guy you're trying to trade :lol:

If you think that either Tyler Bozak or Mason Raymond would command more attention on the open market than Derick Brassard, you, sir, are the one that is in clear denial of reality. Brassard is younger and far more gifted than either of the two. He's been on a woefully hopeless team. There would be a lot of interest in Derick Brassard.


I explained it King, it obvious you don't even know enough about Brassard to make an accurate judgment on how good he is. The only thing you know is when he was drafted.

If Brassard is so good why did Phoenix trade for Vermette last year instead of him? And if some teams had to choose between Brassard at 3.2 or Bozak at 1.5 If sure there would be more than a few that would take Bozak.

And if you think Brassard truley is that much more gifted and so much better than the other two then explain why, with some factual reason that actually makes sense rather than your delusions.
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#17 ice orca

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 09:24 AM

Brassard is 2 years younger, and a former 6th overall pick. To say that he has the same amount of potential as Mason Raymond, who's had 2 consecutive years of decline on the NHL's best team, is insane.

You've gotta ask yourself what other teams might give up to get a guy like Brassard. If you think that out of the entire NHL, the best offer that CBJ could get is a Vancouver forward who's hanging onto his job by a thread and a 2nd round pick who's not showing any evidence at all of being able to have an NHL future, I think you're mistaken.

Let the other teams have him, besides didnt he walk out on a euro team he was playing for and there is rumors of a lawsuit about it? Hockey Central guys were giving him some crap over it. Columbus produces some of the biggest underacheivers in the NHL. The Canucks dont need reclamation projects in Brassard or Brule. Raymond just came off a broken back so maybe cut him some slack.
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#18 King of the ES

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 09:35 AM

If Brassard is so good why did Phoenix trade for Vermette last year instead of him? And if some teams had to choose between Brassard at 3.2 or Bozak at 1.5 If sure there would be more than a few that would take Bozak.


Phoenix probably traded for Vermette because he's a far more appropriate deadline acquisition than Derick Brassard is.

And if you think Brassard truley is that much more gifted and so much better than the other two then explain why, with some factual reason that actually makes sense rather than your delusions.


He's a highly gifted, highly skilled offensive player, which is why he was taken 6th overall. His '08-'09 season was incredibly productive - look at his points compared to his minutes given per-game. He's established himself as a 2/3 C on a historically pathetic team, and he's only 25 years old.

My point is that there would be a lot of interest in a "reclamation" (not really) project like Brassard. A young C, with excellent offensive skills, decent size, etc. I actually like Mason Raymond, but he's simply not worth what Brassard is, with "worth" being loosely defined as team's that would likely have interest. Anton Rodin is worthless, as is the 5th. Therefore, I don't imagine that CBJ would be interested.

Edited by King of the ES, 26 December 2012 - 09:37 AM.

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#19 Pears

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 03:50 PM

Phoenix probably traded for Vermette because he's a far more appropriate deadline acquisition than Derick Brassard is.



He's a highly gifted, highly skilled offensive player, which is why he was taken 6th overall. His '08-'09 season was incredibly productive - look at his points compared to his minutes given per-game. He's established himself as a 2/3 C on a historically pathetic team, and he's only 25 years old.

My point is that there would be a lot of interest in a "reclamation" (not really) project like Brassard. A young C, with excellent offensive skills, decent size, etc. I actually like Mason Raymond, but he's simply not worth what Brassard is, with "worth" being loosely defined as team's that would likely have interest. Anton Rodin is worthless, as is the 5th. Therefore, I don't imagine that CBJ would be interested.

You're forgetting that Raymond is also going to Columbus. And Anton Rodin is far from worthless, even ask MG. He was even gonna take him in the first round.
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#20 ConnorFutureGM

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 04:05 PM

Columbus doesn't do this.

Brassard has much more upside, produces more and plays a higher in demand position.

Raymond sucks.
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#21 DonTaylor4President

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 04:55 PM

Nice to see a reasonable proposal. I like the idea of switching two struggling players and I feel that Brassard's size and upside would fit in well as a second line wing or third line centre which are our two main gaps we need filled. I like Raymond and I feel that given a chance he could bounce back but his value isn't nearly on par with Brassard's and adding Rodin and a 5th is like adding sprinkles to a banana split that has no icecream. Here is my slightly altered proposal:

CBJ: Raymond & Schroeder

VAN: Brassard
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#22 King of the ES

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 05:09 PM

You're forgetting that Raymond is also going to Columbus. And Anton Rodin is far from worthless, even ask MG. He was even gonna take him in the first round.


No, I'm not "forgetting" that Raymond is also going to Columbus. I referenced him many times in my responses. You may want to read them.

"Even ask MG" - LOL. The guy's got 1 goal in 18 AHL games. What's your response to that? Coach conspiracy?
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#23 King of the ES

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 05:10 PM

Nice to see a reasonable proposal. I like the idea of switching two struggling players and I feel that Brassard's size and upside would fit in well as a second line wing or third line centre which are our two main gaps we need filled. I like Raymond and I feel that given a chance he could bounce back but his value isn't nearly on par with Brassard's and adding Rodin and a 5th is like adding sprinkles to a banana split that has no icecream. Here is my slightly altered proposal:

CBJ: Raymond & Schroeder

VAN: Brassard


This is far more reasonable. I still doubt that CBJ would do it, but if the relationship between the player and the organization has been strained at all, they might.
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#24 Dion Phaneuf

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 05:14 PM

The deal isn't horrible however I'd much rather give them Raymond for a pair of average prospects.

Raymond is the type of forward Brassard needs (someone with speed).
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#25 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 05:32 PM

No, I'm not "forgetting" that Raymond is also going to Columbus. I referenced him many times in my responses. You may want to read them.

"Even ask MG" - LOL. The guy's got 1 goal in 18 AHL games. What's your response to that? Coach conspiracy?


8 Points in 18 games playing on the 3rd line****
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#26 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 05:35 PM

Phoenix probably traded for Vermette because he's a far more appropriate deadline acquisition than Derick Brassard is.



He's a highly gifted, highly skilled offensive player, which is why he was taken 6th overall. His '08-'09 season was incredibly productive - look at his points compared to his minutes given per-game. He's established himself as a 2/3 C on a historically pathetic team, and he's only 25 years old.

My point is that there would be a lot of interest in a "reclamation" (not really) project like Brassard. A young C, with excellent offensive skills, decent size, etc. I actually like Mason Raymond, but he's simply not worth what Brassard is, with "worth" being loosely defined as team's that would likely have interest. Anton Rodin is worthless, as is the 5th. Therefore, I don't imagine that CBJ would be interested.


If Brassard is such a "gifted offensive player" (Which he isn't, he has offensive skill but he's doesn't havet to end offensive skill, really his pure offensive ability isn't much worse than raymond's)

Why had Brassard done nothing but digress from the 1st productive season as you call it, right now he has proven himself to be a 3rd liner with upside, that's exactly what Raymond is.

It's a swap of struggling players, key word meaning struggling, both players need a change and this offers it to them and helps both teams add something helpful to there organization.

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 26 December 2012 - 05:35 PM.

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#27 King of the ES

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 05:45 PM

8 Points in 18 games playing on the 3rd line****


What's such an amazing prospect doing lost on the 3rd line in the AHL?
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#28 King of the ES

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 05:50 PM

If Brassard is such a "gifted offensive player" (Which he isn't, he has offensive skill but he's doesn't havet to end offensive skill, really his pure offensive ability isn't much worse than raymond's)

Why had Brassard done nothing but digress from the 1st productive season as you call it, right now he has proven himself to be a 3rd liner with upside, that's exactly what Raymond is.

It's a swap of struggling players, key word meaning struggling, both players need a change and this offers it to them and helps both teams add something helpful to there organization.


Brassard has not built off of his 08-09 season, that is true. But IMO the potential is still there, and I think that there would be a lot of teams interested in picking him up, far more than what would exist for Raymond. Decent production the last two years. Better than a "3rd liner". Can't discount the fact that he's playing on a truly pathetic team, either.

And if "struggling" is so important, would you trade Ballard for Komisarek? Both guys are struggling and need a change.
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#29 Pears

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 05:50 PM

What's such an amazing prospect doing lost on the 3rd line in the AHL?

Sweatt - Schroeder - Haydar
Sterling - Ebbett - Kassian

Would be pretty hard to beat any of those guys out for a top six role.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs


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#30 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 05:54 PM

What's such an amazing prospect doing lost on the 3rd line in the AHL?


And he was playing every 2nd game.

I don't know you have to ask the Genius Arniel why he scratches guys like Rodin and Sauve yet continues to give Joslin "raymond likes" chances.
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