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[Discussion] Roberto Luongo Trade Thread 4.0


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#631 DeNiro

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 11:59 PM

I say keep Luongo for a few weeks at least.

Let the losses start piling up for Toronto until they start getting real desperate. And you know the losses will pile up.

Right now Burke thinks he has the upper hand because Gillis is desperate. Until the tables are turned, no trade should be made.
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#632 Understand

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:01 AM

I say keep Luongo for a few weeks at least.

Let the losses start piling up for Toronto until they start getting real desperate. And you know the losses will pile up.

Right now Burke thinks he has the upper hand because Gillis is desperate. Until the tables are turned, no trade should be made.

What if Reimer and the Leafs gets off to a good start?
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#633 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:07 AM

That was my thought at first, and I definitely agree it's weighted too much in Van's favour - but keep in mind that NYI might not have the operating budget to afford a Dipietro buyout. That might make them more willing to move him to a richer team like Van.


Not for that price.

They won't give up Nelson NYI fans and the organization is really high on him.

They won't give up 2 1sts, they likely aren't a playoff team after those moves so those are 2 top 15 picks, no way.

I highly doubt they give up Hamonic, he's a big part of there team and a HUGE part of the future there.

I also doubt they give up Okposo, he's young and is already good, also a big part of there team.

Pokka is the only one they are willing to do.


And really they don't get much cap space, Luongo has a lifelong contract too and Ballard's cap hit it pretty big, I don't see any chance at all they even think about considering doing it.
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#634 DeNiro

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:07 AM

What if Reimer and the Leafs gets off to a good start?


Then good for them. Doesn't mean Reimer is a number 1.

If they really think they can do anything in the playoffs with him in net, well then Burke might as well just resign right now. But I doubt they do get off to a good start. Too much pressure on guys like JVR, Kessel, and Reimer to be better than they are.

And either way, we'd be back to where we started with low ball offers being made for him. I think it's a risk worth taking to get maximum value. We've actually got quite a bit of cap space with Kesler on LTIR. No need to rush things.

Edited by DeNiro, 09 January 2013 - 12:09 AM.

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#635 oldnews

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:09 AM

That was my thought at first, and I definitely agree it's weighted too much in Van's favour - but keep in mind that NYI might not have the operating budget to afford a Dipietro buyout. That might make them more willing to move him to a richer team like Van.


The first part is value for value. Luongo, Ballard for Okposo, Hamonic, Nelson.

Of course the second part is weighed in Vancouver's favour - except for the $24 million part lol. That is the business part of this transaction, where the Canucks have more leverage - of course in a hockey sense this works in Vancouver's favour - but the negative value of Dipietro to the Islanders might be underestimated here. Smashian suggests the Isles can afford this buyout themselves... Can they really? And that's not the only business aspect of this - Luongo in New York City giving that franchise newborn marketing legitimacy is something they could use - to get rid of their Milbury hangover.
The other thing that makes this sligthly more moderate than it seems is this:
Tavares, Strome, Nielsen, Bailey, Cizikas at center alone....Streit, Reinhart, Donovan, DeHaan...Neiderreiter...the cupboards aren't empty...

Edited by oldnews, 09 January 2013 - 12:16 AM.

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#636 thad

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:09 AM

I say keep Luongo for a few weeks at least.

Let the losses start piling up for Toronto until they start getting real desperate. And you know the losses will pile up.

Right now Burke thinks he has the upper hand because Gillis is desperate. Until the tables are turned, no trade should be made.


and let bozak pile on the points and drive his price up? no way lol
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#637 DeNiro

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:12 AM

and let bozak pile on the points and drive his price up? no way lol


He already is overvalued if he's being offered up as the centerpiece for Luongo.

And what if Luongo starts piling up the wins? Then what?
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#638 Noheart

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:13 AM

That was my thought at first, and I definitely agree it's weighted too much in Van's favour - but keep in mind that NYI might not have the operating budget to afford a Dipietro buyout. That might make them more willing to move him to a richer team like Van.


True but is Luongo and ballards contract that much more of a bargin?

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#639 WHL rocks

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:15 AM

This is absolute robbery, they would much rather just buyout Dipietro than pay that ludicrous price to dump his salary.


I agree with your above post re" TSN pumping up Lu controversy. They want Luongo in Toronto and are trying to create issues. MG knows exactly what's going on.

But as far as Dipietro getting bought out, NO WAY in this universe Isles buy out Dipietro. Never. No owner would do approve such a move. If I was GM no way I would even think about doing such a thing, If I'm owner I'd fire the GM for even asking me.

Edit: I understand the context of your post so not saying you think they would buy him out.

Edited by WHL rocks, 09 January 2013 - 12:19 AM.

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#640 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:18 AM

The first part is value for value. Luongo, Ballard for Okposo, Hamonic, Nelson.

Of course the second part is weighed in Vancouver's favour - except for the $24 million part lol. That is the business part of this transaction, where the Canucks have more leverage - of course in a hockey sense this works in Vancouver's favour - but the negative value of Dipietro to the Islanders might be underestimated here. Smashian suggests the Isles can afford this buyout themselves... Can they really?


I highly doubt NYI would do Hamonic and Nelson for Lu and Ballard. Adding Okposo only makes it worse.

And Luongo's overall value of the contract from now until it ends is 6.6 more than Dipeitro's and is one year Longer, how is that any better? That's trading all that and getting completely hosed for an even worse contract, not to mention Ballard who is 4.2 and isn't nearly what Hamonic is.

Post this on HF Boards & see what NYI fans say, I dare you.

Edit: I agree with you on most things dude, but this doesn't make any sense from their perspective.

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 09 January 2013 - 12:27 AM.

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#641 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:20 AM

I agree with your above post re" TSN pumping up Lu controversy. They want Luongo in Toronto and are trying to create issues. MG knows exactly what's going on.

But as far as Dipietro getting bought out, NO WAY in this universe Isles buy out Dipietro. Never. No owner would do approve such a move. If I was GM no way I would even think about doing such a thing, If I'm owner I'd fire the GM for even asking me.


I'm not saying they would do it, and that point is exactly why I think everyone suggesting buying out Luongo is nuts, & I wouldn't buy Rick either but they would buy him out rather than destroy the future and pull off a move like this. And Luongo's contract is worse + adding Ballard to the trade, so I don't see where the cap relief is.
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#642 WHL rocks

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:29 AM

I think Luongo to CBJ is also a real possibility. Don't shut the door on Columbus. John Davidson was recently hired to turn the team around and bring credibility to the organisation. They desperately need a Luongo on that roster.

As far as Luongo saying he won't go there, don't be so sure. After JD having a talk with Luongo and explaining his vision for the team Luongo might have a change of heart. JD's track record in St. Louis would help.

IF Luongo said NO, and refused to waive MG could say to him look, I'll waive you and CBJ will get you anyways, if needed MG could work out a deal with CBJ where they send over a package for player X and waiving Luongo.

Unlikely but this is a hammer MG holds.

I'm am certain there are several teams involved behind the scenes. Only way BB gets Luongo is if he outbids all other clubs. If it's a tie other club gets Lu.
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#643 oldnews

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:30 AM

But as far as Dipietro getting bought out, NO WAY in this universe Isles buy out Dipietro. Never. No owner would do approve such a move. If I was GM no way I would even think about doing such a thing, If I'm owner I'd fire the GM for even asking me.

Edit: I understand the context of your post so not saying you think they would buy him out.


You're missing something rather important. Buying out Dipietro costs 24 million and no cap hit. Not buying out Dipietro costs 36 million and 36 million in cap hit over 8 years.
If you were the owner, you'd probably have realized that by now. You also already fired someone over this.
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#644 WHL rocks

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:31 AM

I'm not saying they would do it, and that point is exactly why I think everyone suggesting buying out Luongo is nuts, & I wouldn't buy Rick either but they would buy him out rather than destroy the future and pull off a move like this. And Luongo's contract is worse + adding Ballard to the trade, so I don't see where the cap relief is.


Yes, of course, please read my edit shortly after i made my post. I guess you pushed the quote button before I was able to hit edit.
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#645 Canucks_Hockey_101

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:31 AM

Luongo has never been a team player anyway. He's always put his needs before his team. The Canucks need more 'Heart and Soul' guys on this team. I hate how Luongo feels he's automatically deserved a number one spot in Vancouver.....NO, you've gotta earn your spot Lu, instead of complaining and asking to be traded PROVE that you deserve the spot over Schneider. I'll be GLAD when Luongo is gone, that self centered...


And he's human and he's so good that he has never gone through having to deal with the fact that it is perceived he has been surpassed, thereby creating completion which he has never had to deal with processing such information?

Reality check. If he is indeed that good, TSN is again spewing the possibility that the city might get a star. either he will surpass Schneider the sensaional rookie who keeps it cool as cool can be or he doesn't.

If he does, we have a Thomas comeback and people will certainly get back on the wagon.

If not, then he's traded to a team that needs and wants a number one goaltender that gets them into the playoffs.

At least we have an amazing event before our eyes, in a hyper-soason, with two changes at the Cup.

Edited by Canucks_Hockey_101, 09 January 2013 - 12:38 AM.

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#646 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:32 AM

Yes, of course, please read my edit shortly after i made my post. I guess you pushed the quote button before I was able to hit edit.


I saw, and I wasn't trying to be that abrupt in my post, if I came across that way I apologize.
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#647 WHL rocks

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:33 AM

You're missing something rather important. Buying out Dipietro costs 24 million and no cap hit. Not buying out Dipietro costs 36 million and 36 million in cap hit over 8 years.
If you were the owner, you'd probably have realized that by now. You also already fired someone over this.


lol. Every team should buy out players cus buying them out costs less than keeping them on the roster.

Ridiculous post

NYI are a low budget cap floor team, they won't buy out any player on the roster let alone someone who will cost $26 mill to buyout.
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#648 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:34 AM

You're missing something rather important. Buying out Dipietro costs 24 million and no cap hit. Not buying out Dipietro costs 36 million and 36 million in cap hit over 8 years.
If you were the owner, you'd probably have realized that by now. You also already fired someone over this.


Okay so then they hold onto him until the contract expires I guess.

I just can't see why they would trade away this much to take on an even worse contract.
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#649 oldnews

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:35 AM

I highly doubt NYI would do Hamonic and Nelson for Lu and Ballard. Adding Okposo only makes it worse.

And Luongo's overall value of the contract from now until it ends is 6.6 more than Dipeitro's and is one year Longer, how is that any better? That's trading all that and getting completely hosed for an even worse contract, not to mention Ballard who is 4.2 and isn't nearly what Hamonic is.

Post this on HF Boards & see what NYI fans say, I dare you.

Edit: I agree with you on most things dude, but this doesn't make any sense from their perspective.


Evidently you don't take seriously.
When someone says, oh the Islanders wouldn't give up their sixth rated prospect etc I don't take the response very seriously.

The difference between Luongo and Dipietro is that Dipietro is backing up the backup - as in 6 starts last season, with a .876 save percentage. That would be how it's any better. And Nabokov is a 37 year old UFA at season's end.
Is the Isles future Al Montoya?
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#650 oldnews

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:37 AM

Okay so then they hold onto him until the contract expires I guess.

I just can't see why they would trade away this much to take on an even worse contract.


You're not getting any more convincing.
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#651 oldnews

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:47 AM

lol. Every team should buy out players cus buying them out costs less than keeping them on the roster.

Ridiculous post

NYI are a low budget cap floor team, they won't buy out any player on the roster let alone someone who will cost $26 mill to buyout.


Ok there WHL.
You're spinning your tires.
Some teams will use their buyouts - for two obvious reasons - they save 1/3 of the salary, and they save the entire cap hit.

And the point you make regarding the Isles was the point I was making - they can't afford the buyout - they can't afford the salary either - that would be the point of moving the 36 million dollar contract and cap hit of a player that's not even playing.
It will cost them regardless.
If you find that "ridiculous" you are really missing the point.
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#652 Noheart

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:49 AM

Dubinsky, Anisimov, Erixon and a 1st for Rick Nash.

Rick Nash people.

Stop overvaluing Luongo

best case is what Rick Nash fetched and that is a stretch.

Howsen waited like 6 months to squeeze that out.

Non of those guys are superstars or even high end prospects, a 1st round pick from the rangers aint exactly awesome either.

I believe we will get something for Luongo but nothing more than that, you dam well know the they are using that trade as a benchmark.

Edited by Noheart, 09 January 2013 - 12:51 AM.

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#653 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:50 AM

Evidently you don't take seriously.
When someone says, oh the Islanders wouldn't give up their sixth rated prospect etc I don't take the response very seriously.

The difference between Luongo and Dipietro is that Dipietro is backing up the backup - as in 6 starts last season, with a .876 save percentage. That would be how it's any better. And Nabokov is a 37 year old UFA at season's end.
Is the Isles future Al Montoya?


Injuries obviously didn't play a big part in this....

We get that Luongo is an upgrade, but why get that upgrade when you have to sacfirice which will likely be a top pair d-man for you soon (if he isn't already) A top 6 forward who is still young with upside and is a leader and key piece of your team, aswell as a very good prospect that your organization is high on, aswell as a good prospect in Pokka and 2 top 15 picks (We saw how well that worked out with Toronto)

And also when they have some good young goaltenders (To respond to your Montoya joke) in Kevin Poulin and Andres Nilsson.

If your really confident this is a good deal, go post this on HF Board so NYI fans can see, and send me the link when you get flamed I would love to see the replies.
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#654 DeNiro

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:53 AM

^^ Tim Erixon is a pretty solid prospect. If we can get a prospect at that level to go along with a first round pick, and maybe a second or third line player, I'd be more than happy.
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#655 WHL rocks

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:56 AM

Ok there WHL.
You're spinning your tires.
Some teams will use their buyouts - for two obvious reasons - they save 1/3 of the salary, and they save the entire cap hit.

And the point you make regarding the Isles was the point I was making - they can't afford the buyout - they can't afford the salary either - that would be the point of moving the 36 million dollar contract and cap hit of a player that's not even playing.
It will cost them regardless.
If you find that "ridiculous" you are really missing the point.


ok, I'm just saying there is no way Isles will buy out Dipietro. No way for any reason.
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#656 Noheart

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 01:01 AM

^^ Tim Erixon is a pretty solid prospect. If we can get a prospect at that level to go along with a first round pick, and maybe a second or third line player, I'd be more than happy.


I hate your Avatar but at least your on planet earth

Erixon is good but he is no Hamonic.
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#657 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 01:24 AM

I hate your Avatar but at least your on planet earth

Erixon is good but he is no Hamonic.


No kidding, Hamonic is already a top 4 player for them at 22 or whatever he is.

Erixon hasn't locked down an NHL spot yet.

No chance they deal Hamonic.
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#658 firestorm238

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 01:31 AM

ok, I'm just saying there is no way Isles will buy out Dipietro. No way for any reason.


Yeah, that was kinda the whole point of oldnews's original post on this subject. The Isles can't because they can't afford to. Vancouver can. Trading DiPietro takes both the actual dollars and the cap hit off the books for NYI - and in exchange they pay 0.8 mil more per year to get a legitimate starter. Otherwise, as you rightly state, they're on the hook paying 4.5 for a goalie that's riding the pine at worst, and at best will likely never be the elite goalie he's being paid to be.

This is actually a pretty smart way for the Canucks to add value to a deal without having to worry about a significant impact on their cap hit.
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#659 WHL rocks

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 01:59 AM

Yeah, that was kinda the whole point of oldnews's original post on this subject. The Isles can't because they can't afford to. Vancouver can. Trading DiPietro takes both the actual dollars and the cap hit off the books for NYI - and in exchange they pay 0.8 mil more per year to get a legitimate starter. Otherwise, as you rightly state, they're on the hook paying 4.5 for a goalie that's riding the pine at worst, and at best will likely never be the elite goalie he's being paid to be.

This is actually a pretty smart way for the Canucks to add value to a deal without having to worry about a significant impact on their cap hit.


Yeah, I don't see any way possible where Aquilini gives the go ahead to buy out Dipietro either. Basically no owner is going to flush $28 mill down the toilet. It's not happening with Luongo and it sure the heck ain't happening with Dipietro. Canucks aren't going to trade for Dipietro and buy him out.

PPl on these board throw around millions as if it was monopoly money. Get back to reality CDC.
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#660 firestorm238

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 02:24 AM

If that $28 Million replenishes the prospect pool, and helps to keep us in the playoffs for the next few years then it would look like a pretty decent investment to me.
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