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#91 Tearloch7

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:12 PM

.223 is good for varmints but useless in any kind of forest cover as it is to light and deflects easily .. I used to use one for coyotes but switched to the .220 Swift caliber ..
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#92 canadiancon

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:19 PM

Like I said, I have no problem with hunting rifles. Like you say yourself, AR-15 is not a hunting rifle. It can be used as such, but I can hammer a nail with my cell phone, doesn't make it a hammer. It's not about the round (although I can see the impression the post re: McChrystal could make), it's about the ability to fire off multiple shots (up to 30, they say) with high frequency. I think it was Tearloch7 that suggested rifles are regulated by the sound they make between shots. If it goes "bang, bang, bang" it's no good, if it goes "bang, clack, clack cling, bang" that's a-okay (sound effects may differ).

So let's review: hunting rifles = good. Semi-auto assault weapons that are misused for hunting by some = not good.


A mini 14 is not an assault rifle but is semi auto and fires .223 rounds and it is a hunting rifle.

You can get .22 that are semi auto and have 25 shot clips that are legal, a .22 will kill you just as fast.

So where does it stop for the anti gun people.

What about a bolt action .300 win mag that would go through 2 people before the bullet stopped, or a car door. Any gun can kill a big group of people.
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#93 canadiancon

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:21 PM

.223 is good for varmints but useless in any kind of forest cover as it is to light and deflects easily .. I used to use one for coyotes but switched to the .220 Swift caliber ..


Any bullet will deflect. The "brush buster" gun is a myth, there is no such thing. A small twig will deflect a .338
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#94 Tearloch7

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:24 PM

Any bullet will deflect. The "brush buster" gun is a myth, there is no such thing. A small twig will deflect a .338


A heavy grain slower moving bullet DOES NOT deflect nearly as much as the zippy ones .. been there, done that ..
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"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

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#95 Gumballthechewy

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:29 PM

So this thread has turned into a bullet deflection thread?
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#96 Lockout Casualty

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:32 PM

A mini 14 is not an assault rifle but is semi auto and fires .223 rounds and it is a hunting rifle.

You can get .22 that are semi auto and have 25 shot clips that are legal, a .22 will kill you just as fast.

So where does it stop for the anti gun people.

What about a bolt action .300 win mag that would go through 2 people before the bullet stopped, or a car door. Any gun can kill a big group of people.


I wasn't aware that hunting rifles came in semi-auto (can you tell I know nothing about guns?). While that does little to challenge my statement, I should restate it to better reflect reality: weapons that can be fired in quick succession should not be easily available. Bolt action rifles used for hunting should be.

It's clear that any gun can look like a hunting rifle, or even be modified to suit the purpose. Again we return to the sound of the chamber reloading (wise man this Tearloch is).

Any gun can be used to kill, but not every gun is easy to conceal, will fire in quick succession, is fast to reload, or holds a large magazine, and is banned or tightly restricted (and not used in shootings) in pretty much the rest of the civilized world.

Edited by Lockout Casualty, 10 January 2013 - 09:38 PM.

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"It is the Parliament that’s supposed to run the country, not just the largest party and the single leader of that party. I guess that’s a criticism that I've had and that we've had and that most Canadians have had for a long, long time.”

 

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#97 canadiancon

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:36 PM

A heavy grain slower moving bullet DOES NOT deflect nearly as much as the zippy ones .. been there, done that ..


To a point, there was a test done a while ago, I can't find the link but they put a target 2 feet behind some brush and there was a 90% MISS rate regardless of the caliber of bullet. Heavy round nose "brush busters" actually did worse then anything.
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#98 canadiancon

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:38 PM

I wasn't aware that hunting rifles came in semi-auto (can you tell I know nothing about guns?). While that does little to challenge my statement, I should restate it to better reflect reality: weapons that can be fired in quick succession should not be easily available. Bolt action rifles used for hunting should be.

It's clear that any gun can look like a hunting rifle, or even be modified to suit the purpose. Again we return to the sound of the chamber reloading sound (wise man this Tearloch is).

Any gun can be used to kill, but not every gun is easy to conceal, will fire in quick succession, is fast to reload, or holds a large magazine, and is banned (and not used in shootings) in pretty much the rest of the civilized world.

.

Ya lots of hunting rifles come in semi auto, including shotguns.

I see your point about a semi auto rifle tho.

Canada has pretty decent gun rules and how you obtain a gun license is a pretty good procedure also.
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#99 Lockout Casualty

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:42 PM

Good post. I am a gun owner. Have been since I was around 11 or 12 years old. It was not a toy. I did not pose with it in pictures. I did not show it off to my friends. I own a gun, and I am in favour of banning assault rifles and high capacity magazines. I think that there should be strict laws on trigger locks and other safe storage rules. I think that the process of acquiring a gun should be long and arduous. I am not opposed to government making it more difficult for me to own a gun.


Not a toy you say?

Posted ImagePosted Image

I guess this is what Zaibatsu meant when he said "culture", huh?
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"It is the Parliament that’s supposed to run the country, not just the largest party and the single leader of that party. I guess that’s a criticism that I've had and that we've had and that most Canadians have had for a long, long time.”

 

- Steven Harper, circa 2004


#100 Tearloch7

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:42 PM

To a point, there was a test done a while ago, I can't find the link but they put a target 2 feet behind some brush and there was a 90% MISS rate regardless of the caliber of bullet. Heavy round nose "brush busters" actually did worse then anything.


I used to hunt deer in thick second growth Fir stands and used my 30-30 with 210 grain bullets and their penetration ability was amazing .. I know they say their is little difference, but I dinna believe em .. as long as I believe, then my shots hit what I am aiming at .. must be some divine intervention, eh? .. :rolleyes:
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"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

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#101 Tearloch7

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:44 PM

Not a toy you say?

Posted ImagePosted Image

I guess this is what Zaibatsu meant when he said "culture", huh?


Lord have mercy ..
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"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

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#102 Lockout Casualty

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:46 PM

Lord have mercy ..


It's okay though, because you can still take this hunting:
Posted ImagePosted Image

God bless America..

Edited by Lockout Casualty, 10 January 2013 - 09:47 PM.

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"It is the Parliament that’s supposed to run the country, not just the largest party and the single leader of that party. I guess that’s a criticism that I've had and that we've had and that most Canadians have had for a long, long time.”

 

- Steven Harper, circa 2004


#103 canadiancon

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:46 PM

I used to hunt deer in thick second growth Fir stands and used my 30-30 with 210 grain bullets and their penetration ability was amazing .. I know they say their is little difference, but I dinna believe em .. as long as I believe, then my shots hit what I am aiming at .. must be some divine intervention, eh? .. :rolleyes:


I have seen 250 grain .338 bullets deflect off tall grass...
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#104 Tearloch7

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:57 PM

I have seen 250 grain .338 bullets deflect off tall grass...


I guess I must hold my mouth right .. :lol:
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"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

"Always tell the Truth. That way, you don’t have to remember what you said"  ~ Mark Twain ~
 


#105 canadiancon

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:59 PM

I guess I must hold my mouth right .. :lol:


Haha I have also shot grouse with a .22 through some thick crap! Lol the things that brush can do to bullets is amazing!
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#106 Dazzle

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 10:06 PM

I take it nobody died, considering how happy people are willing to share their MW2 experience?

I'm kidding btw.

Edited by Dazzle, 10 January 2013 - 10:07 PM.

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Posted Image --> THANKS EGATTI.

I have to say Dazzle's was the coolest. ROTFLOL


#107 Tearloch7

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 10:26 PM

Haha I have also shot grouse with a .22 through some thick crap! Lol the things that brush can do to bullets is amazing!


Yep .. head shooting grouse with a .22 sharpens the skill alright .. especially free hand .. used to use a Ruger .22 pistol for grouse .. that was tough .. head never stays still it seems ..
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"To Thine Own Self Be True"

 

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#108 Pouria

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 11:06 PM

was'nt aware Columbine had armed guards. they failed I guess.


Maybe you should become an armed guard over there. See how that goes. Armed guards won't prevent crap if the guy coming to kill people has AK-47s and AR-15s. He will just take care of the guards and then enter the school.
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Posted Image


#109 Pouria

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 11:16 PM

Ok So armed guards are no good thanks for the info. I am so glad we can now agree on that. good luck banning guns in the USA. more shootings will happen that's what crazy people do. just ignore them and take the guns away from everyone else.


Do crazy people exclusively live in US??
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Posted Image


#110 Pouria

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 11:19 PM

Ok, I'm convinced. Ban guns. I don't own one. only criminals and police should have them. seems to be only people who have them here in Canada. Crazy people here just saw your head off on a bus or slice you up with a knife stuff you in a bag. Keeps the death count down with only knives and machetes.


At least its better than 20 dead children. That stuff happens everywhere in the world not just Canada or America. If you want to be safe from the "crazy people", you should go live on the moon.
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#111 Hugemanskost

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 11:55 PM


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webkit-fake-url://D8829558-F65F-49B9-9829-A7DFC7F2E6E4/application.pdf


:towel: :canucks:


#112 Dittohead

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 10:22 AM

We need to get guns away from guards, clearly it's not working. No guns allowed at schools, no cops either they are just cannon fodder.
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#113 Electro Rock

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 10:37 AM

Like I said, I have no problem with hunting rifles. Like you say yourself, AR-15 is not a hunting rifle. It can be used as such, but I can hammer a nail with my cell phone, doesn't make it a hammer. It's not about the round (although I can see the impression the post re: McChrystal could make), it's about the ability to fire off multiple shots (up to 30, they say) with high frequency. I think it was Tearloch7 that suggested rifles are regulated by the sound they make between shots. If it goes "bang, bang, bang" it's no good, if it goes "bang, clack, clack cling, bang" that's a-okay (sound effects may differ).

So let's review: hunting rifles = good. Semi-auto assault weapons that are misused for hunting by some = not good.


Far more shots are fired in the pursuit of "varminting", pest control and other small game activities, than in what most people think of hunting such as deer or moose hunting, and as such a smaller caliber semiauto centerfire rifle like the AR-15 is ideal for relatively high volume small game.

The AR-15 specifically is also modular and can be chambered in some very powerful calibers if bigger game was on the menu.

Anyway, generals, like police chiefs and those appointed to the heads of various institutions, are very much political creatures who will shill shamelessly to keep their insider status.
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#114 kyledude

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 11:02 AM

I've lost all faith in humanity over this gun madness. Not because there are ~100 gun-related deaths in the US every day, but because there is suddenly a thread on each one. Multiple murders and mass shootings happen all the time, and this amount of publicity actually makes matters worse.

Gun control agenda aside, overall crime rates in the US have been in decline for decades. America is actually getting safer. Only people drinking the kool-aid have lost sight of this.
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#115 Mr. Ambien

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 11:18 AM

I've lost all faith in humanity over this gun madness. Not because there are ~100 gun-related deaths in the US every day, but because there is suddenly a thread on each one. Multiple murders and mass shootings happen all the time, and this amount of publicity actually makes matters worse.

Gun control agenda aside, overall crime rates in the US have been in decline for decades. America is actually getting safer. Only people drinking the kool-aid have lost sight of this.

Bingo.

People far too susceptible to media driven hysteria believe something drastic must be done right this second.

Problem is blown out of proportion, the problem is actually those who believe the gun problem is getting worse.

Edited by zaibatsu, 11 January 2013 - 11:23 AM.

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#116 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 11:24 AM

Of which "society" do you infer?


The reasons for having a gun in the US differs from having one in Canada, as the background and thinking is different.


The background is different for sure...."the rocket's red glare, the bombs bursting in air" and all that.

The thinking that being such a warlike nation and being so proud of it is what needs to change if the U.S.A. is ever going to be able to eliminate (or at least mitigate) these instances of senseless murders of innocent children.
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#117 Bertuzzi Babe

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 11:25 AM

People far too susceptible to media driven hysteria believe something drastic must be done right this second.


Damn all that media driven hysteria..........women, get thee back to the kitchen and forget about voting......remember you are nothing but chattel. Damn all that media driven hysteria.......all you black folk best get back to the cane fields and stay at the back of the bus where you belong......damn all that media driven hysteria......... who cares that millions of children are dying of AIDS and starving to death on the other side of the world.......... damn all that media driven hysteria........let's allow psychotic folk and those with imaginary axes to grind access to automatic weapons in order to slaughter a bunch of 1st graders and teachers in their classrooms and do nothing about it.........etc., etc.


:rolleyes:

Edited by Bertuzzi Babe, 11 January 2013 - 11:29 AM.

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#118 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 11:28 AM

Gun control agenda aside, overall crime rates in the US have been in decline for decades. America is actually getting safer. Only people drinking the kool-aid have lost sight of this.


Oh, it's getting "safer"? Great!

No need to worry about children being murdered in their shcools then. Everything's fine.

EDIT: To carry this further, using a decreasing US crime rate to discredit the gun control argument is like raising your grade from an F to a D- and telling your parents "Nothing to worry about Mom and Dad. I'm getting smarter!"...

Edited by RUPERTKBD, 11 January 2013 - 11:41 AM.

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#119 I Got A Boy

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 11:29 AM

time to ban some gunning there
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#120 Mr. Ambien

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 12:09 PM

The background is different for sure...."the rocket's red glare, the bombs bursting in air" and all that.

The thinking that being such a warlike nation and being so proud of it is what needs to change if the U.S.A. is ever going to be able to eliminate (or at least mitigate) these instances of senseless murders of innocent children.

"Warlike" = foreign policy.
"eliminate senseless murders" = fiction/fantasy land, there is no country that has eliminated senseless murders.

Oh, it's getting "safer"? Great!

No need to worry about children being murdered in their shcools then. Everything's fine.

EDIT: To carry this further, using a decreasing US crime rate to discredit the gun control argument is like raising your grade from an F to a D- and telling your parents "Nothing to worry about Mom and Dad. I'm getting smarter!"...

"No need to worry about children being murdered" = media driven hysteria and caricature of gun owners.

Why should any of these assertions be taken seriously again? You look far more like the "paranoid" you accuse gun owners of being.

Edited by zaibatsu, 11 January 2013 - 12:09 PM.

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