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[Discussion] Roberto Luongo Trade Thread 5.0


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#871 stawns

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 10:16 AM

Things have happened, Dynamics have changed, moving parts have moved. I think it is time to re-assess the (rumoured/speculated) market.

Chicago:
If it was ever a possibility (Which from our perspective I don't think it was) This one has been put far back on the backburner for now, Chicago is off to a great start and there is no reason to make changes, but once again I don't think they were ever a serious contender from our perspective, they wouldn't give up what it would take to happen and rightly so.

Edmonton:
Pretty much status-quo, again never highly considered as it would take something great for us to move him to a division rival, something they would never give up, Still isn't really a serious possibility.

Florida:
This is the one team that has remained in the same situation the entire time, still very much in the thick of things, not willing to give up what we want, but the goaltending hasn't picked up and hasn't filled there need for help in net like they had hoped, still not willing to give up Bjugstad. not sure where the situation with Weiss remains (if they are willing to move him now or not) but the Huberdeau/Mueller/Kovalev line has been very good for them in the absence of Weiss and Versteeg. If we were to make a deal with them is seems apparent we would have to take salary back, which MG doesn't seem willing to do right now. FLA is very much in the running IMO, but the stars aren't aligned yet.

NY Islanders:
Never really seemed like a big contender, as it never made sense for them to trade future assets when they aren't in "win now" mode, and I can't see them taking on 2 life long deals, don't see how they can afford it. Also they aren't playing that bad, beat Pittsburgh 4-1 tonight and Nabokov has been giving them solid goaltending for the time being. Seems the same as before, Isles aren't really a possibility right now.

Philadelphia:
Goaltending doesn't seem great, but it is the same old story. With Bryz there, they can't make a move for Luongo, so unless we want to take on Bryz, or unless he starts letting in 10 goals a game and they get really desperate (enough to take on both contracts) Philly isn't a serious contender till the summer, although if Bryz doesn't pick it up, they may very well be a major contender in the summer.

San Jose:
Any possibility as slim as it may have been of San Jose being a potential fit for a trade, that chance has completely evaporated for the time being, all the players we would want have been playing great for them and Niemi has been just fine, I never thought it was a serious possibility anyways, but it certainly isn't now.

Toronto:
Toronto is still right there, goaltending hasn't improved, but what are they going to give? Gardiner has never really been in the cards and Kadri and Bozak (as much as we want them, or don't want them) aren't in play right now it seems as both have been major pieces for Toronto and as there top 2 centers, it would probably create a bigger hole than it fills overall. Aslong as Riemer and Scrivens continue to play like Riemer and Scrivens, you have to think they are one of the top dogs in the hunt, but the issue is the return, so they aren't the top dog anymnore.

Tampa Bay:
Never really thought this was an immediate possibility either, as they paid that price for Lindback and were going to give him a long long look before looking elsewhere, but Lindback has played pretty well so far, and provided quality goaltending for a 1st time starter, I conclude that Tampa is not in the running.

Washington:
Ahh the Caps, you have to think they are the main contender now. There defense (& Offense) have struggled but there goaltending hasn't been of any help. if they hope for a cup they have to look elsewhere, Nuevirth and Holtby aren't going to get them a cup, if they can even bring the caps in the playoffs. Luongo could really help turn there season around and could provide the goaltending to push confidence through the entire line-up. They also have pieces that are nice from our perspective and realistically I think if Washington wanted Luongo, they could provide the return that could satisfy both sides.


If I had the rate them (only the realistic teams that have a shot at the deal right now)

1. Washington
2. Florida
3. Toronto

Aside from that, none of the other teams are in a position to make this deal happen.


Washington is also in the Southeast division, lots of Fla trips for Lu
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#872 Boudrias

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 10:28 AM

How about (if they accept):

Frattin + 1st + Finn/Biggs

Next year we will be up against the cap, and Frattin would be a great fit alongside Raymond & Schroeder. He has been described to me as a bull on skates, with a great wrist shot. That would be exactly what Schroeder would need (the wrist shot) then his grit would add much needed grit to the line, also as I said with the cap coming down, it would allow us to replace Higgins quite well if we can't sign him.

One of the few TO proposals that should interest MG. Old News was talking about Frattin quite awhile ago. Schroeder has shown enough that the pressure at center might be less depending on Kesler's ETA.

Panthers: Talk of financial problems don't go away. Does that force them into a weak non-hockey deal for Lui realizing his possible appeal in that market? From Van's perspective the need is a top 6 to help the 2nd line. Booth hasn't really proven anything yet. Kassian's play might make Burrows the answer to the LW on the 2nd.

Islanders: I was questioning this option until I watched their game against Pitt. It looks like the Isles are ready to step out. Their owner is hands on and who knows what he would OK. Lui might look good especially moving into a new arena. Very possible deal.

Philly: They have been winning but Brys is a nutbar. Money has never been an issue and if CAP space can be had I would think they would be interested.

Wash: All sorts of issues in Washington. The biggest is what Ovy is not doing, scoring. Their ownership is also pro=active and who knows who has his ear. Oates is very respected and I suspect he will have a clear idea of what he has by game 15 -20. Their CUP timeline is is pretty much now just like the Canucks. There should be a match there.
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#873 Bingo Chili

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 10:59 AM

Last option should be toronto with their 1st included in a package.

Gillis should just concentrate on fleecing FLA.
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#874 Brick Tamland

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:06 AM

Huberdeau or Gudbrandson have to be apart of any FLA deal.
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#875 D-Money

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:12 AM

Tim Thomas had two phenomenal years. The reSt of his career he sucked and isn't playing this year. It happens in the NHL.

Sometimes a goalie comes from no where and plays amazing for a year or two. Luongo has been amazing for ten years. That's what you call a franchise goaltender... not Tim Thomas Who has two God like seasons and disappears


Edit: I'm not knocking Thomas... just saying u can't compare his two years to Roberto Who has dominated the worlds most competitive hockey league for a decade


You obviously don't know what you're talking about.

Roberto Luongo has been playing in the NHL since 1999. He has a couple of Vezina nominations, a Jennings, and a 32-34 playoff record with a .916 save%, and a 2.53 GAA.

Tim Thomas only started playing in the NHL regularly in 2005. However, he already has two Vezina trophies, two Roger Crozier awards (best save%), a Jennings, a Stanley Cup, and a Conn Smythe. He has a 29-27 playoff record, with a .933 save% and a 2.07 GAA. He's the first goalie to win the Cup, Conn Smythe, and Vezina in the same year since Bernie Parent did it in 74-75.

Luongo is a great goaltender, but he's never "dominated the worlds most competitive hockey league" like Thomas has. Tim had a late start to his career, but in about half the time he accomplished so much more. His regular season stats are better than Luongo's, and his playoff stats put Roberto's to shame. Even last year his playoff stats were far better than anything Lu has done since 2006-07.

Edited by D-Money, 30 January 2013 - 11:15 AM.

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#876 Skead

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:23 AM

Huberdeau or Gudbrandson have to be apart of any FLA deal.


And then you wake up...

I'd be ecstatic if Bjugstad was involved into the deal.

Bjugstad / Roster / Pick

would be friggin awesome.
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#877 Italia2006

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:25 AM

Even if we did get Bjugstad, he couldn't or wouldn't play this year for the Canucks would he?
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#878 Skead

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:28 AM

Even if we did get Bjugstad, he couldn't or wouldn't play this year for the Canucks would he?


No, I think he is playing another year in the collegiate league; which is right up Gillis' alley. He likes when kids are focused on being educated.
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#879 Blacklabel

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:32 AM

Honestly. Luongo playing for wash makes them a deadly team.
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#880 Italia2006

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:33 AM

No, I think he is playing another year in the collegiate league; which is right up Gillis' alley. He likes when kids are focused on being educated.

After he's done playing collegiate hockey(which I believe ends before the nhl season does) can he play with the Canucks and not count against his entry level contract?
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#881 sampy

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:34 AM

No, I think he is playing another year in the collegiate league; which is right up Gillis' alley. He likes when kids are focused on being educated.


I'm not sure how the College thing works, can Bjustad pull a Schultz and become an FA. He's in his 3rd year of university.
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#882 Skead

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:35 AM

After he's done playing collegiate hockey(which I believe ends before the nhl season does) can he play with the Canucks and not count against his entry level contract?


Yes, Post Season games do not count towards ELC. However AV wouldn't play him, Cody Hodgson was much further along being NHL ready than Bjugstad and Cody barely got any ice time.
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#883 Ossi Vaananen

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:38 AM

After he's done playing collegiate hockey(which I believe ends before the nhl season does) can he play with the Canucks and not count against his entry level contract?


He's not currently on an ELC, signing one would mean he's turning pro and would not be eligible in the NCAA. What people fail to realize is the Schultz situation, wherein he was drafted by the Ducks, finished his degree, and then went on to wait for free agency - basically from April to late June of his senior year. It could be a very similar situation with Bjugstad, being that even if he was traded here he could wait out his senior year and sign wherever he wanted to.
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#884 Italia2006

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:43 AM

He's not currently on an ELC, signing one would mean he's turning pro and would not be eligible in the NCAA. What people fail to realize is the Schultz situation, wherein he was drafted by the Ducks, finished his degree, and then went on to wait for free agency - basically from April to late June of his senior year. It could be a very similar situation with Bjugstad, being that even if he was traded here he could wait out his senior year and sign wherever he wanted to.

That's kind of scary isn't it?
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#885 Skead

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:43 AM

He's not currently on an ELC, signing one would mean he's turning pro and would not be eligible in the NCAA. What people fail to realize is the Schultz situation, wherein he was drafted by the Ducks, finished his degree, and then went on to wait for free agency - basically from April to late June of his senior year. It could be a very similar situation with Bjugstad, being that even if he was traded here he could wait out his senior year and sign wherever he wanted to.


Nick was drafted in 2010; he would need to wait another 2 years to exercise the same option as Schultz did.
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#886 Ossi Vaananen

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:47 AM

Nick was drafted in 2010; he would need to wait another 2 years to exercise the same option as Schultz did.


I hope you mean 2 years including this one. Bjugstad is in his 3rd year now, after his 4th his RFA eligibility would be void.
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#887 sampy

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:49 AM

I hope you mean 2 years including this one. Bjugstad is in his 3rd year now, after his 4th his RFA eligibility would be void.


This is right.
If he doesn't sign by June 2014 he's an FA.
That's a big risk if hes the centrepiece.

Edited by sampy, 30 January 2013 - 11:51 AM.

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#888 Provost

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:53 AM

That's kind of scary isn't it?


Not terribly scary. Any draft pick could do that same thing or refuse to sign.

There doesn't seem to be any warning signs where this situation is more risky than any other prospect. There is not a lot of reason to refuse to sign with a team like Vancouver which is a great city and a competing team.
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#889 Ossi Vaananen

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:57 AM

Not terribly scary. Any draft pick could do that same thing or refuse to sign.

There doesn't seem to be any warning signs where this situation is more risky than any other prospect. There is not a lot of reason to refuse to sign with a team like Vancouver which is a great city and a competing team.


There is of course the Hodgson argument, that being does a centre like Bjugstad mind lining up behind Sedin and Kesler? To make this team it's either 3C or back in the minors. He could sign elsewhere, be given top minutes right away, and the ability to reach his rookie bonuses which we can't guarantee here.
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#890 Garrison

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 11:59 AM

I want Weiss+ a prospect (Bjugistad, or a 1st rounder and Drew Shore) for Luongo + Raymond. I think Florida is really our only trade option right now. Their goal tending has been awful and they are at the bottom of the standings. With the new draft lottery their is a chance they could not even get that good of a draft pick, so why not get Lu. Markstrom isn't the stud that many thought he was going to be. Florida needs goal scoring and that's all Raymond can contribute albeit he's rather streaky with it. Weiss would be a good addition now and I think he would re-sign for less here. The prospect would be nice to, I want to re load a bit so when the Sedins retire their is still something to watch in Vancouver.
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#891 Skead

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 12:00 PM

This is right.
If he doesn't sign by June 2014 he's an FA.
That's a big risk if hes the centrepiece.


Correct; 2 years including this one. But people forget if he plays a single game for Florida he is ineligible for this option.
I would assume FLA at one point would call him up to get a single game in to retain his RFA status. Or trade him, I can't see a team making the same mistake as Anaheim did.
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#892 Italia2006

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 12:00 PM

There is of course the Hodgson argument, that being does a centre like Bjugstad mind lining up behind Sedin and Kesler? To make this team it's either 3C or back in the minors. He could sign elsewhere, be given top minutes right away, and the ability to reach his rookie bonuses which we can't guarantee here.

You would have to think if this deal ever went through Schroeder would have to be a part of the deal.
We also have Gaunce in our system.
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#893 Nucks fan555555

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 12:02 PM

You would have to think if this deal ever went through Schroeder would have to be a part of the deal.
We also have Gaunce in our system.

I think Gaunce is still a while away. Schroeder is the real issue because I think he's deserved the oppurtunity to play with the big club, although I have heard somewhere that Bjugstad can also play wing. Any truth to that?
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#894 Provost

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 12:10 PM

There is of course the Hodgson argument, that being does a centre like Bjugstad mind lining up behind Sedin and Kesler? To make this team it's either 3C or back in the minors. He could sign elsewhere, be given top minutes right away, and the ability to reach his rookie bonuses which we can't guarantee here.


I don't think that is anywhere near the worry. Hodgson came into the system a couple of years too early.

Bjugstad would most likely spend a year in the minors, then start on the 3rd kine in the NHL and work his way up to the top line ver 2-3 seasons. That puts us 3-4 years out before he is ready for the top 6 just as natural development. That times about perfectly with when the Sedins/Kesler are getting to the point of getting old enough to start taking smaller roles or even retiring.

Also, Bjugstad seems more suited to move through the lineup anywhere.. rather than Hodgson who really needed to be a top 6.
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#895 Ossi Vaananen

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 12:20 PM

I don't think that is anywhere near the worry. Hodgson came into the system a couple of years too early.

Bjugstad would most likely spend a year in the minors, then start on the 3rd kine in the NHL and work his way up to the top line ver 2-3 seasons. That puts us 3-4 years out before he is ready for the top 6 just as natural development. That times about perfectly with when the Sedins/Kesler are getting to the point of getting old enough to start taking smaller roles or even retiring.

Also, Bjugstad seems more suited to move through the lineup anywhere.. rather than Hodgson who really needed to be a top 6.


This makes sense from the organization's perspective, and is a good development plan.

From the individual perspective, theoretically would Bjugstad rather sign here, for base ELC and bonuses based on performance, or sign in a place like say Calgary, which has a notorious lack of depth at centre. On our depth chart he could make the team, and be limited to a 3rd line role without the ice time to be able to reach his performance bonuses. That or be relegated to the minors, where he would receive the lower figure of a 2 way ELC (80k), without his bonuses. If he were to sign with a team shallow at centre like Calgary, he could be seeing top minutes and the chance of reaching performance bonuses without the risk of being moved to the AHL. In the latter scenario he could be making up to 3.8m (max rookie) in his first year, or be making 80k if he didn't make the team and was sent to the Wolves. The easy decision for Bjugstad would be to sign with a team in need of a centre.
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#896 Pears

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 12:21 PM

So who would we get from Washington?? Neuvirth & Hendricks??

LOL. That's about as bad a proposal I've ever seen.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

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#897 Nucks fan555555

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 12:26 PM

This makes sense from the organization's perspective, and is a good development plan.

From the individual perspective, theoretically would Bjugstad rather sign here, for base ELC and bonuses based on performance, or sign in a place like say Calgary, which has a notorious lack of depth at centre. On our depth chart he could make the team, and be limited to a 3rd line role without the ice time to be able to reach his performance bonuses. That or be relegated to the minors, where he would receive the lower figure of a 2 way ELC (80k), without his bonuses. If he were to sign with a team shallow at centre like Calgary, he could be seeing top minutes and the chance of reaching performance bonuses without the risk of being moved to the AHL. In the latter scenario he could be making up to 3.8m (max rookie) in his first year, or be making 80k if he didn't make the team and was sent to the Wolves. The easy decision for Bjugstad would be to sign with a team in need of a centre.

It's all up to him. Money or playing on a successful team and development
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#898 stexx

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 12:35 PM

there is so few players that go through college that opt for the scenario that justin schultz did i dont see it as a big concern. the canucks would be smart to talk to bjustad before agreeing to a deal to see what his intentions are. if he is planning to return for this 4th year or turn pro at the end of this year.
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#899 Ossi Vaananen

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 12:43 PM

there is so few players that go through college that opt for the scenario that justin schultz did i dont see it as a big concern. the canucks would be smart to talk to bjustad before agreeing to a deal to see what his intentions are. if he is planning to return for this 4th year or turn pro at the end of this year.


I think Schultz certainly sets a precedent though, a contract loophole that players coming out of college may have otherwise been ignorant to. There is also Wheeler, who neglected to sign with Pheonix who drafted him 5th overall in 04, signed with Boston and has yet to play a single game in the minors.

In my mind the decision is simple for young players, go to university, get a degree by staying the 4 years, then go to free agency and sign with whichever team you like, not being confined to serfdom by the team that said your name 4 years earlier.

I'm thinking this could be a worse contract loophole than the NHL/KHL agreement. I could see NCAA prospects being taken later in their respective drafts, meaning longer development plans.
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#900 Steven Stamkos

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 12:56 PM

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