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[Discussion] Roberto Luongo Trade Thread 5.0


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#2521 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:28 PM

we just need a player that helps us now (Brouwer, Laich, Carlson, Alzner, NOT Mojo, orlov, green) and a 2013 first and they can toss in which every crappy-ass goaltender they want bc both are junk


Help right now would be nice, but I think saying that we "need" help is debatable. The team is playing well, leading their division, tied for third in the conference and all withiout 2/3 of it's 2nd line, to say nothing of the early struggles of it's top two offensive players...

In fact, I'd argue that the Canucks need help down the road, as they are a veteran laden group and not particularly well-stocked with highly ranked prospects.
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Orland Kurtenbach and Dennis Kearns had just been torched 8-1 by the Habs, but they still took time to come out to meet us, some fellow BC boys who were playing hockey in Montreal. THAT"S what being a Canuck is!

#2522 Italia2006

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:38 PM

I wonder if Buffalo may get into the picture for Lu?
They have the money and have Ryan Miller signed for this year and next year.
They're in an obvious tail spin and have some assets.

Tyler Myers a guy with size and a right handed shot that we so desperately need, Steve Ott and a 1st

for

Luongo, Raymond and Ballard.

Myers is going to be healthy scratch and is obviously not playing well for them right now. He would give us size and has a lot of potential. The only problem I have is that we have way too much money in our d guys but our D if Myers plays to his potential would be amazing.

The other option would be,

Myers, Ott, Foligno and a 1st or 2nd

For

Luongo, Raymond and Edler.

That seems fair for both teams in my opinion. The other good thing is that we have a pretty good trading history with the Sabres and I would like to think the 2 gms feel pretty good about their past deal.

Edited by Italia2006, 11 February 2013 - 04:40 PM.

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#2523 Pears

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:41 PM

I wonder if Buffalo may get into the picture for Lu?
They have the money and have Ryan Miller signed for this year and next year.
They're in an obvious tail spin and have some assets.

Tyler Myers a guy with size and a right handed shot that we so desperately need, Steve Ott and a 1st

for

Luongo, Raymond and Ballard.

Myers is going to be healthy scratch and is obviously not playing well for them right now. He would give us size and has a lot of potential. The only problem I have is that we have way too much money in our d guys but our D if Myers plays to his potential would be amazing.

The other option would be,

Myers, Ott, Foligno and a 1st or 2nd

For

Luongo, Raymond and Edler.

That seems fair for both teams in my opinion. The other good thing is that we have a pretty good trading history with the Sabres and I would like to think the 2 gms feel pretty good about their past deal.

Myers, Ott and a 1st for Luongo, Ballard and Raymond??? Done.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

   ryan kesler is going to the chicago blackhawks ...       quote me on it


#2524 Italia2006

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:44 PM

Myers, Ott and a 1st for Luongo, Ballard and Raymond??? Done.


If there was a sticky poing I would think it would be Luongo waiving his no trade clause to go there.
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#2525 Canuck Surfer

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:47 PM

He still made it painfully clear right after the play off's it was time to move on...

Think back 2 years to when Schneids got that game in Chicago. Lou did not even sit on the bench.

lol pouting? Luongo has handled this whole thing amazingly well


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#2526 Canucks fan in chicago

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:53 PM

Luongo and a second for Neuvirth, Brouwer, and a first.

Buy out Ballard and Booth in the offseason.

Problem solved.
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#2527 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:58 PM

Agreed!

Or Mike Green instead of Orlov if we're willing to shed $'s elsewhere (Ballard, Booth) next year. I don't think we'll get Alzner or Carlson; but I see the attraction!

Old News (I think?) suggested we should hold out for one of them...


Whats your comparison on MoJo versus Kadri?


We could hold out for 5 years and niether would happen.

I think Orlov is the better choice for both sides, Green doesn't help the cap situation and WSH probably doesn't want to deal him as he has been very good for them this season.

I think Kadri has more pure offensively, but Mojo is better defensively, and more gritty IMO. I would say they are pretty similar in terms of situation though. (Other than the fact that Mojo is struggling and Kadri is booming) Mojo is the better fit for us right now IMO (assuming he will return to last seasons form which I think he will here with less pressure on his)

He can also play Wing better than Kadri can I think.
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#2528 Vansicle

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:06 PM

I'm not completely sold on Ott at all, I'm just saying that a physical presence who can put up the same amount of points as Raymond plus has proven playoff numbers would be a CLEAR UPGRADE and when a team is really gunning for the cup, if there's an upgrade available they should take it..

I think of Brouwer vs. Raymond in the playoffs... Brouwer has had a least 1 super successful run with the Hawks and although his offensive stats weren't great with the Caps, he was still 5th amongst forwards in points for them.. whereas Raymond was 8th amongst Canucks forwards during the cup run.. but the important part is stats-aside, when Raymond hasn't produced in the PLAYOFFS he has not been all that useful, he's been very perimeter and basically always the lowest scorer on his line (incl. the Wellwood/Bernier 3rd line), whereas Brouwer can play a bottom-6 role and when he's not producing throw hits, wear down the opposition, which is something that always happens AGAINST the Canucks in the end. When Raymond isn't producing in the reg. season it is less noticeable, but the playoffs it is very obvious and an obvious hole at that.

I know CDC as a consensus seems to forget the past when a player is putting up decent stats.. (Raymond 4 points last 3 games), but to think that there is no risk with him going into the playoffs is just foolish.. The Canucks should try to be as risk-free as possible even if that means giving up a small piece of the future, because teams only have this much depth every once & a while..

Brouwer > Raymond for the Canucks in the upcoming playoffs. That is my main point.

Well, I'm not one of those that forgets about past shortcomings if a player is hot now, but to grade Raymond's playoff performance in vacuum without the context of the rest of the team's intermittent invisibility is ignoring the whole picture.
The twins are guilty at times of going cold in the playoffs from time to time. That doesn't mean that one of these times they aren't going to absolutely hit their stride at just the right times and dominate. I think Raymond is young and has had consistency issues, to be sure. What makes me continue to believe he will produce is that every time people count him out, he puts up points. And when he's not putting up points, he is making smart plays away from the puck, playing responsible defense, and overall contributing in ways that aren't otherwise tangible.
And he doesn't take stupid penalties like Ott does.
I don't know enough about Brouwer to comment on whether he is a better option than Raymond, but given the connection Raymond has made with JS, it seems a good idea to me to at least keep Raymond around fro another couple of years, and if the contract is short and for the right money, they can evaluate whether or not to make a long term commitment.
In my mind, any Lou trade doesn't have Raymond packaged as value added.
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Snake Doctor, on 23 May 2014 - 10:41 AM, said:snapback.png

Miller is not on our list. It's Lack as our #1. There is no reason we would have traded both Schnieder and Luongo if we never intended to give Lack the #1 starting job.  Furthermore, the salary and term Miller is looking for is not in our favor.

 


#2529 Canuck Surfer

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:12 PM

Look, I'm not trying to inflame things by posting; but the request is there. I don't think these interviews reflect the mind set of a guy you are hoping to lead you to a championship. And I believe, because we made Lou the single highest paid player in the world for 2010/2011 at $10 mill, that we should expect him not to get caught up in not having his tires pumped.

Does anyone think that was not a mental distraction for Lou? He came out and crapped it the next game, and while not the reason for our game 7 loss, was not a solution either. You want the worlds highest paid player leading your team; not get caught up in distractions.



Check the save % in a big game; the real logic...



Anyone want to check Lou's save % after these interviews?



"We're going to talk to Mike in the next few days and draw up a plan." As politically correct as this is said, or how even better it has been said recently; the reality is Lou, who we gave a $60 mill contract, clearly wanted out."

Does not get a start and wants out...

Read between the lines and tell me how its a positive? You can give him all the credit in the world for trying to recover a positive from it since, but its still a bad message...




I was just going to chime in with somethibng similar.

Please CS, feel free to show us an example of Luongo "pouting". If you watched After Hours on Saturday, you saw a goalie doing and saying all the right things, even joking with his coach as AV passed by the set...


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#2530 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:14 PM

we just need a player that helps us now (Brouwer, Laich, Carlson, Alzner, NOT Mojo, orlov, green) and a 2013 first and they can toss in which every crappy-ass goaltender they want bc both are junk

we can throw in Higgins or Raymond and if they give us a D man (Carlson or Alzner) Id toss in Cannauton bc we are so deep on the L side and have corrado coming up

Dream trade

Brouwer
Laich
Neuvirth
1st

for

Luongo
Booth
Cannauton



minimum

Brouwer, 1st for Luongo

happy medium

Brouwer, Neuvirth, 1st for Luongo, Higgins


Non of those deals are really intriguing, that last one is especially bad. I like having Higgins, no need to throw him in that deal. Might even rather him than Brouwer.

I really don't understand how anyone who knows what the Canuck's needs are....would want Johansson.

NHL.com has him listed at 6'1 205, but other sites have him at 5'11 and under 200. I am sure his size is inflated ALONG with his points since he played a lot of minutes with Ovi and Semin last year.

He is soft, relatively small and not good enough for OUR top 6. MEANING he would be a 3rd line guy, in spot where we need GRIT.

The only current roster forward I would want from the Caps is Brouwer. A cup winner, 6'3 213, hits, fights when needed and puts up decent points. He is a guy that can play on the 2nd OR 3rd line no problem.

We already have Schroeder who is the same age and plays the same position.

Makes NO sense. The Caps might want him gone, doesn't mean we are going to pick him up.


Actually there is a problem.

LW - RW
Daniel - Burrows
Booth - Kassian
Raymond - Hansen
Higgins - Weise
Manny - Volpatti

Not sure where Brouwer fits, he has to play top 9 and we already have a plethera of top 9 wingers. Wingers are the last thing we need at this point.

As for Marcus Johansson.

THN, Washington's site and Hockeydb, probably the 3 most up to date sites, all having him at 6'1, 205. Even found another site that has his there.

He was 5'11 180 when drafted, but he has gotten bigger.

He can play center or wing, brings two way ability, good offensive skill (A really nice wrist shot) and bring more grit than you think. He would suit our 3rd line center spot very nice with the Wingers we have for him to play with, and he has nice upside.
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#2531 canuckfan85

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:15 PM

Luongo and a second for Neuvirth, Brouwer, and a first.

Buy out Ballard and Booth in the offseason.

Problem solved.


fine, let's do it! Do it MG. For me this is the minimum I would accept and if it is on the table- I say go for it and we can put this whole 3 ring-dog and pony show circus behind us and move the F on.
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#2532 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:18 PM

In fact, I'd argue that the Canucks need help down the road, as they are a veteran laden group and not particularly well-stocked with highly ranked prospects.


Exactly.

Our biggest organizational need is future assets. Our Cupboard is by far the weakest area of our organization.

We have Wingers, we have defensemen, we don't need either of those. If we can get an upgrade at center over JS and Lappy, then by all means go for it, if not. Just get futures, then perhaps we can look at trading an excess winger for the center we are looking for if we see that as a need.
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#2533 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:19 PM

Luongo and a second for Neuvirth, Brouwer, and a first.

Buy out Ballard and Booth in the offseason.

Problem solved.


The value in this deal is pretty bad.

Nuevirth brings nothing.

Luongo + 2nd >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Brouwer + 1st

Also Booth > Brouwer. No reason to buyout DB.
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#2534 Gooseberries

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:26 PM

The value in this deal is pretty bad.

Nuevirth brings nothing.

Luongo + 2nd >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Brouwer + 1st

Also Booth > Brouwer. No reason to buyout DB.

I find a lot of times booth is hated on even more than mayray. Really upsetting. I hope he tears it up when he comes back.
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#2535 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:32 PM

I find a lot of times booth is hated on even more than mayray. Really upsetting. I hope he tears it up when he comes back.


I agree.

And to think, when he really started to get adjusted and really started to get rolling he had 12 points in 15 games. (Prior to the injury)

Can't wait till he comes back, he's still a good top 6 forward. And brings an element to this team that we don't have.
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#2536 Everybody Hates Raymond

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:33 PM

Damien Cox: "You couldn't even do Kadri-for-Luongo straight up now. Kadri for Cory Schneider, maybe."

That is pathetic. Leafs "insiders" are nothing short of jokes. Hate on Kadri since the day he was drafted, suddenly he's worth more than two elite goaltenders - all because of a hot streak. Joke of a fanbase. Wanted to trade Kessel because he didn't score for a few games, too.
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#2537 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:35 PM

Damien Cox: "You couldn't even do Kadri-for-Luongo straight up now. Kadri for Cory Schneider, maybe."

That is pathetic. Leafs "insiders" are nothing short of jokes. Hate on Kadri since the day he was drafted, suddenly he's worth more than two elite goaltenders - all because of a hot streak. Joke of a fanbase. Wanted to trade Kessel because he didn't score for a few games, too.


Lol that's just classic, is this a tweet?

I understand Kadri is playing well, but anyone who would decline Kadri for Schneider should be instantly fired. And Kadri for Luongo 1 for 1 is not something I would be thrilled with.

Cox is just terrible.
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#2538 MC Fatigue

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:39 PM

Damien Cox: "You couldn't even do Kadri-for-Luongo straight up now. Kadri for Cory Schneider, maybe."

That is pathetic. Leafs "insiders" are nothing short of jokes. Hate on Kadri since the day he was drafted, suddenly he's worth more than two elite goaltenders - all because of a hot streak. Joke of a fanbase. Wanted to trade Kessel because he didn't score for a few games, too.

Leaf fans..... :picard:
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#2539 Gooseberries

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:46 PM

I don't know why anyone is surprised here. According to leafs nation kessle could win art/hart/richard reimer is vezna worthy kadri and gardiner should have won calder and phaneuf is due for the norris... yet with this "stacked" team they cant even play in may
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#2540 Everybody Hates Raymond

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:46 PM

Lol that's just classic, is this a tweet?

I understand Kadri is playing well, but anyone who would decline Kadri for Schneider should be instantly fired. And Kadri for Luongo 1 for 1 is not something I would be thrilled with.

Cox is just terrible.


A quote from an interview
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#2541 Rypien37

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:47 PM

Non of those deals are really intriguing, that last one is especially bad. I like having Higgins, no need to throw him in that deal. Might even rather him than Brouwer.



Actually there is a problem.

LW - RW
Daniel - Burrows
Booth - Kassian
Raymond - Hansen
Higgins - Weise
Manny - Volpatti

Not sure where Brouwer fits, he has to play top 9 and we already have a plethera of top 9 wingers. Wingers are the last thing we need at this point.

As for Marcus Johansson.

THN, Washington's site and Hockeydb, probably the 3 most up to date sites, all having him at 6'1, 205. Even found another site that has his there.

He was 5'11 180 when drafted, but he has gotten bigger.

He can play center or wing, brings two way ability, good offensive skill (A really nice wrist shot) and bring more grit than you think. He would suit our 3rd line center spot very nice with the Wingers we have for him to play with, and he has nice upside.


If we made a trade with the Caps, a forward would most likely be heading to them as well.

As for Johansson bring grit, would love for you to show me some proof? Have you ever watched him play? A slower and bit bigger version of Raymond.
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#2542 Mackcanuck

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:54 PM

Does anybody think that just maybe, Luongo does not want to go to Toronto.
IMHO Lou wants to go to Florida and if not Florida to a strong Stanley Cup Contender.
The Leafs certainly do not fit into either of those criteria.
Lou has the last say, and Lou knows better than to outrightly say I will not go to Toronto because they suck. The Toronto Press would destroy him.
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#2543 Italia2006

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:15 PM

Reimer hurt and being helped off the ice.
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#2544 Millerdraft

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:17 PM

Reimer hurt and being helped off the ice.

Are you kidding me?
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Kassian.... Taylor Pyatt 3.0

Lies. He's more of a Steve Bernier. Hopefully his talent level goes up so he can become like a Taylor Pyatt.


#2545 The Bookie

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:19 PM

Yeah Reimer was playing lights-out but it looked like a pretty nasty groin or leg injury, could barely get up. Bryz just got pulled.
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#2546 Millerdraft

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:22 PM

There goes the Leafs' season...
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Kassian.... Taylor Pyatt 3.0

Lies. He's more of a Steve Bernier. Hopefully his talent level goes up so he can become like a Taylor Pyatt.


#2547 elvis15

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:28 PM

Yeah Reimer was playing lights-out but it looked like a pretty nasty groin or leg injury, could barely get up. Bryz just got pulled.

And this thread explodes for 4 pages in the next hour with 7 new proposals for the Leafs or the Flyers.
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Tanev is going to EDM. I can put my life savings down on it

 


#2548 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:35 PM

If we made a trade with the Caps, a forward would most likely be heading to them as well.

As for Johansson bring grit, would love for you to show me some proof? Have you ever watched him play? A slower and bit bigger version of Raymond.


Yeah I do watch the Caps.

Johansson isn't an overly gritty player, not at the level of Brouwer. But he isn't afraid to go to the tough areas, and when on his game he goes to the corners and wins the battles. Not a soft player, but not a banger and smasher, brings enough grit. He is a very smart two way player. He's not as soft as Raymond.


Here's all I can really offer for proof:

One-Timer: Johansson is a smooth skater and possesses very good hockey sense as well. While nothing really stands out about Marcus’ game when you watch him, it is because he is very good at a lot of things with few or no weaknesses. As long as concussions (see below) do not interfere with his hockey future, Johansson should develop into a very reliable two-way center. He stated in an interview at NHL.com: I like to play with the puck. I like to bring the puck from my own end to the offensive end. I think I’m a little more a passer than a shooter. I want to set up my teammates so they can score goals. Of course I want to score goals myself, but I think I am more of a passer than a shooter.” Although not a typical physical player, Marcus is not afraid of the rough stuff. He also possesses good leadership skills and is a great team player.




Talent Analysis

Johansson has impressive hockey sense, good technical skills and soft hands. He reads the play very well and is a skilled playmaker. He is a speedy skater that does not shy away from the rough stuff, although he is not really a big time physical player. Johansson is a team player with leadership qualities. He has a strong, accurate shot which he could use more often. He has had concussions in the past so that is a concern.


Nice job here to win the battle and score.



Wins the battle down low, then uses his speed to beat the defender wide.



Nice job to read the play, jet up the ice to back off the defenders then finish and score a huge goal.



Showing off his great wrister



Style wise he is like Henrik Zetterberg, (obvious not to his caliber) he is very smart both offensively and defensively.

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 11 February 2013 - 06:40 PM.

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#2549 DaMacNamedDre

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:38 PM

Reimer looked bad.
Here go the trade rumours.
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___________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Posted ImageBodee, on 18 April 2012 - 11:07 AM, said:

I haven't been a supporter of the Canucks for long. Mainly because firstly I know nothing about NHL and secondly ESPN America only started showing NHL 3 years ago.

http://forum.canucks.com/topic/328055-whats-wrong-with-me
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#2550 Italia2006

Italia2006

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:44 PM

And this thread explodes for 4 pages in the next hour with 7 new proposals for the Leafs or the Flyers.


LMAO
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