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Do you think there's a coaching problem?


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134 replies to this topic

Poll: Where do we draw the line? (116 member(s) have cast votes)

Where is YOUR breaking point with AV? When do we fire him?

  1. Never (for the forseable future) (15 votes [12.93%])

    Percentage of vote: 12.93%

  2. Early Playoff Exit (13 votes [11.21%])

    Percentage of vote: 11.21%

  3. Play-off manhandling (we've all seen it) (6 votes [5.17%])

    Percentage of vote: 5.17%

  4. No Cup, No AV (4 votes [3.45%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.45%

  5. Miss the Playoffs (29 votes [25.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 25.00%

  6. Below .500 Half way through the season (6 votes [5.17%])

    Percentage of vote: 5.17%

  7. Below .500 15-ish games through the season (8 votes [6.90%])

    Percentage of vote: 6.90%

  8. Now (8 votes [6.90%])

    Percentage of vote: 6.90%

  9. A long time ago (27 votes [23.28%])

    Percentage of vote: 23.28%

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#121 DIBdaQUIB

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:23 PM

It's not rubbish.

Why do you think teams have a pre-season? It's not just the number of games it is the timing and the condition both physically and mentally the players are in. That is why so many players went abroad................while we did a bit of recreational skating with the local University.

Well Newsflash........it's not a University team we are playing 4 games in 6 days with traveling in between.

And then we get back to my point on lack of physical presence in our team just now which is bound to be taking it's toll.


Fatigue doesn't explain the poor starts where they have been dominated consistently. Even the Anaheim game was a brutal first 10 minutes and only Cory kept them in it.

Fatigue later in games is an issue when playing 3 in 4 but it doesn't explain the system break-downs and lack of execution during the first 2/3 of games. It just becomes more evident what the issues are when the team is tired late in the game.
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#122 Erik Karlsson

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:28 PM

Every year the majority of CDC says it's the coach's fault. One game away from a stanley cup. Was it AV's fault then? Short memories here in this world.


Sorry bud, but with the team we had that year any coach could have taken us that far. I don't recall any of AV's strategies winning us any series? I remember us almost blowing our lead to the Hawks, something AV is best know for, sitting back, not being prepared and blowing leads.

I remember Kesler being the only reason we made it past Nashville.

SJ we got by them with the luckiest goal I've ever seen, and then we blow a lead to the Bruins once again and lose the cup.

Sorry what good did AV do during that run again????

I'm not saying it's his fault we lost, but he really didn't do much, I think it was our "veteran group" that got us that far ;)
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#123 fwybwed

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:30 PM

They've played 3 gamesi n 4 nights after being off for Months, yes that means tired


Really so has Chicago...they are on a streak...Hmmmm Have they lost yet...!?!? Hmmm
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#124 Scottish⑦Canuck

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:40 PM

It's not rubbish.

Why do you think teams have a pre-season? It's not just the number of games it is the timing and the condition both physically and mentally the players are in. That is why so many players went abroad................while we did a bit of recreational skating with the local University.

Well Newsflash........it's not a University team we are playing 4 games in 6 days with traveling in between.

And then we get back to my point on lack of physical presence in our team just now which is bound to be taking it's toll.


Well in that case tired wouldn't be the correct word to use, would it? The players are out of condition. But so are a lot of teams and it's not a valid excuse.
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#125 Aladeen

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:41 PM

I think there is a major armchair coaching problem!
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#126 DIBdaQUIB

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 01:43 PM

Really so has Chicago...they are on a streak...Hmmmm Have they lost yet...!?!? Hmmm


There's always an excuse as to why this team failed....fatigue, injuries, travel, other team is really good etc.

Even when this team is dominated or gives up a 2 goal lead they say how they are playing well, need to stick to thei system yada, yada yada yada...I just wish they would acknowledge that they too often SUCK!!

WIthout the most consistent goaltending in the league for the past 3 years, this team woulod not have sniffed the PT and would never have made a deep run in the playoffs.

Considering the talent in the lineup, this is deeply concerning and to me, smells of issues with management/coaching.

Edited by DIBdaQUIB, 29 January 2013 - 01:46 PM.

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#127 Vansicle

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 03:05 PM

Ha Ha AV is not getting fired there is alot more going on internally than just the Game. Gillis and AV are playing chess. You are playing checkers or nhl 13.

AV backed the team off in the 3rd period because he recognised the King's were destroying us Physically in most of the first and all of the second period. He didn't want the team to blow their wad early like they did against Boston last season. Who cares if we win this game if were so banged up from it, it takes weeks to recover Canucks already have enough injury problems. AV needs to protect his players and just try to make .500 for the next few weeks. It will all make sense when Kes and Booth come back to a team that is jelling and healthy.

Never, ever take your boot off of the throat of your opponent. Grind their trachea into a pulp with your heal.
Oh, and what do you know about AV not wanting to blow wads? That doesn't sound like hockey talk to me.
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Snake Doctor, on 23 May 2014 - 10:41 AM, said:snapback.png

Miller is not on our list. It's Lack as our #1. There is no reason we would have traded both Schnieder and Luongo if we never intended to give Lack the #1 starting job.  Furthermore, the salary and term Miller is looking for is not in our favor.

 


#128 Vansicle

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 03:11 PM

There's always an excuse as to why this team failed....fatigue, injuries, travel, other team is really good etc.

Even when this team is dominated or gives up a 2 goal lead they say how they are playing well, need to stick to thei system yada, yada yada yada...I just wish they would acknowledge that they too often SUCK!!

WIthout the most consistent goaltending in the league for the past 3 years, this team woulod not have sniffed the PT and would never have made a deep run in the playoffs.

Considering the talent in the lineup, this is deeply concerning and to me, smells of issues with management/coaching.

I find it interesting that LA was able to adjust to having the Canucks swarm all over them for the 2-0 lead. They made the strategic adjustment, and boom. They not only get a point when they shouldn't have, they get two. Someone explain to me how that's not coaching.
They've made the corrections everywhere else. Picked up players, called up players, switched starting goaltendenders, traded away prospects, etc. There's only one place left to look.
Of course, the last three seasons they started off crape and won the President's Trophy twice. Is that because of or in spite of? Hard to say for sure; one sure way to find out.
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Snake Doctor, on 23 May 2014 - 10:41 AM, said:snapback.png

Miller is not on our list. It's Lack as our #1. There is no reason we would have traded both Schnieder and Luongo if we never intended to give Lack the #1 starting job.  Furthermore, the salary and term Miller is looking for is not in our favor.

 


#129 DIBdaQUIB

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 03:26 PM

I find it interesting that LA was able to adjust to having the Canucks swarm all over them for the 2-0 lead. They made the strategic adjustment, and boom. They not only get a point when they shouldn't have, they get two. Someone explain to me how that's not coaching.
They've made the corrections everywhere else. Picked up players, called up players, switched starting goaltendenders, traded away prospects, etc. There's only one place left to look.
Of course, the last three seasons they started off crape and won the President's Trophy twice. Is that because of or in spite of? Hard to say for sure; one sure way to find out.


Based on reputation, I would bet aDrryl tore a strip off his team between periods and lit a fire under them.

In the other dressing room, the players talked amongst themselves about how they just have to keep doing what they do and things will be good. Of course, AV was not in the room 'cause he leaves it up to the players to motivate themselves.

Bringing in fresh bodies with different skill-sets hasn't worked and AV has had the best goaltending to backstop his system for years.

The whole atmosphere has to change as this group are under-performing and have been for 2 seasons. 7 shots in 2 periods!! Confirms that despite the talk, AV is, and always has been, a defence first coach and that is his comfort level and where he runs whenever things get tight. How's that worked?!

Edited by DIBdaQUIB, 29 January 2013 - 03:33 PM.

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#130 Erik Karlsson

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 03:35 PM

^^
Exactly, other coaches know how to strategize and motivate when their team is losing, AV just chews gum.
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#131 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 04:37 PM

Yeah, well this should not be coming up after the boys played a great game, and lost a heart breaker. We should be cheering for everyone tonight.

In reality they made a lot of adjustments and came out strong in comparison to not playing great in San Jose. That game started and finished in the first minute at the face off circle. Lack of having the right personnel was an issue, as we won only 32% of face off's in that game and constantly fought up hill in size match up problems without the puck. Plus, in that game, you had clunkers where Edler coughs up the puck for the 2knd goal. But even then we saw the coach rewarding Ballard and Tanev with TOI which should send Edler a message the turnover is not ok.

I'm happy the hoards are not after Lou, because he let in a goal with 40 seonds left. It was not a softie, it was a double screen seeing eye goal..

Losing in a shootout against the Stanley Cup champs when the team put up a great effort is the wrong time to be calling for the coaches head. Calling for the coaches head when they almost steal a win after having their personnel shortcomings pointed out so strongly by San Jose is when we should be asking if the GM is going to go get the team some help; predominantly at centre ice, but perhaps also in size match ups and at right D!


We played better against San Jose than we did against LA, against San Jose we had a terrible start (another example of AV not getting us prepared) but we begain to pick it up and we were playing great in the 2nd and latter stages of the 1st up until Max took that penalty, they scored and our ship was sunk.

Tonight we came out unprepared off the start (LA carried the play) and Lu held us in, we scored that goal against the flow of play and it deflated LA a bit, then we got some momentum going and scored again, although halfway through the 2nd the sales started to turn in LA's favor they came out hot and we were able to escape with a 1 goal lead head into the 3rd, this is where you would think AV and the coaching staff would get everyone focused and buckled down to come out and seal it off. What happens? the exact opposite, LA carries the play in the third, they tie it late, we blow yet another 2 goal lead and then in OT the genius doesn't play his best 2 forwards that night (Schroeder and Kassian) instead giving most of the time to the Sedins who had done nothing 5 on 5 that game, then using Edler in the shootout, get real AV.

Just another example of us coming out flat, blowing another lead and AV making bone headed decisions when the game is on the line.
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#132 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 05:00 PM

Thank goodness you were here to point out some things.

I had NO IDEA the Canucks were being unfairly targeted by the schedule makers.
Good call on us being tired because of the gurelling schedule we've had up till this point. I mean we're nearly thru January & only had 3 home games. Damn this unfair schedule, and making us soooo tired.
A- we are 6 games in
B- there are 6 other teams in our conference who have played as many games as we have... a couple even in less games (we played opening night afterall)
C- they arent 55 yrs old I think. 3 games in 4 nights in the 2nd wk of the season shouldnt be TOO demanding, will they be tired by game 3? sure, but they were terrible the game before that too.

Theres probably 20 teams in the NHL that would be pleased to have Weise, Raymond, Schroeder, Ebbett, Lapierre or Malhotra in their bottom 6.

I'll agree we have a lot of fans who are babies... but it doesnt mean they are not right sometimes either. Also, accusing people of being babies, but crying foul that the players are tired... care to be the pot or the kettle?

So 2 players out of the line up, means every player on the roster needs to play 90% (assuming theyw ere all giving 110% already as I so often hear athletes do) harder now? So you are suggesting Kesler and Booth were both resonsible for a 920% each upgrade to our line ups? (90X16 +400 / 2). Hmmm, well, their production might disagree with that. But sure, we are weaker without them,..... not sure we are 1840% weaker however.

As for the question of the coaching. YES, I balem AV for our failings more than any of the players on most given nights. We've watched him get outmatched by the likes of Quenneville, Julien & Sutter over the years. Those were all teams with equal or less talent than us who beat us because our coach mismanaged the roster.
I think AV is a CAPABLE NHL coach, but not a championship coach.... which is what a team with this skill level should have & we dont.


Early candidate for post of the year.

:bigblush:
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#133 Orca

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 01:52 AM

I'm so sick of AV shuffling the lines all the time. They can't even get the chance to develop enough chemistry. The only reason Kassian is scoring is because he's getting some lucky tap-ins and powerplay time. Sometimes he has no idea how to co-ordinate with the Sedins and messes up the cycle. Burrows is simply the best with the Sedins, and although he's doing pretty well on his own now, it's because he's usually the one exception that fits on any line.

As for the rest of the Canucks other than the Sedins, they've always looked completely lost and uncoordinated on the offense. The breakout usually consists of the wing carrying the puck all the way by himself until he runs out of room and is forced to dump while nobody's ready to chase, or takes a bad angle shot from the wing. They never pass sideways at the right time, or move laterally the way the Sedins and other good players do. Usually only the fourth line manages to get a decent cycle going because they know their roles well enough to keep it simple on the cycle. Everyone else seems like they have no idea how to play together and are never a threat on offense unless they get a lucky bounce or odd man rush.

Also, it seems like the coaches have gotten everyone into the idea that the only offense we can run is to get it back to the point and try to shoot with traffic. Most of the time the shot hits something and never reaches the net, or the shot just misses completely. I'm so sick of that. It's as if nobody except the Sedins have ever even thought about trying to pass it cross crease down low. Even if the pass doesn't get through, it's still likely to hit something around the crease causing chaos and the defense to panic and collapse, which usually leads to open men on the offence.

Edited by Orca, 30 January 2013 - 02:13 AM.

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Aww Crap.

#134 Bodee

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 04:30 AM

Fatigue doesn't explain the poor starts where they have been dominated consistently. Even the Anaheim game was a brutal first 10 minutes and only Cory kept them in it.

Fatigue later in games is an issue when playing 3 in 4 but it doesn't explain the system break-downs and lack of execution during the first 2/3 of games. It just becomes more evident what the issues are when the team is tired late in the game.


I explained the poor starts when I referred to the pre season lack of games. The guys are taking a period almost to slide into their systems. ...........they call it being "ring rusty"

Edited by Bodee, 30 January 2013 - 04:30 AM.

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#135 Bodee

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 04:32 AM

I'm so sick of AV shuffling the lines all the time. They can't even get the chance to develop enough chemistry. The only reason Kassian is scoring is because he's getting some lucky tap-ins and powerplay time. Sometimes he has no idea how to co-ordinate with the Sedins and messes up the cycle. Burrows is simply the best with the Sedins, and although he's doing pretty well on his own now, it's because he's usually the one exception that fits on any line.

As for the rest of the Canucks other than the Sedins, they've always looked completely lost and uncoordinated on the offense. The breakout usually consists of the wing carrying the puck all the way by himself until he runs out of room and is forced to dump while nobody's ready to chase, or takes a bad angle shot from the wing. They never pass sideways at the right time, or move laterally the way the Sedins and other good players do. Usually only the fourth line manages to get a decent cycle going because they know their roles well enough to keep it simple on the cycle. Everyone else seems like they have no idea how to play together and are never a threat on offense unless they get a lucky bounce or odd man rush.

Also, it seems like the coaches have gotten everyone into the idea that the only offense we can run is to get it back to the point and try to shoot with traffic. Most of the time the shot hits something and never reaches the net, or the shot just misses completely. I'm so sick of that. It's as if nobody except the Sedins have ever even thought about trying to pass it cross crease down low. Even if the pass doesn't get through, it's still likely to hit something around the crease causing chaos and the defense to panic and collapse, which usually leads to open men on the offence.


Totally agree. It's not as if there are injury reasons. He appears to be panicking a bit imo. We should be honing our game not disrupting it.
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