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[Proposal] Vancouver and Washington


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#1 Teemu Selšnne

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 11:38 PM

With Gillis & Gilman at the WSH game today, it made me think of possibilities between these two teams..

Some things to consider:

1. Washington's PK is 25th in the league.

2. Washington needs a shake-up badly. They're 2-6-1 and last in their conference in a 48 game season.

3. Vancouver's biggest criticism each playoffs is that they get pushed around too easily. Kassian has improved on that, but I don't think it's perfect.

4. Washington has been horrible in the face-off dot.

So, the trade:

To Washington: Mason Raymond, Manny Malhotra, 3rd round pick 2013

To Vancouver: Troy Brouwer, Eric Fehr

This gives Washington a brand new look on the PK, some speed and a great face-off man who's big contract is about to expire. They lose some size in their line-up.

For Vancouver, they take a hit on their center depth & face-off depth. But they gain two big bodies. One of which can definitely step-into the top 6.

Brouwer: From Vancouver, 215 pounds, 6'4, RH, can play any forward position. Has a cup.

Fehr: Had a good start to the year in Europe but so far hasn't been able to get a point this year. He's another big body at 6'3, 210 pounds. Has some offensive potential. *Has been a HS this year..

With Kes & Booth out, Schroeder gets some much needed size to his line..

Sedin - Sedin - Kassian
Brouwer - Schroeder - Fehr
Higgins - Burrows - Hansen
Volpatti - Lapierre - Weise

When they get back, the Canucks have a playoff perfect forward line-up if Schroeder can continue to play well..

Sedin - Sedin - Kassian
Brouwer - Kesler - Booth
Burrows - Schroeder - Hansen
Higgins - Lapierre - Fehr
Weise/Volpatti/Ebbett

If not a 3rd line C must be necessary in the Luongo deal..
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#2 allkill326

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 11:43 PM

We would really not give up Malhotra, since he is the best faceoff man on our team.
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#3 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 11:44 PM

Thought this was going to be a Luongo deal.

I'm going to say no, Manny for Fehr is a loss for us IMO, Fehr is the better player, but Manny fits our roster more, we need a very good faceoff man, and Manny is the best in the NHL.

Brouwer is a great physical player with some offensive flare aswell, and in a swap for Raymond wouldn't stockpile unnecessary wingers, which is something I like.

But our issue in the playoffs has been scoring, our secondary scoring has been non-existent. Now that Raymond has found his form, and found significant chemistry with Schroeder. I don't think he is someone we should move, as he adds key secondary scoring. We have gotten bigger and more physical, I think we are fine in that department now. We need to score and Raymond brings more offense than Troy.

Equal deal value wise, just don't think it suits our team personally.
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#4 James van Riemsdyk

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 11:45 PM

Manny Malhotra NTC, They're not giving us 2 big 30point scorers for a small 30 point scorer if lucky.
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#5 Pears

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 11:46 PM

I'd do it. Our centers can be much better at faceoffs than they have shown so far.
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In my eyes drouin is overrated he can score in the qmjhl but did nothing in last two gold medal games that canada lost. Fox will be better pro than him talk to me in five yrs

Gaudreau has one NHL goal whereas all your "prized" prospects have none.

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#6 Teemu Selšnne

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 11:47 PM

But our issue in the playoffs has been scoring, our secondary scoring has been non-existent. Now that Raymond has found his form, and found significant chemistry with Schroeder. I don't think he is someone we should move, as he adds key secondary scoring. We have gotten bigger and more physical, I think we are fine in that department now. We need to score and Raymond brings more offense than Troy.

Equal deal value wise, just don't think it suits our team personally.


How exactly has Raymond 'come into form'?

Brouwer and Raymond offensively have about the same abilities 30-40 pointers who might put up a bit more on a good line.

The difference is Raymond is a faster forward, and due to this is good at penalty killing and getting back defensively without trouble. While, Brouwer, is a more physical forward.
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#7 Zoolander

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 11:49 PM

I'm not sold on Fehr.....he was garbage in WPG, and he'd be a gamble, Brouwer is a lot more proven. It all depends on what MG wants in return, but here are the 3 areas I bet Gillis is looking at:

High Level Prospect: Forsberg/Kuznetsov (Kuz is more NHL ready but Forsberg looks like more of a sure-fire thing to come over and not stay in Europe)

Big Top 9 Forward: Brouwer/Laich (Both are very good 2-way forwards who can hit, and play a good all-around game)

D-Men/ Draft Picks: Alzner/Orlov or 1st/2nd rd pick (Alzner = RH D-Man, Born in BC, Orlov = More offensive potential)
The 1st/2nd rd pick will probably be conditional

A Dream scenario IMO would be Forsberg,Brouwer, and a 1st rd pick/Alzner
for Luongo,Raymond, and a 3rd rd pick

Oops, I jumped to the conclusion that this was a Luongo thread.......................

Edited by Zoolander, 03 February 2013 - 11:50 PM.

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#8 Teemu Selšnne

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 11:49 PM

Manny Malhotra NTC, They're not giving us 2 big 30point scorers for a small 30 point scorer if lucky.


Fehr hasn't been a 30 point winger since 2010-2011.

If we're gonna go back that far Raymond was on pace for 47 after a 53 point year..
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#9 Teemu Selšnne

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 11:50 PM

I'm not sold on Fehr.....he was garbage in WPG, and he'd be a gamble, Brouwer is a lot more proven. It all depends on what MG wants in return, but here are the 3 areas I bet Gillis is looking at:

High Level Prospect: Forsberg/Kuznetsov (Kuz is more NHL ready but Forsberg looks like more of a sure-fire thing to come over and not stay in Europe)

Big Top 9 Forward: Brouwer/Laich (Both are very good 2-way forwards who can hit, and play a good all-around game)

D-Men/ Draft Picks: Alzner/Orlov or 1st/2nd rd pick (Alzner = RH D-Man, Born in BC, Orlov = More offensive potential)
The 1st/2nd rd pick will probably be conditional

A Dream scenario IMO would be Forsberg,Brouwer, and a 1st rd pick/Alzner
for Luongo,Raymond, and a 3rd rd pick


Yeah sure, but I don't want to make this a Luongo thread. THERE'S TOO MANY.
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#10 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 12:07 AM

How exactly has Raymond 'come into form'?

Brouwer and Raymond offensively have about the same abilities 30-40 pointers who might put up a bit more on a good line.

The difference is Raymond is a faster forward, and due to this is good at penalty killing and getting back defensively without trouble. While, Brouwer, is a more physical forward.


Raymond has been playing alot better than he has over the last two years. And Raymond does bring more offense, he has a higher skill level, if you needed a top 6 forward (say both were on the 3rd) You would probably choose Raymond.

And I don't think Brouwer is a need, I think our physicality issues were overrated, but that aside we did improve physically by alot. I don't see it as an issue, our issue is offense, executing and coaching/systems. And those 1st 2 are areas in which Raymond is better IMO.
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#11 Teemu Selšnne

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 12:11 AM

Raymond has been playing alot better than he has over the last two years. And Raymond does bring more offense, he has a higher skill level, if you needed a top 6 forward (say both were on the 3rd) You would probably choose Raymond.

And I don't think Brouwer is a need, I think our physicality issues were overrated, but that aside we did improve physically by alot. I don't see it as an issue, our issue is offense, executing and coaching/systems. And those 1st 2 are areas in which Raymond is better IMO.


I disagree. With Kesler fully healthy Brouwer could probably put up Raymond-like numbers with him IMO.
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#12 elvis15

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 12:21 AM

Raymond has been playing alot better than he has over the last two years. And Raymond does bring more offense, he has a higher skill level, if you needed a top 6 forward (say both were on the 3rd) You would probably choose Raymond.

And I don't think Brouwer is a need, I think our physicality issues were overrated, but that aside we did improve physically by alot. I don't see it as an issue, our issue is offense, executing and coaching/systems. And those 1st 2 are areas in which Raymond is better IMO.

I'll believe that when I see more consistency offensively. He's always been reasonable in other areas but we know what we're going to get at best with Raymond. It's not bad but it's hardly going to be amazing either, especially in the playoffs. I wouldn't say Brouwer is the solution, and expecting Malhotra to waive his NTC for that is wishful thinking but it's ok I guess.
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#13 Teemu Selšnne

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 12:36 AM

In theory, just imagine the line-up if GMMG trades Luongo as well this season.. If he can snag a 3rd line center like Sam Gagner, or better Stephen Weiss, the top-9 would look real solid

Sedin - Sedin - Kassian
Burrows - Kesler - Booth
Brouwer - Gagner - Hansen
Higgins
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#14 Tortorella's Rant

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 12:39 AM

This team needs more center depth; it's scary how bad it is when either Henrik or Kesler is out.

Edited by Tortorella's Rant, 04 February 2013 - 12:40 AM.

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#15 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 12:50 AM

I'll believe that when I see more consistency offensively. He's always been reasonable in other areas but we know what we're going to get at best with Raymond. It's not bad but it's hardly going to be amazing either, especially in the playoffs. I wouldn't say Brouwer is the solution, and expecting Malhotra to waive his NTC for that is wishful thinking but it's ok I guess.

I disagree. With Kesler fully healthy Brouwer could probably put up Raymond-like numbers with him IMO.


Do we have confidence that Brouwer will put up a pro-rated 20 goals and 40 points again though? As like Raymond he has had 1 year with that. I don't really have absolute confidence either can bring consistent production, but in the new NHL you have to take risks alot.

Either way Brouwer just isn't a need for us, we have already addressed the component that he brings. We need secondary scoring, that has been our downfall, and while Raymond has been inconsistent in prior years, all indications so far indicate he has really picked it up, and Raymond on his game brings more offensive skill.

Either way I don't think the deal would be beneficial because of the Manny/Fehr swap.
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#16 Teemu Selšnne

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 12:55 AM

Do we have confidence that Brouwer will put up a pro-rated 20 goals and 40 points again though? As like Raymond he has had 1 year with that. I don't really have absolute confidence either can bring consistent production, but in the new NHL you have to take risks alot.

Either way Brouwer just isn't a need for us, we have already addressed the component that he brings. We need secondary scoring, that has been our downfall, and while Raymond has been inconsistent in prior years, all indications so far indicate he has really picked it up, and Raymond on his game brings more offensive skill.

Either way I don't think the deal would be beneficial because of the Manny/Fehr swap.


The difference is when Raymond isn't scoring he isn't doing much for the Canucks, because they have: Burrows, Kesler, Hansen, Higgins and Malhotra (of course not of this trade went through) and last year they also had Pahlsson who can all PK as well or better than Raymond. If everyone was injured, the Sedins can also PK although AV doesn't like to do that. When Brouwer isn't scoring, he's grinding, fighting, hitting, etc..

What do you mean all indications say that Raymond has picked it up? He has 3 goals, 0 assists in 8 games. His 3 goals all came in a 2 game span. So, he's had 5 games/8 without registering a point this season.
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#17 elvis15

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 12:57 AM

This team needs more center depth; it's scary how bad it is when either Henrik or Kesler is out.

I agree we'd do well to target some reasonably significant top end talent that is affordable at least for next year, it's a tough ask to do so. Schroeder might have to be enough unless we do bring back a prospect worth his salt we can use (the further Couturier gets, the more I wish we had him).

Do we have confidence that Brouwer will put up a pro-rated 20 goals and 40 points again though? As like Raymond he has had 1 year with that. I don't really have absolute confidence either can bring consistent production, but in the new NHL you have to take risks alot.

Either way Brouwer just isn't a need for us, we have already addressed the component that he brings. We need secondary scoring, that has been our downfall, and while Raymond has been inconsistent in prior years, all indications so far indicate he has really picked it up, and Raymond on his game brings more offensive skill.

Either way I don't think the deal would be beneficial because of the Manny/Fehr swap.

Sometimes a movement is lateral, but that's not always a good reason to make it. Not terribly excited about it, the Raymond/Brouwer swap might make us tougher to play against, but not sure losing Manny's faceoff ability in exchange for Fehr is a lesser evil.
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#18 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 01:09 AM

The difference is when Raymond isn't scoring he isn't doing much for the Canucks, because they have: Burrows, Kesler, Hansen, Higgins and Malhotra (of course not of this trade went through) and last year they also had Pahlsson who can all PK as well or better than Raymond. If everyone was injured, the Sedins can also PK although AV doesn't like to do that. When Brouwer isn't scoring, he's grinding, fighting, hitting, etc..

What do you mean all indications say that Raymond has picked it up? He has 3 goals, 0 assists in 8 games. His 3 goals all came in a 2 game span. So, he's had 5 games/8 without registering a point this season.


Let's be fair, he is playing on a 3rd line with A rookie getting adjusted and Dale Weise. Brouwer has 4 points and is a minus, he is playing a better role with better players. Aside from just points you can see Raymonds game has improved.

We have players who can do what Brouwer does, Hansen brings the same thing, just less size, more skating. Same level of physicality, and maybe a bit less offense but then again Hansen hasn't had the opportunities Brouwer has.

the flip side of it is when Raymond is on he s one of our best players and most dangerous offensive threats, and when he isn't scoring he can still use his speed effectively to create opportunities atleast this Raymond can. The same can be said for Brouwer, when he is on his game he hits, and can chip in offensively, when Brouwer is inconsistent he might not do either all that well.

If a top 6 forward went down, I would personally rather Raymond in our top 6 than Brouwer. But thats me.

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 04 February 2013 - 01:10 AM.

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#19 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 01:11 AM

Sometimes a movement is lateral, but that's not always a good reason to make it. Not terribly excited about it, the Raymond/Brouwer swap might make us tougher to play against, but not sure losing Manny's faceoff ability in exchange for Fehr is a lesser evil.


Pretty much agree. The Manny/Fehr swap is loss. The Raymond/Brouwer move is a lateral swap, both bring different things. But I think we have what Brouwer brings, so I don't see it as a terrible need. Although if we had Brouwer and the proposal was to bring Raymond in, perhaps we would say the same thing, this is really just a case of being more comfortable with what you have.
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#20 Teemu Selšnne

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 01:14 AM

Let's be fair, he is playing on a 3rd line with A rookie getting adjusted and Dale Weise. Brouwer has 4 points and is a minus, he is playing a better role with better players. Aside from just points you can see Raymonds game has improved.

We have players who can do what Brouwer does, Hansen brings the same thing, just less size, more skating. Same level of physicality, and maybe a bit less offense but then again Hansen hasn't had the opportunities Brouwer has.

the flip side of it is when Raymond is on he s one of our best players and most dangerous offensive threats, and when he isn't scoring he can still use his speed effectively to create opportunities atleast this Raymond can. The same can be said for Brouwer, when he is on his game he hits, and can chip in offensively, when Brouwer is inconsistent he might not do either all that well.

If a top 6 forward went down, I would personally rather Raymond in our top 6 than Brouwer. But thats me.


I think you're forgetting what Raymond looks like when he isn't 'on' in the playoffs. He's not creating chances, he's shooting wide and giving the other team a chance. Even on the famous Raymond - Wellwood - Bernier line, he was the least productive of the 3.

He may be playing with a rookie and Weise, but Schroeder has looked better than both if we're talking stats aside.

Big bodies who can play is a key to winning the cup in regards to all the different teams (basically) since the lockout.
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#21 Teemu Selšnne

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 01:16 AM

Pretty much agree. The Manny/Fehr swap is loss. The Raymond/Brouwer move is a lateral swap, both bring different things. But I think we have what Brouwer brings, so I don't see it as a terrible need. Although if we had Brouwer and the proposal was to bring Raymond in, perhaps we would say the same thing, this is really just a case of being more comfortable with what you have.


I think Brouwer has much more value, that is why I made it that way, IMO it isn't Raymond for Brouwer and Manny for Fehr. It's Raymond + a 3rd, and 35% of Malhotra for Brouwer and 65% of Malhotra for Fehr if you really wanna break it down.

GMTL just signed Brouwer to a 3 year, 11 million dollar deal. Do you think any GM offers Raymond that much on that term? Doubtfully.
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#22 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 01:23 AM

I think you're forgetting what Raymond looks like when he isn't 'on' in the playoffs. He's not creating chances, he's shooting wide and giving the other team a chance. Even on the famous Raymond - Wellwood - Bernier line, he was the least productive of the 3.

He may be playing with a rookie and Weise, but Schroeder has looked better than both if we're talking stats aside.

Big bodies who can play is a key to winning the cup in regards to all the different teams (basically) since the lockout.


Actually the key to winning the cup is goaltending.

Everyone thinks we were physically destroyed by Boston, but the truth is we probably out hit them just as much as they out hit us, they dominated us after the whistles. Nothing more. And since then we have only improved our physicality.

We are equating Raymond of now too much with Raymond of 11/12. He is far more like the 09/10 Raymond than any other Raymond he has been. I do agree Schroeder has looked very good, but in Brouwer's role I think he could still do more. Or on the flip side, in Raymonds role I think Brouwer would do less.

Raymond has been fine this year, we need a good balance of skill and physicality, Not one more slanted than the other. Our offense has failed not our physicality, and Raymond addresses offense more. Raymond has been just fine this year, I don't see any reason to make a change unless it adds a component to the team that we don't currently have, Brouwer doesn't do that.


I think Brouwer has much more value, that is why I made it that way, IMO it isn't Raymond for Brouwer and Manny for Fehr. It's Raymond + a 3rd, and 35% of Malhotra for Brouwer and 65% of Malhotra for Fehr if you really wanna break it down.

GMTL just signed Brouwer to a 3 year, 11 million dollar deal. Do you think any GM offers Raymond that much on that term? Doubtfully.


If you see the deal as that way then you still see Raymond as the what he was last year, that's fine thats your opinion. I disagree, watching him you can see he is a much better player, using his speed much more effectively.

Last year's Raymond? No, but I am willing to bet teams would be willing to give the 09/10 Raymond that, maybe more. And Raymond looks alot more like that guy then the bad Raymond.

Edited by Smashian Kassian, 04 February 2013 - 01:25 AM.

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#23 Teemu Selšnne

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 01:31 AM

Actually the key to winning the cup is goaltending.

Everyone thinks we were physically destroyed by Boston, but the truth is we probably out hit them just as much as they out hit us, they dominated us after the whistles. Nothing more. And since then we have only improved our physicality.

We are equating Raymond of now too much with Raymond of 11/12. He is far more like the 09/10 Raymond than any other Raymond he has been. I do agree Schroeder has looked very good, but in Brouwer's role I think he could still do more. Or on the flip side, in Raymonds role I think Brouwer would do less.

Raymond has been fine this year, we need a good balance of skill and physicality, Not one more slanted than the other. Our offense has failed not our physicality, and Raymond addresses offense more. Raymond has been just fine this year, I don't see any reason to make a change unless it adds a component to the team that we don't currently have, Brouwer doesn't do that.




If you see the deal as that way then you still see Raymond as the what he was last year, that's fine thats your opinion. I disagree, watching him you can see he is a much better player, using his speed much more effectively.

Last year's Raymond? No, but I am willing to bet teams would be willing to give the 09/10 Raymond that, maybe more. And Raymond looks alot more like that guy then the bad Raymond.


Sorry man, but I think turning 'Raymond' into different 'Raymonds' is really grasping at straws. Everything should be accounted, not just the way he has played over the last 6-7 games.

The Canucks may have 'hit' as much as Boston did, but that doesn't mean the Canucks were not physically dominated. For example, a Lucic hit is probably more impactful than a Martin St.Louis (.. or Mase Raymond) hit. Having big bodies is more key. Goaltending is important, but the Canucks already have that..

Also the question again: if you were GMMG would you sign Raymond to a 11 million/3 year deal??
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#24 punjabi7

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 01:53 AM

I dont understand why people want to keep Manny. All he is good for is winning the faceoff. We want to keep a guy who cannot hit or score, but because he can win faceoffs. He is no force on the line, instead lets get a center who can hit, fight, and stick up for the team...

I cant believe we want to keep Manny for faceoff, Lappy is good there as well!
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#25 Smashian Kassian

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 01:59 AM

Sorry man, but I think turning 'Raymond' into different 'Raymonds' is really grasping at straws. Everything should be accounted, not just the way he has played over the last 6-7 games.

The Canucks may have 'hit' as much as Boston did, but that doesn't mean the Canucks were not physically dominated. For example, a Lucic hit is probably more impactful than a Martin St.Louis (.. or Mase Raymond) hit. Having big bodies is more key. Goaltending is important, but the Canucks already have that..

Also the question again: if you were GMMG would you sign Raymond to a 11 million/3 year deal??


No, but that's not a fair comparison. Would you have signed Brouwer to that deal at the end of 08/09? Not likely. It's just not a fair comparison, the comparison should be what they are worth after they played there best, we have seen what Brouwer's is with that deal, and Raymond was worth that too earlier, luckily for us he took a discount, but I am willing to bet market value for May Ray after his best season would have been around the same.

I guess this comes down to opinion. Raymond is much better than what he was last year. To suggest he isn't better than what he was over the last 2 season's is grasping at straws. Yes it is a small sample size, but just watching him you can tell he is a better player. And far more confident.

For me the reason in not making the move is we have already addressed that component, we need our team to be able to play all styles, If this deal addressed something we don't have, I'm all for it, but it doesn't and with the way Raymond has been playing it seems to take away from an area of historical need, and adding to an area which we already are strong in.

But Really this Raymond vs Brouwer thing comes down to personal opinion so we can just agree to disagree.
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#26 cc_devil

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 09:28 AM

Raymond wil be traded sometime this year
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#27 Teemu Selšnne

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 10:22 AM

No, but that's not a fair comparison. Would you have signed Brouwer to that deal at the end of 08/09? Not likely. It's just not a fair comparison, the comparison should be what they are worth after they played there best, we have seen what Brouwer's is with that deal, and Raymond was worth that too earlier, luckily for us he took a discount, but I am willing to bet market value for May Ray after his best season would have been around the same.

I guess this comes down to opinion. Raymond is much better than what he was last year. To suggest he isn't better than what he was over the last 2 season's is grasping at straws. Yes it is a small sample size, but just watching him you can tell he is a better player. And far more confident.

For me the reason in not making the move is we have already addressed that component, we need our team to be able to play all styles, If this deal addressed something we don't have, I'm all for it, but it doesn't and with the way Raymond has been playing it seems to take away from an area of historical need, and adding to an area which we already are strong in.

But Really this Raymond vs Brouwer thing comes down to personal opinion so we can just agree to disagree.


We're not talking about the past right now. This isn't the past. This is a trade I am suggesting for today.

The fact that Raymond has 1 ES G and 2 PPGs in a span of 2 games & 6 games without a single point doesn't not make him a secondary offensive threat.

Brouwer when he's not scoring he's still grinding, getting players off their game, hitting, fighting, putting pressure on the goalie on the PP, etc.

When Raymond isn't scoring he's a useful PKer. The Canucks don't need help in that area, the Caps do.

Brouwer's value NOW > Raymond's value NOW.

Edited by Teemu Selšnne, 04 February 2013 - 10:23 AM.

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#28 elvis15

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 10:27 AM

I dont understand why people want to keep Manny. All he is good for is winning the faceoff. We want to keep a guy who cannot hit or score, but because he can win faceoffs. He is no force on the line, instead lets get a center who can hit, fight, and stick up for the team...

I cant believe we want to keep Manny for faceoff, Lappy is good there as well!

He's 4th in the league in faceoff percentage (for players who have more than 40 draws). No one else on our team is above 50% - apart from Daniel, who's only taken 4 draws. Lapierre is 47.2% right now. That's why we want to keep him.

If you can't win faceoffs, it doesn't matter how good your team is as it sets you up to play defence first. That's tough in a game where you're up by one goal and there's a faceoff in your own end with 30 seconds to play.
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Tanev is going to EDM. I can put my life savings down on it

 


#29 aqua59

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 12:47 PM

Thought this was going to be a Luongo deal.

I'm going to say no, Manny for Fehr is a loss for us IMO, Fehr is the better player, but Manny fits our roster more, we need a very good faceoff man, and Manny is the best in the NHL.

Brouwer is a great physical player with some offensive flare aswell, and in a swap for Raymond wouldn't stockpile unnecessary wingers, which is something I like.

But our issue in the playoffs has been scoring, our secondary scoring has been non-existent. Now that Raymond has found his form, and found significant chemistry with Schroeder. I don't think he is someone we should move, as he adds key secondary scoring. We have gotten bigger and more physical, I think we are fine in that department now. We need to score and Raymond brings more offense than Troy.

Equal deal value wise, just don't think it suits our team personally.


I agree. This deal doesn't suit the Cancuks, well thought out though. Canucks don't want to get bigger and slower. Something that might be Washington's problem.
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#30 Magikal

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 03:33 PM

Wow, one of the few times on CDC where a proposal isn't completely lopsided. Well done. I don't see Manny going anywhere but the idea of a Raymond for Brouwer deal is actually something I really like. Troy is someone i've always thought would be great for our 3rd line. A little fine tuning and I could see it being a possible deal for both sides.
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October1st,2013. #HistoryWillBeMade




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