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Luongo/Schneider shining as backups


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#91 CowtownCanuck

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 01:53 PM

Assuming that they are both Porsche's.

What if one is a 2006 Lamborghini (Luongo) and the other a 2011 Porsche (Schneider)? And what if you saw the 2014 Porsche model (Lack/Cannata) and you really like how it's coming along, and you think that the 2006 Lamborghini can perform at a top level well past when the 2014 Porsche is ready for the market?

Schneider is not and will never be in the same conversation as Luongo. With Luongo, we're talking a goaltender who is likely to be top 3 in all-time wins when all is said and done. Schneider? He hasn't even played a full season as a starter, and he's already 26. Also, Luongo will be dominant past the time Lack or Cannata are ready, and these two look just as poised as Schneider and look to be taking the same career path.

To be honest, goaltenders like Schneider are plenty in this league - develop in the minors long, play well positionally and mature later to become a starter - Jimmy Howard, Brian Elliott, Mike Smith, Craig Anderson, etc. Both Lack and Cannata are doing similar things as Schneider right now. We can develop another Schneider before Luongo is no longer dominant. But it is rare to have an elite goaltender who will dominate well into his late 30s like Luongo. NJ and VAN have it, LA and MTL will have it. Others look in envy.

I am happy to do business with someone who misjudges their asset and sells me a Lamborghini for the price of a Porsche instead of the Porsche any day of my life. Sad thing is, you might be getting rid of that Porsche anyways in 4-5 years when the new Porsche comes out.

Meanwhile, I plan to ride out supreme quality that will last - that's what we have in Luongo.


You ditch the Lamborgorhini, everyone knows they have way too much maintainence
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#92 Nino

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 03:02 PM

LOL, because other teams weren't stacked as well. Horrible posts are horrible posts.


Team Canada was by far the best team in the games and was a favorite by a long shot.


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#93 MonkeyBusiness

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 03:42 PM

Team Canada was by far the best team in the games and was a favorite by a long shot.


Funny how the best team lost to the US only a week before. Oh that's right that it was Lu's fault as well.......

You are clueless, so very clueless.
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#94 Ray_Cathode

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 03:51 PM

No, Schneider didn't play five games in a row, when he was a backup. Luongo's one of the best in the league. I think you should refrain from your posts.


You engage your brain before your mouth - check the facts. Schneider DID play five games in a row from Nov 20-29 2011. Look it up here:
http://canucks.nhl.c...2012&gameType=2
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#95 Nino

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:04 PM

Funny how the best team lost to the US only a week before. Oh that's right that it was Lu's fault as well.......

You are clueless, so very clueless.


What the hell are you talking about and why are you trying to put words in my mouth?

You keep referring to others as clueless, I've never heard anything remotely well thought out that you have ever posted. All your doing is trolling for an online fight, you need to shut your trap and get a life. Others may have a different opinion then you but if all you can reply is something like this then you are the moron.

You need to stop and think before you post, do I have something of interest to add or am I just trying to troll and being a #**^%, if the answer is the later don't post.
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#96 MonkeyBusiness

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:13 PM

What the hell are you talking about and why are you trying to put words in my mouth?

You keep referring to others as clueless, I've never heard anything remotely well thought out that you have ever posted. All your doing is trolling for an online fight, you need to shut your trap and get a life. Others may have a different opinion then you but if all you can reply is something like this then you are the moron.

You need to stop and think before you post, do I have something of interest to add or am I just trying to troll and being a #*•*^%, if the answer is the later don't post.


LOL, you called Canada the best stacked team in the Olympics. The best team got beat by the US a week before. How is that putting words in your mouth?

Glad to know you read all my posts.
Best,
The Moron to the Clueless one.
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#97 Nino

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:54 PM

LOL, you called Canada the best stacked team in the Olympics. The best team got beat by the US a week before. How is that putting words in your mouth?

Glad to know you read all my posts.
Best,
The Moron to the Clueless one.


Ok here is an story with the vagas odds for the 2010 Olympics.

While Russia may be able to send out the most dynamic line, it is Canada who will send out the most balanced lines, the best defensive pairings and the top goaltending tandem, which is why Canada is favored to win the gold medal. Playing in front of a rabid crowd in Vancouver, B.C., certainly can't hurt the chances of the Canadians, either.

Odds to Win the 2010 Olympic Hockey Gold Medal

Canada +125
Russia +245
Sweden +425
U.S.A. +800
Czech Republic +1400
Finland +2000
Obviously, the sportsbooks are expecting a two-horse race between Canada and Russia, with Sweden getting the nod over the U.S. for being the third-best team.

It's hard to go against Canada to win the gold, especially with the Canadians being above even money. The team doesn't have a weakness, which isn't necessarily the case with the other big three contenders.

This is a case where my heart says U.S., but my head says look for Canada to end to recapture the gold medal and make the home fans happy.



Now I know you know as well as me that Canada had a stacked team and were heavy favorites to win, unless you just started watching hockey.

This leads to the point that your just try to troll, as you can't say with an ounce of credibility that Canada was not a stacked team.


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#98 MonkeyBusiness

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:20 PM

Ok here is an story with the vagas odds for the 2010 Olympics.

While Russia may be able to send out the most dynamic line, it is Canada who will send out the most balanced lines, the best defensive pairings and the top goaltending tandem, which is why Canada is favored to win the gold medal. Playing in front of a rabid crowd in Vancouver, B.C., certainly can't hurt the chances of the Canadians, either.

Odds to Win the 2010 Olympic Hockey Gold Medal

Canada +125
Russia +245
Sweden +425
U.S.A. +800
Czech Republic +1400
Finland +2000
Obviously, the sportsbooks are expecting a two-horse race between Canada and Russia, with Sweden getting the nod over the U.S. for being the third-best team.

It's hard to go against Canada to win the gold, especially with the Canadians being above even money. The team doesn't have a weakness, which isn't necessarily the case with the other big three contenders.

This is a case where my heart says U.S., but my head says look for Canada to end to recapture the gold medal and make the home fans happy.



Now I know you know as well as me that Canada had a stacked team and were heavy favorites to win, unless you just started watching hockey.

This leads to the point that your just try to troll, as you can't say with an ounce of credibility that Canada was not a stacked team.


This is my last post in response to anything you say back. You need to read and understand posts. Just a tip.

The best stacked team in the Olympics got beat a week earlier to the US.... Fact! Can you argue that? No! Was Lu in net for that game? No! Here is the stat sheet. http://stats.iihf.co...0A06_74_3_1.pdf

Lu was in net for the game that we won the Gold. Here is the stat sheet. http://stats.iihf.co...0101_74_4_0.pdf
It looks like to me that Lu had something to do with the win...

Stats are stats, reality is that Canada won gold, but did it in overtime against a team that beat them before in the same Olympics.

Edited by MonkeyBusiness, 05 February 2013 - 05:21 PM.

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#99 Primus099

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:48 PM

This is my last post in response to anything you say back. You need to read and understand posts. Just a tip.

The best stacked team in the Olympics got beat a week earlier to the US.... Fact! Can you argue that? No! Was Lu in net for that game? No! Here is the stat sheet. http://stats.iihf.co...0A06_74_3_1.pdf

Lu was in net for the game that we won the Gold. Here is the stat sheet. http://stats.iihf.co...0101_74_4_0.pdf
It looks like to me that Lu had something to do with the win...

Stats are stats, reality is that Canada won gold, but did it in overtime against a team that beat them before in the same Olympics.


but but...Luongo sucks! how could he have had anytihng to do with our gold medal win? :rolleyes: lol

Lu haters will still argue no matter how much you prove them wrong stop wasting your energy
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#100 VMR

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 06:06 PM

Ok here is an story with the vagas odds for the 2010 Olympics.

While Russia may be able to send out the most dynamic line, it is Canada who will send out the most balanced lines, the best defensive pairings and the top goaltending tandem, which is why Canada is favored to win the gold medal. Playing in front of a rabid crowd in Vancouver, B.C., certainly can't hurt the chances of the Canadians, either.

Odds to Win the 2010 Olympic Hockey Gold Medal

Canada +125
Russia +245
Sweden +425
U.S.A. +800
Czech Republic +1400
Finland +2000
Obviously, the sportsbooks are expecting a two-horse race between Canada and Russia, with Sweden getting the nod over the U.S. for being the third-best team.

It's hard to go against Canada to win the gold, especially with the Canadians being above even money. The team doesn't have a weakness, which isn't necessarily the case with the other big three contenders.

This is a case where my heart says U.S., but my head says look for Canada to end to recapture the gold medal and make the home fans happy.



Now I know you know as well as me that Canada had a stacked team and were heavy favorites to win, unless you just started watching hockey.

This leads to the point that your just try to troll, as you can't say with an ounce of credibility that Canada was not a stacked team.


For the record I think Monkey claimed we had a stacked/best team.

Canada was a stacked team. Having said that, Monkey was right they did lose to the US in the same Olympics, so until they won the gold they were second best. After that loss, Luongo was in the net and we won the gold medal. By your flawed logic, he should have lost us that game, according to your claims all he does is Meltdown all the time. (I have to admit I have read some of your posts)

But I digress, again you will end up saying we won in spite of him being in net because we had a stacked team.

I think before you call people trolls and insult all their posts you may want to reread all your posts. You use the same arguments even when proved wrong. You just do it in a new threads that people make. So by your logic does that make you a troll?


Edit Add: You copied and pasted most of your response from this betting site article: http://sportsgamblin...010olympics.htm

Others can decide on troll status.

Edited by VMR, 05 February 2013 - 06:21 PM.

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#101 VMR

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 06:08 PM

but but...Luongo sucks! how could he have had anytihng to do with our gold medal win? :rolleyes: lol

Lu haters will still argue no matter how much you prove them wrong stop wasting your energy


Dang, I should have read this post before I wasted my time typing. You are so right. ::D
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#102 Nino

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 06:38 PM

This is my last post in response to anything you say back. You need to read and understand posts. Just a tip.

The best stacked team in the Olympics got beat a week earlier to the US.... Fact! Can you argue that? No! Was Lu in net for that game? No! Here is the stat sheet. http://stats.iihf.co...0A06_74_3_1.pdf

Lu was in net for the game that we won the Gold. Here is the stat sheet. http://stats.iihf.co...0101_74_4_0.pdf
It looks like to me that Lu had something to do with the win...

Stats are stats, reality is that Canada won gold, but did it in overtime against a team that beat them before in the same Olympics.


Canada did have a stacked team that's all I said, the fact that Marty way playing poorly and Lou outplayed him has nothing to do with the fact that team Canada was stacked.

There was much controversy before and during the Olympics regarding goaltending with a lot of talking heads saying neither goalie should have made the team as they both were coming into the Olympics not playing well.

The fact that we won gold had little to do with Lou and he in fact was outplayed by miller. But none the less he did play as good as he needed to to win the gold so props to him on that.
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#103 Underachieving Hero of CDC

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 06:45 PM

Nino again, you just cannot accept the fact that Lu is a great goalie. Answer this, team Canada was stacked, but so was every other freaking team. The same stacked Canada team lost to the U.S.A in round robin with Brodeur. With Brodeur they barely beat the Swiss, they had to go to shootout with the same stacked team. With this stacked team they would have cruised to Gold with James Reimer in net.

But Hall of famer Martin Brodeur played 2 games with the stacked team Canada, and lost the position to ROBERTO LUONGO. Accept it.

Explain. If you can't have a logical explanation as to why Brodeur lost the job to Luongo with a stacked team Canada you will have proved my point: Nino you do not even have common sense hockey knowledge as proved by many of your posts, and this one is no different.

Brodeur got the starting job because of his undeniable repute as one of the greatest goalies of all time. That didn't stop him from playing horribly in that particular tournament though. His sv% was .867. So, in reality, you're saying that Luongo's one great accomplishment that should forever cement him as an unquestionable legend among goaltenders...is that he outplayed a guy who was putting up a .867 sv%. Just to put that in context, only 5 goalies put up a sv% that bad last year. Think about that. 88 guys played at least a game last year and only 5 of those guys finished with a sv% worse than what Brodeur had in the olympics. Luongo didn't win the job, Brodeur lost it.
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#104 smurf47

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 06:56 PM

Right because 2 or 3 games is totally an indication of how good a goalie is right? lol. Cause that's all Luongo played in the playoffs last year.

By that logic Schneider sucks then cause he has a .897save % and 3.13GAA after 4 games this year.

I love the double standards Lu-haters have to throw in to support their retarded arguments, Luongo sucks cause he had bad stats in 2 playoff games yet Schneider is awesome even though he has bad stats after 4 games. strong logic

FYI....Schneider had a bad first game and got pulled, point taken. Since then and excluding the first game, he has a SP of .935 and a gaa of 1.96...pretty much right on what he played to last year. My point is, there is no reason to think he cannot maintain those stats and no reason to worry. Lous better stats can be reversed by one single game like Schneider had. The sample is just too small at this point in the season to start comparing their abilities or successes or failures.
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#105 smurf47

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 07:00 PM

Assuming that they are both Porsche's.

What if one is a 2006 Lamborghini (Luongo) and the other a 2011 Porsche (Schneider)? And what if you saw the 2014 Porsche model (Lack/Cannata) and you really like how it's coming along, and you think that the 2006 Lamborghini can perform at a top level well past when the 2014 Porsche is ready for the market?

Schneider is not and will never be in the same conversation as Luongo. With Luongo, we're talking a goaltender who is likely to be top 3 in all-time wins when all is said and done. Schneider? He hasn't even played a full season as a starter, and he's already 26. Also, Luongo will be dominant past the time Lack or Cannata are ready, and these two look just as poised as Schneider and look to be taking the same career path.

To be honest, goaltenders like Schneider are plenty in this league - develop in the minors long, play well positionally and mature later to become a starter - Jimmy Howard, Brian Elliott, Mike Smith, Craig Anderson, etc. Both Lack and Cannata are doing similar things as Schneider right now. We can develop another Schneider before Luongo is no longer dominant. But it is rare to have an elite goaltender who will dominate well into his late 30s like Luongo. NJ and VAN have it, LA and MTL will have it. Others look in envy.

I am happy to do business with someone who misjudges their asset and sells me a Lamborghini for the price of a Porsche instead of the Porsche any day of my life. Sad thing is, you might be getting rid of that Porsche anyways in 4-5 years when the new Porsche comes out.

Meanwhile, I plan to ride out supreme quality that will last - that's what we have in Luongo.

If you think goalies like Schneider are common, I suggest you give your head a shake. Hes elite with a tremendous upside and blew Lou out of the rink last season. Were you hibernating or just sleeping it off last year.
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#106 Canucklehead420

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 07:25 PM

Lol. All the Lou lovers praying their bromance is not over but it is.

Folks accept the fact Lou is being traded once the right deal comes, and given his terrific start it wl come.

Most who suggest Schnieds will be the man understand something you people dont, asset management.

Yes Lou has played well but the issue of his trade has nothing to do with the regular season lads, it's everything to do with inconsistency in the playoffs.

Most elite goalies (border, hasek, Roy) were all able to raise their games in the playoffs.

Fact 1: if you look at Lou's save % average over his regular season career it matches up close to those names above.

Fact 2: if you look at his playoff save %, it has only been better than his regular season average save % ONCE in his career as a Canuck, and that was year 1.

Fact 3: in two of the last three playoffs his save % has been below .900 ( ie in the 800's).

Those are the reasons and FACTS behind why he will be moved. His play is only upping his value which helps the team.

Time to accept fact, asset management strategy, and reality. You folks are in a drug induced state of denial.


fuuny all u lu haters were saying take off the blinders Lu will be gone before the season starts. yet here he is tearing up the league still here. next you'll be saying hes as good as gone by the deadline. face it hes owning everyone. enjoy that your team is winning
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#107 Primus099

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 07:28 PM

The fact that we won gold had little to do with Lou and he in fact was outplayed by miller. But none the less he did play as good as he needed to to win the gold so props to him on that.


Luongo stopped 34 of 36 .944 save%

Miller stopped 36 of 39 .923 save%

stop talking

Edited by Primus099, 05 February 2013 - 07:28 PM.

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#108 Canucklehead420

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 07:28 PM

U wouldnt credit that to the defense just letting them walk in?

"Lus collapses" are TEAM collapses..

SMH


what ive been saying all along. boggles my mind that they cant see the teams eneptness at both ends of the rink in those collapses
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#109 Nino

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 08:03 PM

Luongo stopped 34 of 36 .944 save%

Miller stopped 36 of 39 .923 save%

stop talking


Did you watch the game? Miller outplayed Lou trust me.


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#110 Primus099

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 10:58 PM

Did you watch the game? Miller outplayed Lou trust me.


I was at the game, and no he didn't. They were both on their game that day, neither one was noticeably outplaying the other
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#111 MonkeyBusiness

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 11:10 AM

FYI....Schneider had a bad first game and got pulled, point taken. Since then and excluding the first game, he has a SP of .935 and a gaa of 1.96...pretty much right on what he played to last year. My point is, there is no reason to think he cannot maintain those stats and no reason to worry. Lous better stats can be reversed by one single game like Schneider had. The sample is just too small at this point in the season to start comparing their abilities or successes or failures.


Small sample size, I agree. But when you take away the first game and your getting 1.96, you are using an even smaller sample to make your point.

Fact: Cory is a great/could be elite Goalie and in 4 starts has a GAA of 3.13 and has a save % of .897

Fact: Lu is an elite Goalie and in 5 starts has a GAA of 1.53 and has a save % of .940

Granted Lu did take over for Cory in the first game so he has played in six games, but Cory did let in 5 goals on 14 shots.

So lets say we call the first game a mulligan and eliminate it from the equation.
Cory would have a GAA of 1.948
Lu would have a GAA of 1.313
Looks Lu's stats get better as well. Funny how you did not mention that.

So the point I am making is when you remove games because it looks better on stats, you are not giving correct info and there for is useless info.

I credit all the people that helped me understand stats, you know who you are. (Thank You!!!)
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#112 frazzY

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 11:19 AM

what ive been saying all along. boggles my mind that they cant see the teams eneptness at both ends of the rink in those collapses



No doubt, gift wrapped odd man rushes by the dozens and ZERO goal support. ... Ya, Lu sucks....


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