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Canucks trying yoga

forklift_ole

By forklift_ole
in Canucks Talk

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TheWheeler Abbotsford Regular

TheWheeler

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It'll help improve blood flow/circulation, relax the team so they'll go in clear and focused, stretch in order to prevent injury (which is critical after plane trips and multiple games in a short span). I think it's tunnel vision that doesn't accept that many forms of training that compliment each other is likely a very well rounded approach for athletes.

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TheWheeler Abbotsford Regular

TheWheeler

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Yep. And these are the people that are getting the Canucks to do yoga.

Of course they're not going to do it all the time. But to do it periodically at the end of long road trips would be beneficial.

You say that owners spend millions of dollars on players; which is all the more reason for them to make sure these players aren't getting injured. Yoga has been proven to increase flexibility and reduce the likelihood of groin and leg/knee injuries. Which are so much more likely in a condensed season.

Pretty much every team does yoga in some form by the way. So it's not just a fad, it's a legitimate training technique.

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-DLC- Canucks Hall-of-Famer

-DLC-

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No, it's not tunnel vision Deb.

It's science. The fact that so many people here don't actually have an idea about the science of strength and conditioning just shows me that our society can be influenced by so many 'fad' or 'marketing driven' ideas about what is best.

Yes, Yoga CAN have a place. I actually said in my original post that I would be disappointed if they are using it as a regular training tool. Not that it should never have a place. However, that place NEEDS to be miniscule.

Here's the issue. NHL hockey is a multi-million (billion?) dollar industry. These athletes, much like Olympians, need to be training in a way that optimizes their bodies to perform at the highest level. This is a completely different world than regular, everyday athletes or just people in general. These athletes will have their schedules so incredibly in depth it will seem like OCD. They have to periodize. Periodize in their off season, in season, post season, and even in recovery when they get injured. The last thing Roger Takahashi or any knowledgeable Strength Coach would want is for them to be taking up PRIORITY training time with things that go against their sport (Or business, from an Owners perspective).

Yoga does not develop power or speed (kind of essential in the NHL).

Yoga does not develop the energy systems required to participate in Hockey. The ATP-PCr system and Glycolytic systems I would say are the most important for this sport, with Oxidative Phosphorylation (probably the only thing Yoga would help) useful in their recovery. But even then, hockey players train the Oxidative Phosphorylation system anyways with all the other training they do.

Yoga would actually cause muscle fibre characteristics to develop OPPOSITE what is required for hockey. I can't for the life of me think why developing slow twitch muscle fibres would create an elite hockey player...

Yoga CAN aid as a recovery technique, and maybe core work. But here's the issue. An elite athlete who is periodizing EVERYTHING, can't really afford to add more into their routine without the risk of overtraining. The thing is, the benefits an athlete can get from an entire Yoga session, they can get in a 10-15 minute mobility warmup or during their strength training sessions anyways.

The fact that some people try Yoga and think it's tough or a good work out does NOT translate to the fact that it is appropriate for NHL hockey training. Also, I'm sorry but there is no way I will take into consideration the opinions of a Blog or a News Article as to why Yoga is beneficial for hockey players. If it corresponds to what science has proven, then sure. Find me some peer reviewed articles (scientific literature) that PROVES Yoga is great, and then I'll consider it. But from what science tells us for those of us that ARE educated Kinesiologists, Exercise Physiologists, or Certified Strength and Conditioning Coaches, everything that Yoga provides almost goes against how a Hockey Player should be training. Again, I'll say it may have it's place here and there. But hockey is a dynamic, extremely fast paced sport and Yoga is essentially opposite from that.

The physiological benefits from Yoga are essentially the exact same as a well developed strength and conditioning plan that these guys are on. So why change it. And why add it in when these guys are already walking such a fine line between optimal training and overtraining? A hot yoga session and the amount of time it will take to recover from that will do nothing but impair subsequent training sessions. Sorry, but if I'm an NHL owner with hundreds of millions of dollars at stake, I want my athletes doing what is proven and most beneficial to them succeeding.

This has turned into a Yoga debate. But strength and conditioning is something I am passionate about. When Sport Coaches or High School teachers get athletes to do stupid things that completely contraindicate what they should be doing (long duration runs, yoga, sit ups, 2 hours of sprints, etc) I get really annoyed.

Leave the training tips to those that are qualified and actually know what is going on with the human body.

Holy hell calm down?

You've gone off on a bit of a tangent here and while it's very impressive for you to spew your stuff, you're basically caling out the players and the coaches in leading us to believe you know better than they do? I, for one, am not convinced that you do.

They did a yoga session, I think your rant was a little unneccesary and you should keep it in perspective. You'll have a helluva time convincing me that a well rounded program that incorporates various different elements of training is harmful. Or that these guys are all idiots who don't know what they're doing but you do. Yeah, ok. And how about the mental edge? The burnout of doing the daily routine and exhaustion of the road trip - maybe, if just for motivation purposes, it helped them to change the pace after a gruelling 6 in 9 deal. Regrouping. But it's definitely tunnel vision that discounts the advantages and only focuses on what negatives COULD occur without finding a balance. Way to help reinforce my point.

Explosive sports involve bursts, but there are also face offs in hockey, where a guy's hunched over the dot until the puck drops (you only need look to Manny to see how the benefits of yoga can pay off in that). There are stints spent sitting in the penalty box and on the bench. There are periods in one end or the other where things slow down as the puck is passed around and shot. Explosive, but that has to be carried through the duration of a game - one that also involves sitting for periods. I do appreciate and agree with some of what you're saying, but I think you do suffer from that tunnel vision that I spoke of.

Speed and power are only two elements of hockey. There's stability, balance and base of support/core issues, stamina and endurance, etc. - they all factor in. And yoga and flexibility play a big part in overall balance and mobility, which are obviously important in hockey.

Here, found this to support my argument...

http://ihockeytraine...nada_usa_europe

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TheWheeler Abbotsford Regular

TheWheeler

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Holy hell calm down?

You've gone off on a bit of a tangent here and while it's very impressive for you to spew your stuff, you're basically caling out the players and the coaches in leading us to believe you know better than they do? I, for one, am not convinced that you do.

They did a yoga session, I think your rant was a little unneccesary and you should keep it in perspective. You'll have a helluva time convincing me that a well rounded program that incorporates various different elements of training is harmful. Or that these guys are all idiots who don't know what they're doing but you do. Yeah, ok. And how about the mental edge? The burnout of doing the daily routine and exhaustion of the road trip - maybe, if just for motivation purposes, it helped them to change the pace after a gruelling 6 in 9 deal. Regrouping. But it's definitely tunnel vision that discounts the advantages and only focuses on what negatives COULD occur without finding a balance. Way to help reinforce my point.

Explosive sports involve bursts, but there are also face offs in hockey, where a guy's hunched over the dot until the puck drops (you only need look to Manny to see how the benefits of yoga can pay off in that). There are stints spent sitting in the penalty box and on the bench. There are periods in one end or the other where things slow down as the puck is passed around and shot. Explosive, but that has to be carried through the duration of a game - one that also involves sitting for periods. I do appreciate and agree with some of what you're saying, but I think you do suffer from that tunnel vision that I spoke of.

Speed and power are only two elements of hockey. There's stability, balance and base of support/core issues, stamina and endurance, etc. - they all factor in. And yoga and flexibility play a big part in overall balance and mobility, which are obviously important in hockey.

Here, found this to support my argument...

http://ihockeytraine...nada_usa_europe

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-DLC- Canucks Hall-of-Famer

-DLC-

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That is not a peer reviewed article. It is another blog type post, someone trying to sell his product. And he actually says he only uses Yoga "poses", which is completely different from doing Yoga. We have been talking about full Yoga sessions. I did take it in perspective, as I actually did say it may have a place. Just not as a regular training method.

Where does one differentiate from warmup mobility drills and Yoga? An athlete who does 10-15 minutes of warmup (mobility/stretching) could probably easily be said is doing Yoga poses or stretching because they may be very similar. The problem is if someone wants to incorporate traditional Yoga into their training schedule, it can have negative effects. Any of those benefits you listed ARE benefits of Yoga, but the athletes get those same benefits from other, more advantageous methods of training that are more specific to their sport.

If I go and start acting like I know more about any of that than you do, you're going to get annoyed. The same goes with here. An athletes fitness is very much an area of science, and really needs to be left to those that are educated on it.

Too late.

And, while I'm no expert by any stretch, I am somewhat "educated on it". Can I ask what qualifications you have (it's a serious question, not a slam by any means)? Just curious.

My tunnel vision comment is starting to really be reinforced....you're limiting your thinking and have decided only on the negative aspects of yoga based on what appears to be the thinking that it's a waste of time, that can be well used doing something else. But how about the mental fatigue and burnout aspect - you haven't responded to that element of things? What if they like to change things up occassionally to inject a little flavour into the routine? You see it as detrimental and I see it as a well rounded approach.

They "did a yoga session" and you've reacted like they're now giving classes at Rogers Arena during intermission. There was an explanation as to why that was, that supports my thinking. So I just don't understand the barrage from you, as it was rather unnecessary. I'm not angry (at all) - the day the internet makes me mad is the day to sign out for good....I just don't understand this sudden flexing of your online muscles. If you, yourself, can (and have) provide(d) benefits that can be drawn out of a yoga session, then there was no argument? So which one is it - do you grasp why they've used a session or is it something worth ranting about with a long, drawn out Resume?

I will say that when you start using grandmother and sexist comments it hints of desperation as you deflect from the argument.

Yes, you obviously know your stuff, but I stick by my guns with the tunnel vision comment. And how you apply and present your case is important if you want people to actually listen. You're totally missing the mark with a bull in a china shop approach.

And let's answer to this as well: there are currently several NHL players practicing yoga, do they also know nothing about hockey training?

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aGENT Canucks Hall-of-Famer

aGENT

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Yep. And these are the people that are getting the Canucks to do yoga.

Of course they're not going to do it all the time. But to do it periodically at the end of long road trips would be beneficial.

You say that owners spend millions of dollars on players; which is all the more reason for them to make sure these players aren't getting injured. Yoga has been proven to increase flexibility and reduce the likelihood of groin and leg/knee injuries. Which are so much more likely in a condensed season.

Pretty much every team does yoga in some form by the way. So it's not just a fad, it's a legitimate training technique.

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