wallstreetamigo Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Kesler benefit the most from ehrhoff, most of keslers tips were off an ehrhoff shot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashian Kassian Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 I was saying that both the trade for Ballard and the signing of Garrison were needs.....but the coach does not utilize them properly so they are pretty much wasted as well. Keeping Bieksa/Ballard over Ehrhoff was a colossal mistake imo because Ehrhoff fit extremely well with the Sedins especially on the PP. It is not a coincidence they went back to PPG players after he left and only broke 100 while he was here. If the plan had been to keep Bieksa and Hamhuis playing shutdown defence and Ballard, Salo, Edler, etc. picking up the slack offensively for Ehrhoff that might have been a different story, But turning Bieksa and Hamhuis into the ones driving the offense instead of playing that shutdown D is what I consider a major reason the team has fallen this far this fast. If they could not get rid of Ballard, he could have filled Bieksa's two way role adequately while Ehrhoff surely would have made the offense much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Nah Bieksa was the right choice, he was a far more important part of our teams success and on that run and it wasn't even that close IMO, I am one of the biggest Bieksa haters perse (even though I like him, I just am overly hard on him when he plays bad) you can see what he brings to the team when on his game, is just as important if not more important than what Ehrhoff brought. Part of it too was having Edler, who was on pace for more points than Ehrhoff and has proven himself capable of being a 50+ point defenseman, it hasn't worked out quite as well, but then again I think it is easier to fill the PP hole then all the things Kevin can bring. Plus that is one less RH d-man which we were already short on. Given everything I think it was the right move, it would have been great to have Ehrhoff right now for sure but I would do the same thing over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Will we get the above? I doubt it. It doesn't seem like anyone on the Canucks thinks there is anything wrong with the team as it is now or with the effort they put in......that is what is MOST wrong with them though. They don't even understand that they really aren't good enough to float like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashian Kassian Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 It wasn't just the PP though. Our entire transition game left with Ehrhoff. I get all the Bieksa love on here because he is tough - although he really doesn't play that way much anymore - but honestly he floats through a lot of games and has gone back to being ahead of forwards in the offensive zone. His "value" during the cup run was staying back and shutting other teams down. Now he is a liability defensively again most nights. He scores some goals but he is not as good for this team as he was playing shutdown D. I am not the biggest Ehrhoff fan but losing him basically destroyed the roles we had for our D. And for a team that supposedly has such a top end defence, they suck defensively this year. When Bieksa can help the Sedins become 100 point players like having Ehrhoff here did, then we can talk about which one was more valuable. People let their love of fighters overshadow what the team really needed at that time and even now. A talented offensive D who could make things happen on his own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John.Tallhouse Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 like a spelling coach? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Smashian.......Keeping both Bieksa and Ehrhoff and getting rid of Ballard would have been the preferred solution. There was obviously a belief by MG that Ballard would be used to replace some of the game they were losing with Ehrhoff. Had he been, that may have mitigated the loss of Ehrhoff at least some. but AV doesn't roll that way and changed the entire strategy and roles on the defence. That has had the biggest negative impact on this team's results. The only thing good defensively about this team now is the goalies. None of the pairings are really any good consistently (maybe Tanev and Ballard so far) and they switch too often to be effective anyway. It all comes down to how AV is using the guys that are here. Its like he sees a guy and has to needlessly completely change their game to somehow validate himself as a good coach. Why not take the easy road and play guys to their strengths? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vansicle Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Another Higgins and Lappy deadline you say.... If we lose to CBJ again in a couple games I say that it's over for AV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vansicle Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Smashian.......Keeping both Bieksa and Ehrhoff and getting rid of Ballard would have been the preferred solution. There was obviously a belief by MG that Ballard would be used to replace some of the game they were losing with Ehrhoff. Had he been, that may have mitigated the loss of Ehrhoff at least some. but AV doesn't roll that way and changed the entire strategy and roles on the defence. That has had the biggest negative impact on this team's results. The only thing good defensively about this team now is the goalies. None of the pairings are really any good consistently (maybe Tanev and Ballard so far) and they switch too often to be effective anyway. It all comes down to how AV is using the guys that are here. Its like he sees a guy and has to needlessly completely change their game to somehow validate himself as a good coach. Why not take the easy road and play guys to their strengths? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogbyte Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 We have the (correct me if I'm wrong) the highest cap % in the nhl in goaltending.... We will not... I repeat NOT win a cup without using our cap space well. One of our goalies has to go or the season is a wright off. The cap is so important in today's NHL. Fire AV as well, never liked him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kryten Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 It's frustrating, we spend to the cap and don't even have a second line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kryten Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Sorry Wallstreet, I misread your post. I hope this ninja edit keeps me from looking too stupid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogbyte Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Actually, much like the Kassian trade. Garrison and Ballard were both needs, and Ballard could have been what we expected had AV used him right, so much like the Kassian one you can chalk that up to AV too. Garrison was a need, Salo had already signed that monster deal which we were never ever going to be able to match, Garrison was the best defenseman avaliable aside from Suter, we needed a top 4 defenseman, the Garrison signing was really a must aswell, and there were no other options. As for Ehrhoff, he wanted out. Bieksa was the guy I would have choose too, we couldn't really move Ballard it was a short time frame, plus I think MG believed Ehrhoff would buy in and re-sign at a reasonable price. At that contract I don't want him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 I had thought that originally too but why did we go get another LD instead of RD so he could play with Edler in the top 4? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHIPS Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 The first move would be trading away one of our goalies, for a star player that still have 3 years left on their contract. And if that doesn't help, AV is gone. Most of our current core players would stay for now I think. But as it is, we have no chance of getting the Cup this year. Even making the playoffs is questionable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 You want to compete to win a cup? Here is what needs to happen. Step 1: Fire AV. Get a new coaching staff who will instill hard work and accountability from all 23 players as being staples of team success. Get rid of the country club atmosphere and sense of entitlement from AV's favorites. Get them hungry again. Step 2: Get the new coach on the same page as the GM regarding player personnel. If a guy does not fit (like Ballard in AV's system) dump him. This hoarding of depth by Gillis that does not even get used as intended by AV is the most ridiculous thing I have ever seen from a professional sports team. Step 3: Clearly define roles for all players, set D pairings and roles for them, and give these guys a chance to gel. Mistakes will happen but expecting perfection is why these guys can never get even close to it. Every player is expected to do everything........it is not realistic and setting them up for failure. Step 4: Gillis gets on the phone and moves out any guys who do not fit the above or who have a redundant role here in order to fill holes that are not addressed by the current personnel. Waiting for the perfect trade or for the team to play a perfect game is futile. This includes solving the goalie issue too. This team has no direction right now.......and if Gillis can not do the above, then he needs to be fired too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commercial Canuck Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 I just thinkn our management thinks there's nothing wrong with this team, and needing of no change whatsoever. Yes, they understand they should move a goalie, but they're not overly concerned with doing it anytime soon. We won't make any substantial change unless we're out of a playoff spot for more than a week. The last week of March is 5 games in 7 days. 4 of those games are against our division and can and should be won, but, we've said that quite a lot already so far, with unfortunate results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kryten Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 This goes back to what is a major weakness with the team and especially the coach in regards to putting players in the best position to succeed. They think they can reinvent any left side D to play the right side and be immediately successful. And they are attempting to dumb down the team strategy even further to support this....which is obviously not working out well. So we sit and watch while guys are obviously frustrated (Edler, Ballard, Garrison) at being expected to constantly switch back and forth. Edler and Garrison especially suck on the right side. Ballard has been better this year after two years of doing it but he previously sucked at it too. Square peg, round hole. Maybe AV will get lucky and find another Burrows who fits in the oddest of places. But how long should we be willing to wait for lightning to strike twice in the absence of any real positive decision making by this staff regarding player roles? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 I think this also ties into his defend a lead system, which does more harm to certain players stats ie those who see less (if any) PP minutes than others. Something that also really bugs me: we sit on leads (and ties) in the second and third but we are 28th in blocked shots in the NHL? Are we just that bad at blocked shots or do we just not care? Considering the effort level of most of the games this year, I believe it is the latter. AV's done what he can for better or worse, but there are just too many players underperforming for trades to make a difference. The coaching staff needs to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coastal1 Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 We just lost to what-was the crappiest team in the league. Now Florida is the worst team, with by far the worst goals against average. The Panthers GM will be making a play for Lu soon, and hopefully we'll get a piece or two to help get us back on track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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