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If the mediocre play continues will big changes be on the horizon?


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Poll: If the mediocre play continues will big changes be on the horizon? (345 member(s) have cast votes)

if the canucks continue their mediocre play which is most likely to happen

  1. one of the goalies are traded (91 votes [26.53%])

    Percentage of vote: 26.53%

  2. a coaching change (92 votes [26.82%])

    Percentage of vote: 26.82%

  3. nothing, gillis will not have the guts to make a major change (160 votes [46.65%])

    Percentage of vote: 46.65%

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#181 canuckleface77

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 05:09 AM

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You do when guy like Lindy Ruff is available.
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#182 EagleShield

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 05:43 AM

I said 2 games ago that 3 wins from the next 5 or he should go. Look at us now.

My birthday is in 2 weeks (day of the LA game). That's going to be the next time I care about the Canucks (living out of market helps!).
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#183 ghjffbali

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 07:16 AM

Trade with Phili

Luongo, Ballard/Booth/Raymond, and a 1st for L.Schenn and B.Schenn.

We get a Rhanded Dman(which I think we need) and a 2nd line C till Kesler's back, both are young which is a plus. Phili gets an Elite Goalie, a top6 Dman or a top6 fwd, and a 1st. I have doubts but what do you guys think?


Both Schenns are appreciating assets and are projected to be top players in the league. Luongo is an elite goalie but can probably only play at that level for 5 to 6 more years tops, why would you give up two promising young players with plenty of years ahead of them for that? Also Ballard and Booth would be considered dumping salary and would in fact have the opposite effect of "sweetening the deal" and the first pick we would give up would not exactly be able to replace the pieces Philly would give up. If Gillis pulled something off like that he must have gotten Holmgren drunk.
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#184 CowtownCanuck

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 07:20 AM

My question of the day was very similar, who goes first? AV, MG or Lu?

Each of these men is linked with the other and one of them could be the lynch pin to the Canucks succeeding.

Vigneault could be the key, the team is tuning out the message, and I'm not sure if he's ever been able to coach the twins. His only input on their play appears to be when they are on the ice, but why mess with perfection?

Gillis has been a questionable GM. I often wonder if his mediocre trades are based on previous dealings with other Managers around the league as an agent, or is it his "Moneyball" trade startegy that has taken us on the trade roller coaster?

Lastly Luongo, trading Lu could yield us the scoring or defense talent to push us over the wall. But a Luongo trade is stronly linked with Gillis and in his bargaining ability.
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#185 DeNiro

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 07:30 AM

If we're going to make a coaching change, Ruff's gotta be the guy. He'll be gone before the summer because coaches like him aren't available for very long.

He's like Quenville or Babcock, if he becomes available, you go for him.

Just to run down his resume:

2 SCF appearances
5 ECF appearances (1 as assistant coach)
1 Olympic Gold Medal as assistant coach for team Canada
1 Jack Adams Award (05-06)

1st coach to lead the Sabres to back to back 50 win seasons. And set a franchise record with 113 points in 06-07.

1 of only 16 coaches in NHL history to have 500 wins.

The guys got the resume of a winner. If he's available, and you have doubts about your coach, you make the move.
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#186 blueliner1955

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 08:08 AM

when is aquilinnie gonna say enough is enough fire av now sit out line 1 2 3 why is gillies picking up players not doing much to help the canucks their lack of interest in the game no compassion they looking at each other what do we gottah do cant take the puck out of their own end quit taking stupid penalties work on their power play quit relying on kesler oe bieksa find a solution work work or leave the building
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#187 PuckStop27

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 08:10 AM

It seems like they have stopped listening to the coaches, Newell Brown in particular. They have lost KB and others in the past and not missed a beat.They are playing without confidence or conviction at this time and no one has stepped up to fil lthe void.. Only true high point so far is the way Chris Higgins is coming to play each game. Why is Garrison not on the powerplay? If thats what you call it lately..
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#188 jono2009

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 08:39 AM

how is firing the coach the right option to do?
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#189 cc_devil

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 08:57 AM

It's the first step. If a coaching change doesn't work then something is going to have to be done.
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#190 BertuzziJr 2.0

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 09:28 AM

Seems like Jon Cooper is a popular name. If I'm Gillis I go with someone with fresh idea's. Nothing is wrong with Ruff, but go with a new coach rather than a retread
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#191 Quoted

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 09:54 AM

How many times does a hot goalie beat us? Weren't we supposed to have the best goalies?

I don't think Gillis has been with it this year and last. I remember he said he'd retire earlier than not; perhaps he will go first? Otherwise no changes happening, and if so look for dumb trade like Cody for kas type idea


Hot goalies aren't beating them. They are making goalies look better than they are with poor PP, lack of offensive energy and creativity and thus scoring 5 on 5. It can't be that goalies always get hot against the Canucks. The common factor is the Canucks.

Until they get a solid second line going, they are too easy to shut down. The 4th line is a mess.

So, in a perfect world: add a solid D as clearly Edler isn't getting out of his slump anytime soon, get a grinder for the 4th, and a legistimate 2nd line center. If that means trading Schneider, so be it (of the two, he is likely easier to move).
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#192 thad

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:10 AM

Seems like Jon Cooper is a popular name. If I'm Gillis I go with someone with fresh idea's. Nothing is wrong with Ruff, but go with a new coach rather than a retread


You change tires don't you lol

I agree with Deniro, just look at that resume. Ruff has the pedigree to take a veteran team deep.

I also love the toughness he brings too. Didnt he bench half the players on the ice after Lucic ran miller and nobody did anything. That's the guy I want.
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#193 Quoted

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:18 AM

You do when guy like Lindy Ruff is available.


The only thing that Ruff seems to have over AV is that he represents a change. In terms of success and numbers, AV brings just as much to the table. Granted, sometimes a change is required, regardless of the quality of the coach. Still, I think they have more issues with their special teams coaching (yes, AV is still in charge, I get that), so a change there might be better (either replaced or AV shorters the lease considerably). The also are missing some key pieces so AV is working with a less than ideal roster (which is a GM and not a coaching issue).
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#194 Kryten

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:22 AM

You change tires don't you lol

I agree with Deniro, just look at that resume. Ruff has the pedigree to take a veteran team deep.

I also love the toughness he brings too. Didnt he bench half the players on the ice after Lucic ran miller and nobody did anything. That's the guy I want.




I really don't mind Ruff either. Both don't mind the rough stuff and have good senses of humour. At least noone can say we don't have options.
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#195 Quantum-Runner

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:23 AM

For Lindy Ruff fans, 1993-94 Florida Panthers NHL Assistant 1994-95 Florida Panthers NHL Assistant 1995-96 Florida Panthers NHL Assistant 1996-97 Florida Panthers NHL Assistant 1997-98 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 36 29 17 0 0.543 Lost in round 3 1998-99 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 37 28 17 0 0.555 Lost in Finals 1999-00 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 35 32 11 4 0.518 Lost in round 1 2000-01 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 46 30 5 1 0.598 Lost in round 2 2001-02 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 35 35 11 1 0.500 Out of Playoffs 2002-03 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 27 37 10 8 0.439 Out of Playoffs 2003-04 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 37 34 7 4 0.518 Out of Playoffs 2005-06 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 52 24 0 6 0.671 Lost in round 3 2006-07 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 53 22 0 7 0.689 Lost in round 3 2007-08 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 39 31 0 12 0.549 Out of Playoffs 2008-09 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 41 32 0 9 0.555 Out of Playoffs 2009-10 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 45 27 0 10 0.610 Lost in round 1 2010-11 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 43 29 0 10 0.585 Lost in round 1 2011-12 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 39 32 0 11 0.543 Out of Playoffs 2012-13 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head†
† Replace
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#196 Quoted

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:34 AM

Bit easier to read version of Quantum-Runner's post:

For Lindy Ruff fans,
1993-94 Florida Panthers NHL Assistant
1994-95 Florida Panthers NHL Assistant
1995-96 Florida Panthers NHL Assistant
1996-97 Florida Panthers NHL Assistant
1997-98 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 36 29 17 0 0.543 Lost in round 3
1998-99 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 37 28 17 0 0.555 Lost in Finals
1999-00 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 35 32 11 4 0.518 Lost in round 1
2000-01 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 46 30 5 1 0.598 Lost in round 2
2001-02 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 35 35 11 1 0.500 Out of Playoffs
2002-03 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 27 37 10 8 0.439 Out of Playoffs
2003-04 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 37 34 7 4 0.518 Out of Playoffs
2005-06 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 52 24 0 6 0.671 Lost in round 3
2006-07 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 53 22 0 7 0.689 Lost in round 3
2007-08 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 39 31 0 12 0.549 Out of Playoffs
2008-09 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 41 32 0 9 0.555 Out of Playoffs
2009-10 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 45 27 0 10 0.610 Lost in round 1
2010-11 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 43 29 0 10 0.585 Lost in round 1
2011-12 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 39 32 0 11 0.543 Out of Playoffs
2012-13 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head†
† Replaced

Edited by Quoted, 11 March 2013 - 10:34 AM.

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#197 Vansicle

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:39 AM

If we're going to make a coaching change, Ruff's gotta be the guy. He'll be gone before the summer because coaches like him aren't available for very long.

He's like Quenville or Babcock, if he becomes available, you go for him.

Just to run down his resume:

2 SCF appearances
5 ECF appearances (1 as assistant coach)
1 Olympic Gold Medal as assistant coach for team Canada
1 Jack Adams Award (05-06)

1st coach to lead the Sabres to back to back 50 win seasons. And set a franchise record with 113 points in 06-07.

1 of only 16 coaches in NHL history to have 500 wins.

The guys got the resume of a winner. If he's available, and you have doubts about your coach, you make the move.

This. Especially in light of the Schroeder send down. I think it's pretty clear Av's expiration time has passed, and Ruffls style is exactly what Gillis was talking about a couple uears ago when he said he felt the team's future should be based on offense and speed.
No brainer. Fire AV, hire Ruff. Today.
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Snake Doctor, on 23 May 2014 - 10:41 AM, said:snapback.png

Miller is not on our list. It's Lack as our #1. There is no reason we would have traded both Schnieder and Luongo if we never intended to give Lack the #1 starting job.  Furthermore, the salary and term Miller is looking for is not in our favor.

 


#198 Monty

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:43 AM

I have always liked AV, and still do. However, I do think it is about time for a change. He'll land on his feet quickly, as any team would love to have him. But teams need a change at times. Aside from the Luongo trade that is inevitable, the teams needs something different.
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#199 Vansicle

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:46 AM

The only thing that Ruff seems to have over AV is that he represents a change. In terms of success and numbers, AV brings just as much to the table.

Nope. Pattently false. AV has some nice acheivements.
Ruff's resume looks like the profile of an overacheiver on steroids. And instead of telling the boys "make 'em pay with the pp", he'll tell 'em "go out there and make 'em pay with their blood."
That's xactly what this team needs. Immediately.
If Ruff gets picked up by another team, we are going to regret it.
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Snake Doctor, on 23 May 2014 - 10:41 AM, said:snapback.png

Miller is not on our list. It's Lack as our #1. There is no reason we would have traded both Schnieder and Luongo if we never intended to give Lack the #1 starting job.  Furthermore, the salary and term Miller is looking for is not in our favor.

 


#200 TheCammer

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:52 AM

Bit easier to read version of Quantum-Runner's post:

For Lindy Ruff fans,
1993-94 Florida Panthers NHL Assistant
1994-95 Florida Panthers NHL Assistant
1995-96 Florida Panthers NHL Assistant
1996-97 Florida Panthers NHL Assistant
1997-98 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 36 29 17 0 0.543 Lost in round 3
1998-99 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 37 28 17 0 0.555 Lost in Finals
1999-00 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 35 32 11 4 0.518 Lost in round 1
2000-01 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 46 30 5 1 0.598 Lost in round 2
2001-02 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 35 35 11 1 0.500 Out of Playoffs
2002-03 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 27 37 10 8 0.439 Out of Playoffs
2003-04 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 37 34 7 4 0.518 Out of Playoffs
2005-06 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 52 24 0 6 0.671 Lost in round 3
2006-07 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 53 22 0 7 0.689 Lost in round 3
2007-08 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 39 31 0 12 0.549 Out of Playoffs
2008-09 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 41 32 0 9 0.555 Out of Playoffs
2009-10 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 45 27 0 10 0.610 Lost in round 1
2010-11 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 43 29 0 10 0.585 Lost in round 1
2011-12 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head 82 39 32 0 11 0.543 Out of Playoffs
2012-13 Buffalo Sabres NHL Head†
† Replaced

Not exactly a great resume. 6 years they have missed the playoffs with a 7th well on the way when he was canned.

Lindy Ruff is garbage I'm not interested in.
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#201 thad

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:53 AM

Nope. Pattently false. AV has some nice acheivements.
Ruff's resume looks like the profile of an overacheiver on steroids. And instead of telling the boys "make 'em pay with the pp", he'll tell 'em "go out there and make 'em pay with their blood."
That's xactly what this team needs. Immediately.
If Ruff gets picked up by another team, we are going to regret it.


I agree.. The next 2 games will decide Avs fate I think. We are coming up to the the 2 hardest working teams in the league, Columbus and Nashville. If he can't prepare them to outwork those teams in the next couple games he's gotta go.
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#202 Spoosh

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:57 AM

I have always liked AV, and still do. However, I do think it is about time for a change. He'll land on his feet quickly, as any team would love to have him. But teams need a change at times. Aside from the Luongo trade that is inevitable, the teams needs something different.


x2

I like AV and what he has done. But we need a change. We're playing without emotion, or at least very little emotion. Lifeless is a very fitting word to describe the play at the moment.

Though I think if AV becomes available, he'll have a new job faster than Lindy Ruff can say mustache.
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#203 enterin

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 12:04 PM

I still don't get why Gillis brings in players that will benefit the team in some shape or form (Ballard, Garrison, Kassian) and then AV gives them limited minutes, demotes them, scratches them or in Garrison's case not put him on the PP (where most of his goals came from last season) it's frustrating watching Kassian play a 4th line role and we all know what he is capable of.

I'm usually patient with the team when they hit a funk but we seem to be in type of play that we were in the at the end of last season, sitting back early on and coming back then losing it in the end. They seem too comfortable in their environment and MG has to do something Fire AV, trade someone from the core to shock them or something else, but this team needs a wake up call either now or closer to the trade deadline, but if we want a run at the cup something needs to change.


First of all Garrison is a slug he is too slow, he seems to stumble on turns if the puck gets by him he to slow to retrieve the puck...thats why he is not playing on the power play.
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#204 Quoted

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 12:08 PM

Nope. Pattently false. AV has some nice acheivements.
Ruff's resume looks like the profile of an overacheiver on steroids. And instead of telling the boys "make 'em pay with the pp", he'll tell 'em "go out there and make 'em pay with their blood."
That's xactly what this team needs. Immediately.
If Ruff gets picked up by another team, we are going to regret it.


And yet in the last 5 seasons, his team hasn't made the playoffs 3 times and they were bounced in the first round twice.

Having said that, he is a good coach, and as can happen, a new voice might be the way to go. My point was merely that if you compare accomplishments only, AV stacks up pretty well and I don't think it's simple to say Ruff is the better coach.
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#205 crossbar and in

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 02:14 PM

Has anyone thought of Pat Quinn? He has an extensive resume of coaching many styles and ages of teams. He commands respect at whatever level he has been. If you want an uptempo offence or good defense he has the credentials.
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#206 DIBdaQUIB

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 02:19 PM

how is firing the coach the right option to do?


Unacceptable to continue playing like this with the talent on the team and the money being spent. A major "shift" is necessary.

Easier to fire the coach than replace the team.
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#207 Alex the Great

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 02:24 PM

Your not going to win a Stanley Cup with Hansen, Higgins and Raymond as your second line. I think its flipping arrogant and ridiculous that Mike Gillis thinks you can win a Stanley Cup with that. You want to win a cup, the second line should be at least challenging the first line for points.

Well if we were in the cup finals I'm sure Kesler would be back.....
It'd look more like this
Booth - Kesler - Raymond/Higgins/Kassian
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#208 DIBdaQUIB

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 02:32 PM

Not exactly a great resume. 6 years they have missed the playoffs with a 7th well on the way when he was canned.

Lindy Ruff is garbage I'm not interested in.


...and what impresses you about AV? He's had a more talented team and other than the SCF appearance, has had virtually no post-season success. WHat he has done is lose a SCF after having a 2-0 lead. Have a team that scored the fewest goals ever in a 7 game SCF. Allowing the most. ALmost having one of teh biggest melt-downs in sport history after hacing Chicago down 3-0 and managing to luckily win in overtime in game 7. Lindy got his team to the 3rd round 3 times and a SCF appearance.

Still, it's not all about historical achievements but in changing the message, style, strategy and personnel decisions that shakes up a team.

AV has shown that while he is very willing to juggle an ddemote certain players, he allows otheres to be untouched or disciplined no matter what. Over time, these little "slights" add up and player resentment can build. SUre, players wil say the right thing when asked like< I' need ot be better" but secretly, when they see the "heroes" on the team mailing it in without repurcussions, it sucks the life out of them and creates complacency with the "stars" who can do no wrong.

After years of such treatment, it's virtually impossible for a coach to undo all those decisions. A change in coaching is the only solution where every player gets a new lease on life. Vets need to earn their time and impress the new coach while rookies get a chance to earn more ice time and perhaps are given a chance to receive actual encouragement anc coaching to increase their chanc at success.

That AV has resorted to punishments for poor practise effort (something usually done with rookie players) with a team he has always treated as mature vets, is a sign he has run out of ways to address the issues surrounding the team.
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#209 Dildo Faggins

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 02:50 PM

Expect no changes. We could end up missing the play-offs altogether, and next time around Gillis will do his usual thing of picking up a few depth players at the deadline. Those are the "big changes".we will get.
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#210 wallstreetamigo

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 03:26 PM

x2

I like AV and what he has done. But we need a change. We're playing without emotion, or at least very little emotion. Lifeless is a very fitting word to describe the play at the moment.

Though I think if AV becomes available, he'll have a new job faster than Lindy Ruff can say mustache.


Who cares if he gets another job? Its like the Canucks as a whole should be on an episode of hoarders.

Gillis hoards depth players who do not even get used when they are needed and apparently also a coach so no one else can hire him?

Everyone who wants to keep AV should look up the term "Opportunity Cost" from basic economics. (not saying you are, I just see this argument a lot)
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