Updated: BCNU cozying up to BC Liars urging them to sign nursing bill (bill 18)

[Harbinger]

SOMETIMES changing your union is good. Sometimes not so much. The HEU is extremely weak. I can understand why some will want to change unions. I can also understand why the HEU would be against this. If you take their most valued members from them then they even lose more bargaining power.

I don't think I care about the inner squabblings of unions or businesses for that matter.

[Sapper]

More to the point the LPNs have voted to join with the RNs and RPNs in the lawful process set out in the BC Labour Relations Code.

One of the reasons for that vote is that the LPNs are a profession and unlike the other members of HEU (but like the RNs and RPNs) they are governed by a professional regulatory body (as are doctors, lawyers, engineers and other professions) the College of Licensed Practical Nurses of BC. It is like the learning exercise - which of these is not like the others?

It seems for Adrian Dix and the BC NDP and their organized supporters labour law is only to be followed when it operates the way they want it to. And that is a scary precedent.

[Sapper]

And a particularly redundant one at that.

[Wetcoaster]

On the issue of labor law - it wasn't followed. During the raid BCNU was given complete and open access to those they where signing up on the employers property and during work hours. Unheard of but as HEABC supported the raid not suprising. Also this is a precident setting situation where one union was able to cherry pick one group of workers out of a union without having to "take them all ".

Normally if a union wants to sign up members or raid them - they must do it off property and off employer paid time. I would be upset if the NDP did support this new raid precedent of on employer property and time .... Tax payers should not be paying for one union to raid another.

As others have posted they did vote to join them and BCNU made a ton of promises that unless they have a goverment that will ensure they can fufill those promises .... One begins to understand their panic to get bill 18 passed.

And during - after the raid the employer supported the raid. As soon as it was completed and the goverment tabled bill 18 - as reported by global news a letter from all the employer health authorities surfaced where they petitioned the goverment not to - or atleast not at this time.

The complete turn around in opinion by the employer should give everyone a clue that things are not always as it would suggest -

So to suggest that it is labor or the NDP setting a scary precident is very disingenous. The NDP has no part in the raid or the on going fall out ( if elected they will though ) and Labor has every right to be ticked - if you threaten them with the labor board for recruiting on employer property and then cherry pick one to roll out the red carpet it does create a very unequal playing field. Go ahead and dislike either union - the LPN's voted to move so it's a dead issue at this point - but to use anything and everything to imply that some how the NDP are to blame is getting ridiculous as the NDP where not involved in this raid. What's next? Blame adrain for the common cold?

[Sapper]

On the employers disagreeing

http://globalnews.ca/news/464889/b-c-s-proposed-nursing-changes-slammed/

On the employer supporting the raid ( calling on the labor board to support the vote of LPNs only )

http://www.bcnulpn.org/news/2012-03-20.html

For worksite - just ask any person who has worked in a hospital the last 4 years if raiding activity occured on site - on shift

Those are the links that support my comments that the Health Authorities are at this time wanting to delay any move of LPN's to the Nurses bargaining - That during the raid BCNU stated that the employer wrote to the Labor Board in favor of the vote occuring ( supporting it ) and the final piece discussed was personal observations but really - talk to anyone working in a hospital and you will find more than you bargained for in opinions to it happening

[Dazzle]

Leave it to J529 to support the BC NDPers, YAY!

After all, we should totally accept mistakes here and there, as long as it's the NDP that's doing it. YAY!

Any other party that makes mistakes? VOTE NDP of course!

[Wetcoaster]

On the employers disagreeing

http://globalnews.ca...hanges-slammed/

On the employer supporting the raid ( calling on the labor board to support the vote of LPNs only )

http://www.bcnulpn.o...2012-03-20.html

For worksite - just ask any person who has worked in a hospital the last 4 years if raiding activity occured on site - on shift

Those are the links that support my comments that the Health Authorities are at this time wanting to delay any move of LPN's to the Nurses bargaining - That during the raid BCNU stated that the employer wrote to the Labor Board in favor of the vote occuring ( supporting it ) and the final piece discussed was personal observations but really - talk to anyone working in a hospital and you will find more than you bargained for in opinions to it happening

[Sapper]

You do realize those issues were argued at the BC Labour Relations Board by the HEU and BCGEU and were dismissed and then a motion for reconsideration was also dismissed.

[Wetcoaster]

Yes but that does not change the information provided - The employer supported the raid which is unheard of outside of CLAC - then in an about turn apposed them being moved into the RN's bargaining unit knowing full well that during the raid that was a #1 demand ... supports my comment that it makes it odd and suspect to motive

And lastly on the cherry picking - it is my understanding that labor boards and employers have nearly always apposed this. Imagine you own a grocery store that everyone belongs to UFCW. If 6 or 7 departments one by one ( by classification ) breaks free and moves to a different union - a private sector employer could find themselves behind picket lines 365 days a year as unions rotate through like domino's in bargaining. Makes it odd that the goverment would support what private sector would never support

But back to the reasons for my post - Given the way the raid was supported and then not supported by employers and given the fact that if pushed the NDP would have to agree that permitting raiding on employer dime and time is not acceptable ... it is reason enough to steer clear while Bill 18 issues are live. It is not the NDP that has set dangereous precident and they did not condem the process in the news - they simply did not attend which I would think would be a prudent thing.

[ronthecivil]

On the employers disagreeing

http://globalnews.ca...hanges-slammed/

On the employer supporting the raid ( calling on the labor board to support the vote of LPNs only )

http://www.bcnulpn.o...2012-03-20.html

For worksite - just ask any person who has worked in a hospital the last 4 years if raiding activity occured on site - on shift

Those are the links that support my comments that the Health Authorities are at this time wanting to delay any move of LPN's to the Nurses bargaining - That during the raid BCNU stated that the employer wrote to the Labor Board in favor of the vote occuring ( supporting it ) and the final piece discussed was personal observations but really - talk to anyone working in a hospital and you will find more than you bargained for in opinions to it happening

[ronthecivil]

Yes but that does not change the information provided - The employer supported the raid which is unheard of outside of CLAC - then in an about turn apposed them being moved into the RN's bargaining unit knowing full well that during the raid that was a #1 demand ... supports my comment that it makes it odd and suspect to motive

And lastly on the cherry picking - it is my understanding that labor boards and employers have nearly always apposed this. Imagine you own a grocery store that everyone belongs to UFCW. If 6 or 7 departments one by one ( by classification ) breaks free and moves to a different union - a private sector employer could find themselves behind picket lines 365 days a year as unions rotate through like domino's in bargaining. Makes it odd that the goverment would support what private sector would never support

But back to the reasons for my post - Given the way the raid was supported and then not supported by employers and given the fact that if pushed the NDP would have to agree that permitting raiding on employer dime and time is not acceptable ... it is reason enough to steer clear while Bill 18 issues are live. It is not the NDP that has set dangereous precident and they did not condem the process in the news - they simply did not attend which I would think would be a prudent thing.

[J529]

Leave it to J529 to support the BC NDPers, YAY!

After all, we should totally accept mistakes here and there, as long as it's the NDP that's doing it. YAY!

Any other party that makes mistakes? VOTE NDP of course!

[J529]

Some people just really like to use a stupid catch phrase like "BC Liars" any chance they get. The actual story was probably of little concern to the OP.

[Wetcoaster]

You presume wrong. The story was of alot of interest to me, actually. Once again HEU is targeted. People using reason/excuse that HEU was too weak of a union, etc. Doesn't change the fact BCNU raided HEU. Plain and simple. There's an unwritten union code and one union raiding another is a no no. BCNU deserved to be blacklisted by the NDP, BC Fed of Labour and all the blacklash they get.

[J529]

So you are opposed to acting in accordance with the BC Labour Relations Code and you are against democracy.

Good to know.

See:

/topic/341342-updated-bcnu-cozying-up-to-bc-liars-urging-them-to-sign-nursing-bill-bill-18/#entry11209152">http://forum.canucks.../#entry11209152

[Wetcoaster]

What the raid (which is what it really is) or as you want to call is (voting to move to another union) is all about greater power and influence

[J529]

How about a link for that quote?

[Wetcoaster]

www.heu.org/lpnsinfo/qanda

[Sapper]

Except it's the opposite. Half of the nurses are in one union, and half are in another. And regardless of whether or not one is in one union or the other if a picket line goes up nobody in any union crosses it.

Truly frightening that the kind of logic that goes looney because the democratic right of people working in the exact same profession doing the same job at the same time to decide to be in the same union violates some sort of bizarre solidarity movement is about to become mainstream.

God forbid the people cleaning the floors won't have the added leverage of being lumped in with half the nurses when it comes time to negotiate their contract.....

[J529]

LOL

You do realize that the BC LRB after a full hearing completely dismissed those claims by HEU (and also the by the BCGEU) in the originating decision and in the appeal for re-consideration, do you not?

The BCNU complied with the requirements of the Labour Relations Code including a democratic vote by the LPNs.