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The Manny Curse? The Canucks have tanked since Malhotra was placed on IR

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#1 gradin123

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 03:29 AM

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Is there a Manny Curse?

The Canucks looked like they were running away with the division the day the rather shocking news that Malhotra was out for the year came out.

Pre-Malhotra announcement the the Canucks were 8-2-2
Post-Malhotra announcement the Canucks are 3-5-4

Is that a coincidence? Now I don't think Malhotra was playing that good for the Canucks this year but he is a very respected player in the dressing room and the way this situation was handled may have caused waves in the dressing room that weren't immediately obvious. Could it be that the players lost respect for the team's management team with the way they just tossed Manny aside when Kesler was ready to come back?

I personally think that not only have the players started tuning out AV but they also may be disgruntled with the way Gillis has handled both Malhotra and possible even the Hodgson situation. It seems to me a negative vibe has been hanging around the team every since Manny went on IR.

Edited by gradin123, 12 March 2013 - 03:42 AM.

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#2 UFTcan

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 03:33 AM

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Karma
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#3 MayRayDown

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 04:20 AM

He probably brought something to the dressing room that is lacking now. I don't think its a curse that we are losing now for. We are losing because our power play sucks, 3rd line and 4th line are not producing, kesler and Bieksa are injured, goaltending has been just ok.

Things probably won't be much better when the next game our 4th line will be full of plugs

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#4 Kevin Biestra

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 04:26 AM

I also had noticed that these two events coincided almost perfectly.

Something to be said for leadership, I guess. Canucks have been playing the last 12 games like they were lacking in that department.
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#5 Bodee

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 04:59 AM

I don't think losing Volpatti helped either lately. He was I am sure also a big hit with the team with his unassuming manner and his big heart. These guys (Sammy, Salo, Rome Malhotra, Volpatti) are more than just the sum of their parts.

I agree with the OP I am not enamoured with MG's overbearing influence, combined with twisted logic, in some matters and total inertia in others. He says he "doesn't sweat the small stuff"............that's all he sweats imo

Edited by Bodee, 12 March 2013 - 05:00 AM.

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#6 Starfruits

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 05:04 AM

I noticed this just 3 games after the announcement when Manny is in place for IR... I wonder it made a huge impact on lacking leadership...
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#7 Clinch16

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 05:11 AM

Is there a Manny Curse?

The Canucks looked like they were running away with the division the day the rather shocking news that Malhotra was out for the year came out.

Pre-Malhotra announcement the the Canucks were 8-2-2
Post-Malhotra announcement the Canucks are 3-5-4

Is that a coincidence? Now I don't think Malhotra was playing that good for the Canucks this year but he is a very respected player in the dressing room and the way this situation was handled may have caused waves in the dressing room that weren't immediately obvious. Could it be that the players lost respect for the team's management team with the way they just tossed Manny aside when Kesler was ready to come back?

I personally think that not only have the players started tuning out AV but they also may be disgruntled with the way Gillis has handled both Malhotra and possible even the Hodgson situation. It seems to me a negative vibe has been hanging around the team every since Manny went on IR.



Darn, I was really hoping you were on to something. But then you went and mentioned Hodgson. Good try though.
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#8 Ohnoeszz

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 05:37 AM

Sigh....
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#9 CB007

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 07:31 AM

We are missing Kesler, Bieksa and Manny on the ice. That's 3 of our 4 alternate captains. Probably 3 of the 4 more outspoken ones too consider the last one is Daniel. That's a lot of leadership missing.
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#10 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 07:48 AM

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I'd call it more of a Bieksa curse. The Canucks have not won a single game this season that he has not played in...
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#11 sedated

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 07:53 AM

Kesler looked pretty mediocre when he was back. And let's not forget, he was pretty mediocre all of last season as well, so it's not really just the injury. He doesn't put the effort or heart into his shifts that he use to. He puts more of it into embellishment and trying to one man it up the ice and taking poro shots.

Our defense is always one injury away to looking like crap, regardless to where the injury happens. People didn't even like Bieksa and he's been mediocre defensively but even when he's out we just look that much worse. Salo was our best defensemen by a mile last year, and you need no further proof than to look at how TERRIBLE Edler is without him. And not only that, we lost Ehrhoff and replaced him with nothing. Even with his sketchy defense he was still likely an easy first pairing defender here. Which really might not say much about the rest of our defense..
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#12 wallstreetamigo

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 08:52 AM

I'd call it more of a Bieksa curse. The Canucks have not won a single game this season that he has not played in...


Having no right side D on the team other than Bieksa and Tanev is a huge part of the problem. Maybe Gillis should get on that.....
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#13 elvis15

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 08:54 AM

We are missing Kesler, Bieksa and Manny on the ice. That's 3 of our 4 alternate captains. Probably 3 of the 4 more outspoken ones too consider the last one is Daniel. That's a lot of leadership missing.

I'd call it more of a Bieksa curse. The Canucks have not won a single game this season that he has not played in...

Logic will get you nowhere on CDC.

It's not a curse. Its not that the team is mad about Gillis mishandling anything (since I don't think he has). It's not that they've lost respect for the team, since they'd have to lose respect for themselves.

They're professional hockey players, and they should be able to pull it together even if all those things were present and win games with all the talent they have.
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#14 wallstreetamigo

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:04 AM

Malhotra is by all accounts very well respected in the Canucks room, perhaps even more so than any other player on the team. I do believe that the way his situation was handled has had an impact on the team.

I also think that there could be a widening division in the dressing room based on the haves and the have nots in AV's plan. You have to think that certain players seeing that no matter how hard they work they never get an opportunity to advance while others play like crap and get more minutes has to be start taking a toll on locker room cohesion.

The players look like they do not believe in what they are doing. And they almost look fed up with not being able to play with any emotion.
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#15 GLASSJAW

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:12 AM

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What you guys don't understand is that this is all a matter of projection. No, the Sedins and Burrows aren't under-performing because Volpatti was put on waivers. To suggest this has some long-lasting negative emotional resonance would imply these players are incapable of emotionally handling the inevitabilities of the business they work in. Very few players last on the teams they were drafted by--ESPECIALLY THE CANUCKS!

CDC overrated Volpatti to astronomical lengths. Had he scored more than 3 goals in a Canucks shirt, lord knows we'd be seeing Volpatti threads for years, like Torres.

Half of CDC wanted Malholtra's name in the rafters when his eye was popped out, and then a year later, they wanted him traded. Now he's provided a curse for the team. Once again, I think people are overstating his importance and value due to sentimentality. If a team as experienced as the Canucks seriously needs to look to Malholtra for leadership at this point, then there's yet another problem with the team.

To me, this is just more classic absurdity from fans on CDC. People looking for a reason to justify their prejudices and their anxieties over the team. In this case, it's just a way to deflect all the fans' negative energy onto Gillis.

We all have our own ways of coping with the garbage team this year. I, for one, turn into a racist and blame all the heartless Americans on the team. No real justification for that, mind you. And I'm not sure I even believe it myself. Just like I hope the OP doesn't actually believe his post, too.
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#16 - PikaBOO -

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:15 AM

winning faceoffs also does help a bit...
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#17 Dogbyte

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:17 AM

Having no right side D on the team other than Bieksa and Tanev is a huge part of the problem. Maybe Gillis should get on that.....


Whoa, you just blew my mind.

Hmmph, We can address that in 4-6 years when all of our NTC's run out. No big deal.
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#18 disisdayear

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:18 AM

Not to make excuses for the team, and not to say that what we are dealing with is unique to only our team, there's been a chain of events that have taken place that have manifested itself into the slump we're currently in...in order, the following have occurred:

(1) Manny was put on ice for the season and probably his playing career...
(2) Kesler made his return...
(3) Hansen was suspended...
(4) Goaltending started to become "average"...
(5) Flu bug ran through the team...sounds like Schneids was one of the worst hit...
(6) Kes broke one of thousands of bones that we all have in our feet in Dallas...
(7) BXA pulled his groin in Nashville...
(8) Lost Volps on waivers...
(9) Picked up Tito on waivers...

All of these events have created disruptions to the line-up and team chemistry...the injuries in particular have forced certain players into roles that they may not be familiar or comfortable in...

IF we want to be a championship team, none of this stuff should matter...we should have the mental toughness to overcome these challenges and maintain a high level of competitiveness. These two things have been lacking for the past 2-3 weeks but I'm not about to give up on our boys and believe that we'll be able to pull ourselves out of this slump and agree with Hammy when he says that this adversity could very well make the team tougher to play against in the near future...

With the parity in the western conference, a prolonged slump is the kiss of death, especially in shortened season..so the Canucks have a short window of time to start playing like contenders and stop playing like a bunch of Schmucks.
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#19 MoneypuckOverlord

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:19 AM

take away

Ehrhoff
Salo
Kesler
Bieksa
Malhotra from the 2011 team....

this is what you will see.... the 2013 version of the Canucks. Lacking a bunch of players, that being said, I do not wish to blame it on injuries, as overall, even as a team, they've been playing bad. No excuses. Look at Ottawa. 2 points behind Montreal for first in the East, their injuries is equivalent to us losing Henrik Sedin, (Spezza) Erik Karlson (Dan Hamhius) for us.

There is just no excuses actually. Goaltending has been a let down this year. Nuff said. It really has. Anyone who thinks otherwise is dreaming. There is time, plenty of time still, and there I do believe we can start playing like we did last year with the current make up of the team. It can still be done.
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Players Nikolaj Ehlers have been compared too by the fan base of the Vancouver Canucks.

 

1 Pavel Bure

2 Markus Naslund

3 Nathan Mackkinon

4 Jonathan Drouin.

5 Jonathan Tavares

 

http://bleacherrepor...d-top-prospects

combine results.  Ehlers 5'11 162 lbs of solid rock.  


#20 Socrates

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:42 AM

Good posts by wallstreetamigo and GlassJaw - enjoyed ithem.

IMO, one cannot blame MG for his call on Malhotra. In fact, I admire the guy for having the balls to make a decision that was anything but easy. Just imagine Manny losing his vision on his weak eye after a big hit in the playoffs - what could anyone say at that time to Manny and his family? He was incredibly lucky to save his eye, why on Earth would he push it?

@GlassJaw - I disagree with other MG decisions, the most recent on Edler. Next year and until 2019, his salary ($5M) is in the same range with what Bobby Ryan, Jeff Carter and Marian Hossa are making ($5.1M - $5.3M). But this is the Canucks Ownership fault, guys. Just compare cap space and results between VAN and ANA-LAK-CHI (the Western teams to beat this year, IMO). it becomes clear that MG has been uninspired, slow and tentative. Sad to say it, as I used to love this guy.
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#21 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:48 AM

Even half-blind his faceoffs were still key in getting this team out of d-zone jams.

Now with no Kesler, and with Henrik taking mostly o-zone draws, it's been all Lappy, who can only do so much.

When we had Manny and healthy rh Kesler, we could win draws cleanly on both sides.

Now we can't win cleanly on either.

No wonder this team can't buy a win.
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#22 gradin123

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:51 AM

Darn, I was really hoping you were on to something. But then you went and mentioned Hodgson. Good try though.


I wasn't talking about the trade in general. I was talking about the way he threw Hodgson under the bus after the season ended in order to try and justify the trade.

Remember according to Gillis, Hogdson was the guy with the bad attitude but the only person who has commented about this situation on record is Gillis. Neither Hodgson or his agent have ever said anything at all about how the Canucks handled his situation. They have taking the high road which seems strange since he was a suppose pain in the butt according to MG
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#23 MoneypuckOverlord

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:53 AM

Good posts by wallstreetamigo and GlassJaw - enjoyed ithem.

IMO, one cannot blame MG for his call on Malhotra. In fact, I admire the guy for having the balls to make a decision that was anything but easy. Just imagine Manny losing his vision on his weak eye after a big hit in the playoffs - what could anyone say at that time to Manny and his family? He was incredibly lucky to save his eye, why on Earth would he push it?

@GlassJaw - I disagree with other MG decisions, the most recent on Edler. Next year and until 2019, his salary ($5M) is in the same range with what Bobby Ryan, Jeff Carter and Marian Hossa are making ($5.1M - $5.3M). But this is the Canucks Ownership fault, guys. Just compare cap space and results between VAN and ANA-LAK-CHI (the Western teams to beat this year, IMO). it becomes clear that MG has been uninspired, slow and tentative. Sad to say it, as I used to love this guy.


epic fail. What do you expect Mike Gillis to do? So the team starts losing and now Gillis as a GM? But if we win 5 in a row, he's the greatest GM? I don't get the gillis haters.

You guys call him out, want him gone, but are not smart enough to say who should be his replacement. Unbelievable.
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Players Nikolaj Ehlers have been compared too by the fan base of the Vancouver Canucks.

 

1 Pavel Bure

2 Markus Naslund

3 Nathan Mackkinon

4 Jonathan Drouin.

5 Jonathan Tavares

 

http://bleacherrepor...d-top-prospects

combine results.  Ehlers 5'11 162 lbs of solid rock.  


#24 gradin123

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:58 AM

Even half-blind his faceoffs were still key in getting this team out of d-zone jams.

Now with no Kesler, and with Henrik taking mostly o-zone draws, it's been all Lappy, who can only do so much.

When we had Manny and healthy rh Kesler, we could win draws cleanly on both sides.

Now we can't win cleanly on either.

No wonder this team can't buy a win.


Thats true. The Canucks have missed Malholtra from that prespective. I mean the Canucks just don't have enough centers or right handed shooting defenseman on their team right now. Gillis just has done a piss poor job on putting this team together fundamentally.

Edited by gradin123, 12 March 2013 - 10:04 AM.

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#25 Bodee

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:59 AM

Having no right side D on the team other than Bieksa and Tanev is a huge part of the problem. Maybe Gillis should get on that.....


He should have got on a lot of things..............do I hear the sound of breaking glass?

Socrates
"IMO, one cannot blame MG for his call on Malhotra. In fact, I admire the guy for having the balls to make a decision that was anything but easy."

Well many of us including I would imagine Manny himself, felt it wasn't his to make. Why did it take Gillis over a year to make this "ballsy" decision. Surely Manny must have been improving (He looked good training with the Whitecaps? in the summer) all this time. I think Gillis overstepped the line, I never heard him say the Consultants said he shouldn't play, did you?


"@GlassJaw - I disagree with other MG decisions, the most recent on Edler. Next year and until 2019, his salary ($5M) is in the same range with what Bobby Ryan, Jeff Carter and Marian Hossa are making ($5.1M - $5.3M). But this is the Canucks Ownership fault, guys. Just compare cap space and results between VAN and ANA-LAK-CHI (the Western teams to beat this year, IMO). it becomes clear that MG has been uninspired, slow and tentative. Sad to say it, as I used to love this guy."

Eloquently put.

Edited by Bodee, 12 March 2013 - 10:13 AM.

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#26 gradin123

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 10:00 AM

epic fail. What do you expect Mike Gillis to do? So the team starts losing and now Gillis as a GM? But if we win 5 in a row, he's the greatest GM? I don't get the gillis haters.

You guys call him out, want him gone, but are not smart enough to say who should be his replacement. Unbelievable.


To be fair when Gillis won the GM of the year, I came on these boards the next day and said that it was a joke and that the Canucks success was mostly do players left over from the previous regime. I have been saying Gillis is a bad GM for quite a while.

I'd get Burke to replace him. Of course I don't think that will ever happen with this ownership and I also believe the Aqulinis are part of the problem here but of course you can't fire owners.

Edited by gradin123, 12 March 2013 - 10:19 AM.

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#27 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 10:04 AM

Bah. Bad GM's don't get Ehrhoff for free. But those kinda trades are rare. It would be nice if he could get some more players for free, but teams might not want to help us out anymore.

To be fair when Gillis won the GM of the year, I came on these boards the next day and said that was a joke and that the Canucks success was mostly do players left over from the previous regime. I have been saying Gillis is a bad GM for quite a while.

I'd get Burke to replace him. Of course I don't think that will ever happen with this ownership and I aslo believe the Aqulinis are part of the problem here but of course you can't fire owners.


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#28 Fred65

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 10:06 AM

Here's the thing ! The system installed with great success depends more than any other team in the league on zone face off's...unless some haven't noticed that is the system...maintain control of the game. AV instituted it and it has served the club very very well. Well MG has failed to square the circle after getting rid of Malhotra... he hasn't replaced that face off prowess this team lives on and the reason for this failure by MG is simple he's capped himself and the club out of any plan "B". Now fans look around and wonder why Malhotra meant so much and why the team suffers so badly without him.....ask MG he knows why
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#29 gradin123

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 10:08 AM

Bah. Bad GM's don't get Ehrhoff for free. But those kinda trades are rare. It would be nice if he could get some more players for free, but teams might not want to help us out anymore.


Every dog gets a bone once in a while. I can't say Gillis has never made a good move. He has made some but his batting average on good moves to overall moves is under the Mendoza line (.200 or 20% for those who don't get the baseball reference).

Edited by gradin123, 12 March 2013 - 10:16 AM.

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#30 RUPERTKBD

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 10:12 AM

Having no right side D on the team other than Bieksa and Tanev is a huge part of the problem. Maybe Gillis should get on that.....


Ideas?
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