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Kassian needs to be sent down, for everyone's benefit


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#151 Wyoming Fan

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Posted 13 March 2013 - 10:10 PM

Ya, cause AV would definately keep a line together....

Edit: I'm a little frustrated AV doesn't let chemistry develop for longer than a shift


I hear ya! It drives me nuts! Can ANYONE explain why he refuses to leave lines alone? How can any chemistry develop if he is constantly playing musical chairs with his players??
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#152 AnInconvenienceBrah

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Posted 13 March 2013 - 10:33 PM

I agree with you OP, I wouldn't if Jensen wasn't there but now with both Schroeder and Jensen there it would be great for them 3 to build chemistry and build their confidence up, only problem is that Kassian off the Canucks leaves a hole there.
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#153 Gumballthechewy

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Posted 13 March 2013 - 11:27 PM

They should put him back with the Sedins it would improve his game 100% and he will be there to protect them. Plus putting Burrows on the 2nd or 3rd line gives more offense to the other lines, its the obvious thing to do, so you know AV won't do it.


I agree completely, Kassian got taken off the first because the Sedins weren't producing, that's not Kassian's fault. Booth isn't producing either so I guess that's all his line mates fault right?

I don't have the stats but didn't Kassian get 5 goals in like 8 games on the first? I bet if he stayed there he'd have 15 maybe 20 points by now.
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#154 mikeburn

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 10:29 AM

I hear ya! It drives me nuts! Can ANYONE explain why he refuses to leave lines alone? How can any chemistry develop if he is constantly playing musical chairs with his players??


It's true enough that some players naturally click and form an instant, natural, chemistry. More often though, what we fans see as "chemistry" is something players have to build, cultivate, and it only comes through having time on ice together, in different game situations, while they learn what to expect of each other, get to trust where someone will be and figure out tendencies, etc.

But it's not this type of chemistry which ends up not getting a chance under AV's constant line juggling - it's also individual player confidence that is trampled whenever the coach flips around a line. The message given is "one guy is doing okay, you're not, so you're demoted, change, flipped over, gotten rid of".

I swear, AV does this and the guys generally look more intent on racing around in circles chasing useless hits in the effort to impress the coach enough to be moved up a line. It's a crazy way to build a TEAM, but a great way to trash confidence and turn an otherwise skilled player into yet another grinder...
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#155 afan

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 10:41 PM

Kassian is not getting the coaching he needs and he is lot learning with the ice time he has. His play has fallen off the cliff after leaving the Sedin line. Kassian's lots of turnovers, both in the defensive and offensive zones, had been the Canucks killer in many recent games. His turnover in the offensive zone while not under pressure, which led to the Predator's 3rd goal tonite and made the crowd nervous in the 3rd period is just one more example. Right now this guy is not skating, hitting, shooting and his cute little high risk plays or passes more often than not ends in turnovers which has been costly. Everyone expects a skilled big guy like Kassian to play with more intensity but he is not delivering it. It seems like MG had traded a 4th line guy in Kassian, assuming he can stay in the NHL, for a potential top line centre in Hodgson. I don't believe AV or any of the Canucks subpar coaches would ever watch postgame videos with the kid and tell him what to and what not to do in the next game. Playing in the NHL seems to be too comfortable for Kassian and he should be sent down if there is no improvement in his play soon.
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#156 JustAFan33

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 10:55 PM

Kassian is not getting the coaching he needs and he is lot learning with the ice time he has.
....
I don't believe AV or any of the Canucks subpar coaches would ever watch postgame videos with the kid and tell him what to and what not to do in the next game. Playing in the NHL seems to be too comfortable for Kassian and he should be sent down if there is no improvement in his play soon.

Watching how prospects and rookies are progressing on this team has made me wonder the same thing. I also wonder if the compressed schedule is having a big affect on it. That is, they aren't getting enough time to do post-game video reviews and figure out how to and where they can improve. To me, that would be a no-brainer for developing a rookie, but either it's not happening, what's being said is way off base, or the guys are simply not putting it into practice.

Edited by JustAFan33, 14 March 2013 - 10:56 PM.

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#157 Hairy Kneel

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 05:46 AM

I just want Kass to skate hard to the net, nothing fancy,park in the crease and cause havoc like Buffy.
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#158 riffraff

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 05:55 AM

Av benching kassian last nigh is moronic.

I don't get what's in avs head...."here kass, sit on the bench and watch the team play giveaway and junior B defense...."

Pathetic coaching.
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#159 Felix Potvin

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 06:09 AM

I agree completely, Kassian got taken off the first because the Sedins weren't producing, that's not Kassian's fault. Booth isn't producing either so I guess that's all his line mates fault right?

I don't have the stats but didn't Kassian get 5 goals in like 8 games on the first? I bet if he stayed there he'd have 15 maybe 20 points by now.

Burrows will be the guy to stay on the first line and its the way it should be the sedins play a better game with him and Kassian needs to earn that spot not just have it handed to him
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#160 bd71

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 06:33 AM

This is what I see with Kass...

A big kid with good wheels and soft hands who is struggling to find his place in the NHL.

He started the NHL season like a house on fire because he was in game shape...had a minor groin injury while with the Wolves, which he managed to play through. I would even argue that he was our best forward and carried the Sedins for the first 4-5 games as the Sedins and Burrows were working themselves into game shape.

When the rest of the "men" in the NHL caught up with Kass as far as game shape is concerned by game 10 or so, he hit a wall which was further exacerbated by AV's moving him around the lineup, taking away the kid's confidence as to the role that he needed to play (Kass' role should be easy to define -- a skilled power forward who should be capable of playing in all three zones of the ice and able to drop his mitts when he feels is necessary).

Even though AV has treated Kass like the ugly girl at the party, Kass has kept his mouth shut and has been a good team guy. Kass even sounds like a muted wallflower in his interviews...he has come across as being polite and passive, which is not the persona that we want of him on the ice -- this tells me his confidence is lacking. This, I hang entirely on AV.

His lack of confidence has manifested itself in tentative hitting, treating the puck like a hot potato, losing puck battles that he should be winning, and inability to finish. I was glad to see that he took the boarding penalty he did last night because this might be the first sign he's gaining some confidence.

The kid has NHL tangibles (i.e., size and skill)...he doesn't have NHL intangibles yet (i.e., competitiveness, ability to bring it every single shift every night). The only place he's going to learn the NHL intangibles is in the NHL.

For all the talk about Kass needing a mentor specific to the role that he should be playing, who would that be? There's no one on the roster that is expected to play the all-around game that we expect of Kass, other than possibly Booth, but he strikes me more as a surfer dude who is trying to find his own way back in the NHL. Whether Kass has leadership skills or not, we won't know because AV has essentially neutered the kid...when Kass stepped up and took on Eager and Clowe, my thoughts were he was showing initiative and leadership and assuming a specific role on the team, but from day 1 when AV wrapped his arms around Kass to prevent him from getting involved, AV has done more to stunt the kid's mental/emotional development which is the area that Kass needs to develop. When Kass's head is right, he's going to be a force in the NHL...my only concern is AV is going to phuck it up for the kid.

So, here's my solution...put Kass back with the Sedins for a few games...let him play with reckless abandon (the Sedins are smart enough to adjust their game for a few games)...and give the kid carte blanche in taking on whoever he wants. This will also help with getting the Sedins to move their game from the perimeter to the middle of the ice, where they seem deathly afraid of entering (the one time they moved their play to the middle last night, Daniel drew a penalty...their perimeter play with Burrows is getting too easy to defend).

We acquired Kass to be a skilled power forward who is capable of chucking them with the best of them, so let the kid be who want him to be.


You are right to a certain extent but this year has basically been a mirror of his entire hockey playing career. He comes on strong, shows offensive ability, makes the big hits, has some fights and then he disappears for long stretches. He infuriated fans in the OHL, in Rochester and Buffalo and now here. You can't continually blame coaching for a player's inconsistent play. How do you go from being one of the team's best players for the first two weeks to now being really close to the press box or Chicago? That's a player problem.

For all of those excited about Jensen, he has the exact same issues (probably even more so) that have manifested themselves at all his levels as well. He is all there one game and gone the next. I've noticed lots of blame on his coaching in Stockholm. Same happened in Oshawa. There's no love lost for him there either. Everyone loves his raw skill but his floating drives people crazy.

We all come in and overrate these young guys because we so badly want them to be great but we don't really give them a chance to develop or see their flaws. The reality is that they probably aren't as ready or as good as we want them to be but I think the team needs to be more patient with them. Just because they traded a high end asset for Kassian doesn't mean he needs to be rushed or put in a position to fail. He could probably use more development but it may not happen because that will be perceived as a failure on the part of management.
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#161 c-a-n-u-c-k-s

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 06:55 AM

He can't seem to really get anything done unless he's playing with the Twins.

Right... and the twins are doing virtually nothing lately too.... sooo..... AV is a moron.
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#162 Gumballthechewy

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 08:04 AM

You are right to a certain extent but this year has basically been a mirror of his entire hockey playing career. He comes on strong, shows offensive ability, makes the big hits, has some fights and then he disappears for long stretches. He infuriated fans in the OHL, in Rochester and Buffalo and now here. You can't continually blame coaching for a player's inconsistent play. How do you go from being one of the team's best players for the first two weeks to now being really close to the press box or Chicago? That's a player problem.


Yes, it's Kassian's fault, but it's also,in part, AV's fault. Is it not the coaches job to get players (especially rookies) to play consistently? Kassian was playing pretty consistently on the first, before he was taken off for the lamest excuse I've ever heard...

Edited by Gumballthechewy, 15 March 2013 - 08:05 AM.

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#163 surtur

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 08:12 AM

Yes, it's Kassian's fault, but it's also,in part, AV's fault. Is it not the coaches job to get players (especially rookies) to play consistently? Kassian was playing pretty consistently on the first, before he was taken off for the lamest excuse I've ever heard...

was he not our leading scorer at the start of the season? Good enough reason to take him off the top lineż
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#164 wendythirteenthrashers

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 08:25 AM

You people are ridiculous.... KASS tries a nifty drop pass to higgy in the o zone.... Oops turnover.....stapled to the bench..... Didn't the PREDS have to go through minimum 3 other CANUCKS to score??.....in the d zone....yes out of position trying to help the d out and the preds scored again.... All of a sudden that's kass's fault..... Pathetic decisions by av.....

Meanwhile here's the kid out there givin er.... Trying to make plays.... Charging the goal.... Strong on the puck.... Yet one miscue equals punishment.... Av had better not kill this kids potential....

What hypocrisy when the faves and vets on the teams can do that 10 times a game and receive zero reprimands..... The sedins and burr must have had 20 offensive attempted cycling failure turnovers for instance....

I think the KASS haters must be a bunch of HODGSON homers .... The trade is here to stay.... Deal with it!

Edited by wendythirteenthrashers, 15 March 2013 - 08:26 AM.

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#165 Gumballthechewy

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 08:42 AM

was he not our leading scorer at the start of the season? Good enough reason to take him off the top lineż


Can't have a rookie make the Sedin's look bad....
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#166 TOMapleLaughs

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 08:48 AM

He looked good in the offensive zone, not so good in the defensive zone. A few strange bounces in that game though.
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#167 Canucklehead73

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 09:48 AM

First off, would I like Kassian to hit more? Yes! And his role dictates he should be a leader in this department. But as a team we are playing soft... A few years back it was a hallmark of this team, defense stopping up and delivering hard hits in the defensive and neutral zone.

Now we have guys like Weise who skates a 100mph and really throws one hit a week...

I was excited to see we picked up a guy like Sesito who from all accounts skates and hits. Alberts is back playing and he always played pretty tough on the boards. Now if we can get the whole team to buy back into the hitting game things might improve.

As for Kassian he is a young guy who needs to stick with a line, be the sedins or the second or third line, he has alot of skills but the biggest failure so far is the lack of bonding with his linemates. The sedins are an exceptional example of players who have played so long together they know exactly what the other guy is thinking and where they need to be to support the other.

Kassian has alot of playmaking skills for a power forward and if his linemates get used to his mindset they will know where to be when he has the puck. On the flip side Kassian will also learn where his line mates are going as well and his passes will improve.

So if AV would quit dropping him down a line when a pass does not work out or he mishandles the puck his confidence would not be shot. Biggest mistake AV does is send his messages and forgets to give the player another shot to prove they learned from his demotion. And continues the problems with more demotions and line flipping...

As for lines, I actually think he would do well to play with burrows, who has a knack for going to the net and being in the right place at the right time on the cycle game. Kassian is a puck control playmaker who needs shooters to play with. It's a tough call who plays with the sedins, I'd almost want to try to get Booths game going with the sedins, and play kassian with burrows and kesler if he evers gets healthy.
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#168 Ride the red Pony

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 10:02 AM

The kid definitely showed flashes in the first period why MG traded for him, as someone above stated, there doesn't seem to be any reprecussions when the vets turn the puck over, as it would almost seem to be the opposite, ie. Edler turning it over endlessly,only to receive more minutes and the Assistant captaincy the next game, SMH.

If this is the way AV is going to handle Kassians development, then I would almost have to say they should send him down, as it seems the only players AV knows how to deal with are polished veterans, and even then there doesn't seem to be any accountability.

Don't worry boys we allowed 4 goals, I'll have a good laugh behind the bench, and we'll go back to the country club and have a few chardonnay's. SMH
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#169 Erik Karlsson

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 10:33 AM

AV is garbage, terrible coaching last night, almost blew a 3 goal lead by sitting back, then benches Kass for a missed drop pass that the Sedins are usuallly guilty of like once a game...

No point in trying to learn off your best players if it's just going to get you benched.

I hope these wins haven't changed peoples mind about this clown.
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#170 Gumballthechewy

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 10:45 AM

I hope these wins haven't changed peoples mind about this clown.


It hasn't changed my mind about him, that's for sure.

Edited by Gumballthechewy, 15 March 2013 - 10:45 AM.

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#171 monsterdash

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 10:50 AM

If he's not scoring or making plays happen, I just want him to skate hard and finish his checks clean and hard. He misses about 75% of his hits and he definitely doesn't skate hard.

He needs a shot in the arm. Then again, what do I know. I'm just some dude at work typing away on the internet, I have no clue what goes on in that dressing room or the conversations that happen between players and staff.
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#172 sting

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 10:59 AM

I disagree with the favorites statement many here are using. The way I saw it last night Kassian was creating havoc in the first period but seemed to have a lot less jump there after. I think AV tried to start using the big guy with the twins when they were up by 3 and due to the Preds getting back and making it a tight game he went with the players he trusts most defensively to lock down the win. I'm hardly a AV fan but any sensible coach would have done the same.
Kassian is going to have a huge future impact with this team. I originally thought the prospect of him and Booth together on a line would be a defensive nightmare but his transitional play continues to improve. Due to sheer bad luck he is not getting offensive production and this will change if he keeps stringing efforts together like the first 40 minutes of last night.
I really would love to see Kassian take Burrows spot on the pp and create havoc in front of the net and a right handed shot helps as well. Would do wonders for confidence IMO help Burrows stay fresh for pk and 5 on 5. For what you lose in puck pursuit and speed you gain in size and strength.
Kassian is going to be a beast quit worrying people? He just turned 22 is adapting to NHL intensity and speed and shows flashes of a young Bertuzzi. Once his game rounds out no one will be bringing up Cody except to say thanks for being a primadonna.
One last note.....I was reading the HF boards and an Oiler fan was trying to ask people about who they could acquire like Kassian for their team. Made me feel pretty good when the consensus was that there really was none other than Lucic.


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#173 mikeburn

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 11:00 AM

You people are ridiculous.... KASS tries a nifty drop pass to higgy in the o zone.... Oops turnover.....stapled to the bench..... Didn't the PREDS have to go through minimum 3 other CANUCKS to score??.....in the d zone....yes out of position trying to help the d out and the preds scored again.... All of a sudden that's kass's fault..... Pathetic decisions by av.....

Meanwhile here's the kid out there givin er.... Trying to make plays.... Charging the goal.... Strong on the puck.... Yet one miscue equals punishment.... Av had better not kill this kids potential....

What hypocrisy when the faves and vets on the teams can do that 10 times a game and receive zero reprimands..... The sedins and burr must have had 20 offensive attempted cycling failure turnovers for instance....

I think the KASS haters must be a bunch of HODGSON homers .... The trade is here to stay.... Deal with it!


Can't answer for others, but I'll stick my own neck out - I admit to being a "Hodgson Homer", lol. Seriously, I think the kid got a raw deal under AV's "coaching style", was thrown under the bus entirely when MG tried to rationalize the trade after the fact, and has since proven wrong all the lame criticism with his performance in Buffalo this year.

But being a Hodgson "homer" doesn't equate to being a Kassian "hater", any more than hating Kassian equates to liking Hodgson. Nor does one's take on either player equate to not having dealt with the trade ;)

As far as I can tell, Kassian is now suffering through what Hodgson (and others before and after Hodgson) have had to endure under AV's "coaching style". I've been contending for years that AV is the ultimate hypocrite. Sadly too many fans (and media) have fallen for him because of personal biases (pro or con their own fav players) rather than seeing this guy for who he is really...Whether a player is "liked" or not, whether one thinks a particular player ought to be cut or retired or benched or not, fact is AV shows like a hypocrite - remember when he came to the Canucks claiming ice time would be rewarded based on merit? Apparently that was code for "my favourites will get chance after chance after chance, and I'll bench the guys I don't like on the smallest error".

Anyhow, forget if the trade was better for Buffalo or Vancouver, it seems the trade was way better for Hodgson than Kassian...

Hodgson has had the support and investment into his overall game, and has steadily improved in all areas presumably because of how he's been handled in Buffalo - given a chance to screw up without fear of being pressboxed or publicly humiliated with a "call-out" by the coach post game. While comparably, Kassian screws up and gets snapped to the bench - great way to build the kid's experience and confidence. :wacko: It's no wonder Hodgson is only getting better this year while Kassian looks mostly lost and running around still trying to figure out his role.
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#174 Gumballthechewy

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 11:00 AM

If he's not scoring or making plays happen, I just want him to skate hard and finish his checks clean and hard. He misses about 75% of his hits and he definitely doesn't skate hard.

He needs a shot in the arm. Then again, what do I know. I'm just some dude at work typing away on the internet, I have no clue what goes on in that dressing room or the conversations that happen between players and staff.


You're also a dude who apparently forgot that Kassian was leading the team in goals and how good he looked when he was on the first.
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#175 Fred65

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 11:05 AM

Had a pretty solid game last night
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#176 Erik Karlsson

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 11:58 AM

Can't answer for others, but I'll stick my own neck out - I admit to being a "Hodgson Homer", lol. Seriously, I think the kid got a raw deal under AV's "coaching style", was thrown under the bus entirely when MG tried to rationalize the trade after the fact, and has since proven wrong all the lame criticism with his performance in Buffalo this year.

But being a Hodgson "homer" doesn't equate to being a Kassian "hater", any more than hating Kassian equates to liking Hodgson. Nor does one's take on either player equate to not having dealt with the trade ;)

As far as I can tell, Kassian is now suffering through what Hodgson (and others before and after Hodgson) have had to endure under AV's "coaching style". I've been contending for years that AV is the ultimate hypocrite. Sadly too many fans (and media) have fallen for him because of personal biases (pro or con their own fav players) rather than seeing this guy for who he is really...Whether a player is "liked" or not, whether one thinks a particular player ought to be cut or retired or benched or not, fact is AV shows like a hypocrite - remember when he came to the Canucks claiming ice time would be rewarded based on merit? Apparently that was code for "my favourites will get chance after chance after chance, and I'll bench the guys I don't like on the smallest error".

Anyhow, forget if the trade was better for Buffalo or Vancouver, it seems the trade was way better for Hodgson than Kassian...

Hodgson has had the support and investment into his overall game, and has steadily improved in all areas presumably because of how he's been handled in Buffalo - given a chance to screw up without fear of being pressboxed or publicly humiliated with a "call-out" by the coach post game. While comparably, Kassian screws up and gets snapped to the bench - great way to build the kid's experience and confidence. :wacko: It's no wonder Hodgson is only getting better this year while Kassian looks mostly lost and running around still trying to figure out his role.


Agreed, this guy is ruining our prospects, I don't really care if he helped develop Hansen and Bieksa and stuff, that was the past and most of the players he helped develop are grinders.

The thing with young skilled players is that they need confidence to perform, not sure if AV understands that.

Edited by TheGame., 15 March 2013 - 11:59 AM.

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#177 wendythirteenthrashers

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:05 PM

Can't answer for others, but I'll stick my own neck out - I admit to being a "Hodgson Homer", lol. Seriously, I think the kid got a raw deal under AV's "coaching style", was thrown under the bus entirely when MG tried to rationalize the trade after the fact, and has since proven wrong all the lame criticism with his performance in Buffalo this year.

But being a Hodgson "homer" doesn't equate to being a Kassian "hater", any more than hating Kassian equates to liking Hodgson. Nor does one's take on either player equate to not having dealt with the trade ;)

As far as I can tell, Kassian is now suffering through what Hodgson (and others before and after Hodgson) have had to endure under AV's "coaching style". I've been contending for years that AV is the ultimate hypocrite. Sadly too many fans (and media) have fallen for him because of personal biases (pro or con their own fav players) rather than seeing this guy for who he is really...Whether a player is "liked" or not, whether one thinks a particular player ought to be cut or retired or benched or not, fact is AV shows like a hypocrite - remember when he came to the Canucks claiming ice time would be rewarded based on merit? Apparently that was code for "my favourites will get chance after chance after chance, and I'll bench the guys I don't like on the smallest error".

Anyhow, forget if the trade was better for Buffalo or Vancouver, it seems the trade was way better for Hodgson than Kassian...

Hodgson has had the support and investment into his overall game, and has steadily improved in all areas presumably because of how he's been handled in Buffalo - given a chance to screw up without fear of being pressboxed or publicly humiliated with a "call-out" by the coach post game. While comparably, Kassian screws up and gets snapped to the bench - great way to build the kid's experience and confidence. :wacko: It's no wonder Hodgson is only getting better this year while Kassian looks mostly lost and running around still trying to figure out his role.


Gotcha.... I guess that was a little harsh .... I understand why hodgson wanted out...just like shirokov and others.... AV'S coaching style is just so flawed... Wouldn't be surprised if he drives KASS to request a trade outta town too.... Just saddens and angers me so much when he's trying so hard.... He's been showing so much potential... When av broke up the speed line too and sent shredder to the 4th line I just thought WTF !! .... How can a young guy succeed when he has to climb an obstacle course every game with AVS clownish line juggling and runny jello mentality....." Oh that's working, lets shake it up instead?!".. Maybe that's AVS measuring stick perhaps.... Adapt or be benched or sent down I guess....
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#178 Gumballthechewy

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 12:42 PM

Maybe that's AVS measuring stick perhaps.... Adapt or be benched or sent down I guess....


If that's the case half the Canucks roster should be benched. :P
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#179 WZRD

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 01:19 PM

You're also a dude who apparently forgot that Kassian was leading the team in goals and how good he looked when he was on the first.

Remember when the teins made Carter, Pyatt and Bitz look good?
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#180 WZRD

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 01:19 PM

You're also a dude who apparently forgot that Kassian was leading the team in goals and how good he looked when he was on the first.

Remember when the twins made Carter, Pyatt and Bitz look good?
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